UK UK - Suzy Lamplugh, 25, Fulham, 28 Jul 1986 #7

[WestLondoner]

Agree re DL, but one has to sympathise with how people in awful situations react. Her reaction wasn't helpful but it's understandable.

There may be a ghost who did this who's not in any of the inquiry files. After all, the police think JC did it, and he wasn't in their 1986/7 inquiry file. His own absence from the files kind of proves that it's possible this was not him, in a rather odd twist, in that if he could escape notice, so could others.

 

[Cherwell]

There may be a ghost who did this who's not in any of the inquiry files. After all, the police think JC did it, and he wasn't in their 1986/7 inquiry file. His own absence from the files kind of proves that it's possible this was not him, in a rather odd twist, in that if he could escape notice, so could others.

That sums up exactly why I am not sold on JC as the perpetrator.

 

[Klclevi]

As uncomfortable as it may be for the family- after all this time perhaps they should release her personal diaries for reinvestigation. Surely there must be some doubt in their mind as to the guilt of JC. I know if I was her sister I would be scouring those diaries inside and out. The AS book does talk about SJL
talking to her sister and other people (PSS) I think it was, about other men in her life.

 

[espirtu pampa]

As uncomfortable as it may be for the family- after all this time perhaps they should release her personal diaries for reinvestigation. Surely there must be some doubt in their mind as to the guilt of JC. I know if I was her sister I would be scouring those diaries inside and out. The AS book does talk about SJL
talking to her sister and other people (PSS) I think it was, about other men in her life.

What is the meaning of PSS ?
Thanks in advance.

 

[Klclevi]

What is the meaning of PSS ?
Thanks in advance.

Hi it is the initials of a lady SJL was going to go into business with but she backed out. You can read about her in the AS book The Suzy Lamplugh Story - hope that helps!

 

[tes1984]

The biggest * up in this case I think was DL, her interference in the case is unprecedented. I feel she inhibited the case being solved at the time . And quite possibly misled the investigation by muddying the waters and concealing certain aspects of her daughters life .i also think she embellished things too . Unfortunately the case almost became political in a sense .she should have allowed officers do their job .

DL is often criticised but was hardly going to acknowledge that her daughter had multiple boyfriends. Such an admission would have killed off public sympathy in the 80s.

DL conducted her own searches and investigations, which is admirable IMO. She wasn't impressed with the early enquiries.

She was clearly a bit eccentric, but wasn't nearly powerful enough to obstruct officers from the Met in the 80s enquiries.

It's not an unprecedented case in terms of interference either. There's another UK case where the parents were much more influential.

 

[Cherwell]

Classic narcissists. The number one priority is to control everyone and everything they encounter.

 

[lee sumner]

Agreed.

SJL was taken by someone she knew who's never been identified. The reason to think it's JC is that he was around at the time, lied about it, and did this sort of thing. Anyone else is a ghost; a conjectural killer we know nothing about, except that he's almost certainly in her diaries somewhere, because as a personal contact, he must have been contactable.

JC should have been in the police's files from 1986/7 all along. If they identified recently-released sex offenders from the three prisons nearby, that would have added 50 to 100 plausibles. If they had traced the subscriber behind every phone number contact she had in her current and old diaries, JC or someone adjacent to him - JT for example - would surely have emerged. If they had chased down every dark LHD BMW that had had a new log book issued in the last 6 months to a year, which wouldn't be all that many, they'd likely have found the car SJL was seen laughing or screaming in. And so on. The alternative killer who's not JC in effect exists in these gaps in the original investigation. It's possible this alternative exists, but it's not proven. JC fits, and does at least exist.

agree. JC just wanted to be the notorious mr kipper, but is most likely not. we will never know for sure, but JC got what he wanted because investigators/press, etc all think its him.

 

[lee sumner]

DL is often criticised but was hardly going to acknowledge that her daughter had multiple boyfriends. Such an admission would have killed off public sympathy in the 80s.

DL conducted her own searches and investigations, which is admirable IMO. She wasn't impressed with the early enquiries.

She was clearly a bit eccentric, but wasn't nearly powerful enough to obstruct officers from the Met in the 80s enquiries.

It's not an unprecedented case in terms of interference either. There's another UK case where the parents were much more influential.

yes, maddie mccann.

 

[su5ie]

DL is often criticised but was hardly going to acknowledge that her daughter had multiple boyfriends. Such an admission would have killed off public sympathy in the 80s.

DL conducted her own searches and investigations, which is admirable IMO. She wasn't impressed with the early enquiries.

She was clearly a bit eccentric, but wasn't nearly powerful enough to obstruct officers from the Met in the 80s enquiries.

