UK - Sara Sharif, 10, found murdered in house, Surrey, Aug 2023 *POIs ARREST* #3

[seasideForest]

@iamshadow21 @Dotta You're correct on Batool being from Luton. In fact from a DM article on Thread#1, here is the whole sorry story of Urfan's marriages:

Relatives of Sharif revealed that he has married three times, first to a cousin in Pakistan.

But after he arrived in the UK on a student visa around 15 years ago, he divorced his first wife, and married Sara's mother, Polish national Olga Domin, 36, with whom he also had an elder son, aged 13.

After divorcing Olga, he then married Beinash, who was born in Luton. They have had three children together.
Sara Sharif's fugitive father 'willing to surrender soon'

Either the first wife didn't know she had been divorced by him (who knows??) or she didn't accept it and was harassing Olga about it. Or maybe Sharif's relatives have been distorting the truth somewhat in this account too, MOO. iirc some rather fanciful stories came out from that quarter during the international man-hunt... MOO
Oops, I've just noticed one mistake in the quoted bit: Beinash and Urfan had four children together, not just the purported three. DM mistake? Sharif extended family mistake? Sharif extended family didn't know about fourth child? Who knows.

 

[Dotta]

@iamshadow21 @Dotta You're correct on Batool being from Luton. In fact from a DM article on Thread#1, here is the whole sorry story of Urfan's marriages:

Relatives of Sharif revealed that he has married three times, first to a cousin in Pakistan.

But after he arrived in the UK on a student visa around 15 years ago, he divorced his first wife, and married Sara's mother, Polish national Olga Domin, 36, with whom he also had an elder son, aged 13.

After divorcing Olga, he then married Beinash, who was born in Luton. They have had three children together.
Sara Sharif's fugitive father 'willing to surrender soon'

Either the first wife didn't know she had been divorced by him (who knows??) or she didn't accept it and was harassing Olga about it. Or maybe Sharif's relatives have been distorting the truth somewhat in this account too, MOO. iirc some rather fanciful stories came out from that quarter during the international man-hunt... MOO
Oops, I've just noticed one mistake in the quoted bit: Beinash and Urfan had four children together, not just the purported three. DM mistake? Sharif extended family mistake? Sharif extended family didn't know about fourth child? Who knows.

Yep.

4 kids.
3 girls (1+twins)
1 baby boy
whose nanny was Sara.

In fact,
Sara was a nanny to all children.

Didn't a neighbour say
(in link upthread)
that B ordered Sara to make girls quiet whenever they were in the yard?

And...
that at birthday party
(while everyone was enjoying themselves)
Sara was sitting on a chair with a baby in her arms
and her companions were 2 old aunts.

Wow!
What a fun for a 10 year old girl

 

[Luna*]

Did anyone else notice during Urfan’s 999 call the operator asked who’s car he was travelling in, Urfan said his sons.

I have seen Urfan has a wife in Pakistan so maybe he has older children there.

 

[Luna*]

Fridays updates from the Guildford Dragon

In a written statement Dr Roland Kouble, a dental surgeon and forensic odontologist said he had analysed four injuries to Sara’s left forearm, one to her left wrist and one to her inner leg/thigh, concluding they were all probable human bite marks.

Dr Kouble was provided dental impressions of Urfan Sharif, Faisal Malik and Sara’s older brother and excluded all three as being responsible. He also said it was not possible the bites had been self- inflicted

Guildford Dragon NEWS

Guildford News

guildford-dragon.com

 

[Charlot123]

Not if that's not the system in the UK! I mean, I saw from a later post of yours that you were comparing with the US, where I presume you live (you don't have to agree either way). It goes without saying that you can't simply transfer one system onto another country. Besides, there are enough examples here on WS where a child in the US or any other country wasn't protected and saved either.
MOO

Less comparing, rather interested if there is a system like the CPS in the UK. I definitely agree that CPS is not above criticism, and usually the problems can be explained by the same reasons everywhere. Where I see its benefit: it is connected neither to school nor to the police, although police may get involved if a crime has been committed. A neighbor or a concerned person who is not a mandatory reporter can call CPS anonymously. (So if a neighbor is hearing loud noises and kids crying, they can call the CPS or child abuse hotline without mentioning their name).

