ID - 4 University of Idaho Students Murdered - Moscow # 36

[arielilane]

I can’t keep up with what is considered MSM, but the DM has an interview with the driver who took K&M home from the Grub Truk.

EXCLUSIVE: 'My job was to get these girls home safe.' Private taxi driver who drove Idaho roommates Kaylee and Madison home hours before they were murdered says he is haunted by his role in delivering them to their deaths​

Driver who dropped off Idaho students at murder house breaks silence

Speaking for the first time and exclusively to DailyMail.com, the private taxi driver said he can't recall anything that was 'amiss' the night he took Kaylee Goncalves and Madison Mogen home.

www.dailymail.co.uk

 

[drmrgrl]

$500 for each, decent place, with parking, within walking distance to campus. That is a STEAL!!!

IMO, That makes me wonder………..was the deal too good to be true?

 

[CSIDreamer]

Emotions here.

I'm wondering if hatred AND rage can be ruled out. This was a cold, calculated killing. You cannot be verging on losing control of your emotions and walk into a house, murder 4 people, and walk out and disappear into the night.

You're talking about 2 rooms on separate floors with 2 people in each room, each group of 2 in the same bed. You cannot let any emotion get in the way or falter one bit in your mission or you could likely end up chasing someone through the house.

This person was prepared.

Ever heard the saying "I wouldn't go on vacation with them, but I'd attend the funeral" (put on a good show)? It may well apply here.

All JMO

 

[CSIDreamer]

Sorry if this has already been shared:

“University of Idaho professor sues internet sleuth for defamation”​

University of Idaho professor sues internet sleuth for defamation

Good for her.

 

[Ksfarmer8]

Emotions here.

I'm wondering if hatred AND rage can be ruled out. This was a cold, calculated killing. You cannot be verging on losing control of your emotions and walk into a house, murder 4 people, and walk out and disappear into the night.

You're talking about 2 rooms on separate floors with 2 people in each room, each group of 2 in the same bed. You cannot let any emotion get in the way or falter one bit in your mission or you could likely end up chasing someone through the house.

This person was prepared.

Ever heard the saying "I wouldn't go on vacation with them, but I'd attend the funeral" (put on a good show)? It may well apply here.

All JMO

It appears the killer just did walk out and melt away into the night! IMHO the multiple deaths were to prevent any living witnesses that might have known or remotely knew the perp to identify him or her.

 

[WingsOverTX]

IMO, it is unlikely that the "Adam" conversation has anything to do with this case. It is simply the few seconds of conversation that happened to be captured as they walked by the security camera of someone who chose to release it publicly. The chances that that bit of conversation holds the key to this are tiny.

Also, has anyone from LE looked into whether this camera recording audio of random people on the street is legal?

Audio Surveillance Laws by State:Everything You Need to Know

When considering audio surveillance laws by state, most states have specific laws that govern the use of electronic recording of conversations of any kind.

www.upcounsel.com

I realize that at this point the Adam conversation is public knowledge but I do question whether the media should have run with it. But maybe their lawyers vetted it?

It makes me uncomfortable that random audio recording is happening on a public street (even if the owner of the cam posts a notice to inform the public). Civil liberties being impinged upon in the U.S. needs to be watched carefully.

JMO

 

[Tillyjames]

EXCLUSIVE: 'My job was to get these girls home safe.' Private taxi driver who drove Idaho roommates Kaylee and Madison home hours before they were murdered says he is haunted by his role in delivering them to their deaths​

Driver who dropped off Idaho students at murder house breaks silence

Speaking for the first time and exclusively to DailyMail.com, the private taxi driver said he can't recall anything that was 'amiss' the night he took Kaylee Goncalves and Madison Mogen home.

www.dailymail.co.uk

He says they weren’t talking about boys and everything seemed normal. That would be haunting to know he “delivered them to their deaths” ultimately. That has to mess with a person as well.

Nice to hear another person coming forward because there have been few who’ve come forward about their interactions that night

 

[10ofRods]

Emotions here.

I'm wondering if hatred AND rage can be ruled out. This was a cold, calculated killing. You cannot be verging on losing control of your emotions and walk into a house, murder 4 people, and walk out and disappear into the night.

You're talking about 2 rooms on separate floors with 2 people in each room, each group of 2 in the same bed. You cannot let any emotion get in the way or falter one bit in your mission or you could likely end up chasing someone through the house.

This person was prepared.

Ever heard the saying "I wouldn't go on vacation with them, but I'd attend the funeral" (put on a good show)? It may well apply here.

All JMO

I totally agree that this murderer had full mental capabilities and was very much in control of their emotions during and after the crime. Might be someone who is restricted in affect to begin with.

I also agree that they were on a mission. They didn't steal anything or reveal any overt sexual motivations. They brought a weapon they were (very) familiar with, and a plan on who to attack and how. I would add that I am convinced they'd been in the house before.

