GUILTY OH Pike Co., 8 in Rhoden Family Murdered Over Custody Issue, 4 Members Wagner Family Arrested #64

[Covert Operative]

IANAL, but I think its possible that the prosecution can add disclaimers or in some way verify correct information and make note of any claims Jake makes that they can't verify. Seems likely they can give instructions to the jury or somesuch. I've never heard of a case where a killer lied in his proffer and the prosecution was helpless to do anything about it. JMO

I am sure they can put forth their own findings about anything they find in the proffer to be different. They would not be helpless, or it could be null, if that was the route they wanted to go, but they may not want to null the proffer even if something was wrong.
He is on video making his statements, they cannot tell him what to say. They can deal with anything they have to after he confesses. I would have done the same thing, take the evidence, confession etc. and deal with any questionable things afterwards, if there were any.

 

[Cool Cats]

I do not believe they can control what he says in his proffer and make him leave things out and only put in what they can prove or that they want in there. I am pretty sure that would be misconduct.
G4 does not deserve any better treatment to me either, will he get anything better due to strategy or negotiations. Not sure.

Anything better? Better than what?

 

[Covert Operative]

[

Anything better? Better than what?

He should not get Better than life without. I am actually pro DP so I would have like to see the DP stay on the table but I understand their strategy and why they made that decision. Could he get less than LWOP, not sure.
I believe Betty was saying G4 did not deserve anything better than JW unless I misunderstood her post and I am pretty sure I did not. I agree with that.

 

[RAISINISBACK]

G4 should get the same sentence as Jake. No mercy. The R's didn't get any mercy so why should the W's.

JMO

 

[Cool Cats]

[


He should not get Better than life without. I am actually pro DP so I would have like to see the DP stay on the table but I understand their strategy and why they made that decision. Could he get less than LWOP, not sure.
I believe Betty was saying G4 did not deserve anything better than JW unless I misunderstood her post and I am pretty sure I did not. I agree with that.

Impossible to get anything other than LWOP because there are 8 murders plus 14 other charges. Each murder charge is a life sentence, 8 life sentences.

The 14 other charges = 60 years I heard.

 

[Covert Operative]

Impossible to get anything other than LWOP because there are 8 murders plus 14 other charges. Each murder charge is a life sentence, 8 life sentences.

The 14 other charges = 60 years I heard.

Those charges can be changed or some dropped if the state sees fit. I am not sure that we are allowed to say what we may hear so I will not comment on that part. Did you at one time think it was impossible that the DP would ever be dropped for any of them?

 

[Cool Cats]

Those charges can be changed or some dropped if the state sees fit. I am not sure that we are allowed to say what we may hear so I will not comment on that part. Did you at one time think it was impossible that the DP would ever be dropped for any of them?

No. Most defendants charged with the DP plead guilty in exchange for the DP being dropped.

This is how the DP charge is used most of the time, to get someone to turn state's evidence like Jake did, in exchange for dropping the DP.

Jake has LWOP and the others have the exact sane charges so they will all end up with LWOP. Only a plea deal with a guilty plea could change that <modsnip>

 

[Covert Operative]

No. Most defendants charged with the DP plead guilty in exchange for the DP being dropped.

This is how the DP charge is used most of the time, to get someone to turn state's evidence like Jake did, in exchange for dropping the DP.

Jake has LWOP and the others have the exact sane charges so they will all end up with LWOP. Only a plea deal with a guilty plea could change that and <modsnip>

Yes a lot of times that does happen with the DP. The majority of people I recall
(just in general) said the state would never agree to anything less. I saw people say that Dewine said they would never agree to less but I could never find where he said that.
Things happen in the course of a trial and in negotiations that we do not expect or like many times. I do not know the family so I cannot say what they would agree to do. I would say it would depend on a lot of factors.

 

[Betty P]

Those charges can be changed or some dropped if the state sees fit. I am not sure that we are allowed to say what we may hear so I will not comment on that part. Did you at one time think it was impossible that the DP would ever be dropped for any of them?

I assumed that LWOP was going to happen from the start, at least for those willing to work with the prosecution. But, JMO, I don't see any reason why the state should give even better deals to any of the other Wagners. They all committed aggravated murder x 8, plus all the other charges.

Evil, extremely dangerous people who should never be allowed outside prison walls for the rest of their natural lives.

Like these people

 

[Betty P]

[


He should not get Better than life without. I am actually pro DP so I would have like to see the DP stay on the table but I understand their strategy and why they made that decision. Could he get less than LWOP, not sure.
I believe Betty was saying G4 did not deserve anything better than JW unless I misunderstood her post and I am pretty sure I did not. I agree with that.

Yes, that's what I meant to say. GW4 probably killed at least one victim in cold blood, premeditated. He assisted in the murders of 7 others. Why should anyone who does that ever have a chance at parole?

There are lots of people in prison for most of their life for non-violent offenses - marijuana related crimes or for stealing a six pack at a convenience store. Why should any of the Wagners (even the Bible readers) be allowed out just because they only murdered one or two people instead of 5 or 6? Please...