What bothers me in the situation with Sara is that somehow in the process the information did get lost, or the way it traveled was too long. An example: a teacher asked about the bruises (meaning the best I am sure), and it totally backfired. The family moved, Sara was pulled out of school. The report was made in April, and in August, the child died. If the report was entered into the system, what happened with it? Who traces it?

So as usual, can anything be done better and less bureaucratized?

 

[Charlot123]

"A child sends a WhatsApp message to a school friend labelled “urgent”

This child has to be the 13yr old brother. All the other children would be too young to have a mobile phone and have a whatsapp account with their schoolfriends.

Again, he is a key witness! Why are they not bringing him back?!? Why is Pakistani govt and Urfan's family preventing this?

IMO

JMO: I suspect the Pakistani government had a say in Urfan's family returning to GB. I know the imam got involved, but I strongly suspect that the government also made a certain decision. But the boy is the witness, so the longer he stays in Pakistan, the more time to brainwash him by the Urfan's family and the local community.

Personally, I would have another concern. Between survivor's guilt, bad memories, and the loyalty to father, the boy is torn. I am afraid that he is at a huge risk of a different kind and needs immediate psychological help, to avoid another tragedy.

 

[Charlot123]

In light of the evidence and Sara's death ,I feel the children being awarded to the father as main custodian and olga just having access was major manipulation by urfan .
I see in similar cases where this has happened a mother has already suffered DV at the hands of the husband and in this case urfan threatened to kill olga if she kept fighting for her children so women or men in some cases give up they are downtrodden and unable for the fight and confrontation.

He is conniving enough to convince neighbours etc that he is a 'nice" man ,hardworking and polite . How many people in the media have an outward veneer of upstanding member of the community (Huw Edwards comes to mind ) people like this are experts in hiding their true self's. Urfan was just waiting for the moment to take the children in a last act of hurt and degradation to his ex wife and by smacking Sara, olga unintentionally handed him the perfect opportunity.

Imo ,Olga is also a victim the stress of going through a DV relationship leaves a person a shell of their former selves remember he had tried to strangle her with a belt no one knows what else he did I imagine ,physical, verbal ,mental and probably coercive control and sexual violence. I don't think the reasons Sara was removed from her guardianship matters tbh because what ever it was it certainly didn't come close imo to what the three defendants have done .

Someone posted asking would polish papers have access to UK records . Poland is a very advanced country and in many ways have better systems than UK and Ireland I would imagine the media in Poland have as much access as any red top or reputable newspaper in the UK and probably more factual than the filler pieces we see in the daily mail . Polish people are livid over this case as usually in Polish families children are cherished and loved in multi generational homes where their upbringing and care is shared within those generations

JMO: Batool is an aggressive SM, but she has deeper-lying issues and is unstable in general. However, Urfan seems to control himself and is perfectly able to pull the wool over someone's eyes. Olga's family initially accepted him. The neighbors thought he was a nice, hard-working man, even the school commented on Batool's attitude, not Urfan's one. I can imagine that Batool is probably a huge danger to everyone, not only to the children. However, Urfan IMHO is worse. He is like a chameleon, he can suppress his rage, but at home, he'd take it over the most defenseless ones. I would bet that the wife in Pakistan was pre-Olga and pre-Batool. He probably has children with her, too, just abandoned them. However, given his gambling habits, it is interesting to know if Batool was merely a "new" wife, or the interest was her dowry.
Also: Urfan appeared remorseful in Pakistan, but he understands that between three lawyers, he has a decent chance to come out unscathed. It seems that Batool's nasty temper is well-known, and she spent more time with the kids. But he is the manipulator. And I am really curious how a chronic gambler can support such a large family, and where's the money coming from?

 

[ItsMissScarlet]

Less comparing, rather interested if there is a system like the CPS in the UK. I definitely agree that CPS is not above criticism, and usually the problems can be explained by the same reasons everywhere. Where I see its benefit: it is connected neither to school nor to the police, although police may get involved if a crime has been committed. A neighbor or a concerned person who is not a mandatory reporter can call CPS anonymously. (So if a neighbor is hearing loud noises and kids crying, they can call the CPS or child abuse hotline without mentioning their name).

Yes, we do have this in the UK. It’s called Social Services.

