GUILTY UK - Helen Bailey, 51, Royston, 11 April 2016 #4

[Tortoise]

I don't suppose he had anyone to help him with his luggage on holiday either.

 

[snoopydog]

I don't suppose he had anyone to help him with his luggage on holiday either.

And he even said himself she was slim....


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Joely 123]

And he plays bowls, it was mentioned, which is quite strenuous as far as I know!

I thought IS just watched his Son, JS, playing bowls.

 

[cottonweaver]

And he even said himself she was slim....


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

path said she was under 12 stone IIRC.

 

[Squamous]

path said she was under 12 stone IIRC.

And that was after immersion in liquid for three months, from the look of photographs of her in life I suspect that has added a lot to her weight.

She was 5' 8.5" by my reckoning too, so IS didn't get that right.

 

[Florrie]

Forgive me if I am being dim but there was some discrepancy in how sheets etc were dried as far as I recall. Didn't JS say that bedding was usually dried hanging over doors and furniture whereas the cleaner says in the dryer.

Did I understand that correctly?

Can only think that if this is the case and IS then had this lot dried in the dryer was he washing away evidence?

And of course drying everything in a different way from what was usual indicates he did not expect Helen to return.

I guess the Prosecution are establishing that IS behaved very differently following 11th April.

Not putting my thoughts well


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

 

[cottonweaver]

I thought IS just watched his Son, JS, playing bowls.

"Ian played bowls for a local Bassingbourn club." ( CPriest's evidence today)

here's a pic of BBClub members in 2015. Couldn't find a members listing for them online- only a quick mooch though.
http://www.royston-crow.co.uk/sport...deliver_2015_league_and_cup_success_1_4262903

( only 12 of the 24 members are in the linked pic.)

 

[hayaletcatcher]

I am so behind again but thank you so much for this Aylce, I couldn't find it and thought I was getting confused.


[quote name=&quot;hayaletcatcher&quot; post=13106215]I'm not 100% caught up yet but having just read the post about the sons on the stand and the Monday missing vs Tuesday's note, it made me remember something I now can't find. Wasn't there some differing stories about what happened in the previous days, over the weekend? One story was they was all there and Helen was cooking Shepherds Pie on Sunday but one person wasn't there that Sunday and it was actually Saturday? I can't remember seeing if that had been cleared up? Or did i completely get the wrong end of the stick?<br />
*going to catch up no so if this is now a moot point please ignore*[/QUOTE]<br />
<br />
You are correct. There is discrepancy in the evidence given for the week end prior to Monday April 11.<br />
<br />
<font color="#0000CD">Jamie's evidence<br />
The weekend before April 11 there was<b> nothing unusual at all</b>. We spent the Saturday night watching TV. It was hard to remember what happened because it was so normal.<br />
“Helen had made a cottage pie for us all. There was <b>nothing untoward at all</b> about that evening.”</font><br />
<br />
<font color="#B22222">Olivers evidence<br />
On a normal Friday night Oliver would drive home from work, see his dad, have a shower and wait for his girlfriend to finish work, he said.<br />
“On the Sunday (April 10, 2016) I popped back to the house to collect work clothes for Monday. I remember seeing Helen, who asked if I wanted any food and I said no. “I popped into the lounge to see dad and Jamie. I was at the house no more than 20 minutes.<br />
“I spent the night at my girlfriend’s parents house, and went directly to work.<br />
</font><br />
<br />
<font color="#008000">AM ( Olivers gf )<br />
Girlfiend of Oliver Stewart is today's first witness<br />
The first witness is Alexandra Mcgarry, who is the girlfriend of Stewart’s son, Oliver Stewart. She tells the court she met Oliver through hockey. She is being asked about the weekend in particular before Helen went missing.<br />
“On the Saturday before Helen went missing, I went shopping with Oliver to Cambridge.<br />
“After this Oliver dropped me off at mine to pick up my car and then I drove to his and stayed at his this evening. I remember <b>Helen looking quite stressed that particular evening, she didn’t say hi, she kept her head down </b>and just walked into the kitchen.<br />
“I heard she was in her jeep and got very anxious, so I thought it could be to do with that.” <br />
On Sunday, she seemed in better spirits. We woke up, had some breakfast, I drive home, Oliver had some college work to do and I wanted him to concentrate on that so he stayed at his and I went back home.<br />
Alex said she was aware the police had been round and were asking lots of questions. She is being asked about Helen in the weeks before these events.<br />
“I very rarely stayed at Oliver’s so I can’t really comment. <b>On the Saturday (April 9) she seemed very stressed</b>. I got the impression she didn’t really like me staying over.<br />
</font><br />
<br />
<br />
<font color="#A52A2A">IS evidence<br />
He talks about J and O playing football on Sunday afternoon in the garden.<br />
</font><br />
<br />
The two things that stand out for me. <br />
The everything was normal comments are contradicted by the girlfriend saying there was tension - at least on the Saturday evening.<br />
OS saying he was at the house for 20 minutes only on Sunday. Girlfriend says he stayed home on Sunday to study and IS also says he was there during the day - his statement said Oliver was there Sunday afternoon playing football
Sent from my D5803 using Tapatalk