This person does not want to be caught. Whether they had advance plans on how/where to hide out is very hard to conjecture. This person probably didn't know whether they'd make it all the way to Thanksgiving break without being caught - but if they went home at TG, I believe they stayed home (like at least 25% of the student body did).

This same type of person is likely capable of compartmentalizing what happened and has committed other transgressions, even if without a criminal record (trespass, B and E - or something more personal, such as looking through people's stuff in their rooms or purses, etc).

 

[OckhamsRazor22]

They are man made categories, and some murderers and victims don‘t fit. As all man-made categories they may change.

Abstract of a book Mass Murder in The Untied States- Department of Justice website
Abstract
A mass murder is defined as the killing of three or more people at one time and in one location.
The serial murder is the killing of three or more people in more than a 30-day period with a significant cooling-off period between the murders.
A spree murder is the killing of three or more people usually within a 30-day period and typically during the course of another felony (such as a robbery).

In the 1990's there was more than 100 cases of mass murder. There appears to be no reliable source regarding accurate data on the incidence of mass murder. Despite not knowing the exact number of people who fall victim to mass killers, it is usually found that a mass killer murders intimates as well as strangers. There have been cases of mass murder since early in U.S. history. Many of these acts of multicide are unrecorded. No single factor accounts for the personality of the mass killer. Most likely, the motivation to kill comes from outside the personality. The reasons for an act of mass murder are psychological gain and material gain. The killer is found to be geographically stable. The major types of mass killers are pseudocommando, the disciple, the family annihilator, the religious/ideological killer, the disgruntled citizen, the disgruntled employee, the set-and-run killer, and the psychotic mass killer. School shootings by youthful killers have occurred numerous times in this country’s history. Some of the common traits that these types of killers share are white male, student, rural or suburban settings, middle class background, disenfranchised, interest in internet and computer games, and interest in weaponry. Departments that investigate a mass murder case encounter problems that are not ordinarily present in many cases, such as turf protection, determination of the type of mass murder, and identification of the victims. References, index

Pretty interesting
JMO

Definitely. Thanks!

 

[maskedwoman]

Only thing is, in your examples guns were used not a knife.

A knife screams rage and is extremely personal.

I didn't specifically look for examples of mass murders with knives but Hitler used multiple means. Timothy McVeigh used explosives. But I did find examples of mass murders via knife. September 2022, 2017 in London, and 2016 in Japan. The attack in Japan wasn't personal. The guy thought family members should be able to euthanise disabled people. He walked into a home and started stabbing people. Heinous for sure, but not rageful. London was a terrorist attack. There was a mass stabbing on the Vegas Strip earlier this year. And in Thailand, 37 children were killed in a mass stabbing/shooting. Most of the children where stabbed.

 

[OckhamsRazor22]

Interesting, my corgis hunt squirrels. It is a cat and mouse scenario, with the squirrels wining most often. There isn’t hate, just predator and prey.
Couldn’t a killer be both a predator who hunts what they hate? I think so.
Using our hunter analogy, some hunters shoot coyotes and wild pigs, they enjoy the hunt, and also detest coyotes and pigs. Meat is not the goal, they leave the dead right where they fall. These kinds of hunters feel like they are doing the world a favor.

A killer with a mission may enjoy the hunt and justify the killing due to hatred.
The knife and stabbings to me seem like personal hatred, but the idea of stalking and waiting and entering the house at night are the actions of a hunter.
A killer could be so cold as to see people as prey and have zero feelings toward them. The motivation would be the hunt And hatred.
Edit: Hate crimes come to mind- justifying the killing due to bigotry, and the KKK did not just kill to eliminate, they enjoyed the hunt, harming, suffering, and torture.

Does this killer hate others in addition to these victims? Will they hunt again? That is what makes this case so terrifying, because I think they could act again.

JMO

Yes. He is most assuredly a “Hunter” in every sense of the word. Predatory. Cunning. Sneaky. Bone-chilling by all accounts. Stealth. Silent. Nightmarishly Driven. JMOO.

 

[Dotta]

I think the perp had been fantasizing about murdering for a long time before the actual deed.

He might have always carried the knife with him.
Something might have triggered him that particular night.

I think he is local and knew this house - either by sight or actually were inside (as a burglar perhaps).

I also think he didn't attack on the ground floor b/c:
- his anger was already spent or
- was running out of time.

JMO

 

[WingsOverTX]

I stated early in this investigation that a stock model year picture of a vehicle is not a lead that should released to the public, and ask for help locating the vehicle. I believe the owner of the crashed car found in OR would agree with me. I believe all owners of Elantra in the Moscow vicinity would agree. It is dangerous, and casts a wide net of suspicion upon innocent people. LE should release the video you have of the car, an identifying marker, or just keep it to yourself. IMO

Release of information is crucial to solving murders, and LE strategy of total withholding is harming the case. IMO

Yes, this very well may end up a test case for such blanket requests. It is too wide a net to cast IMO also.

