IN - Abigail Williams, 13, & Liberty German, 14, Delphi, 13 Feb 2017 #77

[Shiressleuth]

[FONT=&quot]“Everybody is a suspect,” said Sgt. Riley.
https://www.theindychannel.com/news...in-to-help-isp-with-tips-about-delphi-murders

I'm with SGT Riley.[/FONT]

LE, Please arrest Mr.Everybody.

 

[Daey34]

Here you go
https://www.wthr.com/article/man-who-did-business-with-daniel-nations-recalls-alleged-threats

I have a screenshot of that post, sunset. Just trying to track down the link to it. Hold tight.


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[Jax49]

JMO
Its a great question.

It changed something for me. The main thing I got out of the show was that the BG was not at the crime scene very long at all if I interpreted things right. It sounded to me like the BG barely had time to get the girls to his "spot" and kill them and then leave. Im making this assumption because the searching started very quickly after the last sighting on the bridge and I doubt he would stick around too long once he heard commotion from the searchers. There were witnesses of him and I am assuming some of them were as he was leaving.

So that changed up the timeline for me and it also changed up the motive a little bit to me because he was intent on killing them no matter what. If he had been there to rape them only then I think he would have needed more time.

It is possible he wanted to stay longer and then when he heard the searchers maybe he just killed them real quick and then left. So maybe his original motive was rape all along and he got chased out of there by the searchers and felt he had to kill them to prevent them from IDng him.

But any way I cut it I think it showed a slightly different type of perp to me. One that was ready and able to kill them without batting an eye. A real serial killer that was ready to kill them no matter what.

So what it changed for me is the impression I had of BG. I think the BG is a definite serial killer to me and most likely has killed before. He could be a serial killer with planned rape too but I think he was planning on killing them no matter what the moment he took them from the bridge.

I dont think it changed my opinion on whether DN may have been involved or not. I still have him about 50/50 odds.

Excellent points Hatfield. The timeline is so short -- not sure what I think.

JMHO, it has been along time since I had DN at 50/50. After the show, he's not even on the board.

 

[DeDee]

Has DN ever come out and said he was at his wife's ultrasound appointment?

I don't think he was there , was it ever confirmed that KN was at the Dr's appointment? what time was this appointment?
I wonder if she posted the picture on facebook?

lets say she got out from her appointment at 2:45 and headed straight to delphi to meet him somewhere..she would get there around 3:45 could she have gone and gotten him that night, or could he have spent the night in hiding observing the search , and lingering about out of sight?

could she have picked him up in the morning somewhere away from the bridge ? could he have walked to some other area or away from the town even?

I believe he wrote the letter and that is my tipping point. even if LE is reluctant at this point it can be for a variety of reasons.

there is energy around DN in so many different jurisdictions and for such a variety of offenses that all have different consequnces .

plus the GAG order..plus TW...

Im still on him, I dont care. MOO

There was one thing about the letter that surprised me. It was well-written and well-organized. I did not expect to see such a nice range in his linguists skills. It was MS who mispronounced the word Heinous as 'hyena-us'.

DN did speak to AG/MS in a video where they were misleading him into believing they were raising money to post his bond. His voice was soft spoken and not commanding like the DTH audio.

About that blue jacket, if a man can write as intelligently as DN did in the letter, surely, he knows to discard the blue jacket asap if he committed the double murders. BG wearing the blue jacket has been plastered all over TV and the internet for eons. Furthermore, didn't someone enhance the image of his trashed apt. to determine that it wasn't a blue jacket after all?

 

[Shiressleuth]

You asked:
What about the Subpoena dulces tecum then? Can you explain that?

