CO - Shanann Watts (34), Celeste"Cece" (3) and Bella (4), Frederick, 13 Aug 2018 *Arrest* #16

[AbbyG]

CW reminds me of another Chris -- Christopher Vaughn, in Chicago. So sad, and incomprehensible. Did anyone else here follow that case?

 

[borndem]

This photo posted by @gitana1 of CW is chilling.

https://www.websleuths.com/forums/attachments/img_9697-jpg.145186/

Yes, and maddening, and I hope, a piece of evidence at trial.

What an idiot. He may as well have said something like, "I'm ready for the next chapter of my life, I'm done with this one. So happy I get a mulligan on this," while he was standing up there. He probably already had grand plans when that pic was taken. Grrrrr.
Death penalty. The needle. JMHO.

 

[kay74]

Please stop blaming VITAMINS for a man murdering his family. These are the ingredients for Chris's daily VITAMIN regiment. At least research them if you want to blame them. As far as steroids, I don't know if he was or not.

Geez, who's blaming "vitamins"?

 

[Seattle1]

What do you see in CW that indicates narcissism? Just curious.

Well the mask CW wore for sure. Let's count the other:

A Relationship without Empathy--
(a Narcissist) ...

So much time, energy and emotion is spent trying to understand why emotional manipulators do what they do. The answer has never been a secret. It’s always been in plain sight, but perhaps due to its simplicity and our inability to relate, we shrug it off and continue the search for some way where we can blame ourselves.

Why do Narcissists make such terrible partners? Why are they so hurtful? The answer is of course empathy, or rather a lack there of.

Empathy is defined as – the action of understanding, being aware of, being sensitive to, and vicariously experiencing the feelings and thoughts of another, of either the past or present, without having the feelings, thoughts, and experience fully communicated in an objectively explicit manner. – Webster

The DSM tells us that psychopaths lack empathy and that a Narcissist’s ability to feel empathy is impaired. This means that they cannot understand or have concern for the feelings of others.

Why are Narcissist’s so self-centered? – Because your feelings, your needs do not compute. It’s as if they are emotionally color blind, thus, missing colors in their emotional color palette.

What does a relationship look like with someone that lacks empathy?

Lack of Empathy Symptoms in a Romantic Relationship

Everything is always about them. Your thoughts, feelings, needs and wants are not considered, unless they serve a purpose.

Emotional Manipulators ruin the holidays, birthdays or any special event that is important to their partners. They do not like to share attention and therefore, do not care to be a part of anything that doesn’t thrust them in the spotlight. They have an expectation to receive and feel uncomfortable with the concept of giving.They will, on occasion give, but the gift will often be off somehow, usually not exactly what you wanted or asked for. They do the absolute minimum in terms of effort, when it comes to bestowing something that does not directly benefit them.

When their partners are ill or have some type of pain or injury, the Narcissist will view this as an inconvenience to them and either be bothered by it or ignore it. They are not caregivers. They don’t do nurturing – unless it’s to get praise by others – “Look at how great Tom is being while Anne gets over her appendicitis.”

They are never wrong, so don’t expect to get an apology. You will always be wrong, and they will always be the wronged party.

No issue is ever resolved. They thrive in ambiguity. When you can’t pin them down for a time or a decision they can never be held accountable when they disappoint. Disappointment is what they do. Don’t expect to be able to count or rely on them for much, unless there is a benefit to them.

They have a real problem discerning cause and effect. They cannot see a link between their behavior and your reaction. They will look at your reaction to what they’ve done as the problem, rather than their behavior.[CW will never see that what he did was wrong; his vicious act was, and will always be, somebody else's faul]. Undoubtedly, CW suffers from more than a personality disorder, but omitting the definitions and discussion of psychopaths and sociopaths here is intentional. I believe it's very serious stuff, and I'm not qualified to present it. Providing link below. All MOO].

Because of their fear of abandonment, they will try to control you through emotional, psychological and sometimes physical abuse. They will not care how this abuse affects you. They will not care if they have traumatized you, hurt you or that they are grounding your self-esteem into dust. The effects of their abuse do not generally even register with them.

Even if a Narcissist targeted you because of your wealth, business, fame, talent or connections, they will quickly start to resent you for these things. They are not supporters.They don’t do the cheerleader role. They will try to assert their control and methodically try to take over and try to take credit for your success, by undermining, demeaning and manipulating.

They will attack you verbally, emotionally sometimes physically if they feel that their ego is being threatened. You will usually be their emotional punching bag when things go wrong for them.

They have no interest in your growth and expansion. They don’t care about what’s best for you, your happiness or success. They will try to suppress these things, to maintain your compliance and their control.

They will make it very unpleasant for you to maintain outside relationships with family and friends. They want you there, focusing and serving them. They don’t want you to get any ideas, any hint of a better life. They don’t want people that love you to reach out and give you options, so any time you want to go out and socialize without them there will be a problem.