 

[Johnny B Bad]

(They would not be helpless, or it could be null, if that was the route they wanted to go, but they may not want to null the proffer even if something was wrong)

So how many Sleuthers think that the (Proffer) is better evidence than the the guns and all the other stuff that was found in those 5 buckets not counting the 2 year investigation, JW,CN,RN,EW, BJM, LM, JM and George Wagner iv ex-wife as witness against the 3 remaining Wagner’s, you know we don’t know how the jury will vote but if it was me as a jury, I would have to vote guilty, I just hope that nobody tries to buy a jury off, JMO

 

[Betty P]

(They would not be helpless, or it could be null, if that was the route they wanted to go, but they may not want to null the proffer even if something was wrong)

So how many Sleuthers think that the (Proffer) is better evidence than the the guns and all the other stuff that was found in those 5 buckets not counting the 2 year investigation, JW,CN,RN,EW, BJM, LM, JM and George Wagner iv ex-wife as witness against the 3 remaining Wagner’s, you know we don’t know how the jury will vote but if it was me as a jury, I would have to vote guilty, I just hope that nobody tries to buy a jury off, JMO

All the evidence the prosecution has is good. It's more than good, it's excellent. Ignore the defense attorneys and the odd unbalanced family member who might try to argue otherwise. Not saying that's anyone here, but their POV is always floating around out there on social media, etc.

I also wonder why AW's attorneys, whose client possibly didn't actually murder anyone, isn't out in court banging the drum, claiming she's being railroaded and deserves a better deal? Why aren't they working overtime to take her case to trial, filing motions every other week claiming she's being treated unfairly? Why aren't they claiming she needs to go to trial because she's innocent, just because she forged some legal documents, etc.

JMO, it's because her attorneys accept that she and all the rest of the Wagners are guilty of murder.

 

[Covert Operative]

(They would not be helpless, or it could be null, if that was the route they wanted to go, but they may not want to null the proffer even if something was wrong)

So how many Sleuthers think that the (Proffer) is better evidence than the the guns and all the other stuff that was found in those 5 buckets not counting the 2 year investigation, JW,CN,RN,EW, BJM, LM, JM and George Wagner iv ex-wife as witness against the 3 remaining Wagner’s, you know we don’t know how the jury will vote but if it was me as a jury, I would have to vote guilty, I just hope that nobody tries to buy a jury off, JMO

 

[Covert Operative]

I can't pick one but I guess I would pick the evidence if I had to pick, which we would not have without the proffer. If the evidence was not retrievable I wonder would he have gotten the same deal for his confession. Probably.
What things do you think were in the buckets besides the Glock, 1911, part of the SKS and knife? The discovery list seems to imply there was one item in each bucket. Junks motions seems to imply that also. It is confusing to me in a way.

 

[Johnny B Bad]

All the evidence the prosecution has is good. It's more than good, it's excellent. Ignore the defense attorneys and the odd unbalanced family member who might try to argue otherwise. Not saying that's anyone here, but their POV is always floating around out there on social media, etc.

I also wonder why AW's attorneys, whose client possibly didn't actually murder anyone, isn't out in court banging the drum, claiming she's being railroaded and deserves a better deal? Why aren't they working overtime to take her case to trial, filing motions every other week claiming she's being treated unfairly? Why aren't they claiming she needs to go to trial because she's innocent, just because she forged some legal documents, etc.

JMO, it's because her attorneys accept that she and all the rest of the Wagners are guilty of murder.

IMO I really believe that AW was there that night, because the state named women shoes as evidence

 

[Johnny B Bad]

I can't pick one but I guess I would pick the evidence if I had to pick, which we would not have without the proffer. If the evidence was not retrievable I wonder would he have gotten the same deal for his confession. Probably.
What things do you think were in the buckets besides the Glock, 1911, part of the SKS and knife? The discovery list seems to imply there was one item in each bucket. Junks motions seems to imply that also. It is confusing to me in a way.

The cameras, Dana and Hanna May cell phones and the bugs they had on the Rhodens, IMO

 

[Betty P]

IMO I really believe that AW was there that night, because the state named women shoes as evidence

I've no doubt she was. GW4's shoe print was there, too. There's evidence linking all of them to the crime scenes.

I was using her as an example of a defendant whose attorney could just as easily be making a fuss like GW4's, but he's not. He accepts that his client is guilty of murder. GW4's is grandstanding and trying to make it appear his client is innocent.

 

[Betty P]

The cameras, Dana and Hanna May cell phones and the bugs they had on the Rhodens, IMO

Brass catchers, silencer parts, security/video cams, bug detector, etc. Anything that would have blood and DNA. The crime scenes were described as horrific and blood soaked, so there had to be a lot of blood on weapons, shoes, gloves, bullet proof vests, clothing, masks, etc.

 

[Covert Operative]

The cameras, Dana and Hanna May cell phones and the bugs they had on the Rhodens, IMO

That is not listed so I was not sure if any of that may be in the buckets or not. Seems they would have said Items 1 - 5 Bucket 2 as an example. I wonder if those things were disposed of somewhere else.

 

[Johnny B Bad]

That is not listed so I was not sure if any of that may be in the buckets or not. Seems they would have said Items 1 - 5 Bucket 2 as an example. I wonder if those things were disposed of somewhere else.

Has the prosecution let the public see a full disclosure of what was in the buckets, I would say not that would tamper with getting a good jury pool, IMO
I think we will see a whole lot more evidence as soon as the trials begin.