UK UK - Suzy Lamplugh, 25, Fulham, 28 Jul 1986 #7

[WestLondoner]

MJ saw a well dressed couple in Stevenage Road then later saw the female outside a house in Langthorne.

 

[WestLondoner]

they could find no trace of her from a forensic point of view, but its not that simple. SL could have viewed 37SRD, and not left any trace of herself behind.

That would be very difficult though. Not only Mr Kipper but SJL would have to leave no traces anywhere, which makes you wonder how doors and closets were opened, lights switched on and off, stairs negotiated without touching banisters. You can why he'd avoid doing this, but why would she, and how could he somehow clean up after her?

If there were SJL's prints inside, then there'd have been a huge effort to identify all the others found.

The police said that there was no sign anyone had been inside, which doesn't necessarily mean only that there were no prints. It could also refer perhaps to there being a pile of mail on the door mat that had not been pushed aside by the action of opening the front door recently. I tend to assume the police know what they're talking about on this kind of detail.

 

[Klclevi]

Has anyone read this old DM link and what JC apparently said to another inmate? I have never seen this stated by him in any information I have read before.


Did Suzy Lamplugh have an affair with her killer? Dossier suggests twist in murder case

 

[Spy Versus Spy]

Here is a link to the Archived page of Klclevi's DM article above, it requires no agreeing to DM cookies or subscribing etc

V interesting article

https://archive.is/w5tiZ

 

[Klclevi]

Here is a link to the Archived page of Klclevi's DM article above, it requires no agreeing to DM cookies or subscribing etc

V interesting article

https://archive.is/w5tiZ

Thankyou so much for doing that !

 

[tes1984]

Do you think I'd be daft enough to walk around with a spade, says the man who kept a victim's car is his own garage...

 

[sportstergirl]

"She's in a house, she's got company" Very risky deposition site.
Presumably any property JC owned or had access to was checked though given some of the investigation resembled the Keystone Cops I'm not 100% on this!
Who else went missing without trace in areas known to be frequented by JC in the late 70s to mid 80s when he wasn't in prison?
Did JC have an as yet uncaught accomplice?

 

[lee sumner]

they could find no trace of her from a forensic point of view, but its not that simple. SL could have viewed 37SRD, and not left any trace of herself behind.

That would be very difficult though. Not only Mr Kipper but SJL would have to leave no traces anywhere, which makes you wonder how doors and closets were opened, lights switched on and off, stairs negotiated without touching banisters. You can why he'd avoid doing this, but why would she, and how could he somehow clean up after her?

If there were SJL's prints inside, then there'd have been a huge effort to identify all the others found.

The police said that there was no sign anyone had been inside, which doesn't necessarily mean only that there were no prints. It could also refer perhaps to there being a pile of mail on the door mat that had not been pushed aside by the action of opening the front door recently. I tend to assume the police know what they're talking about on this kind of detail.

yes, i know what you mean, and we dont know what kind of search was carried out at 37SHRD. could SL have done the viewing with mr kipper and just left nothing behind. god knows.

 

[WestLondoner]

One has to consider the possibility that he's lying to impress other lags and/or to kid himself that despite being sent down for life, he's somehow scored a point over the plod.

Look at the Moors Murderers, who taunted their victims' families for years about where their murdered loved ones were buried.

Who else went missing without trace in areas known to be frequented by JC in the late 70s to mid 80s when he wasn't in prison?

He actually was in prison for most of that time. He was arrested on 13 March 1981 for the rape of Jean Bradford one week previously in her shop. He was remanded in custody, jailed for eight years and was allowed out on day release only from January 1986. So for nearly five years he was banged up.

I am not sure who is missing from wherever might be considered his turf, but 250,000 people a year go missing, 99% are very quickly found, but 6,000 never are. In addition, the police have the bodies or parts thereof of about another 1,000 people, who are unidentified but who do not DNA-match any of the 6,000. These are in effect missing persons whom nobody has actually reported missing.

We don't know how many of the missing have been murdered (because they're missing, obviously), but there seems plenty of room in these 7,000-odd people for a number of undetected serial killers to be at work.

 

[lee sumner]

DL is often criticised but was hardly going to acknowledge that her daughter had multiple boyfriends. Such an admission would have killed off public sympathy in the 80s.

DL conducted her own searches and investigations, which is admirable IMO. She wasn't impressed with the early enquiries.

She was clearly a bit eccentric, but wasn't nearly powerful enough to obstruct officers from the Met in the 80s enquiries.

It's not an unprecedented case in terms of interference either. There's another UK case where the parents were much more influential.

there is no way DL would have that influence these days. iam surprised she was allowed so much control over the investigation back in 1986. if i was the SIO, on the case, i would tell DL to go and do one.

 

[lee sumner]

As uncomfortable as it may be for the family- after all this time perhaps they should release her personal diaries for reinvestigation. Surely there must be some doubt in their mind as to the guilt of JC. I know if I was her sister I would be scouring those diaries inside and out. The AS book does talk about SJL
talking to her sister and other people (PSS) I think it was, about other men in her life.

yes, TL memtions men SL knew but could not remember there names. alan or mark. she could just not recall.

