Malaysia airlines 370 with 239 people on board, 8 March 2014 #25

[Roselvr]

Another towfish was lost, apparently due to a failure of a tow cable connector. Reading this, I'm not sure if a new one was flown in to continue the search for the plane or to find and retrieve the lost one?

With the towfish likely thousands of feet down on the seabed, a remote-controlled submersible was flown in from the United States and dispatched aboard a ship from Australia on Monday, the JACC said.

http://www.nbcnews.com/storyline/mi...rchers-lose-2nd-sonar-device-3-months-n555191

Found a better article.

Flight MH370 Search Vessels Lose Towfish Scanning Equipment — Again By Julia Glum @superjulia On 04/13/16 AT 9:14 AM

The Australian Joint Agency Coordination Centre, which is leading the hunt for the vanished Boeing 777, announced in an operational update Wednesday it lost a towfish and depressor last month. A towfish is a high-tech sonar device that can be used to scan the ocean floor for items like aircraft debris, while the depressor helps keeps the equipment in place.

"On 21 March, the failure of a tow cable connector resulted in the loss of the SLH-ProSAS-60 towfish and the attached depressor," the center wrote Wednesday.

The investigative team called in an American remotely operated vehicle, called the Remora III, and hooked it up to the Dong Hai Jiu 101, a Chinese vessel that joined the search this year. The newly outfitted boat started traveling to the search area April 11, and once it arrives the Remora III will begin trying to detect the lost equipment.

"Recovery operations will then be undertaken," the center said, adding that the Remora III was also used to help recover debris from Air France Flight 447, which crashed into the Indian Ocean in 2009 after a mechanical malfunction and pilot error.

The MH370 searchers are no strangers to losing equipment, or even towfish. In January, the Fugro Discovery's $1 million towfish was knocked off when it ran into an underwater mud volcano. It was recovered in February.

A center spokesman told NBC News Wednesday the investigators were using three towfishes in total. He said didn't know whether the towfish lost in January was the same lost last month.

 

[mommylicious]

Is it too much to hope that while they're seeking out the missing equipment they happen to stumble upon the missing plane?

 

[watcher9]

Is it too much to hope that while they're seeking out the missing equipment they happen to stumble upon the missing plane?

No, it's not too much to hope for.
In fact, most people including me are hoping for the same thing!

 

[Pi Thoughts]

STENCILLED codes unique to Malaysia Airlines have proven almost beyond doubt two aircraft parts found in Mozambique are from the missing MH370.

The Australian Transport Safety Bureau has provided an update on the analysis carried out on the parts, including a flap track fairing and a segment of the horizontal stabiliser.

The flap track fairing was found in Mozambique in late December by a South African teenager holidaying with his family.

In late February, US blogger and lawyer Blaine Gibson found the section of horizontal stabiliser as part of his global mission to find answers for MH370 families.

The ATSB report reveals how the code “676EB” and the words “NO STEP” provided almost irrefutable evidence the parts were from the missing Boeing 777.

http://www.news.com.au/travel/trave...0/news-story/c118a580be38776bb7f35d100e202df5

 

[watcher9]

STENCILLED codes unique to Malaysia Airlines have proven almost beyond doubt two aircraft parts found in Mozambique are from the missing MH370.

The Australian Transport Safety Bureau has provided an update on the analysis carried out on the parts, including a flap track fairing and a segment of the horizontal stabiliser.

The flap track fairing was found in Mozambique in late December by a South African teenager holidaying with his family.

In late February, US blogger and lawyer Blaine Gibson found the section of horizontal stabiliser as part of his global mission to find answers for MH370 families.

The ATSB report reveals how the code “676EB” and the words “NO STEP” provided almost irrefutable evidence the parts were from the missing Boeing 777.

http://www.news.com.au/travel/trave...0/news-story/c118a580be38776bb7f35d100e202df5

Thanks for the update.
I think we all knew the debris was part of the plane, but now we have confirmation.

Here is the ATSB report which also shows where the parts were located on the plane.

https://www.atsb.gov.au/publications/investigation_reports/2014/aair/ae-2014-054/

 

[Roselvr]

STENCILLED codes unique to Malaysia Airlines have proven almost beyond doubt two aircraft parts found in Mozambique are from the missing MH370.

The Australian Transport Safety Bureau has provided an update on the analysis carried out on the parts, including a flap track fairing and a segment of the horizontal stabiliser.

The flap track fairing was found in Mozambique in late December by a South African teenager holidaying with his family.

