GUILTY OH - Pike Co, 8 in Rhoden Family Murdered Over Custody Issue, 4 Members Wagner Family Arrested #67

[Cool Cats]

CC you are an angel. Thank you for helping me as I get too tired trying to look up links. IMO you are a great help to this thread. Hugs for you.

Ditto to you Luv.

 

[altojack]

CC you are an angel. Thank you for helping me as I get too tired trying to look up links. IMO you are a great help to this thread. Hugs for you.

Isn't she just! Very helpful and so quick with it. It would take me days to locate what I wanted.
Take care of yourself RAISINISBACK, stay safe.

 

[altojack]

Watching Leonard on that video takes me back to his early chats with the media. He would not be quiet, speak his mind no matter what. What a man.

I remember the early days sometimes telling him to shush, through the screen of course, for fear he may say the wrong thing and get himself in trouble. He didn't care if he upset anyone as long as someone would hear him.

I reckon Charlie heard him. Loud and clear, but De Wine kept shutting Charlie down.

 

[RAISINISBACK]

I'll bet it was when the searches and laser focus came out that alot of people started agreeing with you.

But still it was really hard for people to believe anyone would do that over custody. Especially because most of the victims had nothing to do with having custody.

I felt it was amateur locals who had a beef over land/money/nefarious business etc...(Chris Sr main target)
Because of the way it was done. All those excessive gunshot wounds to the head are not the way drug "hit men" operate. The disorganized way it was handled at Chris's reeked of amateurs and non-professionals, and
they knew their way around too well going to 4 locations so they had to be from the area.

It was really staged at Kenneth's to look like a drug hit. Throwing dollar bills on him and one shot in the eye screamed "look we are mad over money." It looked too staged.

To target Kenny was to distract from the real motive and from the main family they were after.

I felt it was locals who would get caught on wiretaps discussing it amongst themselves. As time went on I felt more and more the Wagners were the locals and Hanna - not Chris Sr - was the main target. I never pegged them outright from the beginning like you did.

Good job. Wish I had been on here back then to hear your theories and everyone elses. I didn't come on until after arrests. Book'em Danno!

BBM
Because of the way it was done. All those excessive gunshot wounds to the head are not the way drug "hit men" operate.

I kind of had an inside track. My DIL is from Mexico, in an area where drug cartels are rampant. Her parents, siblings, most of her family still live there. My son lived in MX for over a year with a missionary group. (That's how he met my DIL) While people do get caught in crossfire between cartels who are at war (7 Le Baron church members as an example) that is not how cartels work.

I had my DIL talk to her mother and this is what her mom said. "If the cartel is after a target, they go to where that target is known to be. If the target's family is in the home with him/her they MIGHT kill them as not to leave any witnesses, but not usually since the point is to send a message, so they don't care who knows. They know the family left alive is never going to talk to LE anyway because they are too scared. If you talk, you die. They kill who they are after and leave. Killing women and especially children draws too much attention from the Federales. They try to keep a very low profile so not to get caught. Besides most cartel members have families themselves, so they don't really want to kill the target's family. They wear masks, get in and get out, firing as few shots as possible. They would NEVER go door to door or to four houses killing everyone in them, to kill a target. Usually they catch them out in a car or on the street. That is when innocent people get caught in the crossfire."

Remember her mom lives there and knows how the cartels operate. Believe it or not, cartel members have morals, a code so to speak. If you are involved in a cartel you are fair game since you knew what you were getting into, but family members are off limits since they are not in the cartel.

But since the American missionaries from the Le Baron church group were killed they are careful now not to have any running gun battles between themselves. I still know a lot of church missionaries working down there.

Plus hubby is retired LE so I had a lot of help with trying to figure it out.

JMO

 

[RAISINISBACK]

I'll bet it was when the searches and laser focus came out that alot of people started agreeing with you.

But still it was really hard for people to believe anyone would do that over custody. Especially because most of the victims had nothing to do with having custody.

I felt it was amateur locals who had a beef over land/money/nefarious business etc...(Chris Sr main target)
Because of the way it was done. All those excessive gunshot wounds to the head are not the way drug "hit men" operate. The disorganized way it was handled at Chris's reeked of amateurs and non-professionals, and
they knew their way around too well going to 4 locations so they had to be from the area.

It was really staged at Kenneth's to look like a drug hit. Throwing dollar bills on him and one shot in the eye screamed "look we are mad over money." It looked too staged.

To target Kenny was to distract from the real motive and from the main family they were after.

