The Incinerator #2

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While I agree the description of DM was pretty good (I, for one, would never notice exact details, I'd be hard-pressed to remember the orange t-shirt let alone the type of shoe in any lighting), I truly believe a much bigger deal would have been made out of it had DM and MS stepoed into the Bosma home that night. They were going for a test-drive, not for a beer. I especially dont think a man like Tim would let two strangers in with his wife and sleeping child in the house, especially when one of the guys is wearing his hoodie up like a 🤬🤬🤬🤬. Add to that they came late which probably sruck the Bosmas as odd. The combination of these things spell an unlikelihood of Tim letting them step in and let's not get started on what SB would think. Trusting is one thing but I doubt the late Tim B was stupid and he would know letting these guys Iin wouldnt fly with the Mrs.

So far as the descriptions, some people notice more than others.
 
IMO we are missing something here..

1. DM & SM took TB for a TEST DRIVE in his RAM truck.SB gave a very good description SO SHE SAW THEM !....It matched test drive #1 driver ( forgetting intials )

2. they arrived late At the bosma household...and since that test drive TB has been killed.

3. A horrible INDIGNITY was done to his body....Burned <modsnip> beyond recognition on DM farm.....

<modsnip>....thank you robynhood....
 
As I suspected from the start ... the 50 barrels in the barn were of no significance and the whole barrel issue can be put to bed as far as the TB and LB investigation.

Several times I attempted to explain why it is not unusual for aviators to have a stash of them behind the hangar , or in an old barn , or in upper-volta for that matter

It took me a while to dig out some photos and here they are.

PILOTS LOVE OLD BARRELS !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :)

here is the proof .... gas cans too .... :) we got 'em everywhere !!!!

enjoy
 

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As I suspected from the start ... the 50 barrels in the barn were of no significance and the whole barrel issue can be put to bed as far as the TB and LB investigation.

Several times I attempted to explain why it is not unusual for aviators to have a stash of them behind the hangar , or in an old barn , or in upper-volta for that matter

It took me a while to dig out some photos and here they are.

PILOTS LOVE OLD BARRELS !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :)

here is the proof .... gas cans too .... :) we got 'em everywhere !!!!

enjoy

I never doubted ya Arnie! Your insight as to some of these matters has been very helpful, especially for those of us who are not pilots.
That sure is a heck of a lot of barrels!
I would not have ever thought where you see numerous barrels you might find an aviator.
 
I didn't associate barrels with aviators, either, until Arnie mentioned it on the search thread. It made sense when I thought about it.

Thanks for the pics, Arnie. :seeya:
 
There ya go, MsSherlock. You could be Toronto's new traffic reporter. :D
 
This is for you girls

courtesy of http://viking.twolaneroads.com/hughes-aircraft-and-the-269/

Even men love pink when we see this one
Arnie-it's not everyday that we have a crime centered around our local aviation community! Yes, barrels and gas cans are a fixation-now that I think about it, I have 15 gas cans of various shapes and sizes in my shed along with 3 random barrels that I brought to my home in the City when I sold my farm! Just never know when I may need them! :floorlaugh: If I'm flying to any place remote, it's not unusual for me to take an empty gas can-don't ask me why-guess I never know when I may have to go hiking for some 100LL !! :scared:

Thinking of the gas cans and barrels, I started to think about the chosen fuel option for the incinerator: propane. IMO, if I had access to all sorts of liquid fuels and was to buy a piece of equipment that needed a fuel source, I would probably lean towards a fuel I had easy access to: avgas, diesel, ethynol etc. IIRC, propane was an upgrade on this particular incinerator. However, once I watched the manufacturers video, I realized that the propane option may circumvent any potential fuel line issues.

IMO, it's an informative video to watch on the website. For the incinerator to work, it is necessary that it is connected to a power source to operate the fans etc. If the power source had to leave the scene, the incinerator shuts down automatically. With this in mind it would have made more sense for the incinerator to be close to the barn if there was hydro there. MOO

http://www.supernovamfg.com/
 
And if there was hydro in the barn, LE could call into the local Hydro One office and ask for a power consumption record to see if there are any spikes in use and if there are, when.
 
