CO CO - Kelsey Berreth, 29, Woodland Park, Teller County, 22 Nov 2018 - #45*ARREST*

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CB (mom) had visited in October, right? You'd think she'd notice the missing curtains and bath rug, maybe even the pillows (assuming sofa pillows here). Was she too distraught at first to notice?

I wondered about that. I assume we're talking sofa pillows, not the sofa cushions themselves, because I'm sure CB would have noticed if they had been missing. It's possible the curtains were seldom if ever closed (I never close my kitchen curtains but the kitchen window would look too stark without them). I think CB did report the missing bath mat.

Then again, I think a lot probably had to do with CB's frame of mind at the time. I imagine she and KB's brother were focused on signs of violence or departure. After KK's clean up, there wouldn't be any obvious signs of violence. KB's brother checked things like her luggage and makeup. LE seems to have made the same mistake CB did: they looked for signs of a voluntary departure (none) or a violent event (none). They never looked at the condo as a cleaned-up crime scene.

Lots of us have posted this before, but once a gain: thank heavens CB wouldn't give up and found the blood in the bathroom that LE had missed or PF probably wouldn't be sitting in jail right now.

IMHO, of course.
 
I'm kind of wondering how big the trash bags were that KK filled at KB's.

I only have 32-gallon bags myself. They hold quite a bit. According to KK, she washed some towels and threw away curtains, pillows, a bath rug, a Bible, baby toys and some dirty baby wipes that appeared to have been used by PF to clean up. The presence of the tampons in the trash suggests that she didn't just empty the trash cans into her bags.

Six bags seems like a lot to hold the stuff she claimed she took. Maybe they were smaller inside trash can sizes?

I assume they were the living room curtains - just above the sofa. - maybe about 4 x 6 ft span
Yeah, those curtains would have been bulky. Did LE not notice there were no window coverings when they arrived for the wellness check? I assume these would be the living room curtains that faced the parking lot.
 
Just catching up with all the timelines. Thank you so much to those who put all that information together! It really paints a clear picture of what they did.

What struck me as I was halfway through is that if they had tossed out the cinnamon buns, it would have been more difficult to determine when she was last seen. That is, her phone was travelling all over the place, so it would have been more difficult to say that she was not with her phone except for the fresh baked buns that were left to cool.
I wonder why she left those and just threw away the foil.
It makes no sense! Throw the whole thing away!
Was that supposed to make it look like she walked away suddenly?
Moo
 
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I wonder if during the long evening before, PF made sure to invite KB to Chez Frazee for T-Day dinner, assuring she would be at home making plans and getting Baby K ready. He is meanwhile planning to kill her before the real T-Day dinner, so he has an alibi.

When he arrives at KB’s, she and Baby K are dressed up and getting ready to leave with him.

Then he attacks? Has to have a quick shower to clean himself, get the phone, not gonna make it to SF’s by 2;30 when SF2 & family arrive....

I wonder what he told SF when he showed up with Baby K but not KB. SF must have known KB was there the night before. I wonder if SF will ever tell us.

He had probably been bad-mouthing KB to SF for a long time. He probably could have given her any reason for KB not being there and she would have accepted it. He could have told her he got to KB's and she was passed out drunk/drugged and that's why she couldn't come and I'm sure SF would have believed him.
 
I think CB would have noticed instantly that some things weren’t right

No living room curtains?
Sofa cushions missing?
Bath mat missing?
The old cinnamon rolls
NO BIBLE
I’ll bet stuff in the kitchen wasn’t put away where it usually was.
 
“PF is stupid, but make no mistake, he is as evil as they come.

He drove this plot; he wanted Kelsey dead.

There is no evidence that KK was the person who pushed him to kill Kelsey, and every indication that the opposite is true.

In August, he was thinking about gaining sole custody of their baby.

That appears to be the motive, not KK.

Saying that KK is the one who is “cold and calculating” and PF is merely “some stupid man,” doesn’t jibe with the facts here.

It makes a man who literally bashed Kelsey’s face in, into some innocent pawn, and shifts the blame to KK.

Hell no.”
——————————————————

Respectfully,we will have to agree to disagree. But I do think he is evil and easily manipulated by someone with a bit more intelligence
 
That's the concern. The ex-wife implies that the suspect's mother knew what was being burned simply because the mother asked about it. I doubt they answered by telling her that it was his wife, so chances are although the mother was curious, she was fed a lie that was plausible.
Unless she has completely lost her sense of smell, she knew. She's a nurse, we are very in tune with odors!
I can tell from smell if you have diahrrea from giardia or blood in your poop after you flush!
Don't need to see anything!
I have also smelled cancer on a few family members and one friend's breath, a few months before they were even diagnosed.

Moo
 
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“PF is stupid, but make no mistake, he is as evil as they come.

He drove this plot; he wanted Kelsey dead.

There is no evidence that KK was the person who pushed him to kill Kelsey, and every indication that the opposite is true.

In August, he was thinking about gaining sole custody of their baby.