I felt it was locals who would get caught on wiretaps discussing it amongst themselves. As time went on I felt more and more the Wagners were the locals and Hanna - not Chris Sr - was the main target. I never pegged them outright from the beginning like you did.

Good job. Wish I had been on here back then to hear your theories and everyone elses. I didn't come on until after arrests. Book'em Danno!

BBM

It wasn't really over custody. It was over control. Jake was a garden variety domestic abuser. The most dangerous time for a victim of domestic violence is in the first year after they leave their abuser. HR had left him 8 months earlier.

A guy in Georgia who's wife left him because he was beating the heck out of her all the time, went to his wife's sisters home where she was staying, killed her, their kids, her sister, her BIL, their kids, and then drove 90 miles to kill his wife's parents and her brother. All because his wife wouldn't come back to him. He said he killed the others because they were keeping his wife from him. So yeah it's pretty common.

JMO

 

[RAISINISBACK]

Isn't she just! Very helpful and so quick with it. It would take me days to locate what I wanted.
Take care of yourself RAISINISBACK, stay safe.

@altojack

Thank you. Still no surgery date for open heart, if they can fix it. Still no match for a transplant.

 

[Dudly]

Watching Leonard on that video takes me back to his early chats with the media. He would not be quiet, speak his mind no matter what. What a man.

I remember the early days sometimes telling him to shush, through the screen of course, for fear he may say the wrong thing and get himself in trouble. He didn't care if he upset anyone as long as someone would hear him.

I reckon Charlie heard him. Loud and clear, but De Wine kept shutting Charlie down.

I have always thought that Reader had it figured out early on but DeWine and BCI were in charge and ignored him…

 

[altojack]

@altojack

Thank you. Still no surgery date for open heart, if they can fix it. Still no match for a transplant.

My thoughts are with you, and I'm praying that a match will be found if a fix isn't possible. My dad had open heart surgery, very stressful for the whole family. Just take things slow and steady xx

 

[altojack]

I have always thought that Reader had it figured out early on but DeWine and BCI were in charge and ignored him…

Oh Charlie definitely knew. I saw it in his face, heard it in his voice. Made me cry listening to him at those pressers.

I was here on WS at the start but not registered until I think September 2016. It's was hard to follow back in the early days wasn't it.

 

[Cool Cats]

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Custody not really mentioned except by Leonard and until laser focus and searches.

But it wasn't just all about custody as Raisin mentioned.

It was about control and along with that came the obsession.

Leonard Manley cocked his head and leaned in from the edge of the funeral home’s couch, when they asked what he needed.

“Whatchya’ mean?”

Union Hill Road

He opened his arms wide as if to offer an embrace: “My friends are here. My family is all here.

“What else could a man need?’’


Pike County: Death in the foothills

 

[LMDlong]

@altojack

Thank you. Still no surgery date for open heart, if they can fix it. Still no match for a transplant.

Praying for you

 

[RAISINISBACK]

That video was dated April 25th. LM said Saturday evening we had a big conflict up here with the deputies. I took that to mean that they had an issue the Saturday after the murders with the deputies at the homes/scenes.

There was an earlier interview with LM where he said deputies had been called out the weekend before the murders. He said the deputies sided with the other party the Wags. I remember discussing it through about 5 threads on here in the early days after the murders.

CC can you help with finding that one sweetie? I think it was on 4-16-16 - 4-18-16. TIA angel.

 

[Cool Cats]

There was an earlier interview with LM where he said deputies had been called out the weekend before the murders. He said the deputies sided with the other party the Wags. I remember discussing it through about 5 threads on here in the early days after the murders.

CC can you help with finding that one sweetie? I think it was on 4-16-16 - 4-18-16. TIA angel.

I can hunt around but
the one mentioned earlier is the first Leonard interview video that I know of, the 10 WBNS Columbus News Reporter asked where he lived and his last name.

They had to "know the family" and "2 dogs would eat you up" and "cops are snots." Dana would give you "the shirt off her back."

 

[Caylee Advocate]

Hopefully Leonard is now at peace, rest easy Lennie.


Leonard E Manley - View Obituary & Service Information

 

[RAISINISBACK]

I can hunt around but
the one mentioned earlier is the first Leonard interview video that I know of, the 10 WBNS Columbus News Reporter asked where he lived and his last name.

They had to "know the family" and "2 dogs would eat you up" and "cops are snots." Dana would give you "the shirt off her back."