My uneducated guess is Indiana LE found a phone belonging to DN while in Colorado and want to see if any calls were made to or from Delphi. Or it's for computer records or any other number of things.

https://study.com/academy/lesson/subpoena-duces-tecum-definition-example.html
http://www.rotlaw.com/legal-library/what-is-a-subpoena-duces-tecum/

Or you can go look at the other ones Ives filed; type in Ives and scroll down
mycase.IN.gov

TY. That's what I think too. I was originally asking sumzero what they thought because I haven't seen any other such sealed subpoenas. I just wondered why that would be, if DN was just one of 100's of POI's.
Eta I have had another thought - it could be for KN's medical reports for the U/s appointment to see if there is a record that DN attended. If he did they would not need the phone records.

 

[BeesInMyBonnet]

I just want to hear DN speak. The lady who gave an interview (who he worked & trashed their house) said his voice sounded like BG. She said he (DN) also walked like BG and the sketch looks like him. The one thing I would like to know is what color was the car that was seen on the 13th by a witness that was there. Wasn't it red in color? I know we talked about it early on but now I can't find that info. Anyone remember what I'm talking about? Heck even KN thinks the sketch looks like DN. Howver she said he never owned a jacket like BG is wearing. Well I certainly see a jacket like that in one of the photos provided to the media that was taken at the home they trashed. One should never say never. DN or KN owned a blue jacket imho.

Back on March 1(!), jjhoward33 posted in thread 17, post 321: “IIRC, early on a witness reported seeing a red car with paper plates parked in the parking lot. Does anyone recall if this was ever ruled out? I am assuming it was but don't remember for sure.”
http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...Delphi-13-Feb-2017-17&p=13193234#post13193234

Red car. Paper plates. Before DN and KN even entered our conversation.

I’ll look for the other post once I tuck my little urchins into bed.


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[FrostedGlass]

TY. That's what I think too. I was originally asking sumzero what they thought because I haven't seen any other such sealed subpoenas. I just wondered why that would be, if DN was just one of 100's of POI's.

I would certainly hope that LE is following up on every lead connected to every POI.

 

[mtnlites]

since it seems at least we are pretty sure that DN has written a letter proclaiming his innocence while claiming to understand the pain of the girls families, I have come up with a great idea that would be most helpful in clearing up some questions and would move us past a day that neither DN nor KN seem to recall .

it's called a polygraph,

lets all take a polygraph shall we? we can put this baby to bed then..IMO

I would NEVER take a poly. Guilty people pass them all the time, innocent people fail them. They are so fickle that they're not even admissable in court. IMO passing or failing a poly proves nothing and, if I were an attorney, I'd advise my client to pass.

 

[Confusion]

I had another thought, this makes 2 in one day! With the short timeline, I wonder if he got the girls cornered in the area where they were found, and planned to assault them there. If it was close to 3:00, Libby may have tried to scare him so he'd let them go by telling him that her father would be there in a few minutes and he (DG) would kill him (BG) if he had hurt them. Not wanting to actually tangle with an adult male, he may have just killed them and left as quickly as he could. I have no idea how big her father is, but if BG is estimated to be 5'6"-5'10", there's a good chance that he'd avoid getting into an altercation with someone who could be larger and more physically fit - not to mention being extremely upset about his daughter being hurt.

I know it's not likely, but it really is nice to think at times that they may not have suffered too much. MOO

 

[BIC]

TY. That's what I think too. I was originally asking sumzero what they thought because I haven't seen any other such sealed subpoenas. I just wondered why that would be, if DN was just one of 100's of POI's.

Maybe they have done this 100’s of times, and we only know of this one?

 

[drama_farmer]

This post includes ZERO factual information. . .

I'm hesitant to even bring this up again, as its been searched and researched and sleuthed over and over. But, my short time here on WS has shown me that, well, that's pretty much an inevitability. With fresh eyes and time for theories to percolate, re-hashing and re-sleuthing is not always counter-productive, as long as we don't create an infinite, non-productive feedback loop.

Get ready. . . it's about the jacket!
I'm also somewhat hesitant to broach this topic again because will our ability to identify an article of clothing worn by BG really bring us any closer to finding the perp?

