UNSOLVED Oh - Pike County: 8 People From One Family Dead As Police Hunt For Killer(s) #33

[Charliegizmo49]

I think DeWine and Reader will retire before someone goes to jail for these murders.

It’s friday and and I’m discouraged over lack of any progress. Victims deserve better.

 

[AdamsCounty]

Chris Graves of the Cincinnati Enquirer seemed to develop a good relationship with the survivors. Her coverage was factual and respectful. JMO it was LE who most likely discouraged them from talking to the news media.[/QUOT

Chris Graves of the Cincinnati Enquirer seemed to develop a good relationship with the survivors. Her coverage was factual and respectful. JMO it was LE who most likely discouraged them from talking to the news media.

I agree 100%.I actually met and spoke with Chris Graves for a few moments and she mentioned to me that she only reports Facts.She was curious as to who owned the Wagner farmhouse right after the searches.I also spoke to the neighbor who owns the dog kennel on Peterson Rd next to the W's old farmhouse and she told me that the W's boys were sloppy mechanics and didn't think they could pull of 8 murders without leaving evidence behind.I thought it was kind of Ironic watching Chris Cuomo's story on HLN about serial killer Joel Rifkin last week and Rifkin admitting how he couldn't believe how he had gotten away with killing 17 women because he was a messy mechanic and just a messy person in general...I have an inner faith that this case will be solved one day and when it happens,it's just going to come out of the Blue.I guess that's the optimist in me.

 

[rsd1200]

I think DeWine and Reader will retire before someone goes to jail for these murders.

It’s friday and and I’m discouraged over lack of any progress. Victims deserve better.

I get discouraged too, but, I started following, the Missy Bevers case, shortly after I signed on, to follow the R case. I follow MB's case more loosely now, but, it too has been two years, and they had video of the suspected murderer, who had a unique walk, people driving that way for her class, who may have passed the vehicle, a vehicle on video, not to mention, a $50k reward, and zip. Then I think of how little they seem to have on the R & HHG case. It's eight people murdered, in four separate homes. Roads like UHR are very dark at night, and folks are usually in the house by midnight on a weekday, especially on Thursdays. Everyone is tired and ready for the weekend.

 

[Betty P]

I think DeWine and Reader will retire before someone goes to jail for these murders.

It’s friday and and I’m discouraged over lack of any progress. Victims deserve better.

I tend to agree. If, as they imply, they know who the killers are, they should be able to make arrests. They've spent a small fortune to retrieve and lock up every scrap of evidence. They knew a year ago who was in their laser focus.

Who knows what they're waiting for?

 

[MittenScarpetta]

I tend to agree. If, as they imply, they know who the killers are, they should be able to make arrests. They've spent a small fortune to retrieve and lock up every scrap of evidence. They knew a year ago who was in their laser focus.

Who knows what they're waiting for?

IMO, it’s 1 of 2 things- that November election OR they just don’t want to arrest them. There’s cases every day prosecuted on mainly circumstancial evidence and convictions still happen. Murder weapons often times go unrecovered. There’s often not an Eyewitness, but people still get convicted. Dewine has said more than once that he hopes to have this solved before he leaves office. That doesn’t sit well with me. Reader has said it WILL be solved. Their statements have seemed very confident but still no arrrests. I just don’t like it. JMO

There’s 13 unsolved with a possible 14th murder currently that I’m aware of. That speaks volumes in a rural county.

 

[Charliegizmo49]

I would like some help. I understand the basic relationship between the W an R family. I’m trying to get into the details of what kind of motive could be present to cause this kind of retribution.


Please explain what you’re willing to share about;

Inheritance;

Child Custody of SW;

Business relationship re carpentry;

Business relationship re MJ grow or drugs;

Conflict over debt;

Other;

Derby car competitions issues.

I’m trying to get my teeth into something worth the risk to kill 8 people. Even considering the social environment I can’t think until I can organize it visually. And I’m really missing something. I can’t see a money issue, I might understand custody. I might get the drug connection but the rest not yet.

Of course I am weighing my knowledge that none of the motives above are, in my mind, worth 8 Capitol murder charges, the stigma, and future impact on the community and family. But that’s me.

Thank you. Maybe reviewing all of it will help find the true motive. And I will try to put it into 1 single post very simply for everyone.

