Found Deceased Ks - Lucas Hernandez, 5, Wichita, 17 Feb 2018 #32

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This case has been a muddled mess from the beginning. Imo EG probably lived her entire life deep in lies. It probably began as a child and reinforced by an enabling environment. People like her often seek out others she can successfully deceive. Because it was her way of life.

She may have been pretty intelligent all along believing she could fool everyone. No one witnessed the abuse she inflicted on Lucas and she came up with believable reasons for bruising.

I believe she escalated to the point she was pretty confident and even perhaps believed her own lies. Until Lucas died. Then she needed time to fashion a story that might be believable.
Imo by the time she reported him missing he had been gone for several days.


The problem for her at that point,imo, was that the minute she lied to law enforcement the night she reported him missing, she told her lie to trained officers.

I believe they realized she was lying very very early into her statement to them. I also think they checked her record very quickly and it reinforced their position. EG had run into LE that were not believing the story she gave them.

She had taken several days to remove all traces of the incident, her drug use and had disposed of his body several days before.

It was a slip to have told them she smoked pot and went to OG with MH. when LE searched they found no drugs or evidence she had smoked.

My guess is that gave them indication that the house had been cleaned and at least the evidence of drug use had been trashed.

It gave LE suspicion to wonder what else had been removed.

Imo LE took her statement admitting to smoking MJ as enough to arrest, charge and convict her on the endangerment charge.

I think it was an oversight not to have tested her for the presence of drugs when they arrested her for child endangerment.

I thought the DA had held back the child endangerment charge relating to Lucas as a backup if she walked in the first case. My thinking has evolved to now believe that LE knew Lucas had not been in the home when she went to OG and any decent defense attorney would have questioned it and probably won that case in court.

At some point they subpoenaed her phone records. Sometimes it takes a while for a cell provider to go in and give LE an accurate record, not of use and calls, but of exact towers the phone connected with for let’s say a 14 day period prior to reporting Lucas missing.

It seems my understanding that a cell phone can connect with several towers at once while at first blush a Cell phone can be tracked, an analyst has to look at cell traffic, strength of signal and other factors to determine the details of exact location.

My guess is that while waiting for a response from EG cell provider, LE investigated phone tips and info from interviews. That might be the reason one Park was searched several times.





I think her entire adult life was lived in aa fantasy like world made up of lies evil and deceit.

Until the night she reported him missing.

That night she told LE a culmination of lies of the last few days when she killed Lucas, hid his body and cleaned her house to rid it of all possible evidence.


The problem she quickly faced us that LE is highly trained to detect deceit. They may have even told her so. Regardless she stuck to her story.
After she realized they didn’t believe her, and for validation, I think she made every effort to seem truthful to JH.

She then began targeting anyone but her for Lucas disappearance. Early on she blamed JO then the couple outside the house,then the third was the homeless man, CR.

She deflected to and against anybody but Emily. I’m not sure if she had a grasp on the truth until the PI convinced her he was there to help her. For whatever reason she had a momens if reality or weakness and together they found Lucas.


Sorry for partial duplicate posts. My phone is nuts and can’t spend for new one for a couple weeks. Never thought I’d pay a thousand dollars for a gadget that annoys me so often. Getting to old for all the updated tech.
 
I am NOT at all familiar with the law (did you notice? ;)) but, can someone even be "charged" or can it be even officially said that Emily is a murderer by the courts considering she is deceased?

Not sure if it differs by state, but Aaron Hernandez died after his conviction was overturned and he is no longer officially considered a murderer.
 
If the family doesn't want all the details out there,that is fine with me. I just do not like how "open" the case still is for the Emily groupies. Even though they will always deny her part in it,it would be nice to have the law come out with a charge against her. I guess I am naive to want that for Lucas.
Hi sorry if I came across wrong. I have no idea what they would be thinking and I hope I never have to. I just meant I wonder how much they really can/will say. The DA certainly seemed genuine and has intentions to see it all through. I just wonder what they will be able to actually say in terms of details.
I think Charlie says something about an inquest below, usually here that would allow more to come out I think.
 
I am wondering if the PI had interviewed Emily in jail if she would have let loose of Lucas' location? I am guessing the family timed Emily's release with having the PI come. But.... if Emily had never gotten released from jail, we might not have found out Lucas' location. Or, Emily would have assumed she would still get a lighter sentence.

