CO CO - Kelsey Berreth, 29, Woodland Park, Teller County, 22 Nov 2018 - #40 *ARREST*

[Seattle1]

What? Where did they meet? How did they meet each other? And where can I find all this info?

Most of it all came out in testimony at preliminary hearing 2/19 --CBI Agent Slater.

The hearing was trial by twitter so check out thread #39. No camera/audio permitted.

 

[NWLady]

Don't we know that she was in Idaho on the day of? I read he made two calls, one at 4:24 to his mom, and then another to KK at 4:37 (missed, but she called back). Had she been in Colorado at the time, I think that would have been a major bombshell. They spent a lot of time talking about pinging cell phones--KB and PF's together, then ultimately KB and KK's together.

I agree with your post and I have been wondering if KK wasn't there not only before AND after, but also DURING. I realize phone records would probably verify this, BUT would phone records verify this IF KK was using her burner phone that she admitted to having? It seems as if PF must have told her a lot of details, in a step-by-step play, and I myself really find it hard to believe she wasn't there when it all went down....

And if IIRC, they said yesterday she burned her burner phone and I don't know if there is any way to get records from those. Does anyone know?

 

[sunshineandlove]

Just to add to the coldness of this case, I found it interesting PF took the time on Dec 12th to update who could provide medical direction for Baby K if he was "absent". KB wasn't on that list, because he knew she was dead when she was only "missing". Also wondering if KK was listed...after all he called her for "medical advice" for Baby K.

 

[Steelhead]

KK supposedly intentionally left blood evidence and a phone trail so that LE could find her, yet when they finally caught up to her in Las Vegas, she proceeded to lie to them right off the bat? Yeah, that makes perfect sense. NOT!

 

[Seattle1]

How many burner cell phones have these two purchased. She bought two for two of the three trips, and I am just now reading in the arrest affidavit that she purchased a third burner phone on the 4th of December, the same day that Patrick's was seized and he got a new phone.

From the preliminary hearing, I believed they spoke of two burner phones.

The arrest affidavit talks about new Samsung for KK on the day PF handed his phone over to authorities, and it's not clear to me if that was one of the "burners" or if KK replaced her contract phone at Verizon.

 

[Kapua]

PICTURED: Female nurse, 32, ‘who assisted killer fiance Patrick Frazee’

KK was divorced in June 2016.

 

[MsArk]

I’ve been following this case but this is my first comment. The testimony yesterday was more than disturbing. I get that without KK there wouldn’t be much of a case against PF... but OMG! She was so involved! My guess is that PF thought she would never go to the authorities as she seemed to jump when he said so. I am still shocked she is getting out of this with only a tampering charge but again, I understand it. It is all so disturbing.

 

[Ultra Violet]

Hmmm. Didn’t KK say that she only got back into a “romantic” relationship with PF in March of 2018?

Yes, and I did not realize she had only been divorced since the summer of 2018. I thought it had been for two years. Imo

KK and PF tried to get their stories to match but KK did not make sure her story matched with her ex. Whoooops!

Will be interesting to find out what portion of her testimony revealed in yesterday’s hearing turns out to be false.

JMO

 

[MsBetsy]

I have only read through the first 5 pages of the arrest affidavit so far, but thought I would start rattling off some questions to (somewhat) break things down. Please reply with your thoughts on any of these discussion points or questions:
(and apologies for any of these that have already been discussed....between being gone yesterday, and the site being down, I'm still way behind)

- thoughts on middle of the night phone calls between KB and PF on early morning hours of 11/22? is this what led to PF committing murder when he did? obviously these calls are signs of trouble...

- PF being on video surveillance at Walmart after picking up baby K on 11/22? this was a surprise...as many of us thought he killed Kelsey right away. Was this on purpose so that he is being spotted on video elsewhere? I doubt he was getting any kind of pertinent supplies (candles or other), otherwise it would have been mentioned in affidavit? What is this Walmart detail all about?

- the fact that LE or family never mentioned KB's missing gun...was this by design? or maybe it wasn't considered missing the CB may have thought he hadn't returned it yet? (though it appears PF did say he returned it...and hoped people would think she used it for harm?) Anyway, my question is why you think it wasn't mentioned that the gun was missing. I'm thinking it was a purposely withheld detail to be used with later confession(s)?

- thoughts on search at PF's turning up custody document (but not filed)? It definitely fits what most of us felt was the motive here...child custody.

- I read that Lee said that PF did not ask Lee to take and dispose of phone? huh? Confused by this. I thought she also stated that PF directed her to send the texts in order to misdirect LE. Wouldn't that require her "taking" the phone? Again, if this is true, this suggests that Lee was also very much motivated to be a player in this crime, and she is not at all a victim.

- unknown male (and female) dna found in bathroom. thoughts? former tenants? I'm assuming the dna was already checked against all other friends or family members who were known to visit Kelsey...

- thoughts on why KK is not spotted on video entering or leaving KB's house? Do you think they camera's info. may have been overwritten by the time LE asked for later dates (11/24 vs. 11/22)??

- why nothing on video of PF leaving house with black tote?

That's it for now. I'll be back later with more questions when I have a chance to read the rest of the affidavit.

p.s. I felt like a caged dog when the Websleuth site was down this morning!