 

[IceCreamSundae]

This is absolutely what I think too.
The person who had a grudge or 'beef' with these students didn't do the killing himself. They got someone in to do the job. Someone who specialises in that kind of thing, and who was capable of doing it without being caught.

Going back to initial statements of a “sloppy” scene, and the fact that most university students could not afford to hire a hit man, I don’t think this is the way it will play out. MOO.

 

[sds71]

"It's definitely an old, creaky house," said Cole Alteneder, who graduated in 2022 and lived in the house during his junior year. "You can't walk up any of the stairs or on any of the floors without everybody in the house knowing it."

Idaho murders: Everybody can hear each others' footsteps in 'creaky' house, former resident says

A University of Idaho graduate who previously lived in the off-campus house where four students were killed is speaking out to ABC News.

abcnews.go.com

 

[IceCreamSundae]

I don't post much but am following. Currently my working theory is a) someone known to the friend group with a grudge or b) one of the four was the primary target and the other deaths were collateral damage.

In last place is c) random psycho killer that just decided to go kill four strangers one night.

Definitely think it’s B.

 

[newredtabby]

IMO, That makes me wonder………..was the deal too good to be true?

Huh? What do you mean?

 

[OckhamsRazor22]

I totally agree that this murderer had full mental capabilities and was very much in control of their emotions during and after the crime. Might be someone who is restricted in affect to begin with.

I also agree that they were on a mission. They didn't steal anything or reveal any overt sexual motivations. They brought a weapon they were (very) familiar with, and a plan on who to attack and how. I would add that I am convinced they'd been in the house before.

This person does not want to be caught. Whether they had advance plans on how/where to hide out is very hard to conjecture. This person probably didn't know whether they'd make it all the way to Thanksgiving break without being caught - but if they went home at TG, I believe they stayed home (like at least 25% of the student body did).

This same type of person is likely capable of compartmentalizing what happened and has committed other transgressions, even if without a criminal record (trespass, B and E - or something more personal, such as looking through people's stuff in their rooms or purses, etc).

Great points, all agreed upon. Mentally capable. On a mission and driven to compete/succeed.
I too feel they had been in the home before. A cold run, when the home was empty. Getting a feel for the layout. Individual rooms, exits and entrances. Assuredly avoiding capture. Could either be close by, or at home across the country (or outside the US). Undoubtedly a genuine compartmentalization expert. Almost unequivocally has committed other crimes, possibly murder. Still puzzling on so many levels.
Jmoo

 

[Sister Golden Hair]

Let’s pretend that M and K had a mutual friend Stephanie that had a crush on Adam. Stephanie has been hinting to Adam that she likes him but he hasn’t seemed to pick up on it. Stephanie has told M and K that she’s head over heels for Adam, is planning to ask him to go see The Black Keys with her in January, and had a dream the other night where they were married and had two daughters together. Well guess what? Maddie had one too many Jell-O shots and gushed to Adam everything that Stephanie has said. EVERYTHING.

My scenario is obviously completely made up and I have no idea if “everything” is something completely trivial or if “everything” is somehow secret information that got a household of wonderful people murdered. There just isn’t enough context to support any one particular interpretation IMO.

DtE - Imo completely on this. We don't know enough to say it is important or not, but IMO it's important to view it from both before and after to put it into perspective. We are looking at the convo in retrospect, with the knowledge that these two young women are going to be stabbed to death a few hours later, but putting it through the normal college experience lens that K&M would have been using, IMO the convo is much less ominous.

IME, this type of "and then I told him everything... and then he totally said... and then I totally said..." convos are the in-the-moment important social drama that's so key to college life for some of us. IMO it might be why they were calling J, but I seriously doubt that it was the reason for what happened that night. ICBW and this is JMO but... my other thought is that the calls went unanswered because the callee was in the presence of another young women. That is very common during 'breaks' in an LTR IMO and IME.

edited to add the first point and this: the everything could be something that helped LE immensely, too, by fitting a few additional pieces together. I don't personally believe that, but feel it's possible and IMO important to consider.

ALL IMO & IME

 

[smokeybandit]

The previous Zillow privacy policy does not mention "law enforcement". The policy released today does:

"Legal Obligations and Rights: We may disclose your personal data to third parties, such as legal advisors and law enforcement"

Link to March 7, 2022 privacy policy:

Privacy Policy

Effective Date: January 2023 When you use Zillow Group services to find, buy, rent, or sell your home, get a mortgage, or connect to a real estate pro, we know you’re trusting us with your data. We also know we have a responsibility to respect your privacy, and we work hard to do just that...

www.zillowgroup.com

Link to current privacy policy released today:

Privacy Policy

Effective Date: January 2023 When you use Zillow Group services to find, buy, rent, or sell your home, get a mortgage, or connect to a real estate pro, we know you’re trusting us with your data. We also know we have a responsibility to respect your privacy, and we work hard to do just that...

www.zillowgroup.com

Ctrl + F to victory.

Keep in mind that photos of the inside of the 1122 King Road house were publicly available information prior to the murders.