Egypt Air flight 804 missing, 19 May 2016

[CARIIS]

http://www.msnbc.com/andrea-mitchel...-on-egyptair-crash-investigation-691075139597

 

[SouthAussie]

A French ship that was expected to help in the search for the black box of EgyptAir flight MS804 arrived at the crash site on Tuesday. However, officials in charge of the search said that the ship arrived without the black box signal receiver required for the search.

You have got to be kidding me I'm getting MH370 deja vu

Unreal .... they are "negotiating with American companies to purchase the signal receiver as soon as possible".
So, for now, they are trawling in a submarine that may not be able to reach adequate depths as they look for the main wreckage.

http://www.dailynewsegypt.com/2016/...crash-site-without-black-box-signal-receiver/

 

[CARIIS]

tid bits

EgyptAir will contract two foreign companies, one French and one Italian, to help search for the black boxes of its plane that crashed in the Mediterranean, its chairman says

to conduct deep sea searching in the Mediterranean, 3,000 metres deep,"

The sources said the plane did not make contact with Egyptian air traffic control, but Egyptian air traffic controllers were able to see it on radar on a border area between Egyptian and Greek airspace known as KUMBI, 260 nautical miles from Cairo.

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2016-05-25/egyptair-to-contract-french-italian-companies-for-black-box/7446538

It could have been a fire, a bomb, a cascading electrical failure - or something else altogether.

bodies can also be ripped apart when an aircraft disintegrates following a structural failure, or hits the ground or sea at high velocity.

Uncertainty over what caused the May 19 crash is delaying any response by policy makers, whether it be a hunt for a terrorist who planted a bomb, or revising safety procedures

Other alerts showed unspecified problems with flight computers, including one that pilots use to set flight parameters such as altitude,

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/world/news/article.cfm?c_id=2&objectid=11644037

ash

 

[CARIIS]

It has been amazing to me that for some reason finding body parts in this specific crash has resulted in these big declarations that body parts indicate a bomb was on board.

Not at all. Finding only fragments in aviation accidents is the norm. Obliteration is the norm. Indicates violent impact and IMO, nothing more.

All of the following are different crashes:

1 ValuJet crash, there were no bodies, only pieces. - there was no bomb in this accident
About 68 of the 110 persons aboard the plane were identified, crashed into water just like this one.

2 Another crash ------seven were never identified.-- there was no bomb in this accident

3 Another accident -------18 caskets of unidentified remains were interred. - crash had nothing to do with a bomb

4 coroner still hasn't been able to identify the victims on board - another - no bomb involved

5 Another than had nothing to do with a bomb------- 9-unidentified-bodies-of-tara

6 12 unidentified victims of IX-812 Air India plane

7 Unidentified body parts from the disaster were also buried near the site a different crash ----- no bomb

8 While the identities of the two people who died in a plane crash Sunday afternoon have yet to be determined----- another " bombless" crash

9 Cortland plane crash; victims remain unidentified -------no bomb here either

10. 27 victims whose remains could not be idenitfied - nothing to do with a bomb

I could go on and on and on!

The only thing, IMO, body parts being found, in small parts, indicate - an aviation accident .

This far , with the bags and bags of human remeains, the only thing that has been determined is that , at this point, no eveidence of a bomb thus far , while examining the body parts. At this point ,the body parts are excluding a bomb - no residue.on any body parts ..............

moo

Airplanes crashing are violent........................


Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...dentified-body-parts-scene.html#ixzz49fli0Slg
Follow us: @MailOnline on Twitter | DailyMail on Facebook

https://www.google.com/webhp?sourceid=chrome-instant&ion=1&espv=2&ie=UTF-8#q=unidnetified%20vistims%20from%20aircrash

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/world/news/article.cfm?c_id=2&objectid=11644037


http://articles.sun-sentinel.com/19...alujet-crash-plane-crashes-aviation-disasters

 

[Hope32]

Would Imeristat data help at all for this type of case? And if so how long would it take for them to have the data ready?

 

[gregjrichards]

Would Imeristat data help at all for this type of case? And if so how long would it take for them to have the data ready?

I don't think this plane had this facility as its a budget airline that's why it is critical they find the black boxes.