Arnie-it's not everyday that we have a crime centered around our local aviation community! Yes, barrels and gas cans are a fixation-now that I think about it, I have 15 gas cans of various shapes and sizes in my shed along with 3 random barrels that I brought to my home in the City when I sold my farm! Just never know when I may need them! :floorlaugh: If I'm flying to any place remote, it's not unusual for me to take an empty gas can-don't ask me why-guess I never know when I may have to go hiking for some 100LL !! :scared:

Thinking of the gas cans and barrels, I started to think about the chosen fuel option for the incinerator: propane. IMO, if I had access to all sorts of liquid fuels and was to buy a piece of equipment that needed a fuel source, I would probably lean towards a fuel I had easy access to: avgas, diesel, ethynol etc. IIRC, propane was an upgrade on this particular incinerator. However, once I watched the manufacturers video, I realized that the propane option may circumvent any potential fuel line issues.

IMO, it's an informative video to watch on the website. For the incinerator to work, it is necessary that it is connected to a power source to operate the fans etc. If the power source had to leave the scene, the incinerator shuts down automatically. With this in mind it would have made more sense for the incinerator to be close to the barn if there was hydro there. MOO

http://www.supernovamfg.com/

This is why I've wondered if they used some of the chemicals from the barrels in the incinerator. Lack of hydro in the bush. Unless of course they had a generator. Could that have been the large item covered in plastic forensics were carrying from the barn in the latest search? Maybe they were able to get TB's DNA or blood from it... MOO.
 
This is why I've wondered if they used some of the chemicals from the barrels in the incinerator. Lack of hydro in the bush. Unless of course they had a generator. Could that have been the large item covered in plastic forensics were carrying from the barn in the latest search? Maybe they were able to get TB's DNA or blood from it... MOO.

How much power does the incinerator need? Could you use a power inverter connected to the towing vehicle?
 
This is why I've wondered if they used some of the chemicals from the barrels in the incinerator. Lack of hydro in the bush. Unless of course they had a generator. Could that have been the large item covered in plastic forensics were carrying from the barn in the latest search? Maybe they were able to get TB's DNA or blood from it... MOO.

A generator would be my guess. From the supernova site:

from:
http://www.supernovamfg.com/prod_gen.html

SuperNova Manufacturing, Inc. has also designed and manufactured mobile units for equine and cattle farmers, mobile veterinarian operations, and drug task force agencies. We highly recommend diesel-fired burners for the mobile units. The appropriate generator, diesel tank, trailer size (weight capacity) will be dependent on the size of the incinerator that is being employed. The trailer, at the customer request, may use a gooseneck hitch or a standard hitch along with the hitch size of choice.
<bbm>
 
I've always figured that when they were at the farm they made a real racket. Moving the incinerator, running it, they would have had a few motors roaring.
 
Assuming the incinerator was used for whatever purposes in the location we have seen, that in itself is interesting. It would have been just as easy, if not easier, to have it located in proximity to the barn with access to the hydro. Plug in and go ... quiet, no need for a noisy generator with appropriate fuel having to be supplied, and poured and refilled as necessary.
 
Assuming the incinerator was used for whatever purposes in the location we have seen, that in itself is interesting. It would have been just as easy, if not easier, to have it located in proximity to the barn with access to the hydro. Plug in and go ... quiet, no need for a noisy generator with appropriate fuel having to be supplied, and poured and refilled as necessary.

I wonder though, do you think the power was on for the barn? Maybe DM was really never out at the barn, therefore no need to keep a power supply. Wouldn't he get a monthly bill for power to be on at the barn even if it wasn't really being used? Also, as we saw in some of the news reports, investigators were using flashlights. If the barn had power and lighting why did it seem so dark inside the barn and flashlights used at least that first day? Interesting IMHO.
 
It would be typical for a hangar like M.Air to have portable Honda type generators around , the same type used by campers to power lights or tv's , or homeowners in case of a power failure , they are fairly light and portable and one guy can lift one into the back of a truck.