They will think nothing of flirting, spending time with or giving attention to another in your presence. They seek to be revered and the center of attention, it will not compute that their behavior is inappropriate or upsetting you. In fact, they will thrive on pitting one against the other, a term called triangulation. They love the feelings and attention that your jealousy gives them.

Nothing is ever equal. On matters that they care about they will insist on complete domination. In matters that don’t, they will not lift a finger to help or compromise.

They will not love you for you. They will constantly be trying to change you. They will criticize you and never let you feel comfortable in your own skin.

Their presence and energy will dominate your space. You won’t be able to work or focus on your own projects.

You will never be able to trust them. You will walk on egg shells because you will never know what’s coming or when the next shoe will drop. There is no relaxing, only high stress and anxiety.

You will never feel truly loved. You will never feel comfortable. You will never feel safe.

Why didn’t your relationship work? Stop searching. Stop looking for a way to make it your fault. If your relationship resembled many of the above behaviors, it’s time to stop obsessing. Stop the FBI analysis and start accepting the truth.Your relationship didn’t work out because you were involved with someone who has a Personality Disorder. It never had a chance.

Fair Use Act Disclaimer

This post is for education purposes only.

Copyright Disclaimer under section 107 of the Copyright Act of 1976, allowance is made for “fair use” for purposes such as criticism, comment, news reporting, teaching, scholarship, education and research. Fair use is a use permitted by copyright statute that might otherwise be infringing.

www.esteemology.com, a website dedicated to educating and healing survivors of abusive relationships.

Psychopaths versus sociopaths: what is the difference?

 

[kay74]

Exactly. To go further, I don’t care if he was using steroids (known to induce rage in some people). He alone made the decision to kill his family. He brutally murdered his wife and children. He dumped their bodies like trash. He went about his day, and engaged in a coverup in which he told lie after lie. Then he tried to blame the victim. Vitamins, supplements, anti-depressants, steroids or anything else, don’t make him any less responsible for his actions.

Anti-depressants do cause you to kill or commit suicide. Once such case is the Columbine killer. He was on them and there are Many other cases. That is why the pharm co. (won't name it) has over 3000 lawsuits against it for this. They make a balanced mind unbalanced in some individuals. Yes the pharm company has blood on their hands. You think they will take them off the market? NOO it's a money maker.

 

[MyBelle]

Please stop blaming VITAMINS for a man murdering his family. These are the ingredients for Chris's daily VITAMIN regiment. At least research them if you want to blame them. As far as steroids, I don't know if he was or not.

I've not seen anybody here blaming vitamins. I don't believe any of us know exactly what CW was ingesting.

 

[Jennifer17]

Anti-depressants do cause you to kill or commit suicide. Once such case is the Columbine killer. He was on them and there are Many other cases. That is why the pharm co. (won't name it) has over 3000 lawsuits against it for this. They make a balanced mind unbalanced in some individuals. Yes the pharm company has blood on their hands. You think they will take them off the market? NOO it's a money maker.

I am sorry, but I do not believe that. He was on anti depressants because he was depressed and obviously had a personality disorder.
The anti depressant did not make it plot with another young man to kill.

 

[MassGuy]

Anti-depressants do cause you to kill or commit suicide. Once such case is the Columbine killer. He was on them and there are Many other cases. That is why the pharm co. (won't name it) has over 3000 lawsuits against it for this. They make a balanced mind unbalanced in some individuals. Yes the pharm company has blood on their hands. You think they will take them off the market? NOO it's a money maker.

Let’s entertain the notion that he was on medication that made him psychotic. Say that he killed his family in a psychotic state. Then go ahead and explain to me, the attempted coverup, the manipulation, lies, and victim blaming. Those are the actions of someone who is thinking logically. He knew what he did, he knew it was wrong, and he thought he could get away with it.

Narrator: “But he didn’t get away with it. In fact, he spent the rest of his life in prison.”

 

[Bill Carson]

Also people who have taken antidepressants have committed violent acts and suicide. The info even comes with them. Thousands of cases of this happening. It makes me wonder if he was on these or if it was these patches. It seems after he did this, he was in Lalaland.

Yes, and (not that it matters) I wonder if users of the patches suffer from any sort of withdrawal when they stop using them. Whether they have to be tapered off like some medications. I know people suffer withdrawal even from caffeine, and I think the patches had caffeine and other substances.

 

[AgeofAquaruis]

What do you see in CW that indicates narcissism? Just curious.

Cheating,lying, killing wife,and daughters,and blaming her for it.
Classic Narccisistic Sociopath.

 

[Bill Carson]

Please stop blaming VITAMINS for a man murdering his family. These are the ingredients for Chris's daily VITAMIN regiment. At least research them if you want to blame them. As far as steroids, I don't know if he was or not.

I wasn't blaming the vitamins, I just think that someone with a pharmacological background should look into what CW specifically was taking (and that could include the Thrive patches, other supplements, prescription medication, OTC medication, and other controlled substances) that might have caused him to be quick tempered or especially irritable. We know from the advertising claims that the patches gave users incredible amounts of energy, so there might be some form of stimulant, even if this is caffeine. Or the energy could come from changes in metabolism from eating fewer carbs and exercise.

