Found Deceased IN - Abigail (Abby) Williams, 13, & Liberty (Libby) German, 14, The Delphi Murders 13 Feb 2017 #99

[pepper 34]

It appears they know who owned the car at the time of the murders but these two sentences worry me:

LE states,
"We're still looking for the car that was parked in the lot," Riley told News 18. "If somebody can give us that information, we want that information as quickly as possible."

So, it seems, that LE is looking for the car, itself. I'm wondering where the car is right now. Did someone report it stolen some time during the last few years while, in reality, they actually "ditched" it? If someone sold it or junked it there should be a record of that. Even donating the car to a charity group should leave a clear record as to where the car is now.

I'm assuming LE wants to have possession of the car, as they said, "as quickly as possible" so they can examine it for any forensic evidence that might tie it to the murders before someone can destroy that evidence. If this is true, I hope LE finds the car very quickly.

But, what I really hope (wishful thinking) ... is that LE knows exactly where the car is and they're watching it to see who comes to steal or destroy it and any evidence it might hold... and that's why they told the reporter that,
"We're still looking for the car."
Because they know BG is watching for news updates while chewing up whole rolls of TUMS.

This could all be incorrect. It's theory only and jmo.

 

[Cherokee]

Hmmm. Not in case of Jayme Closs though. Perp shaved his head before crime, made other preparations to not shed any DNA.

JMO.

I agree. No perp DNA in the Closs case. But was the investigator talking about perp DNA? He only said there was DNA at every crime scene. Yes, there is DNA at every crime scene because the victim's DNA is also there. That was my point.

The investigator's answer was nebulous and told us nothing.

Semantics are important in understanding exactly what has been said. Lawyers are masters of this type of communication; speaking a lot of words but saying nothing. How many times have we heard, "my client looks forward to having his day in court" or "my client is anxious for the facts of this case to be heard" as if his client is innocent. It's all bluff and bluster.

Basically, the investigator never answered the reporter's inferred question, asking if there was perp DNA at the crime scene.

 

[margarita25]

Yes. Was he wearing a scarf? What age does "an older man" mean? 80? 50?

(Maybe he’s “80” but he “looks younger” like “50”, but “we shouldn’t look at the scarf”.

I’m going with new age range, 50 to 80... )

 

[Charlot123]

Omggggggg!!! Look what I just found! I’ve been looking for this since April 22nd! Holy cow, I can’t believe I actually made a note of it!! I think this is what I was thinking of!



ETA: I haven’t reviewed this yet and I’m not sure that it has anything to with anything (“The Shack”), but it was the first thing that came to mind. Eager to take a look now.

I wonder if this could be the person’s alibi, visiting the cemetery. Does it make sense to look through family names on the graves?

 

[Boxer]

I sure hope my frig never gets that bad but I love this analogy. I also love that the name he does not want is taking off with the group effort. Coward of CC.

Got it now.
CCC it is. Much better description.

 

[margarita25]

It appears they know who owned the car at the time of the murders but these two sentences worry me:

LE states,
"We're still looking for the car that was parked in the lot," Riley told News 18. "If somebody can give us that information, we want that information as quickly as possible."

So, it seems, that LE is looking for the car, itself. I'm wondering where the car is right now. Did someone report it stolen some time during the last few years while, in reality, they actually "ditched" it? If someone sold it or junked it there should be a record of that. Even donating the car to a charity group should leave a clear record as to where the car is now.

I'm assuming LE wants to have possession of the car, as they said, "as quickly as possible" so they can examine it for any forensic evidence that might tie it to the murders before someone can destroy that evidence. If this is true, I hope LE finds the car very quickly.

But, what I really hope (wishful thinking) ... is that LE knows exactly where the car is and they're watching it to see who comes to steal or destroy it and any evidence it might hold... and that's why they told the reporter that,
"We're still looking for the car."
Because they know BG is watching for news updates while chewing up whole rolls of TUMS.