I want to know if Emily did tell her side of the story in the suicide notes. She said in jail, it



I would have had her cremated and then flushed her down the toilet.
The DA said there was nothing in the notes about solving Lucas death. Not his exact words but a summation.

Again selfishly, she left everything unanswered. And exactly as she wanted.
 
ession 2000
Effective: July 1, 2000SENATE BILL No. 224An Act concerning district coroners; notification and investigation of deaths; amendingK.S.A. 22a-230, 22a-231 and 22a-232 and repealing the existing sections.


Be it enacted by the Legislature of the State of Kansas:

Section. 1 K.S.A. 22a-230 is hereby amended to read as follows: 22a-
230. (a) The coroner may hold an inquest upon the dead bodies of such
persons whose deaths appear to have been caused by unlawful means
when the circumstances relating to such deaths are unknown. The inquest
shall be held in accordance with the provisions of this section. Except as
provided in subsection (b), upon being notified of any such death occur-
ring within the district, if an inquest is to be held, the coroner shall sum-
mon a jury of six residents of the county in which the death occurred, at
a time and place named, for the purpose of inquiring into the cause of
death. In any other case in which this act requires that the coroner be
notified, the coroner may also summon six citizens of the county to appear
at a time and place named.

(b) When the coroner has been notified of any death as provided in
subsection (a), and the cause of such death occurred in a county other
than the county in which the death occurred, the coroner of the county
in which the cause of death occurred shall take the responsibility of sum-
moning a jury as provided in subsection (a) for the purpose of inquiring
into the death, if requested to do so by the coroner of the county in which
the death occurred.

(c) If any juror fails to appear, the coroner shall summon the proper
number from bystanders immediately, and proceed to impanel them and
administer the following oath, in substance: "You do solemnly swear (or
affirm) that you will diligently inquire and true presentment make, when,
how and by what means the person whose body lies here dead came to
death, according to your knowledge, and evidence given you. So help you
God."

(d) The coroner may issue subpoenas within the judicial district for
witnesses, returnable forthwith, or at such time and place as the coroner
shall therein direct. Witnesses shall be allowed the fees provided in K.S.A.
28-125 and amendments thereto. In cases of disobedience of the coro-
ner's subpoena, it shall be the duty of the judge of the district court, on
application of the coroner, to compel obedience to the coroner's sub-
poena by indirect proceedings for contempt as in cases of disobedience
of a subpoena issued from the district court.

(e) An oath shall be administered to the witness, in substance as fol-
lows: "You do solemnly swear (or affirm) that the testimony which you
shall give to this inquest, concerning the death of the person here lying
dead, shall be the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth. So
help you God."

(f) The testimony shall be reduced to writing, under the coroner's
order, and subscribed by the witness.

(g) The jurors, having inspected the body, if available, heard the tes-
timony, and made all needful inquiries, shall return to the coroner their
inquisition in writing, under their hands, in substance as follows, and
stating the matter in the following form suggested, as far as found:

State of Kansas, ________ County.

An inquisition held at ________, in ________ county, on the ________ day
of ________, A.D., 19 year__, before me, ________ coroner of such county,
on the body of ________ (or, a person unknown), there lying dead; by the jurors whose
names are hereunto subscribed. The jurors, upon their oaths, do say (here state when, how,
by what person, means, weapon or accident the person died, and whether feloniously). In
testimony whereof, the jurors have hereunto subscribe, the day and year aforesaid. Which
shall be attested by the coroner.

(h) If the inquisition finds a crime has been committed on the de-
ceased, and name the person the jury believes has committed the crime,
the inquest shall not be made public until after the arrest directed in the
next subsection.

(i) If the person charged is present, the coroner may order the person
arrested by an officer or any other person, and shall then make a warrant
requiring the officer or other person to take the arrested person before
a judge of a court of competent jurisdiction.

(j) If the person charged is not present, the coroner may issue a war-
rant to the sheriff of the county, directing the sheriff to arrest the person
and take the arrested person before a judge of a court of competent
jurisdiction.

(k) The warrant of a coroner in the above case shall be of equal au-
thority with that of a judge of a court of competent jurisdiction. When
the person charged is brought before the court, the person charged shall
be dealt with as a person held under a complaint in the usual form.