 

[mickey2942]

The debate if other substances made CW susceptible to rage, is okay. It was the coverup and lies later.

And no, steroids/vitamins don't cause people to commit murder. We are looking at correlations, not causation.

Was there a highly combustible mix of factors that lead to this disaster? Definitely. Does that excuse anything? Nope.

 

[MyBelle]

Let’s entertain the notion that he was on medication that made him psychotic. Say that he killed his family in a psychotic state. Then go ahead and explain to me, the attempted coverup, the manipulation, lies, and victim blaming. Those are the actions of someone who is thinking logically. He knew what he did, he knew it was wrong, and he thought he could get away with it.

Narrator: “But he didn’t get away with it. In fact, he spent the rest of his life in prison.”

The victim blaming could be part of his delusional state of mind. I'm not a psychiatrist nor do I wish to play one on this forum.

Discussing any explanation for his monster behavior isn't remotely implying that CW is going to "get away with it."

 

[DexterMorgan]

Why say she probably took the kids and left while knowing the cops would see everything was still there?

I don't get that part.

 

[Bill Carson]

Exactly. To go further, I don’t care if he was using steroids (known to induce rage in some people). He alone made the decision to kill his family. He brutally murdered his wife and children. He dumped their bodies like trash. He went about his day, and engaged in a coverup in which he told lie after lie. Then he tried to blame the victim. Vitamins, supplements, anti-depressants, steroids or anything else, don’t make him any less responsible for his actions.

1. "....don't make him any less responsible for his actions." I said that in my post.

2. Some of us are here for answers to the question "Why," and not just to watch him fry in the electric chair.

3. If there are any pharmacological contributing factors (similar to the link between anti-depressants and suicide), then we need to know that so that other people don't commit acts of violence.

 

[Layla123]

I said the same the other day, we know absolutely nothing apart from old school friends and an ex employee

We know CW’s Dad cared enough about his son to fly out to Colorado when SW was first discovered to be missing. We know SW asked LE for an opportunity to speak with his Dad before confessing. I’m seeing a supportive Dad who cares very much about his family. I’m hoping Dad is an upstanding man who counsels C.W. to do the right thing, but we shall see.

 

[BingoBongo]

Well the mask CW wore for sure. Let's count the other:

Snipped for brevity...Google "crime and narcissism". Some very enlightening papers and books out there.

Dr. Craig Malkin has written some good stuff, and has some pretty good videos on Youtube.

The Most Powerful Way to Protect Your Kids From Pathological Narcissism - The Good Men Project

This is one reason why I'd like to know more about his childhood and family dynamics.

 

[Bill Carson]

Regardless of what story one believes, what we do know for sure is that CW had just buried his wife in a shallow grave and dumped his baby girls in vats of oil when he made those media interviews. He shows no signs of distress - currently or evidence of distress in the preceding hours, he is able to lie with ease, and he smiles. He shows ability to completely detach, and an extreme lack of empathy for other human beings.

Compare that to video of SW's father to see what genuine grief looks like in a man who feels real emotions and cares for others.

It's really hard to gauge tone on these message boards. My first reaction is that you are yelling at me for asking a simple question. Then I have to take a deep breath and consider that you are answering in a very calm, rational tone. I'm going to presume the latter instead of the former, and I would appreciate it if all of us would presume good faith in our questions and comments here. I know I don't like it when I feel like I'm walking on eggshells, and I'm sure most everyone feels the same.

So let me apologize to you for my first reaction. I can see that you are trying to help me. Thank you.

I don't know anything about narcissism, other than it's about being self-centered and selfish. I presume that not everybody with narcissism kills their entire family. I don't know what symptoms to look for, so I asked a question.

 

[MerryB]

ETA: You'll never hear a Type-A male described as "bossy", "pushy", "nagging", etc... you'll hear him described as driven, passionate, and hard-working.

Agree! I was actually going to say, imagine if the roles were reversed before I saw your post.
I do want to highlight, however, that there is a difference between bossy and emotionally abusive. And both men & women can be victims.

 

[MassGuy]

1. "....don't make him any less responsible for his actions." I said that in my post.

2. Some of us are here for answers to the question "Why," and not just to watch him fry in the electric chair.

3. If there are any pharmacological contributing factors (similar to the link between anti-depressants and suicide), then we need to know that so that other people don't commit acts of violence.

I absolutely agree that it’s important to understand the why, and all the contributing factors.

My issue is that we have no knowledge of what he was taking, and specifically, how or if, it contributed to his actions.

His post murder coverup efforts, don’t jibe with something pharmacological effecting him on such a deep level, that it influenced him enough to murder his family. This is because his actions appear to be rational (as much as murdering one’s family can be rational).

I think that his obvious psychological issues, are deeper seated than “the medication made me do it.”