 

[Charlot123]

The article about the other side - Sara's mother. (Not sleuthing; I think Olga wants people to know how she feels). She is a victim. My heart goes out to her.

She is very quiet. Now, more than ever, I feel that her son needs to be returned to the UK. Not as the witness. I am concerned that his mental state no one is thinking of. You can't just take a British citizen and send him to Pakistan to live without telling his mom.

Who is Sara Sharif's mother Olga?

THE heartbroken mum of Sara Sharif is desperately trying to find out what happened to her daughter. Here we take a look at everything Olga Sharif has said about the 10-year-old’s death. …

www.thesun.co.uk

 

[Charlot123]

Yes, we do have this in the UK. It’s called Social Services.

Thank you. I assume it is as overwhelmed as any other system. How does it work? The lead in Sara's school entered a report in the system and it went to SS? What happened next? (Least of all am I blaming them; I suspect that some people are quietly suffering, and it was Sara's case. However, I am concerned that there is no community to actively support the rights of the mother now. It seems that it is lonely on her side, and it is unfair).

 

[Smoke and Mirrors]

Thank you. I assume it is as overwhelmed as any other system. How does it work? The lead in Sara's school entered a report in the system and it went to SS? What happened next? (Least of all am I blaming them; I suspect that some people are quietly suffering, and it was Sara's case. However, I am concerned that there is no community to actively support the rights of the mother now. It seems that it is lonely on her side, and it is unfair).

The school has an internal online safeguarding reporting system into which any member of staff can enter any observations/concerns about children. This is monitored closely by the DSL (Designated Safeguarding Lead) in the school, but does not have a direct link to social services. Any major concerns (such as those in Sara’s case) are reported by the DSL to the local social services children’s safeguarding hub, usually by a phone call. This hub will often be referred to as the MASH which is a Multi-Agency Safeguarding Hub and will consist of social workers, police and other agencies who work together to protect children. It’s the MASH who decide on the next steps once a concern comes in from the school and whether a written referral is required.

 

[Dotta]

---

Did anyone else notice during Urfan’s 999 call the operator asked who’s car he was travelling in, Urfan said his sons.

I have seen Urfan has a wife in Pakistan so maybe he has older children there.

U has 2 sons.
1 half Polish with Olga.
1 baby boy with B.

 

[Dotta]

JMO: Batool is an aggressive SM, but she has deeper-lying issues and is unstable in general. However, Urfan seems to control himself and is perfectly able to pull the wool over someone's eyes. Olga's family initially accepted him. The neighbors thought he was a nice, hard-working man, even the school commented on Batool's attitude, not Urfan's one. I can imagine that Batool is probably a huge danger to everyone, not only to the children. However, Urfan IMHO is worse. He is like a chameleon, he can suppress his rage, but at home, he'd take it over the most defenseless ones. I would bet that the wife in Pakistan was pre-Olga and pre-Batool. He probably has children with her, too, just abandoned them. However, given his gambling habits, it is interesting to know if Batool was merely a "new" wife, or the interest was her dowry.
Also: Urfan appeared remorseful in Pakistan, but he understands that between three lawyers, he has a decent chance to come out unscathed. It seems that Batool's nasty temper is well-known, and she spent more time with the kids. But he is the manipulator. And I am really curious how a chronic gambler can support such a large family, and where's the money coming from?

Interesting that both families
(Olga's & B's)
were against marriage with U.

But both women seemed to be charmed by him.

Not other family members.

Sometimes it is worthwhile to listen to family's advice.
And to more experienced and wise family members.
Collective "family wisdom" is priceless and not to be ignored.

But, unfortunately,
"Love is blind".
And then,
there are only tears left and grinding of teeth.

JMO
based on remembered reports from Thread 1.

 

[su5ie]

Did anyone else notice during Urfan’s 999 call the operator asked who’s car he was travelling in, Urfan said his sons.

I have seen Urfan has a wife in Pakistan so maybe he has older children there.

