AMBER ALERT TN - Summer Moon-Utah Wells, 5, Rogersville, 15 Jun 2021 #29

[Miigo]

Did you notice in the Chris McDonough Interview Room Hunter's Interview at 6:50 mins. in to the recording' Hunter says the first thing he notice about Summer Moon's was her short hair. Then after Chris refocuses his thoughts, Hunter reorganizes his context, he corrects himself. Then when the two women arrive from the store, the first thing Hunter notices was the "milks". Hunter sounds like he was just entering the car himself for the first time as if the milk was there, but not Summer Moon. So, where did he first notice her short hair. Was it at the house, or when he first entered the truck.

Hypothetical questions.

New angle.

Have a listen.

IS IT POSSIBLE THAT SUMMER WAS LEFT ALONE IN THE TRUCK SLEEPING? OR WAS THAT PICTURE TAKEN BEFORE PICKING HUNTER UP? He talks as if he did not see the walk to the truck with groceries.

Imagine that the pictures are not available then go on a timeline reference only.

My mind keeps going back to that darn milk. As I’ve mentioned previously, I won’t buy milk in those jugs because they sweat and leave marks on my wooden table very quickly. Originally, it didn’t make sense to me that Summer would be able to comfortably fall asleep on a cold and wet jug.

Recently I’ve been paying more attention to how cold drinks react to a change in temperature. As an example, if I take a cold can/bottle/jug of Pepsi/beer/milk out of the fridge, the sweat/condensation on the outside of the container forms almost immediately. If I leave the drink on my kitchen table untouched, those droplets are still present hours later. If I leave it on my patio table under the sun, it still remains “wet” after at least an hour.

But there’s no visible water droplets on the milk jugs summer is sleeping on. There’s no redness to her skin touching the jug. There’s no sense in buying milk hours before you’ll be able to refrigerate it.

Now I’m in Canada and it’s possible they use different plastic in Tennessee than they do here, and obviously weather isn’t the same. Leaving it in a hot truck may have also made a difference. It’s evening here but tomorrow morning I’m going to buy a couple plastic jugs of milk to experiment with. I will leave one on my counter, one on my patio, and one in my car. And I will record how quickly the sweat forms and how long it lasts.

Anyone know off the top of their heads the temperature there on June 15th?

Any locals willing to experiment on this with me?

 

[charminglane]

I anxiously await the results of your experiment.
Thank you.

 

[Tiff23fr]

My mind keeps going back to that darn milk. As I’ve mentioned previously, I won’t buy milk in those jugs because they sweat and leave marks on my wooden table very quickly. Originally, it didn’t make sense to me that Summer would be able to comfortably fall asleep on a cold and wet jug.

Recently I’ve been paying more attention to how cold drinks react to a change in temperature. As an example, if I take a cold can/bottle/jug of Pepsi/beer/milk out of the fridge, the sweat/condensation on the outside of the container forms almost immediately. If I leave the drink on my kitchen table untouched, those droplets are still present hours later. If I leave it on my patio table under the sun, it still remains “wet” after at least an hour.

But there’s no visible water droplets on the milk jugs summer is sleeping on. There’s no redness to her skin touching the jug. There’s no sense in buying milk hours before you’ll be able to refrigerate it.

Now I’m in Canada and it’s possible they use different plastic in Tennessee than they do here, and obviously weather isn’t the same. Leaving it in a hot truck may have also made a difference. It’s evening here but tomorrow morning I’m going to buy a couple plastic jugs of milk to experiment with. I will leave one on my counter, one on my patio, and one in my car. And I will record how quickly the sweat forms and how long it lasts.

Anyone know off the top of their heads the temperature there on June 15th?

Any locals willing to experiment on this with me?

The milk jug challenge?
(A little levity is healthy )

Do we know it was a few hours from the purchase of the milk to arrival at home?

 

[RANCH]

The milk jug challenge?
(A little levity is healthy )

Do we know it was a few hours from the purchase of the milk to arrival at home?

What about humidity?

 

[Tiff23fr]

What about humidity?

Can you expand on your question @RANCH, so I better understand?