They are noisy if you are trying to sleep next to one at the campground , but far out in a farm field they would be less noticeable . If DM and associates used power I expect that is how . The barn would be too close to prying eyes , traffic and neighbors .

At the best of times operating an incinerator would draw too much curious attention because nobody has ever seen one before , let alone seen a couple of young guys load it with unusual contents and operate it near a busy road.

The electrical power , by generator or otherwise , serves one main purpose and that is to run the small fans that push fresh air into the unit , without air , a fire will not burn. A small amount of power would also operate the timer if they used it.

I would be surprised if they carried a generator around day after day just in case they got lucky , so most likely everything went to the farm first , probably a trip back to town to get tools and generator , maybe different truck with the right hitch , or the large black trailer , and then complete the task early the next day (Tuesday)

That's presuming the incinerator was at the farm in the first place , .... if it was kept inside the barn it would have had bird crap all over it unless covered with a tarp. Probably stored outside . They are designed for that.

My guess is everything was completed by late Tuesday afternoon and then the "boys" went to DM's house .... I say that because in one TV interview a neighbor commented that "the guys" were in the back yard tues evening doing "remedial work" and there were "tools all around" ..... makes me wonder why the neighbor specifically remembered what happened tuesday because the arrest and publicity wasn't until 3-4 days later ..... unless he is the neighbor with the security camera and had reviewed it .

Random thoughts
--guys like TB would also have portable generators for construction , often in the back of work trucks , but I think the truck for sale was for towing the family fifth wheel camper unit , not for work , yet on the other hand maybe a generator for TB's camper .... it is a pretty long stretch and an amazing coincidence if TB's generator was there to be used.

-- my speculation is the incinerator was operated in one area , contents emptied into the woods (forensics was digging there) ,,,, incinerator then moved and parked where the neighbor photoed it , then the patch of ground where the incinerator was operated was flash burned with gasoline to burn off any bits of blood or clothing or evidence spread around while loading the machine. And /or burn the truck seats as well , there would be no other reason for the burned patch of ground. Certainly the incinerator itself would not have done it. One of the helicopters showed the forensic tent mounted over the burn patch , plus off a few feet in the actual bush were personnel removing soil and items , could have been some of the incinerator contents, or debris raked up after the flash burn. My speculations only.

--It would also be typical for the trailer DM took to races in Baja to have tools and a generator to power drills etc . Maybe the trailer (with generator) was brought to the farm , when finished , load TB truck and off they go. I suspect they did because looking at field tire tracks from the air indicate long turning radius of a truck and trailer but hard to tell if dual wheels (DM red Ram) . Trailer tracks could also be from towing the incinerator.
 
It would be typical for a hangar like M.Air to have portable Honda type generators around , the same type used by campers to power lights or tv's , or homeowners in case of a power failure , they are fairly light and portable and one guy can lift one into the back of a truck.

They are noisy if you are trying to sleep next to one at the campground , but far out in a farm field they would be less noticeable . If DM and associates used power I expect that is how . The barn would be too close to prying eyes , traffic and neighbors .

At the best of times operating an incinerator would draw too much curious attention because nobody has ever seen one before , let alone seen a couple of young guys load it with unusual contents and operate it near a busy road.

The electrical power , by generator or otherwise , serves one main purpose and that is to run the small fans that push fresh air into the unit , without air , a fire will not burn. A small amount of power would also operate the timer if they used it.

I would be surprised if they carried a generator around day after day just in case they got lucky , so most likely everything went to the farm first , probably a trip back to town to get tools and generator , maybe different truck with the right hitch , or the large black trailer , and then complete the task early the next day (Tuesday)

That's presuming the incinerator was at the farm in the first place , .... if it was kept inside the barn it would have had bird crap all over it unless covered with a tarp. Probably stored outside . They are designed for that.

My guess is everything was completed by late Tuesday afternoon and then the "boys" went to DM's house .... I say that because in one TV interview a neighbor commented that "the guys" were in the back yard tues evening doing "remedial work" and there were "tools all around" ..... makes me wonder why the neighbor specifically remembered what happened tuesday because the arrest and publicity wasn't until 3-4 days later ..... unless he is the neighbor with the security camera and had reviewed it .