Some may see a button-front jacket. I see a jacket with a broken zipper (stuck about 1/3rd up) with several clothing layers beneath.

This is a "Members Only" jacket, very popular in the 80s, but still a common style of outerwear, with or without a logo on the chest:

http://www.rustyzipper.com/full/214959-M50593.jpg


Also from the 80s, the once ubiquitous "Baracuta" Jacket (also known as a "Harrington")

https://img1.etsystatic.com/213/0/9022527/il_570xN.1393173665_e57k.jpg


This is a "Baracuta" Jacket (aka Harrington) that has bright white draw strings for the attached hood.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/BARACUTA-E...891833?hash=item4d68b0b0b9:g:YoQAAOSwGzhaIYg4


This particular model of tactical jacket has a built-in quilted liner. (from usarmynavystore.com)

https://static.wixstatic.com/media/.../c0d093_bfafc6f5ed094a5e8f698118705c024b.webp


https://static.wixstatic.com/media/.../c0d093_54ecae719f8245f7b4b300deaeb9e66b.webp


DESCRIPTION
Rothco's Tactical 3 Season Concealed Carry Jacket will keep you warm from the fall to the spring season. The jacket features a washed 100% cotton outer shell and polyester inner lining. The casual jacket comes with a tactical twist it features two inner concealment pockets (one on each side) with hook & loop closures and four inner mag pockets with hook & loop flap closure. Additional features include: 2 tricot lined front zipper pockets, button closure wrists, and button adjustment waist straps.

FEATURES (snipped for brevity)
Brass Color Zipper (Right Hand Pull When Worn); note from me: much less reflective compared to other metals
2 Front Zipper Pockets (Tricot Lined);
2 Inner Concealment Pockets, Each on the Left and Right side with padded insides and hook & loop closure;
Made To Conceal Items (bbm)

 

[sunsetbeach]

mrsu, sorry I was away from my screen for a bit. BeesInMyBonnet linked the article for me. Post #666

 

[Shiressleuth]

Maybe they have done this 100’s of times, and we only know of this one?

Maybe they have but wouldnt someone have seen them ?

 

[BIC]

Maybe they have but wouldnt someone have seen them ?

I doubt it. There is absolutely nothing to find on this case that isn’t being divulged by LE. They are doing everything possible to keep any info out of the public eye. IMO

 

[sunsetbeach]

There was one thing about the letter that surprised me. It was well-written and well-organized. I did not expect to see such a nice range in his linguists skills. It was MS who mispronounced the word Heinous as 'hyena-us'.

DN did speak to AG/MS in a video where they were misleading him into believing they were raising money to post his bond. His voice was soft spoken and not commanding like the DTH audio.

About that blue jacket, if a man can write as intelligently as DN did in the letter, surely, he knows to discard the blue jacket asap if he committed the double murders. BG wearing the blue jacket has been plastered all over TV and the internet for eons. Furthermore, didn't someone enhance the image of his trashed apt. to determine that it wasn't a blue jacket after all?

BBM

I never saw that enhancement but I have a copy of the picture and it's very clear to me that a blue jacket is draped on the arm of a sofa. It has a Sherpa type lining on the inside of the collar and I also see a white string. Also of note on that jacket is a white area on what would be the right arm near the cuff area. I'm not sure if it's white or white reflective but could be some sort of logo. Oddly enough I see either a reflection of a watch or something else on BG's right arm. Could it be the same thing on that jacket from the sofa? Anything is possible.

If I remember correctly the lady who took the photos did so while DN was out of the house and she seemed concerned that she might get caught but she wanted to document the condition of the house.

Please remember this is all based on my memory of her interview and I'm not stating this is 100% fact.

And now stepping off from your post ...