 

[gregjrichards]

Experts fear doomed EgyptAir MS804 'downed by laptop bomb' like one used by militants on Daallo Airlines plane

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/world-news/experts-fear-doomed-egyptair-ms804-8050375

 

[branwynbreeze]

France and Egypt's spat?

http://www.dailynewsegypt.com/2016/...ported-egypt-sparking-discontent-among-press/

Although Pigaglio was reportedly stopped on Monday while entering Egypt, it was not until two days later that he was put onboard a plane headed to France. Pigaglio, who has worked as a correspondent in Egypt for two years, was expelled on Tuesday night after being detained at the airport as he was returning from vacation, according to his employer, La Croix.

 

[CARIIS]

tid bits

EgyptAir will contract two foreign companies, one French and one Italian, to help search for the black boxes of its plane that crashed in the Mediterranean, its chairman says

to conduct deep sea searching in the Mediterranean, 3,000 metres deep,"

The sources said the plane did not make contact with Egyptian air traffic control, but Egyptian air traffic controllers were able to see it on radar on a border area between Egyptian and Greek airspace known as KUMBI, 260 nautical miles from Cairo.

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2016-05-25/egyptair-to-contract-french-italian-companies-for-black-box/7446538

It could have been a fire, a bomb, a cascading electrical failure - or something else altogether.

bodies can also be ripped apart when an aircraft disintegrates following a structural failure, or hits the ground or sea at high velocity.

Uncertainty over what caused the May 19 crash is delaying any response by policy makers, whether it be a hunt for a terrorist who planted a bomb, or revising safety procedures

Other alerts showed unspecified problems with flight computers, including one that pilots use to set flight parameters such as altitude,



remains shrouded in confusion, speculation and conflicting statements.

https://twitter.com/egyptair



Breaking now, a red martian, 5 foot6, with purple hair, 14 fingers, and two noses grabbed the plane with its left toe. Just wanted ya all to know.

Good lord they are talking metoerites now. IMO, its an old plane that has run to death - rivots popped at 37 000, its called a plane crash!! I am telling ya all the internet can be awesome but..................................

 

[CARIIS]

[h=1]EgyptAir crash: official dismisses claim that remains suggest blast[/h]Aircraft investigation on in background. Just learned something. In depressazation, their lungs would basically explode, so there won't be awareness or pain.

The head of Egypt’s forensics authority has dismissed a suggestion that the small size of the body parts retrieved since an EgyptAir plane crashed last week indicated there had been an explosion on board.
On Tuesday an unnamed senior Egyptian forensics official told Associated Press that he had personally examined human remains recovered from the crash site and that they suggested there had been an explosion.
Speaking on condition of anonymity he said all 80 pieces brought to Cairo so far are small human fragments, leading him to conclude that “the logical explanation is that it was an explosion”.

(Of course there was an explosion, thats what happens when planes crash - they explode - how it works!)
However Egypt’s head of forensics later denounced the reports as “completely false”, state news agency Mena said.

“Everything published about this matter is completely false, and mere assumptions that did not come from the forensics authority,”
Another senior forensics official told Reuters only a tiny number of remains had arrived so far and it was too early to specify whether there had been an explosion on board.
.. the plane’s black box recorder would be analysed in Egypt if it is found intact, but would be sent abroad for analysis if it is found to be damaged.

http://www.theguardian.com/world/20...ial-says-human-remains-suggest-blast-on-plane


"[The] claims made by the French TV station are not true. The pilot did not contact Egypt air control before the incident."
Emergency descents can be dangerous as they can cause major changes in cabin air pressure and, it was speculated, may have led to the plane plunging 37,0000 feet into the Mediterranean Sea.
It was not the only controversial theory behind the crash to be of offered on Monday, as a Turkish newspaper quoted an airline pilot as saying he saw "an unidentified object with green flashing lights" pass over Istanbul just one hour before the air disaster.
"Then it disappeared all of a sudden. We are guessing that it was a UFO," the pilot told Hurriet Daily News.

No it was a martian............

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/world/news/article.cfm?c_id=2&objectid=11643606

 

[catatonia]

I'm reading through the Aviation Herald and there have been a couple of smoke incidents in planes lately.

Iberia A332 near Fortaleza on Apr 16th 2016, smoke in cabin

smoke was observed from the crew rest area/lavatory

Ukraine International B738 at Lviv on Jan 15th 2016, smell of burning plastics in cabin

a smell of burning plastics developed in the cabin prompting the crew to stop the climb at about 8500 feet MSL and to return to Lviv for a safe landing about 15 minutes after departure.

The airline reported that the aircraft was examined with all systems found serviceable. A piece of plastics, some cellophane, was identified as source of the smell. The passengers were provided with food, those continuing through Kiev and losing their connections were rebooked onto other connecting flights.