 

[faybradshaw]

I thought IS just watched his Son, JS, playing bowls.

He evidently plays for a local bowls club - his friend giving evidence this morning

 

[Joely 123]

[FONT=&amp]11:15[/FONT]
[FONT=&amp]'Helen had left note'

“When I went round to see Ian he said he had no idea where she was.
“She didn’t have a phone or a coat. She had left a note which he couldn’t find. He thought he might have thrown it away. He checked everywhere he thought she might be. I was with Ian for a couple of hours. We had a cup of tea. I was there to support him. (this was Monday, April 18 - following disappearance) He mentioned her car was still there. But Helen would quite often leave her car and take the train. She didn’t like driving.”

http://www.cambridge-news.co.uk/news/cambridge-news/helen-bailey-murder-trial-jury-12538102
[/FONT][/QUOTE
'She didn't have a phone or a Coat', as stated by IS to his friend.
And yet when Jamie S gave evidence at 14.43 on his day in Court, he said that they had searched the house, and believed that Helen's green wax jacket (or coat) was missing, along with wellies - and also Boris's yellow collar and 'go to' lead.
Apart from this possible contradiction in evidence of coat or no coat - where is Boris's yellow collar (and lead) - this is something that would be very easy to find. Most people have a regular place for collars and leads.
I may not be able to say where a coat is - but I always know where leads and collars are hanging.

 

[Squamous]

I don't know if the collar and lead have ever been found?

 

[Joely 123]

"Ian played bowls for a local Bassingbourn club." ( CPriest's evidence today)

here's a pic of BBClub members in 2015. Couldn't find a members listing for them online- only a quick mooch though.
http://www.royston-crow.co.uk/sport...deliver_2015_league_and_cup_success_1_4262903

( only 12 of the 24 members are in the linked pic.)

Oh! thank you cottonweaver - that is interesting and I completely missed his friend C Priest stating this.

 

[cottonweaver]

Oh! thank you cottonweaver - that is interesting and I completely missed his friend C Priest stating this.

no probs, we had lot of witnesses today. I hadn't looked properly this morning during trial, since had another look and have found the stewarts here, 2007 though!

http://www.royston-crow.co.uk/sport/trio_make_it_a_first_for_buntingford_1_267030
"- BASSINGBOURN notched another two wins in the Cambridge & District League Division 1.

Two wins this week, have given the club the perfect platform, with Bassingbourn edging away from the chasing pack - led by next week's opponents Sawston.

First up for Bassingbourn was a trip to Mitchell Lodge in Swaffam Prior. Oliver Stewart made his debut on rink one, and helped his teammates to a convincing 23-13 win.

The league leaders then claimed a 17-10 win on rink two, while Ian Stewart, Dave Lester, and Val Francis had a comprehensive 17-9 victory.

Bassingbourn completed the rout with another comfortable win, this time 30-4.

Overall, Bassingbourn won by a 50 shots, with the home side suffering their biggest defeat to date.

Bassingbourn then entertained Chesterton in what was another impressive performance, and started the night in style with a 17-7 win courtesy of Graham Parrish, Andy Brown, and Bob Stevenson.

That was followed by Bill Manley, Don Slater, and Sid Manning's hard-fought 18-13 victory, while in another tight game Ken Clark, Joe Cippulo, and Jamie Stewart came out on top with a 23-14 win.