In late February, US blogger and lawyer Blaine Gibson found the section of horizontal stabiliser as part of his global mission to find answers for MH370 families.

The ATSB report reveals how the code “676EB” and the words “NO STEP” provided almost irrefutable evidence the parts were from the missing Boeing 777.

http://www.news.com.au/travel/trave...0/news-story/c118a580be38776bb7f35d100e202df5

Glad to hear the codes match the stencils used. Photos below. At least it shows more that it is from the plane verses someone dumping pieces from a junk 777 plane.

 

[watcher9]

Yeah!
They found and recovered the towfish.
Also, the weight was recovered separately.

http://www.nbcnews.com/storyline/mi...ost-towfish-scanner-12-000-feet-under-n558996

 

[Tulessa]

Yeah!
They found and recovered the towfish.
Also, the weight was recovered separately.

http://www.nbcnews.com/storyline/mi...ost-towfish-scanner-12-000-feet-under-n558996

Wow!! :loveyou:

 

[Hope4More]

Wow!! :loveyou:

WOW indeed!!!! Such a long time to get even this far, but hopeful these confirmed finds will make it impossible for governments to give up before they find the main wreckage underwater.

 

[Roselvr]

WOW indeed!!!! Such a long time to get even this far, but hopeful these confirmed finds will make it impossible for governments to give up before they find the main wreckage underwater.

I don't think we can know how it feels to be in Australia's shoes, footing the main bill for the search. I honestly do not see them putting any more money out to search and if Malaysia wants to continue, they can pay for it.

Who pays for multilateral search and rescue missions, such as the one underway for Malaysia Airlines flight MH370?

Government of "host" country
The Convention on International Civil Aviation (also known as the Chicago Convention) requires that the country in which the accident occurs "institute an inquiry into the circumstances of the accident, in accordance, so far as its laws permit, with the procedure which may be recommended by the
International Civil Aviation Organization."

If the accident happens in international waters, the Convention requests that countries nearest the scene of the accident provide help "as they are able."

Government of country of registry
Under the aforementioned Convention, the country where the aircraft is registered is only required to conduct the investigation if the accident happened in international waters. Otherwise, the Convention simply notes that the country must be given the opportunity to appoint observers to be present at the inquiry conducted by the country in which the accident occurs.

However, most countries, whether by national law or sense of obligation, choose to actively participate in SAR missions.

Governments of other countries
As we have seen with this incident, other countries choose to get involved, whether because of national interest (e.g China in this case, given the number of its nationals on board) or diplomatic interest (e.g. the US in this case). As far as we know, no money has changed hands for this. However, often such aid can be positive for diplomatic relations as well as public opinion.

Also, it is worth noting that a significant portion of the cost for SAR is being incurred on an ongoing basis regardless of whether a mission is underway, as the resources are often kept on standby anyway.

Insurance companies
Aviation insurance policies vary, but generally speaking there is a provision for SAR. For the MH370 Incident, I would surmise insurance would only cover a small portion of the cost given the SAR mission's expansiveness.

Airlines and plane manufacturers
Airlines and plane manufacturers (including specific component manufacturers, as we've seen with Inmarsat) routinely participate in and provide technical support to SAR missions and investigations. However, in terms of actual financing, it is unusual for them to assist, partly because the SAR is meant to be impartial. The search for Air France Flight 447 was the first time that Airbus had offered to “sponsor” a search mission; the French Bureau of Investigations and Analyses also asked both Airbus and Air France to help pay for the prolonged search (see: Airbus Offers to Pay for Extended Crash Search).

The airline, of course, bears other related costs during this period of time such as aid to victims and their families (also covered to some extent by insurance).

The Cost of the Hunt: MH370 Search by Numbers - $130 million

The cost of covering the entire search area. In a multinational hunt led by Australian, Malaysian and Chinese authorities, the Chinese government has contributed about $14 million, including the sonar-equipped vessel Dong Hai Jiu 101.

Joint Agency Coordination Centre - Cost of the Search

The Australian Government has provided around $90 million as part of Australia's contribution to the search for Malaysia Airlines flight MH370, including $60 million towards the cost of the underwater search effort.

The final cost of the search will depend on a number of factors, including the outcome of procurement processes for specialist services, the length of the search and the extent of contributions from other countries. It is expected that the underwater search may cost up to $180 million.