The aircraft was released to depart again about 8 hours after landing and reached Kiev with a delay of 8 hours.

On Apr 18th 2016 Ukraine's National Bureau of Air Accident Investigation (NBAAI) reported that during the initial climb a pungent smell of burning plastics developed in the cabin, flight attendants were unable to identify the source of the odour prompting the captain to return to Lviv. However, the crew did not work the related "Fire, Smoke or Fumes in flight" checklist, all aircraft systems worked normally, no smoke detector triggered. After landing maintenance discovered an odour of burning plastics smell with the right hand engine (CFM56) running and associated bleed air and air conditioning system operating. The odour was identified to be the result of thermal degradation of polymeric material of foreign objects in the right hand engine's ducts, additional foreign objects were also found in the ducts of the left hand engine. Following the removal of the foreign objects tests did not reproduce any further odour. The NBAAI concluded: "The most likely cause of the odour after takeoff from Lviv was the ingestion of foreign objects probably consisting of polymere material into the inner core of the engines, in particular the right hand engine, and thermal degradation of such material causing evaporation or combustion with the release of toxic substances. As result these gasses (steam or smoke) got into the aircraft's air conditioning system and into the passenger cabin."

British Airways A320 near Venice on Apr 12th 2016, cabin smoke indication

the crew received a cabin fire indication and decided to divert to Venice for a safe landing on Venice's runway 04R about 30 minutes later.

A replacement Airbus A320-200 registration G-MIDT was dispatched to Venice, resumed the flight and reached London with a delay of 8 hours.

The occurrence aircraft remained on the ground in Venice for 7 hours, then positioned to London Gatwick. The smoke detector indication was identified false. The aircraft resumed service the following morning.

Easyjet A319 near Toulouse on Apr 16th 2016, fumes in cabin

the crew declared PAN reporting a strange smell in the aft cabin which resulted in two flight attendants complaining about head aches. The crew requested medical assistance available upon arrival. The aircraft landed safely on Toulouse's runway 32R about 30 minutes later. After landing the crew advised the odour had dissipated. The flight attendants were taken to a hospital.

Srilankan A332 at Bangkok on Apr 7th 2016, smoke in cabin

A Srilankan Airlines Airbus A330-200, registration 4R-ALJ performing flight UL-891 from Bangkok (Thailand) to Colombo (Sri Lanka), was in the initial climb out of Bangkok's runway 19L when the crew stopped the climb at 4000 feet reporting smoke in the cabin. The aircraft returned to Bangkok for a safe landing on runway 19R about 11 minutes after departure.

A passenger reported there was smoke in the aft cabin.

Lufthansa Cityline E195 at Munich on Apr 4th 2016, burning odour in cockpit

A Lufthansa Cityline Embraer ERJ-195, registration D-AEMB performing flight LH-2134 from Munich to Muenster (Germany), was climbing out of Munich's runway 26R when the crew stopped the climb at 5000 feet reporting a burning odour in the cockpit. Both crew donned their oxygen masks and returned to Munich for a safe landing on runway 26R about 12 minutes after departure. There were no injuries, the flight crew however was taken to a hospital for medical checks.

The flight was cancelled, the passengers were rebooked onto other flights.

Lufthansa Cityline E195 near Munich on Mar 30th 2016, smoke on board

A Lufthansa Cityline Embraer ERJ-195, registration D-AEMD performing flight LH-2311 from Amsterdam (Netherlands) to Munich (Germany), was descending towards Munich when the crew reported smoke on board. The aircraft continued for a safe landing on Munich's runway 26R and taxied to the gate with emergency services in trail.

The occurrence aircraft remained on the ground for 10 hours, then resumed service.

Jetblue E190 near Buffalo on Mar 30th 2016, smokey odour in cockpit

A Jetblue Embraer ERJ-190, registration N309JB performing flight B6-1012 from Chicago O'Hare,IL to Boston,MA (USA) with 54 passengers and 4 crew, was enroute at FL390 about 50nm westsouthwest of Buffalo,NY (USA) when the crew reported a smokey odour in the cockpit and decided to divert to Buffalo. The aircraft landed safely on Buffalo's runway 23 about 15 minutes later.

The airline reported all passengers were safe and are being rebooked onto other flights.

www.avherald.com

just to name a few, so apparently it isn't that unusual, but when you're in the plane and not knowing what's going on, still scary though.

 

[Roselvr]

Very interesting reports regarding terror and this crash - more substance than CNN endless regergatation of same ole same ole !