It's not an unprecedented case in terms of interference either. There's another UK case where the parents were much more influential.

Yes I agree DL was very proactive and as you say the 80s were a time were judgement of womens role and lifestyle was still similar to the 50s. And I can't began thankfully how it feels to have lost her daughter in such horrendous circumstances.

Unfortunately many women ,men and children remain in unmarked graves even nowadays put there by people whom decided to murder them . Sick people will always exist and its terrible when families suffer the consequences of their evil deeds

As mentioned by a number of posters here . Why the police never checked the hostel for culprits or recently released prisoners is beyond my comprehension.

Whomever is the culprit, it would seem suzy felt compelled enough to meet them during work hours if Mr kipper is a made up client by suzy herself .

The one reason I suspect she made it up is I feel if Mr kipper arranged a pretend viewing at 37 Shorrolds. They would have entered the house .where the perpetrator would have had her alone behind closed doors . And possibly killed her there . Why bother luring her to another location or into another or her own car .

If BW is right about the sighting .it was suzy driving so why would the perpetrator allow suzy that much control .she could have just stopped in the middle of traffic and screamed for help or refuse to drive .

I think what makes this case so hard to solve is all the conflicting sightings and the place she supposedly went to doesn't seem like it was the scene of any crime and her car not throwing up any evidence of anyone struggling within it . Nor is there signs of a struggle on any street she was supposedly on ,no keys ,no particulars ,no hair ,no nothing . Not one fingerprint belonging to the culprit even on the door handles inside or out

I wonder was Wendy's house searched or any of the houses and garages that lined the street where her car was found .

Does anyone remember if Wendy's husband was the taxi driver going to work who said he spotted suzys car between 1pm and 2pm

 

[su5ie]

I just had a look back over the suzy lamplugh Wikipedia page and it's been updated to include Cannan's death .

I came across this which I never spotted before .Did anyone else see this about her being sighted with a man at Stevenage Road beside her car

 

[lee sumner]

Yes I agree DL was very proactive and as you say the 80s were a time were judgement of womens role and lifestyle was still similar to the 50s. And I can't began thankfully how it feels to have lost her daughter in such horrendous circumstances.

Unfortunately many women ,men and children remain in unmarked graves even nowadays put there by people whom decided to murder them . Sick people will always exist and its terrible when families suffer the consequences of their evil deeds

As mentioned by a number of posters here . Why the police never checked the hostel for culprits or recently released prisoners is beyond my comprehension.

Whomever is the culprit, it would seem suzy felt compelled enough to meet them during work hours if Mr kipper is a made up client by suzy herself .

The one reason I suspect she made it up is I feel if Mr kipper arranged a pretend viewing at 37 Shorrolds. They would have entered the house .where the perpetrator would have had her alone behind closed doors . And possibly killed her there . Why bother luring her to another location or into another or her own car .

If BW is right about the sighting .it was suzy driving so why would the perpetrator allow suzy that much control .she could have just stopped in the middle of traffic and screamed for help or refuse to drive .

I think what makes this case so hard to solve is all the conflicting sightings and the place she supposedly went to doesn't seem like it was the scene of any crime and her car not throwing up any evidence of anyone struggling within it . Nor is there signs of a struggle on any street she was supposedly on ,no keys ,no particulars ,no hair ,no nothing . Not one fingerprint belonging to the culprit even on the door handles inside or out

I wonder was Wendy's house searched or any of the houses and garages that lined the street where her car was found .

Does anyone remember if Wendy's husband was the taxi driver going to work who said he spotted suzys car between 1pm and 2pm

does not mention him in AS book. i think WJ was confused that day about SL car being ditched on stevenage rd at around 1240pm.

 

[sportstergirl]

LHD BMWs were pretty thin on the ground in 1986. Why wasn't this car traced? Could it have belonged to a serviceman?

 

[WestLondoner]

Unfortunately many women ,men and children remain in unmarked graves even nowadays put there by people whom decided to murder them

There are about 6,000 missing persons in the UK who could chronologically still be alive but who have not been seen since some past date. One presumes quite a lot them have been murdered.

The one reason I suspect she made it up is I feel if Mr kipper arranged a pretend viewing at 37 Shorrolds. They would have entered the house .where the perpetrator would have had her alone behind closed doors . And possibly killed her there . Why bother luring her to another location or into another or her own car .

The police forensicated 37SR next day and concluded nobody had been inside the day before. As for why you'd lure her away, well, if you've never been inside 37SR before, you'd have no idea whether it was suitable - how far sound travelled, what its layout was, your escape routes etc. Also, you'd have to assume colleagues knew where she was going, meaning you've got unknown but limited time to do what you intend to do. SJL was taken somewhere her killer did know all this and did not have to fret about time or being disturbed.