(l) The warrant of the coroner shall recite substantially the transaction
before the coroner, and the verdict of the jury of inquest leading to the
arrest. The warrant shall be a sufficient foundation for the proceeding of
the court instead of a complaint.

(m) The coroner shall then return to the clerk of the district court
the inquisition, the written evidence and a list of the witnesses who tes-
tified to material matters.

(n) The district coroner shall receive such compensation, in addition
to other compensation provided by law for the coroner, for holding an
inquest as specified by the county commissioners of a single-county ju-
dicial district or the county commissioners of the county with the largest
population in multiple-county judicial districts.

Sec. 2. K.S.A. 22a-231 is hereby amended to read as follows: 22a-
231. When any person dies, or human body is found dead in the state,
and the death is suspected to have been the result of violence, caused by
unlawful means or by suicide, or by casualty, or suddenly when the de-
cedent was in apparent health, or when decedent was not regularly at-
tended by a licensed physician, or in any suspicious or unusual manner,
or when in police custody, or when in a jail or correctional institution, or
in any circumstances specified under K.S.A. 22a-242, and amendments
thereto, or when the determination of the cause of a death is held to be
in the public interest, the coroner or deputy coroner of the county in
which the cause of death occurred, if known, or if not known, the coroner
or deputy coroner of the county in which such dead body was found, shall
be notified by the physician in attendance, by any law enforcement offi-
cer, by the embalmer, by any person who is or may in the future be
required to notify the coroner or by any other person. The coroner in the
county of the cause of death shall decide if an investigation shall take
place. If an investigation is authorized by the coroner of the county of
cause of death, the coroner in the county of death shall undertake such
investigation, with costs to be accounted to and reimbursed by the county
of the cause of death. Investigation may include, but is not limited to,
obtaining medical and law enforcement background information, exami-
nation of the scene of the cause of death, inquest, autopsy, and other duties
required of the coroner. If the coroner of the county of the cause of death
requests an investigation, the coroner of the county of death shall be re-
sponsible for the investigation and the certification of death.

Sec. 3. K.S.A. 22a-232 is hereby amended to read as follows: 22a-
232. (a) Upon receipt of notice pursuant to K.S.A. 22a-231, and amend-
ments thereto, the coroner shall take charge of the dead body, make
inquiries regarding the cause of death and reduce the findings to a report
in writing. Such report shall be filed with the clerk of the district court
of the county in which the cause of death occurred if known, or if not
known the report shall be filed with the clerk of the district court of the
county in which the death occurred dead body was found. If the coroner
determines that the dead body is not a body described by K.S.A. 22a-231,
and amendments thereto, the coroner shall immediately notify the state
historical society.

(b) If in the opinion of the coroner information is present in the
coroner's report that might jeopardize a criminal investigation, the cor-
oner shall file the report with the clerk of the district court of such county
and designate such report as a criminal investigation record, pursuant to
subsection (a)(10) of K.S.A. 45-221, and amendments thereto.

(c) If a death investigation involves multiple jurisdictions, the coroner
notified under K.S.A. 22a-231, and amendments thereto, may transfer
jurisdiction to another jurisdiction if the coroners of both jurisdictions
agree to the transfer.

Sec. 4. K.S.A. 22a-230, 22a-231 and 22a-232 are hereby repealed.
Sec. 5. This act shall take effect and be in force from and after its
publication in the statute book.


Could not copy link so I copied statutes.

There is also a child death review board in Kansas.
 
I am NOT at all familiar with the law (did you notice? ;)) but, can someone even be "charged" or can it be even officially said that Emily is a murderer by the courts considering she is deceased?

I don't think they can declare EG a murderer without a trial. But I believe they'd declare EG the only suspect (if no one else turns up in the investigation as having a hand in any of it).
 