 

[lee sumner]

One has to consider the possibility that he's lying to impress other lags and/or to kid himself that despite being sent down for life, he's somehow scored a point over the plod.

Look at the Moors Murderers, who taunted their victims' families for years about where their murdered loved ones were buried.

He actually was in prison for most of that time. He was arrested on 13 March 1981 for the rape of Jean Bradford one week previously in her shop. He was remanded in custody, jailed for eight years and was allowed out on day release only from January 1986. So for nearly five years he was banged up.

I am not sure who is missing from wherever might be considered his turf, but 250,000 people a year go missing, 99% are very quickly found, but 6,000 never are. In addition, the police have the bodies or parts thereof of about another 1,000 people, who are unidentified but who do not DNA-match any of the 6,000. These are in effect missing persons whom nobody has actually reported missing.

We don't know how many of the missing have been murdered (because they're missing, obviously), but there seems plenty of room in these 7,000-odd people for a number of undetected serial killers to be at work.

re, JC. I thought the same about him. he wants the notoriety that comes with big cases like these. he wants to impress the other cons and go down in criminal history as the infamous mr kipper, the man who snatched SL, but its all a figment of his imagination.

 

[su5ie]

MJ saw a well dressed couple in Stevenage Road then later saw the female outside a house in Langthorne.

Sorry who is MJ . Is this the person from 139 Stevenage road

 

[WestLondoner]

Sorry who is MJ . Is this the person from 139 Stevenage road

Yes

 

[tes1984]

there is no way DL would have that influence these days. iam surprised she was allowed so much control over the investigation back in 1986. if i was the SIO, on the case, i would tell DL to go and do one.

DL had a lot of powerful supporters from the start. The police couldn't tell her to go and do one.

 

[tes1984]

re, JC. I thought the same about him. he wants the notoriety that comes with big cases like these. he wants to impress the other cons and go down in criminal history as the infamous mr kipper, the man who snatched SL, but its all a figment of his imagination.

If it was all a figment of Cannan's imagination, then the real killer was very lucky to have JC there as such a plausible prime suspect.

 

[tes1984]

There have been several high profile UK murder cases where the wrong men were imprisoned for decades.

All the men protested their innocence though. None of them withheld alibi information or kept changing their stories.

JC could not account for his whereabouts during the week Suzy vanished. He changed his story several times.

I think his lack of alibi is because he was in Fulham when Suzy went missing. He withheld information when questioned about Sandra Court. Lied until confronted with proof he was in the area, then clammed up.

 

[Terryb808]

Hi Terry , like yourself and many others here I've spent a lot of time trying to glean clues from the details in the public domain. We probably know suzy's story better than we know about our own friends .

There is only one reason that makes me reluctant to fully assert Cannan is her killer and its his MO . He did nothing really to conceal Shirley body and if he did also murder sandra ,her body was not really hidden well either .
But I will concede that my train of thought lately is prehaps Cannan got sloppy over time or was disturbed while trying to conceal Shirley and there is a higher body count that could be attributed to him . He also liked to have a one-upmanship on LE ,a catch me if you can attitude.

The biggest * up in this case I think was DL, her interference in the case is unprecedented. I feel she inhibited the case being solved at the time . And quite possibly misled the investigation by muddying the waters and concealing certain aspects of her daughters life .i also think she embellished things too . Unfortunately the case almost became political in a sense .she should have allowed officers do their job .

I still hold the opinion that suzy willing went to meet her killer that day and it was somebody she felt couldn't wait till after work I also feel the higher the class , ,the more rich people feel there is an image and money to protect it complicates the investigation .Basically the investigators start out with their backs against the wall

We’d all like to think we know Suzy, however, her work colleagues didn’t and maybe even her brother RL only had a small insight into her private life.
There are police detectives that can read criminals, and IMO Detective MB is one of those.
He was the only detective (to may knowledge) that realised that Shorrolds was a complete mistake. He made this assumption early on, but I can only assume wasn’t listened too by his superiors.
Again IMO he read JC like a book, and picked up on the mistakes he made in the interview.
Okay JC was inept, but sometimes even evil criminals have luck on their side. I don’t think JC was anymore careful with Suzy’s deposition than SC or SB, the only difference being he was lucky.
Look at the Melanie Hall case, the perpetrator just dumped her at the side of the motorway. A few metres further in and her remains would never have been found.
Maybe JC did just that, or given his love of water no one found her in the Brent river
section of the canal.

 

[Markybug]

LHD BMWs were pretty thin on the ground in 1986. Why wasn't this car traced? Could it have belonged to a serviceman?

didn't the police trace a similar car with a dubious owner , but it went nowhere ?

 

[lee sumner]

DL had a lot of powerful supporters from the start. The police couldn't tell her to go and do one.

If it was all a figment of Cannan's imagination, then the real killer was very lucky to have JC there as such a plausible prime suspect.

not that plausible. the CPS never charged him with SL abduction, so it makes you wonder if another man did this.