This could all be incorrect. It's theory only and jmo.

This is an astute observation that after all these pages of what I thought we figured out, that it’s the “driver” they’re looking for, technically it’s the driver AND the car...in other words, it doesn’t sound like they necessarily know as much about this car than we thought they did?

Ow my head...

—-

ETA: Not holding my breath on that.

 

[ab01]

JMO.

I agree. No perp DNA. But was the investigator talking about perp DNA? He only said there was DNA at every crime scene. Yes, there is DNA at every crime scene because the victim's DNA is also there. That was my point.

The investigator's answer was nebulous and told us nothing.

Semantics are important in understanding exactly what has been said. Lawyers are masters of this type of communication; speaking a lot of words but saying nothing. How many times have we heard, "my client looks forward to having his day in court" or "my client is anxious for the facts of this case to be heard" as if his client is innocent. It's all bluff and bluster.

Basically, the investigator never answered the reporter's inferred question, asking if there was perp DNA at the crime scene.

Agreed and I think after all this time it’s highly likely they only have the victims dna.

Genetic testing would have been completed in 2yrs

I’m just becoming less and less convinced that dna is a viable option in this case

 

[Not a Belle]

I never said this case couldn't be solved. I said it's not solved. The comment "hiding in plain sight" means that the man, like most, is probably working, going shopping, dining, etc... all the while, nobody knows its him.

He's probably not detached from society. He probably isnt a recluse. He probably didnt drastically change his routine.

The unveiling was announcing to the whole world "this guy we have been searching for is the wrong guy... here is another sketch that we are now looking for."

The shack was an impromptu, utterly irrelevant to the investigation, off-handed comment.

I wish I could see something that convinced me this is wrong, but unfortunately I think you’re right. As much as I want it to be that LE is on the verge of a breakthrough in this case, I don’t think that’s true. I think this person has gone about his business, safe in his anonymity, not terribly concerned about what LE is doing. I don’t believe he is shaking in his boots or living in agony looking over his shoulder as the investigation continues; I think he’s pretty content and has no discernible reason to do anything differently. Whatever he’s doing has worked for this long. I don’t think it matters much whether he’s a genius or of average or below-average intelligence; he has stumped some really smart people, and as much as I hope that changes, I just don’t see it right now. MOO of course (and one I hope is shown to be completely wrong very soon).

 

[Charlot123]

JMO

That has actually happened in the case of El Dorado Jane Doe. In January, they found the paternal side of her family through a DNA match to a 2nd cousin through an autosomal DNA match. However, no one in that family knew of her existence, so she was either known by her father and hidden from his family, or he never knew of her existence. The latter is more likely.

More detailed research on the DNA is needed now, as well as more DNA testing on family members. It is unknown at this time if EDJD's maternal side has been identified, but it could be that few, if anyone, on that side of her family knew of her existence other than her mother. Eventually, EDJD's indentity will be known, but it is going to take more time and more DNA matches to narrow the possibilities further.

Here. If her father is deceased, but his family is known, and her DNA is available, there is a Lazarus program on Gedmatch allowing to reconstruct paternal/maternal DNA. The more closer cousins, the better, but if several of his sibs are still alive, it is the best.

Once they “reconstruct” the paternal DNA, they can do phasing to phase off mom’s side. And work with mom’s portion of find her matches.

Assuming parents were not first cousins, or brother and sister, of course. Incest happens, often in the form of rape.

 

[JustEve]

It appears they know who owned the car at the time of the murders but these two sentences worry me:

LE states,
"We're still looking for the car that was parked in the lot," Riley told News 18. "If somebody can give us that information, we want that information as quickly as possible."

So, it seems, that LE is looking for the car, itself. I'm wondering where the car is right now. Did someone report it stolen some time during the last few years while, in reality, they actually "ditched" it? If someone sold it or junked it there should be a record of that. Even donating the car to a charity group should leave a clear record as to where the car is now.