And despite getting off to a terrible start, Ian Stewart, Dave Lester, and Don Laing clawed their way back after trailing 11-2 to claim a well-earned 18-16 victory."

and another http://www.royston-crow.co.uk/sport/ken_leads_the_way_as_bassingbourn_go_top_1_265160

 

[DollyDiamond]

And that was after immersion in liquid for three months, from the look of photographs of her in life I suspect that has added a lot to her weight.

She was 5' 8.5" by my reckoning too, so IS didn't get that right.

Yes, not to be too graphic here but dead bodies left in liquid absorb it in large volume - no way was Helen nearly 12 stones on the day she was murdered and I hope the Prosecution will make that clear to the jury, as the pathologist's report could possibly be misleading. Obviously her weight is an important factor in terms of his ability to transport her

 

[Interested Bystander]

Very interesting post. I don't mean to disrespect those who genuinely suffer from this rare disorder but it does strike me as odd that he claims he can't do a desk job. He's a self-proclaimed 'computer expert' not a manual labourer! However as you say, it is patently ludicrous, not to say desperate, to argue (as the defence will) that a grown man in his fifties was unable to drag the body of a woman to the garage, a matter of yards, with the help of a duvet cover or similar. No one is even suggesting he carried her!

It should be possible as long as the job is not stressful in any sense because that can play a huge part with energy reserves. I was describing how I was before treatment which was quite different after diagnosis and treatment. As yet we don't know exactly what his status is. If he is genuine he will get very tired, very easily. It is no picnic even with treatment but with care he should be able to do something, I would have thought.

 

[Joely 123]

Thing is zopiclone have a chemical taste. I've had horrible tasting supplements but they usually taste or smell of something gross that's herby


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I have googled 'why do herbal vitamins taste so bad?' And there are comments on forums - saying such as 'in the industry we do not sweeten them to protect accidents with children' - and 'they make me want to puke'.

I was also thinking if Helen may have been recommended (in her searches) to use Mexican Yam, which I was by a herbalist as a natural antidote to the Menopause. And is brilliant - and comes in capsules.
No doubt IS has thrown away her products in her 'medicine cabinet' and IF so, why so? Nobody would throw out their 'missing partner's' belongings .. and most people, as Helen said in her book, can't even begin to face it when a beloved has died.
If he can clear her online history to support his 'innocence' he can hope to destroy her personal products - but he needs to answer the question, WHY!!!

 

[Alyce]

The Zopiclone are so powerfully nasty, I can't imagine you wouldn't be aware of a bitter taste/aftertaste (even the next day, in my experience of taking them for insomnia), but I guess Helen just put that down to some other tablet she was taking.

Thanks Dolly. I was thinking of maybe in a capsule. I am hopeless at taking tablets but I have learnt how to almost throw capsules to the back of my mouth, large gulp of water and no taste at all.
Although, if I understand it right, it is the chemical reaction within the body afterwards that brings on the metallic taste ? but as you say, Helen probably thought it was just one of the herbal ones.

 

[Squamous]

I haven't had zopiclone but I have had a really gopping antibiotic and I'm sure that came through taste wise even if it didn't touch the sides on the way down. In fact it came with a warning that if you were breastfeeding it would make your milk taste bad, so yes, it's not always as simple as it tasting bad in the mouth.

 

[Joely 123]

Forgive me if I am being dim but there was some discrepancy in how sheets etc were dried as far as I recall. Didn't JS say that bedding was usually dried hanging over doors and furniture whereas the cleaner says in the dryer.

Did I understand that correctly?

Can only think that if this is the case and IS then had this lot dried in the dryer was he washing away evidence?

And of course drying everything in a different way from what was usual indicates he did not expect Helen to return.

I guess the Prosecution are establishing that IS behaved very differently following 11th April.

Not putting my thoughts well


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

I also remembered someone saying bedding was draped on dining room chairs at Royston - and checked on JS's time in Court, but can't see him saying this in the script.
But you're right Florrie - any distinction in IS methods differing from Helen's are interesting to the prosecution - asking the reasons for his 'new' methods.

 

[Joely 123]

I don't suppose he had anyone to help him with his luggage on holiday either.

Brilliant!! Tortoise x