 

[RichP]

I have no idea why, although I have seen the "laser focus" words used in other statements by the same party having nothing to do with this case. I certainly don't buy that the reason they have interest in the Ws has anything to do with custody. Maybe a tip, maybe a statement made by a W themselves, could be any reason. But to make up a statement like ""Members of that family, LE has hinted, have been involved in drug or MJ trafficking." is a pure falsehood. I am one more to let the actual statements fall where they may without embellishment.

""Members of that family, LE has hinted, have been involved in drug or MJ trafficking."

LE hasn't hinted, they've stated that MJ grow operations were found. Not the "two plants on a window sill type" If one is growing more than they need for personal consumption than one is trafficking.

 

[Charliegizmo49]

Agree, with Mittens, from last post, re; GW4 removing G from the state. I don't find removing the child from visits with his mother, to be what I'd call, compassionate, or Christ-like, behaviour. I don't know how to put it, other than, for example, GW4, probably justified what he did, to get young BW, then, later, justified taking him out of state, away from his mommy, thus breaking the custody agreement, because they were doing it for the child's best interests. JW could have very well done the same thing, while he had S in his care. They all could have packed up one night and left for AK, and no one would have known til they were in AK. In fact they could have even said they were going on vacation, and just not returned. GW4 and B's mom had a custody agreement, and she hasn't gotten them to bring B back. JW had no custody agreement, but did have an established pattern of joint visitation worked out between he and the mother. They'd not do anymore, for HMR, than they have for Bs momma, which appears to be zip. The Ws could've just kept on extending that vacation...

If ya'll want to dump this thread and make a "W Theory Only" thread, have at it, but I have multiple theories, so, I'll be right here with the main thread. Even if I'm alone.

With you. I’m looking at all of it. I’m trying to find anything or a combination of everything to justify the death penalty if they were caught. The penalties are harsh with the exception of income from mj.

None of the rest can justify that kind of risk.

 

[Charliegizmo49]

BBM

I don't see that happening. If the W's were in danger, LE would have known it. I cannot see AG DeWine calling them out nationally and exposing not only the state they went to, but the town and indeed the very house they moved to. That would have put not only the adults but the children in danger. So no, they did not run because they were scared.

DeWine made sure everyone in AK and the rest of the world knew exactly what the W's looked like, what state they moved to, what town and even their house was photographed. I cannot believe that the AG and LE did not know that would happen when he said they were "laser focused" on that family. In other words he did it so everyone in AK would keep an eye on them, and to make sure that anyone who bought or traded a gun with them would know to be watching.

Don't forget it wasn't just the laser focus comment, but a plea for help from the public asking for anyone who bought, sold, or traded firearms, vehicles or ammo with this family.

JMO

Whatever was used to kill this family is long gone. Never to be found. Imo

 

[rsd1200]

The suspicious part is that it was built by and located on the property of a family that's suspected in the murder of 8 members of the same family, just several miles down the road. Members of that family, LE has hinted, have been involved in drug or MJ trafficking. The family has extensive real estate holdings in the area, some near this church, where LE has busted people for dealing drugs, running meth labs, etc. Some of these are or have been past tenants of the people who built the church and own the land.

And, yeah, the local police refuse to talk about the case publicly, almost never mention the reward and have no suspects or arrests in over 2 years. They also preside over a county where most of the drug related murders in the last several years have gone cold.

Just as important as figuring out which people might have committed these murders is to understand why LE hasn't been able to arrest them and has stonewalled anyone seeking to help with the case for 2 years.

IOW, the problem isn't just with the killers. If LE doesn't stop them, how much longer before they kill again?

""Members of that family, LE has hinted, have been involved in drug or MJ trafficking."

LE hasn't hinted, they've stated that MJ grow operations were found. Not the "two plants on a window sill type" If one is growing more than they need for personal consumption than one is trafficking.

The original quote, read, to me that it had been hinted that the Ws had been connected to hard drug and weed trafficking, and if not the Ws, then the Rs. No connection to the Ws and Rs in hard drug, or weed trafficking, has been made by LE.