I'm assuming LE wants to have possession of the car, as they said, "as quickly as possible" so they can examine it for any forensic evidence that might tie it to the murders before someone can destroy that evidence. If this is true, I hope LE finds the car very quickly.

But, what I really hope (wishful thinking) ... is that LE knows exactly where the car is and they're watching it to see who comes to steal or destroy it and any evidence it might hold... and that's why they told the reporter that,
"We're still looking for the car."
Because they know BG is watching for news updates while chewing up whole rolls of TUMS.

This could all be incorrect. It's theory only and jmo.

That´s exactly the impression I got out of this "word salad" we´ve been served... They are looking for the car.
I hope to God they are concealing some better plan that I can´t decipher right now.

 

[sunshineray]

Any chance they could have retrieved the DNA from that guy who probably eats out at McDonald’s? Sooner? Before a big undercover sting op?

I myself was thinking more along the lines of some police agency nearby in another county could have more recently arrested a man who looked very much like sketch #1. They would have informed the ISP to come take a look and they interviewed him and tested him. This has been brought up on another site as happening but it just rumor.

 

[enelram]

I wonder if this could be the person’s alibi, visiting the cemetery. Does it make sense to look through family names on the graves?

I noticed the broken hinges on the 'shack door' like someone forced it open and then just laid the door back in place where it belonged.
Does anyone think the girls were herded at gunpoint to the shack
and assaulted there? Then taken to area where they were found
and killed there? We know they were found on private property,
maybe this is the private property being discussed.
moo

 

[sunshineray]

It appears they know who owned the car at the time of the murders but these two sentences worry me:

LE states,
"We're still looking for the car that was parked in the lot," Riley told News 18. "If somebody can give us that information, we want that information as quickly as possible."

So, it seems, that LE is looking for the car, itself. I'm wondering where the car is right now. Did someone report it stolen some time during the last few years while, in reality, they actually "ditched" it? If someone sold it or junked it there should be a record of that. Even donating the car to a charity group should leave a clear record as to where the car is now.

I'm assuming LE wants to have possession of the car, as they said, "as quickly as possible" so they can examine it for any forensic evidence that might tie it to the murders before someone can destroy that evidence. If this is true, I hope LE finds the car very quickly.

But, what I really hope (wishful thinking) ... is that LE knows exactly where the car is and they're watching it to see who comes to steal or destroy it and any evidence it might hold... and that's why they told the reporter that,
"We're still looking for the car."
Because they know BG is watching for news updates while chewing up whole rolls of TUMS.

This could all be incorrect. It's theory only and jmo.

Or they feel they know but need more witness to it?

 

[crhedBngr]

"We're still looking for the car that was parked in the lot," Riley told News 18. "If somebody can give us that information, we want that information as quickly as possible."

"Somebody may have already interviewed him," said Riley. "I'm not going to say they have or have not, but there's a possibility that has happened. The person apparently gave the investigating officers the information they were looking for. We have to try to go back and check on the information that we have received."

RBBM

To me, the above-bolded sentence means the following:

LE interviewed the perp, and the perp gave LE the car information they were looking for.

JMVHO.

I have more thoughts on this, but I am extremely caffine-challenged today.

ISP on Delphi killer: 'Somebody may have already interviewed him'

 

[margarita25]

Hmmm. Did the suspect go to or was a member of either Hope Cathedral Church or Delphi United Methodist Church? I think it is quite possible that he did!
My thoughts go back to the church-going BTK killer. Was church a good cover for the Delphi suspect thinking, "If I go to church and put on a Christian face, no one would ever suspect me of killing these girls?" Did the suspect know the girls from church? I think it is quite possible that he did! Either from church or maybe from a church function.
Also, we have to remember what Carter said at the press conference. "To the killer...I believe you have just a little bit of conscience left." Is this alluding to a church man who may have a little of that Christian conscience left...knowing that killing is a sin?
I think it could be pointing in that direction.