[video=youtube;jaLVSbG3maE]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jaLVSbG3maE[/video]

I am going to have to seperate posts cause one cant post multple videos in one post. Def better reporting IMO!

Been a few days since I've seen anything reported. Have to agree with your video, why did they put a bomb on this small plane when there are larger planes flying the same route?

It really blows me away that the plane hasn't been found yet and that 2 years after MH370 they're no closer to finding technology to track flights better.
How many days ago did they find the oil slick plus belongings?

 

[Tssiemer]

I'm surprised that they aren't denying the plane is missing at all. Like "what plane? Huh? We have no idea what you're talking about."


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[CARIIS]

Searchers Detect Emergency Signal of EgyptAir Plane
Tid bits

Passenger jets have emergency locator beacons on their fuselage, which differ from the underwater locator beacons attached to the Airbus A320’s so-called black boxes, the cockpit voice and data recorders that typically provide the most comprehensive flight information. Mr. Moqadem said investigators haven’t located the black boxes.

http://www.wsj.com/articles/searchers-detect-emergency-signal-of-egyptair-plane-1464264946

It will be intersting to see what the actual depth will be. I found it somewhat ironic, that they were claiming plane crashed into the deepest part of the sea, when they had no idea where it was!!

I do not think Egypt and Paris "hang" out often! My sense is in the beginning they did /said anything to steer toward bomb, and really did not want anything found (casue mechanical IMO) .

However when French investigators arrived on scene they quickly got the point that BEA does it by the book and honest and realized they had no choice but to start doing the truth. Pure speculation on my part, but will be interesting to see how this plays out...................

vessel provided by ALSEAMAR, a French company which specializes in marine wreckage searches, will join within hours the hunt for the data recorders of EgyptAir flight MS804 which has crashed in the Mediterranean Sea.

the company joined the search for black boxes after a Boeing 737 belonging to Egypt’s Flash Air crashed in the Red Sea near Sharm al-Sheikh. The French BEA investigation agency was involved due to the large number of French tourists on board.

ALSEAMAR used a specially adapted system of “intelligent buoys” connected to underwater acoustic listening devices in the search for the Flash Air jet, which was in 1,000 meters of water. It was not immediately clear whether the same system could be used in the much deeper Mediterranean waters where the EgyptAir crashed.

The black boxes are believed to be lying in up to 3,000 meters of water, on the edge of the range for hearing and locating signals emitted by the boxes.

acoustic hydrophones must be towed in the water at depths of up to 2,000 meters in order to have the best chance of picking up the signals.

it disappeared from the radar screens less than a minute after it entered the Egyptian airspace.

not made any other requests for assistance from the U.S.

Frist time hearing this: air traffic control centre was assisted by airplanes that were in the surroundings of EgyptAir flight MS804 which called for it and offered any information about it and that the search and rescue units were then notified.

..............all legal procedures were taken by the company to seize the aircraft's recordings.

http://www.albawaba.com/news/egypti...reports-contact-crashed-egyptair-plane-843648

http://www.albawaba.com/news/specialized-french-vessel-joining-sea-search-egyptair-crash-844958

Funny tweets about an Egypt Air plane that was hijacked (all ended fine) in March

Some are quite funny!) 2016:

http://www.albawaba.com/business/loveisintheair-egyptians-find-funny-side-egyptair-hijacking-823126

Hummm
CAIRO, Nov. 26 (Aswat Masriya) - EgyptAir's decision to suspend the shipping of commercial cargo on passenger flights bound for New York and Canada created a crisis in the export of Egypt's spinning, weaving and garments sector, with Qualified Industrial Zones (QIZ) exporters being the hardest hit by the decision.EgyptAir said in a statement on Thursday, that the decision to suspend the transfer of goods on passenger flights is based on recommendations by the U.S. transportation safety delegation, which visited Egypt last week, in the aftermath of the Russian jet crash on Oct. 31. (yeh right!)

http://en.aswatmasriya.com/news/details/12166

Hummmm again!
On Oct. 31, 2015, an Airbus A321 was downed over Egypt's Sinai Peninsula while en route to St. Petersburg — all 224 people on board were killed. Two weeks after the crash, the FSB announced that a terror attack had caused the plane crash. Moscow bans Egypt Air flights

flights from the UK are also off.
'Germany has recently announced that flights can start again

prepared to accept the right level of risk or threat for you and your family.'