 

[flashy09]

My mind keeps going back to that darn milk. As I’ve mentioned previously, I won’t buy milk in those jugs because they sweat and leave marks on my wooden table very quickly. Originally, it didn’t make sense to me that Summer would be able to comfortably fall asleep on a cold and wet jug.

Recently I’ve been paying more attention to how cold drinks react to a change in temperature. As an example, if I take a cold can/bottle/jug of Pepsi/beer/milk out of the fridge, the sweat/condensation on the outside of the container forms almost immediately. If I leave the drink on my kitchen table untouched, those droplets are still present hours later. If I leave it on my patio table under the sun, it still remains “wet” after at least an hour.

But there’s no visible water droplets on the milk jugs summer is sleeping on. There’s no redness to her skin touching the jug. There’s no sense in buying milk hours before you’ll be able to refrigerate it.

Now I’m in Canada and it’s possible they use different plastic in Tennessee than they do here, and obviously weather isn’t the same. Leaving it in a hot truck may have also made a difference. It’s evening here but tomorrow morning I’m going to buy a couple plastic jugs of milk to experiment with. I will leave one on my counter, one on my patio, and one in my car. And I will record how quickly the sweat forms and how long it lasts.

Anyone know off the top of their heads the temperature there on June 15th?

Any locals willing to experiment on this with me?

The high was 78 and the low 60.

 

[RANCH]

Can you expand on your question @RANCH, so I better understand?

Water in the air. That's what gets on the milk jug. Low humidity vs high humidity. What was it in Tennessee last June and what is it in Canada now.

 

[flashy09]

Water in the air. That's what gets on the milk jug. Low humidity vs high humidity. What was it in Tennessee last June and what is it in Canada now.

I think the dew point might be even more relevant.

 

[LookinInn2]

Am trying to stay supportive of LE.
Your post makes me question them.
Why no public statement, even to say they're working on the case ?

The last two sentences of your comment are chilling.
MOO.

My Speculation only.

LE should be looking in Jonesborough IMO: It has been mentioned too many times by those interviewed.


IMO, the perp took Sumer Moon to Jonesborough. The Wells have told us everything truthfully.

In order to discover the truth, try to forget the pictures and the time line. Listen to all of the

{she did get changed, they did go to the store, they did make several stops etc.}

the explanations of the day. Also, watch the Chris McDonugh's interviews. BUT, wait until you

have listened to all of the time lines that don't match. Don't look at Hunter when he answers

Chris' questions.

Look at Allie and grandma. There gestures mean so much. Hunter needs to get his answers

right. Grandma did not laugh. (Hunter says, Allie was "dead" asleep, so she doesn't know.) Was it the afternoon that Allie slept while they changed Summer Moon the second time. Did Allie not go to the car because she was sleeping. Was grandma coming over at evening or mid-day, not morning and so there wasn't much time?)

When you listen to Candus interviewed by Chris McDonough, don't look at

Chris, but look at Candus. Everything she is explaining, she says happened at home.

BUT imo. EVERYTHING happened where she is standing, in the first part of the interview.

That place she stands is where she breaks (stops) down in tears. IMO: she had relived the image of her daughter. Could Summer Moon have had a mild form ERB's palsy?
When she explains what grandma was doing to holler, she points behind at the parking lot
When she moves her position to have a cigarette, IMO: psychologically, she doesn't want Chris
to see what happened that day.
So, when she navigates his back to the spot, then she is looking at the event again.
If you notice her attention stops, like a hiccup. Candus looks at the spot and continues to explain.
(Don hiccups every time he tells the story of Summer Moon running behind his lawnmower. He switches to the boys motor bikes quickly. When he show the new blue lawnmower far away from he house, he pans the video very quickly.)
When Chris McDonough asks her if she would show him the events that led to disappaerence,
Candus, asks, "you mean at the house?" Where else would she be thinking? They were done at the horse pond.

I believe, IMO, that Candus speaks the truth. However, she leaves out the details, like where it all happened. If Summer Moon was taken from the property, (store lot?), it could be truthful because she was taken. Was she placed where she was supposed to be picked up, and taken/picked up for medical assistance. Or IMO, speculation, she could have been taken literally taken by someone not knowing they just interrupted, what could have been the Wells attempt to help Summer Moon medically.