The whole “I believe you have just a little bit of conscience left” sounds like a crock to me, just saying. I seriously doubt he’s going to feel so guilty and turn himself in because it’s the right thing to do in God’s eyes ( :rolleyes ) ; if anything, the only way I would see someone turning themself in is for notoriety and other ego related purposes.

Now this doooes bring to mind something though: say Carter really doooooes think “he may have a little bit of conscience left” (I doubt it, but let’s say what if)—well, then what might lead him to believe this? Could this be something specifically related to the crime scene or bodies, because I really find it hard to understand how LE would think someone who killed 2 little girls has any bit of conscience left.

Jmo.

 

[ab01]

I noticed the broken hinges on the 'shack door' like someone forced it open and then just laid the door back in place where it belonged.
Does anyone think the girls were herded at gunpoint to the shack
and assaulted there? Then taken to area where they were found
and killed there? We know they were found on private property,
maybe this is the private property being discussed.
moo

No moo

 

[margarita25]

"We're still looking for the car that was parked in the lot," Riley told News 18. "If somebody can give us that information, we want that information as quickly as possible."

"Somebody may have already interviewed him," said Riley. "I'm not going to say they have or have not, but there's a possibility that has happened. The person apparently gave the investigating officers the information they were looking for. We have to try to go back and check on the information that we have received."

RBBM

To me, the above-bolded sentence means the following:

LE interviewed the perp, and the perp gave LE the car information they were looking for.

JMVHO.

ISP on Delphi killer: 'Somebody may have already interviewed him'

Or someone that knows the perp?

 

[margarita25]

I noticed the broken hinges on the 'shack door' like someone forced it open and then just laid the door back in place where it belonged.
Does anyone think the girls were herded at gunpoint to the shack
and assaulted there? Then taken to area where they were found
and killed there? We know they were found on private property,
maybe this is the private property being discussed.
moo

Yes, imo I think this is possible which is exactly why I was curious about shacks, sheds etc to begin with, moo.

Re: “shack door”, are you referencing the shed in the video (I haven’t gotten to view it again yet), or another shack, RL’s property?

 

[ab01]

Or someone that knows the perp?

I’m about done with all this vagueness. Yeah, integrity of the investigation, all that stuff. Let me know when you guys figure it out.

I know right the audacity of them

I’m surprised they don’t just turn over all their evidence to the public lol

ETA 50 different random people would already be killed by pitchfork

 

[sunshineray]

I think what a poster said earlier may be the case. What if the witness who generated the sketch a few days after the murders and the one that is now the focus, what if they didn't strike the police as very credible in the beginning. They had more eyewitnesses involved in sketch #1's creation and it favored the BG photos too. Something happened to eliminate sketch #1 for the investigators. Maybe in going back with a lot of re-interviewing and reevaluation of early tips may have led to an ahh-ha moment? Something came to light for the ISP to hold that last presser and talk so chillingly to the killer. We may have interviewed you, you are probably local hiding in plain sight, you may be in this room. Very direct and powerful statements. IMO

 

[margarita25]

I know right the audacity of them

I’m surprised they don’t just turn over all their evidence to the public lol

Dang...you quoted me right before I had already deleted my crabby post hahaha!

Of course I realize they don’t need to release everything and like I said “integrity of the investigation”, etc...Just saying that the new comments re: the car seem slightly different from what they said in the PC, and to me that’s frustrating. I do need to stare at @pepper 34 ‘s side by side quotes again though.

 

[crhedBngr]

Or someone that knows the perp?

Yes, that makes sense as well. Which really brings us back to a possible family connection; did a relative of New Sketch Guy (NSG) give LE the car description? Is LE appealing to the relative's "little bit of conscience left"?

Clear as mud, and convoluted as heck.

JMVHO.

Today's coffee and donuts (@cody22 , and Everyone Else!)