In regard to KK denying PF asking her to take the phone, this was just one of the lies she told LE at first. She admitted it later. It was at the time of the arrest so LE didn't know at the time. Imo

 

[gitana1]

Yes, as I understand it, the fact that they have a witness that he confessed to is the most valuable evidence they have. At least that's what I read is the case when there is not a body.
Despite the fact that she seems to be far more involved than we knew, he is the actual murderer. Imo

Yeah. I mean I just reviewed the law from a CO lawyer blog on accesssory after the fact and it seems the possible sentence is also pretty light? Maybe 2-6 years? As a class 4 felony. Colorado law on "accessory to crime "| 18-8-105 C.R.S.

But it seems she actually conspired with him which by my calculations would make her eligible for 8-24 years.
Colorado Criminal "Conspiracy" Laws | 18-2-201 CRS
Class 2 Felony Crimes in Colorado

Sigh.

 

[Herat]

I believe he's full of rage most of the time, it just takes something to trigger it.

These types go from zero to sixty in seconds if you demean them, cross them, out them. Even though this was planned for some time, I think it probably took two things...something to initially trigger his hate for KB (which may have built over time), and something to propel him to take action.

They (narcs/sociopaths/psychopaths) most of the time don't honestly feel they did anything wrong, they consider themselves above the law - legal and moral. Hence, they often don't think they'll get caught because they are better than that. Mistakes are just them glossing over the fact that they are doing something evil.

Add to that the fact that their ability to feel empathy, remorse, etc. is just non-existant.

The more I read about this case, the more KKL strikes me as a bizarre combo of co-dependent and sociopath.

But, my knowledge and understanding is limited as I only know what I've read and experienced.

Would be VERY interested in any input from our VI experts on this!

This behavior has been known to his family since he was a small child, undoubtedly. Also is the reason why he lives with his mother. She is the only one who can tolerate him.

So WHY did he go looking for nice quiet respectful religious woman Kelsey? Why did he move her out here so quickly?

I’ll bet SF is behind this.

 

[Hatfield]

Someday when I get time I am going to go back through yesterday's hearing thread and make a list of all of KK's "lies" and "possible lies" she has told.

I will break it into three categories.
-guaranteed lies
-most likely a lie
-possible lie

In the guaranteed lie category I can think of two of them right off the top. If I remember right, the first guaranteed lie is the one about purposely leaving some evidence behind so LE would find it. LOL I cant even hardly type that.

And the one about her purposely letting the phone ping in Idaho so she can be tracked and caught.

 

[gitana1]

KK could probably teach PF a thing or two about manipulation! KK has an "Aunt K" that resides in Colorado. She was waiting in the car when KK was introducing herself to KB with the coffee ruse. "Aunt K" was also with KK in Las Vegas when CBI contacted her 12/14 -- KK didn't cooperate, said she knew nothing about KB.

KK used another Aunt in Idaho to drive her to Boise to lawyer up on 12/18-- but not before Idaho PD arrested her for buccal swab (KK made her deal with DA by 12/20).

KK used friend MS (paralegal) to confide in, and try to get legal hints from. MS went to her employer about the solicitations, but nobody in that group acted to warn authorities or KB.

KK used friend MG to confide in about solicitation, used her as cover for ex-husband, and borrowed her vehicle to travel to Colorado.

Yup, KK has manipulating and gathering flying monkey's down pact. MOO

My God.

 

[Ultra Violet]

What? Where did they meet? How did they meet each other? And where can I find all this info?

Hey, @gitana1 ! I found the twitter searches are a little repetitive at times, but the live blog from KOAAs Sam Kraemer has a pretty good account of everything. Start at the bottom and work your way up....

Live blog: Patrick Frazee appears in court for preliminary hearing

 

[gitana1]

Ugh, that is so concerning.

Don't worry though. I believe it is definitely enough to sustain a conviction. Altogether.

 

[BingoBongo]

What happened to the “underground” witness who was supposed to testify today?

He's a bit of a whack-o. Reminds me a tad of the supposed "boyfriend" of Chris Watts in that he wants his fame on the back of someone else.

 

[gitana1]

A lot of it is in the last thread.

Ugh. I don't have time to go back! Maybe if someone could link me to the first post where it starts I can catch up later?

 

[NWLady]

He called her on the 22nd and she arrived on the morning of the 24th.

He did this himself.

I have to give thanks were thanks is due, MassGuy. You were adamant that all 3 solicitation charges were related to PF soliciting KK and you were absolutely right. Kudos to you. You had that figured out from the beginning!

 

[BingoBongo]

So, Interesting.

PF's brother SF, who happens to be a LEO, was present when PF told LE he wanted an attorney.

Now we know why PF was smart enough to keep his yap shut.
Turns out, it wasn't PF who was smart enough.
Somebody told him to keep his yap shut.
Somebody with knowledge of how LE works.

JMO.

Yup, they gathered the wagons.

 

[gitana1]

Most of it all came out in testimony at preliminary hearing 2/19 --CBI Agent Slater.

The hearing was trial by twitter so check out thread #39. No camera/audio permitted.

Any post # or just from the beginning?