ID - DeOrr Kunz Jr, 2, Timber Creek Campground, 10 July 2015 - #12

[Dee10]

Where is the link saying the Sheriff said anything about searching eagle's nests? There isn't any.

Sorry I missed your post. I spent a lot of wasted time searching & came to the same conclusion as you lol.

 

[TeaTime]

RedRum out in CA posting pictures of lost boy that looks like DeOrr.

Is it the little boy left in the motel? I agree he does look like DeOrr but I heard that he was reunited with his mother.

Is this another little fella?

 

[Deleted member 718]

July 26
"Twin Falls County deputies are headed to Lemhi County to help in the search for a missing toddler.
Deputies are helping to look for 2 year old toddler DeOrr Kunz Jr., who went missing while camping with family near Salmon, Idaho.
Twin Falls County Sheriff Tom Carter sent Chief Deputy Don Newman, Lt. Daron Brown, Sgt. Dave Benefiel, and Deputy Jake Benson. They left last Wednesday, and took with them two drones, a Razor, and two 4-wheelers to use in the search."

Link for photos of the drone and search area.

Twin Falls Sheriff's Office facebook page
https://www.facebook.com/twinfallssheriff/posts/871845679520079

 

[travelbug]

Eagles can only carry three or four pounds.

Thank you, I should have been more specific. Bald eagles, the type commonly found around the Snake River valley, weigh 9-14 lbs. They will attack prey that is twice their weight, but can only "carry" half of their weight. My thought was that if DK Jr. (who was believed to weigh around 20 lbs.) was attacked and killed by an eagle then manageable portions could be carried back to the nest as food. Sorry to be so graphic, but that is the only way evidence of the little guy would be found in a nesting area. I do not mean to suggest that is what happened, because I don't believe any type of bird, mammal (other than human), serpent, etc. had a part in the disappearance of Deorr. I was simply responding to the question of why the Sheriff was searching the area around the eagles nests.

http://fishandgame.idaho.gov/public/wildlife/nongame/leafletBirdsPrey.pdf

 

[ILOKAL]

Thank you, I should have been more specific. Bald eagles, the type commonly found around the Snake River valley, weigh 9-14 lbs. They will attack prey that is twice their weight, but can only "carry" half of their weight. My thought was that if DK Jr. (who was believed to weigh around 20 lbs.) was attacked and killed by an eagle then manageable portions could be carried back to the nest as food. Sorry to be so graphic, but that is the only way evidence of the little guy would be found in a nesting area. I do not mean to suggest that is what happened, because I don't believe any type of bird, mammal (other than human), serpent, etc. had a part in the disappearance of Deorr. I was simply responding to the question of why the Sheriff was searching the area around the eagles nests.

http://fishandgame.idaho.gov/public/wildlife/nongame/leafletBirdsPrey.pdf

I think (NOT sure) little Deorr weighed about 28 pounds. Also, from what I read about bald eagles, they wouldn't attack a child. It seems every source says something a little different about eagles. It's hard to know which is the most accurate since they all seem to be reputable.

 

[Mickshawn]

Eagles can and do pick up prey all the time his size and bigger...

Link, please?

 

[pepelepolecat]

Aren't Eagles endangered species? I don't think anybody's allowed to disturb them.

Had to look that one up. I guess they are no longer on the endangered list.

The bald eagle is both the national bird and national animal of the United States of America. The bald eagle appears on its seal. In the late 20th century it was on the brink of extirpation in the contiguous United States. Populations have since recovered and the species was removed from the U.S. government's list of endangered species on July 12, 1995 and transferred to the list of threatened species. It was removed from the List of Endangered and Threatened Wildlife in the Lower 48 States on June 28, 2007.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bald_eagle

Well, there are also golden eagles, but I'm just not sure how much credence I put into the nest searching.

 

[desert-blue]

Maybe they used the drones to capture some images of the eagles' nests and didn't actually "search" them. MOO.

 

[haven71]

I just had a thought, if someone was intent to push an abduction theory, the best way maybe to show how no other theory is possible. For example the most thorough searches using the best, most advanced technology available, etc. therefore it 'has' to be an abduction.

Although the Sheriff has narrowed his thoughts down on probabilities or possibilities due the apparent lack of evidence not found while searching, last I remember he hasn't ruled anything out totally. We also don't know what other evidence that was turned over to the FBI that may open the door to other scenarios of what may have happened to little DeOrr. JMO, but I am always going to be a little leary or take a closer look, when someone 'pushes' a one-sided agenda/conclusion, especially when the stakes are so high.

What stinks is that we don't even know if we will be privy to "evidence" or suspects or anything else discovered by FBI investigation. For all we know, they'll release a general statement telling us squat. I think I've been waiting for the wrong thing. If the FBI has something, an arrest would've hopefully have been made by now. But we're nearing the end of the line, and they've said nothing. The fact that IR retained a lawyer makes me thinks something is in the works though.