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/travel/t...hundreds-slashed-little-18.html#ixzz49m2SxsCn
Follow us: @MailOnline on Twitter | DailyMail on Facebook
http://en.aswatmasriya.com/news/details/12166

 

[CARIIS]

Been a few days since I've seen anything reported. Have to agree with your video, why did they put a bomb on this small plane when there are larger planes flying the same route?

It really blows me away that the plane hasn't been found yet and that 2 years after MH370 they're no closer to finding technology to track flights better.
How many days ago did they find the oil slick plus belongings?

It is here. Has been here. It is up. It works. Its free to airlines. Obserd , huh? Go figure....

0700 BST, Monday 12 May 2014:

Inmarsat has confirmed it has proposed to ICAO a free global airline tracking service over the Inmarsat network, as part of the anticipated adoption of further aviation safety service measures by the world’s airlines following the loss of flight MH370.
This service is being offered to all 11,000 commercial passenger aircraft, which are already equipped with an Inmarsat satellite connection, virtually 100 per cent of the world’s long haul commercial fleet.


In addition to this free global airline tracking service, Inmarsat will also offer both an enhanced position reporting facility to support reduced in-flight aircraft separation, and a ‘black box in the cloud’ service, under which – on the back of certain defined trigger events (such as an unapproved course deviation) – historic and real-time flight data recorder and cockpit voice recorder information can be streamed off an aircraft to defined aviation safety recipients.

This offer responsibly, quickly and at little or no cost to the industry, addresses in part the problem brought to light by the recent tragic events around MH370.”

Basically planes are kept seperate, horiz and vert, by concrete number of miles. Dont remember the order, but odd altitudes are east and even altitudes are west or vice versa.There are bunch of other "entites" to it but that is the basic way now.

Little tornados are generated by the wings on aircraft. . So if "heavy" (jumbo) is ahead of a smaller aircraft, the distances vary. It beomes even more crucial upon takeoff or appraoch, Distances are increased. Accidents have been caused by wake turblance when a mistake happens.

Basically can flip the smaller plane behind it. This free deal can also:

It also has the capacity to reduce' "in-flight seperation" which translates to more airplanes can use the same space, increasing reliability, reducing delays, all sorts of stuff

http://www.inmarsat.com/press-release/inmarsat-provide-free-global-airline-tracking-service/



Here are wake vortex ( tornados) :

Don't understand why it has to be cut and paste?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zW4PmUE151c

It really neat cause you see the airflow over the wings too!!

 

[JohnPaul]

It really blows me away that the plane hasn't been found yet and that 2 years after MH370 they're no closer to finding technology to track flights better.

if we have the technology to put GPS in cell phones and cars, why can't they do it on planes, or the "black boxes"? :thinking:

 

[Dr. Know?]

Report: Signals detected from EgyptAir Flight 804 in Mediterranean

The signals were emitted by the plane's emergency locator transmitter, a device that can manually or automatically activate at impact and will usually send a distress signal. The signals from the emergency locator transmitter are different from the pings emitted by the "black boxes."

Having these signals narrows down the area that the multinational search team has been focusing on -- which a few days ago was described as "about the size of Connecticut." It dramatically decreases the search area to a 5-kilometer (3.1-mile) radius, giving investigators a more specific location to detect pings from the black boxes.

[video=cnn;world/2016/05/26/egyptair-flight-804-signal-detected-report-todd-tsr-tell.cnn]http://edition.cnn.com/2016/05/26/middleeast/egyptair-airbus-signals-detected/index.html[/video]

 

[Dr. Know?]

From the same link.

Signals from plane device?

The plane has three emergency locator transmitters, one of which is in the tail, where the flight data recorders are. It wasn't clear where the emergency transmitting device had been located within the plane.
The Egyptian news agency reported that Airbus sent the information to Egyptian authorities, who then relayed the information to the search and rescue units.
Airbus would not comment when asked about the signals, saying: "We are supporting the parties in charge of the investigation and we can't comment, nor do we contribute to any kind of speculation."
The signals from emergency locator transmitters can be picked up by satellite. It is not immediately clear when Airbus received these signals, but they are more commonly identified a few hours after impact -- not a few days later.

 

[Dr. Know?]

A handy dandy Airbus Glossary.

http://www.airbus.com/tools/glossary/

 

[Dr. Know?]

Everythng about Emergency locator transmitters.

Emergency Locator Transmitter (ELT)

http://www.skybrary.aero/index.php/Emergency_Locator_Transmitter_(ELT)