That appears to be the motive, not KK.

Saying that KK is the one who is “cold and calculating” and PF is merely “some stupid man,” doesn’t jibe with the facts here.

It makes a man who literally bashed Kelsey’s face in, into some innocent pawn, and shifts the blame to KK.

Hell no.”
——————————————————

Respectfully,we will have to agree to disagree. But I do think he is evil and easily manipulated by someone with a bit more intelligence
Do you have specific evidence that you can cite, that indicates that KK was the one who encouraged this plot?
 
Has anyone tried to understand or speculated if what we think we know happened if KKL actually did what she said she did? If it's true, I cannot figure out what was in it for her. I have a few ideas but none of these would even make me get out of bed to put my shoes on let alone drive hundreds of miles several times for someone I didn't really even have a "real" relationship with to clean up a murder mess.

What would do it for her? What was her investment?

Guy from back in the day "hot" rodeo guy says he can't stop thinking about her. (Meanwhile he has a girlfriend he moved across the country likely by the same manipulative tactics and has a toddler with her.)

Guy who she considers a friend, a past love interest and possible future with calls and starts a conversation with a girl he has learned of her weaknesses in the past, and starts grooming her with charm that perhaps she was the one after all? She is in a stagnant place in her relationship and welcomes the attention. (That quiet horse life set in and suddenly a husband and kids with a mortgage payment in the same small town you grew up in isn't what you thought it was. PF secretly calls while she's on her way home from work and get's her all riled up about the what if.) Husband has no idea. Or he does, but they don't acknowledge it.

She can move to the ranch, bring her kids, after all it's "his" ranch. If only she can prove she really loves him. There's just one problem.......

Really low self esteem because hers came from her success as a big fish in a small sea back in the day in high school, and her rodeo achievements.

Just pure hate for the competition. Or did she even know but then when she found out she got pissed and signed up? Some kind of promise about the future? Together?

Sex life? (Morbidly wonder if this bonding moment turned PF or them on where they were intimate before she went home after burning what she knows to be KB's remains.) Did they get off on laughing about and discussing this? Or just one of them did? Sorry I know it's sick but I have to believe KKL spent the night after THAT day. And they don't see each other that often.

Or did he completely use her as narcissists do and before she knew it she was in over her head and panicked? You would think there would be blinking red lights, huge flags, slaps in the face, with sirens and horns but sometimes the grooming and manipulation is beyond what we can see.

All of the above? Some of the above? None? PF doesn't strike me as being a ladies man and not even good looking or charming off the bat.

Hard to understand, just wondering what other sleuthers think if you were in her shoes. What on earth could have made her do this as a human, a woman, a mother, a girlfriend? Really struggling with it. Would like to hear others idea of what would encourage this type of insane behavior.

I personally would have called LE if I heard this idea from ANYONE more than a very small joke or passing small conversation people have about their ex. Actual directions or plans, burner phones, sitting in someone's driveway, plane tickets, rental/borrow cars, driving hundreds of miles, bringing bleach and hazmat suit, leaving keys, metal rods, how-to's? WTH

This is speculation and I'm not qualified to diagnose anyone. MOO, MOS, JMO

It's all just a guess at this point, isn't it?

But, I'd go with the she's always had the hots for him, and experienced great sadness when her life went a different direction, but never forgot the emotional thrill he gave her. She became depressed/bummed/lost after her divorce from CL and the weight gain and stagnant life got to be too much. PF comes back into her life and she see's rainbows, hot romance and a possible future. All those initial "girl in love" feelings came flooding back.

It's truly amazing, and frightening, how much control a narc can have over you...and how easily it is to wear blinders, under the right circumstances.

Still - murder solicitation?!? At what point does that red flag become a high intensity sunspot? She had plenty of opportunity to run from this, and she chose not to.

So, IMO, she's either a crazed, love-lorn woman, or evil. Probably a bit of both.
 
I wonder if she bought them for PF's mom. She was very thoughtful and sweet. I could totally see her doing that.
Sounds like it. Along with calling her mother for the dip recipe. Poor thing was probably secretly hoping she'd get a Thanksgiving Day dinner invite, instead of the bleak prospect of staying home all along, on a major holiday. What a disgusting, vile, excuse for a human Patrick Frazee, is.
And I don't have that high of an opinion of the mother who raised him, either. I've dealt with abusive trash "men," twice. In both instances, their mothers blamed ME.
 
I winder why she left those and just threw away the foil.
It makes no sense! Throw the while thing away!
Was that supposed to make it look like she walked away suddenly?
Moo

Didn't the foil have blood on it? She collected everything with blood, and if the foil had blood, she would have taken it. At the same time, she left the scene as though Kelsey would be back any minute.
 
I think CB would have noticed instantly that some things weren’t right

No living room curtains?
Sofa cushions missing?
Bath mat missing?
The old cinnamon rolls
NO BIBLE
I’ll bet stuff in the kitchen wasn’t put away where it usually was.
Didn't I read there was a bleached out area on the sofa?
Moo
 
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