On 28 August 2014, Australian Deputy Prime Minister, the Hon Warren Truss and Malaysian Minister for Transport Dato' Sri Liow Tiong Lai, signed the Memorandum of Understanding on Cooperation between the Government of Malaysia and the Government of Australia in relation to MH370. At that time, Malaysian Government committed to matching Australia's costs in the underwater search for MH370.

The People's Republic of China has committed $20 million in the form of funding and equipment.

In addition to the earlier commitment to match Australia's contribution of $60 million, Malaysia has agreed to fund the balance of the costs associated with searching the entire 120,000 square kilometre search area.

 

[watcher9]

Here's the weekly update from the Australian Transport Safety Bureau (ATSB) which includes the recovery operations for the towfish.

https://www.atsb.gov.au/mh370-pages/updates/operational-update/

 

[watcher9]

When a big airplane crashes into the ocean, does the main fuselage sink straight to the bottom or can the ocean current move it some distance away as it is sinking?

 

[ilovepierre]

When a big airplane crashes into the ocean, does the main fuselage sink straight to the bottom or can the ocean current move it some distance away as it is sinking?

I THINK the fuselage just sinks where it is.
I don't think ocean currents would be strong enough to carry it anywhere.1

IMO

 

[Roselvr]

Good question. Been watching deadliest catch where they battle huge waves, my guess would be that it may move some but I doubt it would be significant. I wonder how long it took to actually go under. I'm thinking of the plane in NY that landed in the water a few years ago, the plane was floating IIRC.

It still blows me away that Australia's radar didn't catch the plane

 

[watcher9]

Found this article dated 4/23/2016.

Malaysia received permission from both Mozambique and South Africa to search for the plane debris in their waters but have agreed to let each country lead in the searching at this time.

Also, a meeting with Malaysia, China and Australia will be scheduled in June to discuss any future searching, if any.

http://www.ibtimes.com/flight-mh370...rch-their-waters-after-2358541?rel=most_read1

 

[ilovepierre]

Good question. Been watching deadliest catch where they battle huge waves, my guess would be that it may move some but I doubt it would be significant. I wonder how long it took to actually go under. I'm thinking of the plane in NY that landed in the water a few years ago, the plane was floating IIRC.

It still blows me away that Australia's radar didn't catch the plane

The plane wouldn't have shown up on any country's radar due to the fact that the transponders were switched off.

 

[Roselvr]

The plane wouldn't have shown up on any country's radar due to the fact that the transponders were switched off.

Flight 370 Mystery: How Can a Jetliner Drop Off the Radar? By Mike Wall, Senior Writer | March 11, 2014 10:42am ET

Two radar systems - Air traffic controllers track commercial jets using two types of radar. "Primary" radar determines a plane's position by analyzing signals that bounce back off the aircraft; the "secondary" or "enhanced" type requests information from each plane, which is then sent by a piece of equipment aboard a jet known as a transponder.

Radar facilities are based on land, and each one has a range of about 200 miles (320 kilometers), McGuirk said. So passenger jets on transoceanic flights do go off the radar map for a period of time — but that doesn't mean nobody's keeping tabs on them.

"The flight crews use combinations of high-frequency (HF) radio, satellite-based voice communication and text-data networks to report to ATC [air traffic control] the exact time, position and flight level when the crossing begins," said Emily McGee of the Flight Safety Foundation, a nonprofit organization headquartered in Alexandria, Va.

"They then update ATC with voice or text progress reports at defined geographic locations and time intervals," McGee told Live Science via email. "Airlines file flight plans, and airplanes are expected to arrive at certain points by certain times. When an airplane crew fails to check in at its next checkpoint, that is when an alarm is raised. This case is an extremely rare event, especially with the highly technologically advanced aircraft in the air today."

Commercial jets can also fall off the map briefly when they fly at low altitudes because radar relies on line-of-sight contact. Mountains and other landforms can block the signals going to and from the closest radar stations, as can the curvature of the Earth.

As a result, low-flying jets can be tough to track continuously, especially if their transponders are disabled — a fact that terrorists took advantage of on 9/11. [9/11 Science: 10 Ways Terrorist Attacks Rocked America]

"The first thing that many of the hijackers did [on 9/11] was turn off the transponder," McGuirk said. "Once they turned off the transponders, then they turned the aircraft back toward whatever their target was."

Someone who wanted to steal the Malaysia Airlines jet could theoretically shut off the transponder and dip down to an altitude of 5,000 feet (about 1,520 meters) or so, he added, while cautioning how far-fetched that scenario is.

 

[bradfordsleuth]

Snipped by me to highlight points made in article.