If the FBI stays mum, I'm guessing the Sheriff will make a general statement that there are no viable leads in the case. We will have nothing to go on.

This is frustrating as h*ll.

 

[ILOKAL]

What stinks is that we don't even know if we will be privy to "evidence" or suspects or anything else discovered by FBI investigation. For all we know, they'll release a general statement telling us squat. I think I've been waiting for the wrong thing. If the FBI has something, an arrest would've hopefully have been made by now. But we're nearing the end of the line, and they've said nothing. The fact that IR retained a lawyer makes me thinks something is in the works though.

If the FBI stays mum, I'm guessing the Sheriff will make a general statement that there are no viable leads in the case. We will have nothing to go on.

This is frustrating as h*ll.

In the SM article that was posted a few posts up thread, the sheriff indicated that he had been criticized for not having an Amber Alert issued when little Deorr went missing. I have always wondered if the main purpose for bringing the FBI on board was so it could ultimately determine that an abduction did not take place, so that going forward, such criticism of the sheriff would stop.

 

[CoverMeCagney]

A whole page about the likelihood of an eagle stealing Deorr. Wow!

What's next, folks?

As for "staring man". I think it's quite possible a man was there, looking at Deorr. It was probably innocuous. It obviously didn't alarm the parents or the police too much or we'd have heard about it on day dot. Think about it, if they really believed it was an abduction, and that man had really freaked them out, don't you think that's the first thing the police would have concentrated on?

 

[haven71]

In the SM article that was posted a few posts up thread, the sheriff indicated that he had been criticized for not having an Amber Alert issued when little Deorr went missing. I have always wondered if the main purpose for bringing the FBI on board was so it could ultimately determine than an abduction did not take place, so that going forward, such criticism of the sheriff would stop.

Refresh my memory? Regarding the Amber Alert I think I remember that it did not fit the criteria for an alert to be issued. I'll backtrack and find out, but I'm sure many of you probably remember this being discussed. My memory SUCKS.

IKOLAL, thanks, I can understand now why the FBI may have been called in to assist. The sheriff would likely be crucified if it turned out to be an abduction if he'd never asked them for their assistance. I think the parents too might get raked through the coals as well because from what I've seen they have not sought out media attention, pressed for or organized for more intense searches (maybe they have), and used every bulletin board and missing children website in the US of A to alert the public of Deorr's disappearance.

So perhaps calling the FBI was more to rule things out, rather to rule things "in".

ISI

 

[ILOKAL]

Refresh my memory? Regarding the Amber Alert I think I remember that it did not fit the criteria for an alert to be issued. I'll backtrack and find out, but I'm sure many of you probably remember this being discussed. My memory SUCKS.

IKOLAL, thanks, I can understand now why the FBI may have been called in to assist. The sheriff would likely be crucified if it turned out to be an abduction if he'd never asked them for their assistance. I think the parents too might get raked through the coals as well because from what I've seen they have not sought out media attention, pressed for or organized for more intense searches (maybe they have), and used every bulletin board and missing children website in the US of A to alert the public of Deorr's disappearance.

So perhaps calling the FBI was more to rule things out, rather to rule things "in".

ISI

I'm never certain about the criteria for an Amber Alert and it seems there are exceptions. A 9-yr old went missing at a municipal man-made lake within a recreational park. He was last seen at a splash pad and the next time anyone noticed, he was gone. Authorities didn't believe he had been abducted but his aunt (who had taken him there that day) DID. The little boy was autistic and non-verbal but was responsive. An Amber Alert was issued. Sadly, in spite of six very thorough water searches, he was found in the lake a week later.

So in the case of little Deorr, I'm not certain what the criteria would have been. Granted, there was no vehicle and no witnesses, but he is very young, was in the wilderness and virtually vanished. Should there have been any exceptions and an alert issued? Dunno.

 

[kammiemc]

A whole page about the likelihood of an eagle stealing Deorr. Wow!

What's next, folks?

As for "staring man". I think it's quite possible a man was there, looking at Deorr. It was probably innocuous. It obviously didn't alarm the parents or the police too much or we'd have heard about it on day dot. Think about it, if they really believed it was an abduction, and that man had really freaked them out, don't you think that's the first thing the police would have concentrated on?

I agree. That's one reason I have a hard time imagining it's a valid, viable lead in this case, or that the Leadore man is also the Swan Valley man. My gut IMO JMO is that the PI has made this more significant than it was.

For one thing, I assume the PI would have immediately asked the parents for a vehicle description when they first told him about the staring man lead.