 

[Betty P]

I agree 100%.I actually met and spoke with Chris Graves for a few moments and she mentioned to me that she only reports Facts.She was curious as to who owned the Wagner farmhouse right after the searches.I also spoke to the neighbor who owns the dog kennel on Peterson Rd next to the W's old farmhouse and she told me that the W's boys were sloppy mechanics and didn't think they could pull of 8 murders without leaving evidence behind.I thought it was kind of Ironic watching Chris Cuomo's story on HLN about serial killer Joel Rifkin last week and Rifkin admitting how he couldn't believe how he had gotten away with killing 17 women because he was a messy mechanic and just a messy person in general...I have an inner faith that this case will be solved one day and when it happens,it's just going to come out of the Blue.I guess that's the optimist in me.

IMO, this case has already been solved. I think they already know the killers, but they're not yet pursuing arrest and prosecution. This seems to be a pattern for PCSO and prosecutors.

There's also news of the first medical MJ license awarded in Ohio.

First medical marijuana grower gets green light to start planting in Ohio

I still have a theory that legalizing MJ was somehow connected in these murders. The various health care companies that some folks had set up may have been related to getting licenses once MJ was legalized for medical use. Someone threatening to talk could have put people at risk, as well as their licenses for future business opportunities. These folks may have lined up some silent investors who didn't want to see their investments disappear and face a legal ban from future MJ business opportunities. There are a lot of start up costs involved in these licenses for grow ops, processing, distribution.

 

[Betty P]

The original quote, read, to me that it had been hinted that the Ws had been connected to hard drug and weed trafficking, and if not the Ws, then the Rs. No connection to the Ws and Rs in hard drug, or weed trafficking, has been made by LE.

Is there a reason why we're still discussing this? Mods said to cease. TIA.

 

[rsd1200]

I would like some help. I understand the basic relationship between the W an R family. I’m trying to get into the details of what kind of motive could be present to cause this kind of retribution.


Please explain what you’re willing to share about;

Inheritance;

Child Custody of SW;

Business relationship re carpentry;

Business relationship re MJ grow or drugs;

Conflict over debt;

Other;

Derby car competitions issues.

I’m trying to get my teeth into something worth the risk to kill 8 people. Even considering the social environment I can’t think until I can organize it visually. And I’m really missing something. I can’t see a money issue, I might understand custody. I might get the drug connection but the rest not yet.

Of course I am weighing my knowledge that none of the motives above are, in my mind, worth 8 Capitol murder charges, the stigma, and future impact on the community and family. But that’s me.

Thank you. Maybe reviewing all of it will help find the true motive. And I will try to put it into 1 single post very simply for everyone.

S stands to gain little inheritance, from my point of view, from her maternal side.

I don't know what business relationships they had with the Wagners, although it's said they were friends, and it's been said there was a business relationship. That doesn't mean that it was drugs or weed though. I'm pretty sure carpentry was with another entity, who has been discussed, and I do know they had other business dealings with that same entity, but that doesn't answer your question about the Ws.

The money issue can come into play, if, the Rs were dealing, no matter if it was hard drugs, or weed, and shorted someone, the weight was off, they didn't pay off someone who fronted them, or, another someone thought they were a risk to their freedom. Good money, but it can be risky dealing in illegal activities, especially if a lot of money is at stake.

Other: LM was very upset that the woman who hit CR2 hard enough to bruise his face, and, had left threats on DR's phone, and, iirc, had had previous altercations with DR, was not being looked at adequately.

Fwiw, two fathers gained custody of a much wanted child after the murders.

 

[rsd1200]

Is there a reason why we're still discussing this? Mods said to cease. TIA.

Ask RichP, just trying to clear up where the confusion lay on my end.

 

[Betty P]

With you. I’m looking at all of it. I’m trying to find anything or a combination of everything to justify the death penalty if they were caught. The penalties are harsh with the exception of income from mj.

None of the rest can justify that kind of risk.

Death penalty shouldn't be too difficult in these cases. Cruel, multiple murders of defenseless people sleeping in their homes. Evidence of premeditation.