Random thoughts
--guys like TB would also have portable generators for construction , often in the back of work trucks , but I think the truck for sale was for towing the family fifth wheel camper unit , not for work , yet on the other hand maybe a generator for TB's camper .... it is a pretty long stretch and an amazing coincidence if TB's generator was there to be used.

-- my speculation is the incinerator was operated in one area , contents emptied into the woods (forensics was digging there) ,,,, incinerator then moved and parked where the neighbor photoed it , then the patch of ground where the incinerator was operated was flash burned with gasoline to burn off any bits of blood or clothing or evidence spread around while loading the machine. And /or burn the truck seats as well , there would be no other reason for the burned patch of ground. Certainly the incinerator itself would not have done it. One of the helicopters showed the forensic tent mounted over the burn patch , plus off a few feet in the actual bush were personnel removing soil and items , could have been some of the incinerator contents, or debris raked up after the flash burn. My speculations only.

--It would also be typical for the trailer DM took to races in Baja to have tools and a generator to power drills etc . Maybe the trailer (with generator) was brought to the farm , when finished , load TB truck and off they go. I suspect they did because looking at field tire tracks from the air indicate long turning radius of a truck and trailer but hard to tell if dual wheels (DM red Ram) . Trailer tracks could also be from towing the incinerator.
Thanks Arnie - I think you're pretty close to what may have happened that night. Looking back at it, it's too easy for us to assume that everything went down in a calm cool organized fashion. In reality, chances are it was chaos.
However, even a little honda generator would amplify thru the spring evening air, so conducting the burn in the daylight would make much more sense, especially when we consider that they wouldn't have been at the farm until 10:30 or 11 pm. I follow you on the separate burn areas caused by regular fires burning evidence. MOO

The fact is that the incinerator when used correctly produces sterile ash. Pretty hard to quickly ID the contents, so with the rapid ID'ing of TB, IMO, we have to assume that something was left behind-either the burn wasn't complete or an article or body part didn't make it into the incinerator. If the burn was done in the daytime, IMO, the likelihood of leaving damning evidence behind isn't as great as if it was done under a tremendous amount of stress and uncertainty in the dark. MOO

It's strange though that the manufacturer recommends a diesel fuel supply for their portable units- the biggest difference between propane and diesel IMO, would be cold weather performance: http://www.globalp.com/news/article.cfm?articleID=274 IMO, DM would have had easy access to either fuel. MOO

"It's like a crematorium," the officer said. "How his body was disposed of would make the hair on the back of anyone's neck curl up."
http://www.sunnewsnetwork.ca/sunnews/canada/archives/2013/05/20130516-090354.html
 
I'd have more confidence in the "officer's" statements if s/he were named.

I've always thought that if the incinerator were used, the job was botched. Like other aspects of this case, it fits with my impression of a clown shoes operation with one dumb fool at the helm directing a couple of dumber fools.
 
Very early information provided by police. We learnt very early once TB was found, LE would not disclose where his body was found, or at least it wasn't made clear until day(s) later when it was confirmed he was found on the farmland. One thing I believe would be obvious to LE is whether or not TB's body was found IN the incinerator. This article makes me believe he was not found in the incinerator as they were not sure if it was used. So was TB's remains found in a burn barrel as mentioned in RM video link below, in the bush or just lying out in the open? MOO.

Bosma&#8217;s body was found at either the farm or the hangar. An incinerator was found on the farm property, but police say they&#8217;re not sure if the incinerator is connected to the death of Bosma, whose body was found burned.

Read more: http://kitchener.ctvnews.ca/investi...n-with-dellen-millard-1.1286519#ixzz2gXBGl39h

Ross McLean, Crime Specialist Interview on Tim Bosma Murder
[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vFDhn6rOuBA"]Ross McLean, Crime Specialist Interview on Tim Bosma Murder - YouTube[/ame]
 
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