GUILTY UK - Nurse Lucy Letby, murder of babies, 7 Guilty of murder verdicts; 8 Guilty of attempted murder; 2 Not Guilty of attempted; 5 hung re attempted #38

[Marantz4250b]

It's still legally privileged information. She's just waived that so that her new barrister, MM, can see the info and present evidence to the CCRC.

At least, that's how I understand it.

 

[WaneLyrical]

Why is that? I was thinking it would be open access at that point.

waiving privilege doesn’t change anything from the public’s perspective. What is does is allows the CCRC to interview Myers directly.

Edit: just to be clear, the CCRC wont use McDonald as a middle man for their information gathering. If they want to know why no experts were called by the defence, they go straight to Myers for that information.

 

[imstilla.grandma]

New medical research has been published which casts serious doubt on claims of an expert panel that child killer Lucy Letby is innocent and the victim of a miscarriage of justice, the Daily Mail has learned.

The former neonatal nurse's legal team have lodged reports from 26 medics, led by retired Canadian neonatologist Professor Shoo Lee, with the Criminal Cases Review Commission (CCRC), in a bid to get her free.

In a press conference last year, Prof Lee announced his panel of experts had concluded that medical evidence presented to convict Letby had been flawed

New research cast doubts on evidence submitted to help free Lucy Letby

Lucy Letby's defence team say new medical evidence has been submitted to the Criminal Cases Review Commission in a bid to have her convictions quashed.

www.dailymail.co.uk

 

[Sweeper2000]

New medical research has been published which casts serious doubt on claims of an expert panel that child killer Lucy Letby is innocent and the victim of a miscarriage of justice, the Daily Mail has learned.

The former neonatal nurse's legal team have lodged reports from 26 medics, led by retired Canadian neonatologist Professor Shoo Lee, with the Criminal Cases Review Commission (CCRC), in a bid to get her free.

In a press conference last year, Prof Lee announced his panel of experts had concluded that medical evidence presented to convict Letby had been flawed

New research cast doubts on evidence submitted to help free Lucy Letby

Lucy Letby's defence team say new medical evidence has been submitted to the Criminal Cases Review Commission in a bid to have her convictions quashed.

www.dailymail.co.uk

Genuinely so interesting. I believe it was said at trial that all of the happenings after a air embolism simply couldn't be stated with utter certainty as it was so rare and you can't give babies air embolism to see what happens. One of the things that came off bad about dr Lee was he tried to present as an authority on the matter.

Thanks @Marantz4250b. Thanks @WaneLyrical

 

[katydid23]

waiving privilege doesn’t change anything from the public’s perspective. What is does is allows the CCRC to interview Myers directly.

Edit: just to be clear, the CCRC wont use McDonald as a middle man for their information gathering. If they want to know why no experts were called by the defence, they go straight to Myers for that information.

Exactly, and I can't wait for that to happen.

Meyers couldn't call any of his 'available' experts to the stand because he knew they were going to get hammered by the prosecution's evidence.

He didn't have any credible defense experts to offer to the jury. He ended up hoping they'd go for a reasonable doubt verdict---but if he had put any of his medical experts up, the Crown would have eaten them up and lost them the possibility for reasonable doubt, imo.

 

[katydid23]

New medical research has been published which casts serious doubt on claims of an expert panel that child killer Lucy Letby is innocent and the victim of a miscarriage of justice, the Daily Mail has learned.

The former neonatal nurse's legal team have lodged reports from 26 medics, led by retired Canadian neonatologist Professor Shoo Lee, with the Criminal Cases Review Commission (CCRC), in a bid to get her free.