If BW is right about the sighting .it was suzy driving so why would the perpetrator allow suzy that much control .she could have just stopped in the middle of traffic and screamed for help or refuse to drive .

Presumably she didn't yet know she was in danger. If she knew because he was threatening her with a knife BW could not see, yes, she'd surely slam the brakes on, flee the car and run for it.

I think what makes this case so hard to solve is all the conflicting sightings and the place she supposedly went to doesn't seem like it was the scene of any crime and her car not throwing up any evidence of anyone struggling within it .

Yes, for any hypothesis you pick, you have to discard one or more of the sightings as mistaken or irrelevant. Most obviously, her car can't have been outside WJ's house all day but also in the Fulham Palace Road at 2.30.

I wonder was Wendy's house searched or any of the houses and garages that lined the street where her car was found .

Her house was searched. This is DV's point really. There were only 4 places she could have been going: to 37SR (searched), to 123SR (searched), home (searched), or the pub (not searched). Spot the odd one out.

I don't buy his theory but he's right to pick up on this. By the time the PoW and the planned errand there entered the picture, the police had already decided, before taking any statements, that she never went to the PoW because she went to Shorrolds. This assumption jeopardised every subsequent step.

 

[su5ie]

Just out of curiosity I looked up "how many bmw in 1986 uk were LHD and surprisingly, most bmws of the time came as LHD from the factory in Germany. Many were only RHD because they were converted 8m unsure of the exact model that witnesses claim to have seen but this is just an example of 2 models . I by no means know anything about cars

https://www.instagram.com/4star_classics/p/DBLowk5o58e/

Modern classic: 1986-1990 BMW E30 M3 Buying Guide from Magneto magazine - Magneto

The original BMW M3 is still regarded as the purest example of what an M car should represent. Here's how to buy the perfect example in 2024.

www.magnetomagazine.com

 

[sportstergirl]

Thank you I stand corrected! Only seen RHD BMWs, I assumed LHD would be unpopular as I couldn't get on with LHD cars. A BMW M3 would be a very expensive car in 1986 & was built in small numbers compared to the ordinary 3 series cars

 

[WestLondoner]

What sportstergirl said. The M series were LHD because there were so few made.

Auto Trader has 47 pre 1990 BMWs for sale right now of which 45 are RHD and the other 2 are M3s.

 

[lee sumner]

There are about 6,000 missing persons in the UK who could chronologically still be alive but who have not been seen since some past date. One presumes quite a lot them have been murdered.



The police forensicated 37SR next day and concluded nobody had been inside the day before. As for why you'd lure her away, well, if you've never been inside 37SR before, you'd have no idea whether it was suitable - how far sound travelled, what its layout was, your escape routes etc. Also, you'd have to assume colleagues knew where she was going, meaning you've got unknown but limited time to do what you intend to do. SJL was taken somewhere her killer did know all this and did not have to fret about time or being disturbed.



Presumably she didn't yet know she was in danger. If she knew because he was threatening her with a knife BW could not see, yes, she'd surely slam the brakes on, flee the car and run for it.



Yes, for any hypothesis you pick, you have to discard one or more of the sightings as mistaken or irrelevant. Most obviously, her car can't have been outside WJ's house all day but also in the Fulham Palace Road at 2.30.



Her house was searched. This is DV's point really. There were only 4 places she could have been going: to 37SR (searched), to 123SR (searched), home (searched), or the pub (not searched). Spot the odd one out.

I don't buy his theory but he's right to pick up on this. By the time the PoW and the planned errand there entered the picture, the police had already decided, before taking any statements, that she never went to the PoW because she went to Shorrolds. This assumption jeopardised every subsequent step.

they say SL never attended 37 shorrolds rd. they could find no trace of her from a forensic point of view, but its not that simple. SL could have viewed 37SRD, and not left any trace of herself behind. its not like you see on TV or CSI where there is always a load of trace evidence at the scene. we dont leave trace evidence everywhere we go.

 

[Cherwell]

Her house was searched. This is DV's point really. There were only 4 places she could have been going: to 37SR (searched), to 123SR (searched), home (searched), or the pub (not searched). Spot the odd one out.

What about the house in Langthorne Street where a witness apparently saw someone like her?
I don't know where this came from, presumably a TV programme that I haven't seen.
Was this house for sale and on Sturgis books?

 

[lee sumner]

What about the house in Langthorne Street where a witness apparently saw someone like her?
I don't know where this came from, presumably a TV programme that I haven't seen.
Was this house for sale and on Sturgis books?

never heard anything about a property on langhorne st. just more BS conspiracy theory and rumour.