Here's the full list of circumstances for aggravated murder justifying capital punishment in Ohio
Capital punishment in Ohio - Wikipedia

A charge of aggravated murder with death penalty specifications may occur with at least one of the following special circumstances:[3]

1. The murder was the assassination of the president of the United States or person in line of succession to the presidency, or of the governor or lieutenant governor of Ohio, or of the president-elect or vice president-elect of the United States, or of the governor-elect of Ohio, or of a candidate for any of the foregoing offices.
2. The murder was committed for hire.
3. The murder was committed for the purpose of escaping detection, apprehension, trial, or punishment for another offense committed by the offender.
4. The murder was committed while the offender was under detention or while the offender was at large after having broken detention.
5. Prior to the murder, the offender was convicted of a previous offense having as an essential element the purposeful killing of or attempt to kill another, or the current offense was part of a course of conduct involving the offender's purposeful killing of or attempt to kill two or more persons.
6. The victim was a law enforcement officer, and the offender knew or reasonably should have known that fact, and the officer was either performing duties or the offender acted with the specific purpose of killing such officer.
7. The murder was committed while the offender was committing, attempting to commit, or fleeing immediately after committing or attempting to commit kidnapping, rape, aggravated arson, aggravated robbery, or aggravated burglary, and either the offender was the principal offender in the commission of the aggravated murder or, if not the principal offender, committed the aggravated murder with prior planning.
8. The victim was a witness who was purposely killed by the offender either to prevent the victim from testifying, or in retaliation for prior testimony.
9. The offender, in the commission of the murder, purposefully caused the death of another who was under 13 years of age at the time of the commission of the offense, and either the offender was the principal offender in the commission of the offense or, if not the principal offender, committed the offense with prior planning.
10. The offense was committed while the offender was committing, attempting to commit, or fleeing immediately after committing or attempting to commit terrorism.

BBM

ETA: It's possible the killers were trying to avoid the DP by not killing the children. I think we've discussed this before. If anything was stolen from the crime scenes, robbery or burglary offenses would seem to apply.

 

[Charliegizmo49]

Death penalty shouldn't be too difficult in these cases. Cruel, multiple murders of defenseless people sleeping in their homes. Evidence of premeditation.

Here's the full list of circumstances for aggravated murder justifying capital punishment in Ohio
Capital punishment in Ohio - Wikipedia



BBM

ETA: It's possible the killers were trying to avoid the DP by not killing the children. I think we've discussed this before. If anything was stolen from the crime scenes, robbery or burglary offenses would seem to apply.

Oh no doubt in my mind this is going to be a death penalty case. There would be a national outrage if it went any other way.

 

[RichP]

Ask RichP, just trying to clear up where the confusion lay on my end.

Just trying to set the facts straight. and the facts are that MJ was found and it was a "commercial" amount. IMO that makes some of the victims dealers, traffickers, or whatever it is you call people who deal with illegal substances. In this case it's a fact that LE has stated that commercial amounts of MJ was found on the victims property.

Listen to around the 26:00 minute of the press conference.

Raw: AG, Sheriff's Wednesday update on Pike Co. shooting investigation

 

[Charliegizmo49]

The original quote, read, to me that it had been hinted that the Ws had been connected to hard drug and weed trafficking, and if not the Ws, then the Rs. No connection to the Ws and Rs in hard drug, or weed trafficking, has been made by LE.

I picked up on that but I can’t make the connection between the death penalty if caught. The motive can’t be something small it has to be something pretty significant for the risk the killers took killing 8 people. Not 1 or 2 but 8. It seems as though at least 1 at each scene either had to know something, have seen something, were involved in something or were a threat. I can see where some were at the wrong place at the wrong time.

But the risk is substantial.

 

[Charliegizmo49]

Just trying to set the facts straight. and the facts are that MJ was found and it was a "commercial" amount. IMO that makes some of the victims dealers, traffickers, or whatever it is you call people who deal with illegal substances. In this case it's a fact that LE has stated that commercial amounts of MJ was found on the victims property.

Listen to around the 26:00 minute of the press conference.

Raw: AG, Sheriff's Wednesday update on Pike Co. shooting investigation

I’m leaning towards that very thing. The land is not that valuable. Custody. That’s crazy but outside chance. The murders took $500 k out if the market. That’s the only thing i can see that makes sense here.

 

[iridized]

Just trying to set the facts straight. and the facts are that MJ was found and it was a "commercial" amount. IMO that makes some of the victims dealers, traffickers, or whatever it is you call people who deal with illegal substances. In this case it's a fact that LE has stated that commercial amounts of MJ was found on the victims property.

Listen to around the 26:00 minute of the press conference.

Raw: AG, Sheriff's Wednesday update on Pike Co. shooting investigation

We were not discussing the Rhodens or their grows.