MH370's resting place nearer Indonesia, investigators say
BTN News Friday, 06 May 2016
The search for the missing Malaysia Airlines B777 MH370 that mysteriously vanished more than two years ago on March 8 2014, could end as it began, with nothing.

United States-based author and investigator Jeff Wise says an unpublished new document from the French government indicates the plane could have come down closer to Indonesia in the north.


Wise says a report from the French meteorological agency determined a flaperon (believed to have been part of MH370) shows that, due to the extensive growth of marine organisms known as lepas on the flaperon, the debris fragment could not have drifted to Reunion from the current search area — but instead came from a site farther north, near Indonesia.

The findings agree with a new computer analysis by mathematician Brock McEwen, that shows that based on drift patterns of the flaperon and other likely MH370 debris fragments, the likely final resting place of the missing Malaysia Airlines plane is considerably north of the search area known as 'The Seventh Arc'.


http://www.impactpub.com.au/micebtn...ting-place-nearer-indonesia-investigators-say

The above bbm, is what most of us have thought all along. With only a handful of weeks left until the search comes to an end, I really wonder if they will ever find this aircraft!
What I keep hoping for is more debris to shift, drift, and be found washed up on one of the islands. Hopefully suitcases, cushions etc. will eventually wash ashore and provide more clues.
I really feel for these poor families who are still looking for answers and some hope for closure.

 

[Roselvr]

Snipped by me to highlight points made in article.


MH370's resting place nearer Indonesia, investigators say
BTN News Friday, 06 May 2016
The search for the missing Malaysia Airlines B777 MH370 that mysteriously vanished more than two years ago on March 8 2014, could end as it began, with nothing.

United States-based author and investigator Jeff Wise says an unpublished new document from the French government indicates the plane could have come down closer to Indonesia in the north.


Wise says a report from the French meteorological agency determined a flaperon (believed to have been part of MH370) shows that, due to the extensive growth of marine organisms known as lepas on the flaperon, the debris fragment could not have drifted to Reunion from the current search area — but instead came from a site farther north, near Indonesia.

The findings agree with a new computer analysis by mathematician Brock McEwen, that shows that based on drift patterns of the flaperon and other likely MH370 debris fragments, the likely final resting place of the missing Malaysia Airlines plane is considerably north of the search area known as 'The Seventh Arc'.


http://www.impactpub.com.au/micebtn...ting-place-nearer-indonesia-investigators-say

The above bbm, is what most of us have thought all along. With only a handful of weeks left until the search comes to an end, I really wonder if they will ever find this aircraft!
What I keep hoping for is more debris to shift, drift, and be found washed up on one of the islands. Hopefully suitcases, cushions etc. will eventually wash ashore and provide more clues.
I really feel for these poor families who are still looking for answers and some hope for closure.

So the plane is almost out of fuel and turns North. I have to wonder why. I really hope someone decides to take up the search if the plane isn't found.

Jeff Wise blog
MH370 Debris Questions Mount – April 29, 2016

Earlier this week the indomitable Brock McEwen completed a much-anticipated statistical analysis of where MH370 debris would most likely wash ashore given a presumptive start point within the current seabed search zone. It’s definitely worth a look, but for the moment I’ll stick to the punch line, which is that while it is quite possible for Indian Ocean currents to carry debris from the search zone to the discovery locations in the western Indian Ocean within the appropriate time frame, Brock was not able to run any simulations in which debris turned up in Africa/Madagascar/Réunion but not in Western Australia. No matter how he changed the parameters, the result came back the same: debris should have washed up in Western Australia long before it washed up anywhere else.

The gap between Brock’s simulations and the actual state of affairs—five pieces of debris in the western Indian Ocean, and none in Australia—indicates, as Brock points out, that “either something’s wrong with the model, or something’s wrong with the search.”

French Judiciary Report Raises Fresh Doubts About MH370 Debris – May 2, 2016

 

[watcher9]

So the plane is almost out of fuel and turns North. I have to wonder why. I really hope someone decides to take up the search if the plane isn't found.

Jeff Wise blog
MH370 Debris Questions Mount – April 29, 2016


View attachment 93962

French Judiciary Report Raises Fresh Doubts About MH370 Debris – May 2, 2016
View attachment 93961

Since you brought it up about turning back north, there is a comment at the end of this article that proposes about the same thing.

http://www.airtrafficmanagement.net/2014/06/mh370-what-does-inmarsat-ping-data-reveal/