In a press conference last year, Prof Lee announced his panel of experts had concluded that medical evidence presented to convict Letby had been flawed

New research cast doubts on evidence submitted to help free Lucy Letby

Lucy Letby's defence team say new medical evidence has been submitted to the Criminal Cases Review Commission in a bid to have her convictions quashed.

www.dailymail.co.uk

New research cast doubts on evidence submitted to help free Lucy Letby

Lucy Letby's defence team say new medical evidence has been submitted to the Criminal Cases Review Commission in a bid to have her convictions quashed.

www.dailymail.co.uk

"She couldn't have injected the infants with air, Prof Lee insisted, because he had trawled the medical literature and failed to find a single case where venous air embolism - air in the veins – had caused a bright pink rash with bluish-purple skin, which, the trial heard, was seen on several of the infants who died.

Only arterial air embolism – air in the arteries – could cause the distinctive rash, which Prof Lee nicknamed the ‘Lee sign,’ he said.

But, the Daily Mail can reveal, new research published by a neonatologist in Taiwan as recently as October appears to contradict this claim.
....snipped for space...

And at least four other papers on air embolism, published between 1981 and the present day, have been missed, or wrongly interpreted, by Prof Lee, experts say.


The Daily Mail has also spoken to an independent senior neonatologist, not involved in Letby’s trial, who said Prof Lee is incorrect to say that venous air embolism cannot lead to a similar blotchy skin rash or patchy discolouration.

Professor Paul Clarke, who works at Norfolk and Norwich University Hospitals NHS Trust, and is also an honorary professor at the University of East Anglia Medical School, said it is ‘entirely possible’ for air that is injected into a baby’s veins to end up in the arteries, or arterial circulation, via either a small hole between the right and left side of the heart, or a blood vessel that connects the pulmonary artery and the aorta."

 

[katydid23]

New research cast doubts on evidence submitted to help free Lucy Letby

Lucy Letby's defence team say new medical evidence has been submitted to the Criminal Cases Review Commission in a bid to have her convictions quashed.

www.dailymail.co.uk

ALSO, that article made another very important point:


over his 30-year career, he had only ever heard of one fatal case during his clinical practice, which occurred in the 1990s when a junior doctor forgot to flush the air from a venous catheter before it was inserted into a baby’s belly button.

Many of the doctors at the Countess of Chester Hospital told Letby’s trial that they had never seen such an unusual rash before or since.

Referring to the deaths of Babies A, D and E – infants murdered by Letby within a three-month period in summer 2015 – Prof Clarke added: ‘If three air-embolism deaths have occurred in such a short period of time in a single neonatal unit, that speaks for itself.’


WHAT did Dr Lee say in response to this rebuttal of his accusations?

Prof Lee told the Daily Mail: 'The international expert panel of course welcomes scrutiny of our findings by those in the medical profession - however, respectfully, the interpretation of my paper in this instance is incorrect.'
That is a pretty weak response to such a detailed rebuttal of his arguments, imo.

 

[Marantz4250b]

It's quite the coincidence that this chap has spoken up now, right after LL has waived privilege. That's a very detailed article which I doubt was knocked up in a couple of hours.

Maybe it's just my jaded cynicism, but I wonder if there's some connection here?

 

[Baileyboo]

It's quite the coincidence that this chap has spoken up now, right after LL has waived privilege. That's a very detailed article which I doubt was knocked up in a couple of hours.

Maybe it's just my jaded cynicism, but I wonder if there's some connection here?

His research paper has already been sent to the CCRC.

 

[Parker Knoll]

‘however, respectfully, the interpretation of my paper in this instance is incorrect.'

Weak but entirely expected of him.

 

[Sweeper2000]

Big thanks to whomever gifted me the account upgrade. Very lovely of you

 

[Parker Knoll]

The DM podcast is so interesting today.
I will look up the research papers he quoted from later and post them here for anyone not subscribed as it’s behind a paywall.

 

[Parker Knoll]

Here are the three cases he relies on.
The first two require an account / subscription but the last one which was the latest only in 2025 you can see both text and photos of air embolism clearly.
I don’t think we have ever seen this before.

Paraplegia due to peripheral venous air embolus in a neonate: a case report - PubMed

https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/j.1556-4029.2006.00307.x

https://www.pediatr-neonatol.com/article/S1875-9572(25)00162-7/fulltext?utm_source=chatgpt.com

 

[marynnu]

Here are the three cases he relies on.
The first two require an account / subscription but the last one which was the latest only in 2025 you can see both text and photos of air embolism clearly.
I don’t think we have ever seen this before.