Just wanted to tell you something...
I am from Germany and we have our fair share of similar cases, even though you don't get that much information about them ( I think due to our privacy laws). I am not a mother, I always thought "how horrible " when I read about them, and then moved on. But since I heard about
Lucas I am more aware about how the people around me deal with their kids.
So he changed alot already and the way that Bethany in all her pain managed to bring him close to us had alot to do with it.:)
Thanks for your patience:)
 
Just wanted to tell you something...
I am from Germany and we have our fair share of similar cases, even though you don't get that much information about them ( I think due to our privacy laws). I am not a mother, I always thought "how horrible " when I read about them, and then moved on. But since I heard about
Lucas I am more aware about how the people around me deal with their kids.
So he changed alot already and the way that Bethany in all her pain managed to bring him close to us had alot to do with it.:)
Thanks for your patience:)


I want to thank you for sharing your opinions and perspectives here. I'd rather read and learn from varying viewpoints than be in an "echo chamber" so to speak, with everyone having the same opinions. Except maybe Lucas' case, I think everyone pretty much agrees what/who happened to him, not for the better.
 
Hi sorry if I came across wrong. I have no idea what they would be thinking and I hope I never have to. I just meant I wonder how much they really can/will say. The DA certainly seemed genuine and has intentions to see it all through. I just wonder what they will be able to actually say in terms of details.
I think Charlie says something about an inquest below, usually here that would allow more to come out I think.

I also want to thank you for sharing your opinions and perspectives here-- I think it enhances the discussion.
 
I am NOT at all familiar with the law (did you notice? ;)) but, can someone even be "charged" or can it be even officially said that Emily is a murderer by the courts considering she is deceased?

Well, there's always the local, state, and federal courts, but there's also the court of public opinion, which JH was so concerned about, IIRC, IMO. ;)
 
I don't think they can declare EG a murderer without a trial. But I believe they'd declare EG the only suspect (if no one else turns up in the investigation as having a hand in any of it).
And they can state the COD. So if there is one suspect and the manner of death is homicide, they can state what the COD has been determined to be, if known. It will be apparent who the DA believes is guilty. But I don't believe a deceased person can be tried. How could they? There are rights extended to the accused. She's not here to perform her rights.
 
Seems to have become very resigned and slow here.

I hope people don’t forget Lucas and how so many people tried to help him along the way.


Most comments here seem to express a high regard for Lucas and his family, and posters have commented on the changes they've incorporated in their lives as a result of learning about Lucas and his story. I think the effects are/will be much farther-reaching than any of us can imagine. We all grew to love him, thanks to FLA!

ETA : I think it's a natural slowing-down, with all that's happened. Now we're in a waiting period. Waiting for results from the DA, ME, LE.

ETA2: spelling is important!
 
And they can state the COD. So if there is one suspect and the manner of death is homicide, they can state what the COD has been determined to be, if known. It will be apparent who the DA believes is guilty. But I don't believe a deceased person can be tried. How could they? There are rights extended to the accused. She's not here to perform her rights.

I can’t imagibe the DA holding any type of legal proceeding now. First the only person of interest is dead. And any accused has the right to question witnesses at trial.

If the DA were to do anything formal it would be a waste of time and money. There would be no logical end.

There is probably one option and that would be a coroners inquest type proceeding. And the State Child Death Commission is tasked with some proceeding but I don’t believe it to be public. There might be something other unknown to this layperson.

But if the public in Wichita becomes vocal, contacts state representatives, the DA, LE and coroner they might bend to public pressure and at the least hold a public inquest. That appears to be up to the coroner and a few other people. There might be interest in starting a petition. I’ll see if I can remember which news outlet mentioned it. And post the link.

All in my opinion.
 
I think we need to respect the families wishes. The DA will decide what if any info to release to the public, the families will know the cause of death for Lucas and Emily. If the family does not want to pursue it being released to the public than I think that should be honored.
 
I feel like the investigation needs to be followed through to its absolute conclusion. Yes, I feel an emotional attachment to this sweet boy I never actually knew, and I want answers on his behalf. But I'm just a stranger on the internet. My "wants" are not what matters. BUT. Even tho EG is dead, questions need answers because Lucas was failed. And Lucas sadly is not the first, or last, child to be abused. At a minimum, any culpability on the part of govt agencies needs to be assessed. I'm not the type to think govt is the answer to our problems, but we already have child and family protective services in place. The failings in the system need examined. And part of that is looking at this one little boy's story to examine how and when and why and where everything went down. Examine it for his sake, and to learn for the sake of other kids who may still be saved.

Edited because I didn't finish one of my thoughts.
 
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