 

[Miigo]

The milk jug challenge?
(A little levity is healthy )

Do we know it was a few hours from the purchase of

Water in the air. That's what gets on the milk jug. Low humidity vs high humidity. What was it in Tennessee last June and what is it in Canada now.

This is why I’m hoping a local will experiment with me. Since the beginning I’ve felt that trip to the grocery store is what holds the key to figuring out what happened

 

[flashy09]

My mind keeps going back to that darn milk. As I’ve mentioned previously, I won’t buy milk in those jugs because they sweat and leave marks on my wooden table very quickly. Originally, it didn’t make sense to me that Summer would be able to comfortably fall asleep on a cold and wet jug.

Recently I’ve been paying more attention to how cold drinks react to a change in temperature. As an example, if I take a cold can/bottle/jug of Pepsi/beer/milk out of the fridge, the sweat/condensation on the outside of the container forms almost immediately. If I leave the drink on my kitchen table untouched, those droplets are still present hours later. If I leave it on my patio table under the sun, it still remains “wet” after at least an hour.

But there’s no visible water droplets on the milk jugs summer is sleeping on. There’s no redness to her skin touching the jug. There’s no sense in buying milk hours before you’ll be able to refrigerate it.

Now I’m in Canada and it’s possible they use different plastic in Tennessee than they do here, and obviously weather isn’t the same. Leaving it in a hot truck may have also made a difference. It’s evening here but tomorrow morning I’m going to buy a couple plastic jugs of milk to experiment with. I will leave one on my counter, one on my patio, and one in my car. And I will record how quickly the sweat forms and how long it lasts.

Anyone know off the top of their heads the temperature there on June 15th?

Any locals willing to experiment on this with me?

So the actual high temp recorded that day was 81 at the Hawkins County airport. Dew Point was 57.21

Humidity can’t always tell you if it’s humid, but dewpoint can!

 

[RANCH]

I think the dew point might be even more relevant.

The dew point is the temperature the air needs to be cooled to (at constant pressure) in order to achieve a relative humidity (RH) of 100%. At this point the air cannot hold more water in the gas form. If the air were to be cooled even more, water vapor would have to come out of the atmosphere in the liquid form, usually as fog or precipitation.

If the poster wants to try and measure the temperature of the air at the surface of the milk jug that could be useful.

Dew Point vs Humidity

 

[Tiff23fr]

Water in the air. That's what gets on the milk jug. Low humidity vs high humidity. What was it in Tennessee last June and what is it in Canada now.

OK - I see what you are asking - thanks for clarity. I will toss this out to the group. Humidity, dew points, etc. are not areas I can offer much on.

 

[dacjess]

The milk jug challenge?
(A little levity is healthy )

Do we know it was a few hours from the purchase of the milk to arrival at home?

Lol Tiff

I think we know the minimum would be however long it takes to get from where they bought the milk to their home. Their statements were they bought milk then took H home, then drove home. Supposedly A/H live about 45 min from the Wells residence. CW has also stated that they didn’t use the air conditioner that day. So supposedly the milk would be in the car approximately 45 min. or more?

The only problem is this assumes everyone is telling the truth about timeline, where they bought milk, what order things were done that day, when the picture with the milk and Summer was taken, etc. I have no idea anymore if any of this information is true. Presumably there’s a receipt somewhere for milk but I haven’t seen one. Maybe an employee knows if milk was bought that day?

JMO.

 

[Chelly]

The children should all qualify for Medicaid which should cover medical and dental visits.

This post on Medicaid coverage for the four children has raised a question in my mind. The W's were likely receiving monthly government payments for low-income families based on the size of their family (6). So, I am wondering if that extra income stopped when the boys were taken by CPS. The family size has been reduced from 6 to 2. Does anyone know how that works?

 

[RANCH]

Lol Tiff

I think we know the minimum would be however long it takes to get from where they bought the milk to their home. Their statements were they bought milk then took H home, then drove home. Supposedly A/H live about 45 min from the Wells residence. CW has also stated that they didn’t use the air conditioner that day. So supposedly the milk would be in the car approximately 45 min. or more?