'I killed my daughter' - Chilling transcript of phone call from Sara Sharif's dad

Jurors were played the full recording of a phone call Sara Sharif's dad made to police from Pakistan.

www.yourlocalguardian.co.uk

This is full transcript of urfans call from Pakistan to report Sara dead . No where does he say my son's car. He states "someone else's car " when the operator presses him on this he still doesn't say .
Prehaps listening to the transcript instead of reading it may sound like son .
He may possibly have had a child or children with the first wife in Pakistan nobody has stated that in msm or sm . But for clarification of the facts urfan does not say this at all

 

[Dotta]

From a neighbour:

On the surface
the Sharifs seemed like a 'happy family'
but the neighbour noted the mother
'needed support',
jurors heard.

(It sounds as if B. was overwhelmed by taking care of 6 kids. And it showed. JMO)

Another neighbour Brenin L. said
Sara’s hijab hid her face so that he could only
see her eyes
which he found 'slightly strange',
particularly as no-one else in the family wore Asian dress.

From a teacher:

'She never spoke about her home life'.

The teaching assistant said Sara never confided in her there were any problems at home
and was always covered up, apart from her face.



Inside the Sharif family home on Hammond Road in Woking, Surrey, where the 10-year-old’s body was found
(Surrey Police/PA).

Scream ‘in pain’ alarmed neighbour two days before Sara Sharif died, court heard

Father Urfan Sharif, stepmother Beinash Batool and uncle Faisal Malik are accused of carrying out a campaign of abuse against the 10-year-old.

www.irishnews.com

 

[Sooty]

Fridays updates from the Guildford Dragon

In a written statement Dr Roland Kouble, a dental surgeon and forensic odontologist said he had analysed four injuries to Sara’s left forearm, one to her left wrist and one to her inner leg/thigh, concluding they were all probable human bite marks.

Dr Kouble was provided dental impressions of Urfan Sharif, Faisal Malik and Sara’s older brother and excluded all three as being responsible. He also said it was not possible the bites had been self- inflicted

Guildford Dragon NEWS

Guildford News

guildford-dragon.com

This news that Sara’s brother provided dental impression gives me hope that he will have made a statement, or will appear as a witness.

 

[Alyce]

To be fair, Batool might have met Urfan before he and Olga separated. (My post was in response to somebody else's who was querying when they met iirc.)

Quote from the Daily Mail fwiw: "The Polish uncle also revealed that Sharif had a wife in Pakistan and added: 'Our family did not know about it. Him and his family were hiding it from us. Eventually his Pakistani wife called Olga and that's how we found out.' " Polish uncle of Sara Sharif urges police to 'catch her killer' Idk if that was/is Batool or some other woman completely?? So, yeah, Batool may have met Urfan far earlier than in 2015.

Batool was born in the UK and, far as I know, was raised here.

 

[porkypies]

This news that Sara’s brother provided dental impression gives me hope that he will have made a statement, or will appear as a witness.

Dr. Roland Kouble is reported as having been provided with dental impressions of the three male family members, but not that they specifically gave them for trial purposes, or that he took them himself.
Maybe they were provided by the appropriate dentists?
Which I know begs the question of why Batool's dental impressions were not provided, perhaps this is a question of the patient giving permission?

 

[Dotta]

Batool was born in the UK and, far as I know, was raised here.

Yes.

But why does she speak sooo heavily accented English though?
One would think that living in England and attending English schools a person should sound like a native, no?

Was she home schooled?

Is she only the first generation born in the UK and parents don't speak English well?

This is very interesting,
as even my pupils in Primary School speak English nearly without an accent.
Well, "nearly" is a key word hehe
But still!
(They start learning 2 foreign languages in Primary School,
usually English and German)

But to obtain such good pronunciation,
one must start learning/speaking a foreign language early,
when throat muscles are still flexible.

It seems to me it didn't happen in her case.
But education starts early in the UK, no?
From the age of 5 as far as I know.

Sorry,
but it is really baffling to me

JMO

 

[PKFS]

Does anyone know of Pakistani News channels covering Sara Sharif's story? I tried a few Dawn.com and The Nation.com to find out if Shairf was married before Olga but not much is reported. Although one newspaper has reported one of its reader has said that Muslims to speak out against the abuse of women and girls in Asian communities. I wont be surprised if Sharif was/is married and Batool is his 3rd wife. It is allowed in muslim culture to have more than one wife.

Sadly a lot of the abuse is behind closed doors and curtains in some cultures which is so hard to disclose, with even the community concealing the abuse (IMOO).