I'm going to fall in the minority here but I'm going to say it anyway ... I believe in the pic of BG that he is holding his private part. Call me crazy but I can't unsee it. When I showed the picture to my husband a long time ago he said the same thing without me saying anything. I don't see a shirt tail hanging out. If it was it would match the color in the open area of his jacket. It does not. I don't think it's a fanny pack, or a hatchet, or a gun. I see a hand with his tally wacker in it. I saw this long before DN ever came into the picture so it's not based on that at all but it's funny that seems to be a hobby of his that get's him in trouble.

Mod's if this is against the rules (talking about private parts) please feel free to delete.

 

[TeaTime]

BBM

I see a hand with his tally wacker in it. I saw this long before DN ever came into the picture so it's not based on that at all but it's funny that seems to be a hobby of his that get's him in trouble.

Mod's if this is against the rules (talking about private parts) please feel free to delete.

Snipped by me. LOL Lots of people thought that as well, but if you look at the proportions, the "hand" is giant sized for the person.

It is not a photo of BG holding his penis. LE wouldn't release that kind of photo.

 

[JazzTune]

Interesting to read, regardless of the unknown events that occurred.

How to Thwart an Abduction Attempt
https://m.wikihow.com/Thwart-an-Abduction-Attempt

Thanks Misty, and attempting a fake seizure was not even listed?!

In all seriousness, please everyone, if you're ever in that situation follow the sound advice of LE.

Scream, kick hard! Do anything to avoid getting moved to a second location.

Really sorry for any confusion my posts may have caused with all of this.

I should have been more discerning, and made it plain that my thoughts were a fallback option, not the foremost action to take.

No more fake seizure talk, I promise...

Just stay safe, everyone...



JMO

 

[mrsu]

BBM

I never saw that enhancement but I have a copy of the picture and it's very clear to me that a blue jacket is draped on the arm of a sofa. It has a Sherpa type lining on the inside of the collar and I also see a white string. Also of note on that jacket is a white area on what would be the right arm near the cuff area. I'm not sure if it's white or white reflective but could be some sort of logo. Oddly enough I see either a reflection of a watch or something else on BG's right arm. Could it be the same thing on that jacket from the sofa? Anything is possible.

If I remember correctly the lady who took the photos did so while DN was out of the house and she seemed concerned that she might get caught but she wanted to document the condition of the house.

Please remember this is all based on my memory of her interview and I'm not stating this is 100% fact.

And now stepping off from your post ...

I'm going to fall in the minority here but I'm going to say it anyway ... I believe in the pic of BG that he is holding his private part. Call me crazy but I can't unsee it. When I showed the picture to my husband a long time ago he said the same thing without me saying anything. I don't see a shirt tail hanging out. If it was it would match the color in the open area of his jacket. It does not. I don't think it's a fanny pack, or a hatchet, or a gun. I see a hand with his tally wacker in it. I saw this long before DN ever came into the picture so it's not based on that at all but it's funny that seems to be a hobby of his that get's him in trouble.

Mod's if this is against the rules (talking about private parts) please feel free to delete.

Can you post the pic?

 

[sunsetbeach]

Snipped by me. LOL Lots of people thought that as well, but if you look at the proportions, the "hand" is giant sized for the person.

It is not a photo of BG holding his penis. LE wouldn't release that kind of photo.

The hand looks normal size to me.

How do we know that they wouldn't, I mean it seems to be pretty blurry to me. Maybe they thought it would pass and no one would notice. It's a screen capture of a freeze frame in a video so it's bound to be blurry.

Most people just glance or look at a pic for a min or so and move along. Not us, we pick everything apart by zooming in etc. lol.

Like I said, I am in the minority but I'm staying there.

 

[mrsu]

The hand looks normal size to me.

How do we know that they wouldn't, I mean it seems to be pretty blurry to me. Maybe they thought it would pass and no one would notice. It's a screen capture of a freeze frame in a video so it's bound to be blurry.

Most people just glance or look at a pic for a min or so and move along. Not us, we pick everything apart by zooming in etc. lol.

Like I said, I am in the minority but I'm staying there.

Both of his hands are in his pockets in the photos.