He actually did a news interview the day of the murders at the road block right after the bodies were discovered, before the crime scene was processed. He was standing there beside a sheriff's car. They asked him who he thought did it and he started to say something, then thought better of it and said "That's all I am going to say about it right now." Then he said "the deputies were out here last weekend" I don't remember his exact words but he implied the deputies sided against the R and M's in that altercation. We discussed endlessly on here what he was going to say. We all agreed then he knew who did it or had a good idea.

Then one the next day or the day after. I don't remember exactly but he gave several in the first few days, even one at his house.

Maybe someone else remembers it. <modsnip>

 

[RAISINISBACK]

I can hunt around but
the one mentioned earlier is the first Leonard interview video that I know of, the 10 WBNS Columbus News Reporter asked where he lived and his last name.

They had to "know the family" and "2 dogs would eat you up" and "cops are snots." Dana would give you "the shirt off her back."

Thank you angel.

 

[Cool Cats]

D. Need link.

 

[RAISINISBACK]

D. Need link.

CC I think the one in the hollister shirt was done at his house.
The first one in the MGM hat may have been the interview he gave the first day. Can't think real well right now. But I know he gave one in the hours after the murders.

 

[Cool Cats]

He actually did a news interview the day of the murders at the road block right after the bodies were discovered, before the crime scene was processed. He was standing there beside a sheriff's car. They asked him who he thought did it and he started to say something, then thought better of it and said "That's all I am going to say about it right now." Then he said "the deputies were out here last weekend" I don't remember his exact words but he implied the deputies sided against the R and M's in that altercation. We discussed endlessly on here what he was going to say. We all agreed then he knew who did it or had a good idea.

Then one the next day or the day after. I don't remember exactly but he gave several in the first few days, even one at his house.

Maybe someone else remembers it. Am really tired tonight but will try to look tomorrow.

Depends on how high my blood oxygen is though. When it drops into the low 80's like 84, I get tired and sleep sometimes 16 hours. Hopefully this week when they come out they will set my oxygen machine on a higher level so it will raise my blood oxygen level. Then maybe I can stop having conversations with my fan at night thinking it's hubby. lol

All the old videos I find from Sheriff's car videos, including one where he is looking at a map, and one from his house, all come up with video not available.

Reader said some of the family was involved in two fights not reported to police before the murders.
https://www.wcpo.com/longform/pike-...lers-in-rhoden-family-homicides-may-be-locals

In one video Leonard says there are 2 possibilities to the murders but he "ain't gonna say."

In an interview I posted from the Daily Mail he says it could be road rage or child custody so I think he means these 2 things.

From delving back, other posters from past posts have made references to what you mention so I believe you are correct that in an early interview Leonard alluded to deputies coming around, altercations, and custody.

Be nice if all early videos were available.

The whole point is that there were altercations over custody that counter the Wagner's lies that everything was fine with custody.

And I think it is an important fact in the case that Leonard is the only one who brought up the conflict with custody, getting it right from the beginning when everyone else had a whole list of other issues it was about.

Scheiderer said George lied when he said everything was fine with custody and the prosecution can prove it. With witness testimony they can prove George was lying to cover for the Wagners, trying to show the Wagners have no motive.

The motive is important.

Now Jake himself can testify about that motive showing George lied, which shows George knew what was going on and was involved with the plot to cover it.

...2 Cents....

 

[Covert Operative]

G4

12/16/2021 SUBPOENA ISSUED TO RYAN SCHEIDERER (SERVICE BY COUNSEL) Attorney: NASH, JR, RICHARD M

12/16/2021 MOTION NO, 77 - DEFENDANT'S RENEWED MOTION TO COMPEL THE PRODUCTION OF "OTHER ACTS" EVIDENCE PURSUANT TO EVID.R. 404(B) FILED Attorney: PARKER, JOHN PATRICK Attorney: NASH, JR, RICHARD M

12/16/2021 MOTION NUMBER 76 - DEFENDANT'S MOTION IN LIMINE REQUESTING A PRETRIAL EVIDENTIARY HEARING TO DETERMINE THE ADMISSIBILITY OF SHOEPRINT EVIDENCE AND OPINIONS FILED Attorney: PARKER, JOHN PATRICK Attorney: NASH, JR, RICHARD M

12/16/2021 DEFENDANT'S MEMO CONTRA TO THE PROSECUTION'S MOTION TO PREVENT EDWARD "JAKE" WAGNER'S TESTIMONY FILED Attorney: PARKER, JOHN PATRICK Attorney: NASH, JR, RICHARD M