I have trouble buying, per the PI's interview, that it was after hearing about the Swan Valley man's car, he called DK to then ask about what cars were in the parking lot and DK suddenly recalled the same car as just reported to the PI by the Swan Valley woman, even using the same descriptors. Just seems more like the PI might have prompted DK with that description and the possibility that that same car was in the parking lot.
Not impossible, just seems a little too convenient to be highly believable.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[desert-blue]

In the SM article that was posted a few posts up thread, the sheriff indicated that he had been criticized for not having an Amber Alert issued when little Deorr went missing. I have always wondered if the main purpose for bringing the FBI on board was so it could ultimately determine that an abduction did not take place, so that going forward, such criticism of the sheriff would stop.

I don't know... that seems like a lot of time, money, resources, etc. to use just to try to prove something didn't happen for the sake of the sheriff's reputation, IMO. You may be correct, but I hope not.... I hope they are actually trying to figure out what did happen to him (but obviously he hasn't been found, so who knows what is going on...) :-(

 

[haven71]

I don't know... that seems like a lot of time, money, resources, etc. to use just to try to prove something didn't happen for the sake of the sheriff's reputation, IMO. You may be correct, but I hope not.... I hope they are actually trying to figure out what did happen to him (but obviously he hasn't been found, so who knows what is going on...) :-(

I don't think anyone would think that was the sole reason for calling in the FBI. Likely the sheriff wants all his i's dotted and t's crossed, and by enlisting their help was is ensuring that he wasn't missing anything critical in the case. His reputation naturally would be respected as a consequence.

 

[iamnotagolem]

A whole page about the likelihood of an eagle stealing Deorr. Wow!

What's next, folks?

As for "staring man". I think it's quite possible a man was there, looking at Deorr. It was probably innocuous. It obviously didn't alarm the parents or the police too much or we'd have heard about it on day dot. Think about it, if they really believed it was an abduction, and that man had really freaked them out, don't you think that's the first thing the police would have concentrated on?

If Deorr was "a filthy, bawling toddler" then it's to be expected that someone was staring. Whether he was sympathetic for the parents or silently judging them, I promise you having a screaming toddler warrants plenty of stares, in my experience.

 

[bessie]

Refresh my memory? Regarding the Amber Alert I think I remember that it did not fit the criteria for an alert to be issued. I'll backtrack and find out, but I'm sure many of you probably remember this being discussed. My memory SUCKS.

<rsbm>

Here are the Amber Alert criteria for Idaho.

1. A child is known by law enforcement officials to have been abducted
2. The abduction occurred within 12 hours of initial activation of AMBER Alert
3. The child is under 17 years of age
4. Law enforcement must believe the child is in imminent danger of serious bodily harm or death
5. There must be enough descriptive information to believe that an AMBER Alert will assist in the
recovery of the child (must include as much of the following information as possible)
6. The missing child must be entered into NCIC

Scope of Amber Alert: Statewide

http://klaaskids.org/amberplan/idaho/

 

[bessie]

I'm never certain about the criteria for an Amber Alert and it seems there are exceptions. A 9-yr old went missing at a municipal man-made lake within a recreational park. He was last seen at a splash pad and the next time anyone noticed, he was gone. Authorities didn't believe he had been abducted but his aunt (who had taken him there that day) DID. The little boy was autistic and non-verbal but was responsive. An Amber Alert was issued. Sadly, in spite of six very thorough water searches, he was found in the lake a week later.
So in the case of little Deorr, I'm not certain what the criteria would have been. Granted, there was no vehicle and no witnesses, but he is very young, was in the wilderness and virtually vanished. Should there have been any exceptions and an alert issued? Dunno.

Note that "recommendations" is in bold on the webpage.


​

Guidelines for Issuing AMBER Alerts

Every successful AMBER plan contains clearly defined activation criteria. The following guidance is designed to achieve a uniform, interoperable network of plans across the country, and to minimize potentially deadly delays because of confusion among varying jurisdictions. The following are criteria recommendations:

This is a summary of the recommended criteria. A detailed explanation can be found at the link.
​

Summary of Department of Justice Recommended Criteria

There is reasonable belief by law enforcement that an abduction has occurred.

• The law enforcement agency believes that the child is in imminent danger of serious bodily injury or death.
• There is enough descriptive information about the victim and the abduction for law enforcement to issue an AMBER Alert to assist in the recovery of the child.
• The abduction is of a child aged 17 years or younger.
• The child&#8217;s name and other critical data elements, including the Child Abduction flag, have been entered into the National Crime Information Center (NCIC) system.

http://www.amberalert.gov/guidelines.htm

Criteria for each state can be found at this page on the KlaasKids website.
​

http://klaaskids.org/amberplan/

 

[Cardinal47]

Is it the little boy left in the motel? I agree he does look like DeOrr but I heard that he was reunited with his mother.

Is this another little fella?

No same little guy. Redrum is the one that posted the pictures on SM. When the WS poster was mentioning "RED" I thought of this one.