Paraplegia due to peripheral venous air embolus in a neonate: a case report - PubMed

https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/j.1556-4029.2006.00307.x

https://www.pediatr-neonatol.com/article/S1875-9572(25)00162-7/fulltext?utm_source=chatgpt.com

I wonder if any of the staff who saw the rashes have seen these photos? It would be interesting to know what they think.

 

[Parker Knoll]

It would wouldn’t it ?

Letby as we all remember was asked to go and get a camera so the rash could be recorded but SURPRISINGLY she didn’t get back in time with one.
Mmmm.

 

[Sweeper2000]

TO ANYONE who is thinking of opening those med files BE WARNED. It couldn't be more SAD and UPSETTING, VERY GRAPHIC.

 

[Sweeper2000]

I find it striking just how much that last med file and even the medical description hit the bell on what we heard about the coch staff saw during so many of the events. Its almost word for word and even graphically so similar.

I have no doubt now that these are indeed applicable to the cases. The similarity is just so striking.

×××× m× how on earth did she see all of this happening and just play ignorant? She saw all of that and more and knew she did it but didnt care at all. That is just beyond effin words. What in the actual flying ××××ery
I mean I knew about all of the symptoms but never anything that graphic and panic inducing? I genuinely find it beyond description.

That's pretty much put it into perspective for me. Damn that b is evil

 

[joltz]

The faithful have been rushing to try and discredit this new information as expected. I feel like they are quite a small bunch, the same posters, some with alts. They can try and spin it as they might but its another nail in the coffin for Letbys prospects.

 

[joltz]

I find it striking just how much that last med file and even the medical description hit the bell on what we heard about the coch staff saw during so many of the events. Its almost word for word and even graphically so similar.

I have no doubt now that these are indeed applicable to the cases. The similarity is just so striking.

×××× m× how on earth did she see all of this happening and just play ignorant? She saw all of that and more and knew she did it but didnt care at all. That is just beyond effin words. What in the actual flying ××××ery
I mean I knew about all of the symptoms but never anything that graphic and panic inducing? I genuinely find it beyond description.

That's pretty much put it into perspective for me. Damn that b is evil

The people obsessed with her innocence seem to have no overall awareness whatsoever. They try to hone in on particular aspects of the case and fill in the blanks with misinformation. Right from the off something wasn't right, hence asking for the camera. Add to this, the fact that these collapses and deaths for baby A, B and C, happened on the first, second and third nightshift that Letby worked after she gained her QIS qualification. Is that not a big fat red flag right there? As soon as she gained the access that she previously didn't have and did nights, she struck.

 

[Sweeper2000]

The people obsessed with her innocence seem to have no overall awareness whatsoever. They try to hone in on particular aspects of the case and fill in the blanks with misinformation. Right from the off something wasn't right, hence asking for the camera. Add to this, the fact that these collapses and deaths for baby A, B and C, happened on the first, second and third nightshift that Letby worked after she gained her QIS qualification. Is that not a big fat red flag right there? As soon as she gained the access that she previously didn't have and did nights, she struck.

Plenty of red flags.

Isn't it also interesting that the defences strength of position hasn't grown and has in fact weakened and comparatively the prosecutions has grown. It grew every time the coa rejected the appeals and with those med files grows even stronger. Not that the defence was ever strong anyways.

To be fair I think its quite a task to actually study comprehensively everything about this case and then be able to bring it into one coherent picture. If people in her defence are only doing it with part of the picture then they wouldn't ever really get it. With Dr lee that would be one of the first things they hear really in her defence as well and its been so long since an answer. His credentials, his self claimed authority on AE would make it seem more punchy than it actually is.

I really do hope the ccrc get a bloody move on and issue their decision on the matter. I think it would provide closure to the families and hush up allot of the vacuous noise around the case.