The only problem is this assumes everyone is telling the truth about timeline, where they bought milk, what order things were done that day, when the picture with the milk and Summer was taken, etc. I have no idea anymore if any of this information is true. Presumably there’s a receipt somewhere for milk but I haven’t seen one. Maybe an employee knows if milk was bought that day?

JMO.

So in other words it's a waste of time to do the milk jug experiment.

 

[Tiff23fr]

So in other words it's a waste of time to do the milk jug experiment.

It brings up an interesting thought.

I jokingly asked my spouse if I could place a milk jug next to him to see if it would wake him up. After he looked at me like I had lost my mind, something did occur in my thoughts.

In the experiment above, seeing if he would wake up after placing a milk jug against him, there is another variable that would make it inconclusive. In my example, I would be using milk within moments of its removal from the refrigerator. In Summer’s case, we don’t know what the temperature of the milk had reached by the time she fell asleep on it. It likely wouldn’t be nearly as cold as one might think, depending on:
-how long they walked around in the store with the milk after it was removed from refrigeration
-how quickly the temperature of the milk increased based on the environmental temp in the vehicle
-how long it then had been in the vehicle before she even fell asleep on it

 

[Tiff23fr]

Here we are talking about a milk jug experiment and re-creation. Thanks for getting my mind going @Miigo !

Question to Posters:
We don’t know what happened, and there has been no recovery. Given what little we have heard about the day, the property, etc., what do you feel LE might be trying to re-create in order to help them find answers?

 

[MsMarple]

My mind keeps going back to that darn milk. As I’ve mentioned previously, I won’t buy milk in those jugs because they sweat and leave marks on my wooden table very quickly. Originally, it didn’t make sense to me that Summer would be able to comfortably fall asleep on a cold and wet jug.

Recently I’ve been paying more attention to how cold drinks react to a change in temperature. As an example, if I take a cold can/bottle/jug of Pepsi/beer/milk out of the fridge, the sweat/condensation on the outside of the container forms almost immediately. If I leave the drink on my kitchen table untouched, those droplets are still present hours later. If I leave it on my patio table under the sun, it still remains “wet” after at least an hour.

But there’s no visible water droplets on the milk jugs summer is sleeping on. There’s no redness to her skin touching the jug. There’s no sense in buying milk hours before you’ll be able to refrigerate it.

Now I’m in Canada and it’s possible they use different plastic in Tennessee than they do here, and obviously weather isn’t the same. Leaving it in a hot truck may have also made a difference. It’s evening here but tomorrow morning I’m going to buy a couple plastic jugs of milk to experiment with. I will leave one on my counter, one on my patio, and one in my car. And I will record how quickly the sweat forms and how long it lasts.

Anyone know off the top of their heads the temperature there on June 15th?

Any locals willing to experiment on this with me?

It's really cool that you're thinking like a scientist! What you're referring to is the dew point. If the temperature of a milk jug is lower than the surrounding air then it causes the water vapor in the air (relative humidity) to form liquid water on the surface of the plastic. AKA condensation. It relies more on temperatures than the type of plastic.

In order to know how quickly that would happen in the car and how quickly it would dissipate you would need to know the car's interior temperature, the relative humidity and the temperature of the milk jug.

If you can estimate using the outdoor temps/humidity from that day and the average temp of a gallon of milk in a dairy case you might at least get some general result. I dunno but at this point there's no harm as we sure don't have any information about June 15 other than what DW and CB have told us.

 

[RANCH]

It brings up an interesting thought.

I jokingly asked my spouse if I could place a milk jug next to him to see if it would wake him up. After he looked at me like I had lost my mind, something did occur in my thoughts.

In the experiment above, seeing if he would wake up after placing a milk jug against him, there is another variable that would make it inconclusive. In my example, I would be using milk within moments of its removal from the refrigerator. In Summer’s case, we don’t know what the temperature of the milk had reached by the time she fell asleep on it. It likely wouldn’t be nearly as cold as one might think, depending on:
-how long they walked around in the store with the milk after it was removed from refrigeration
-how quickly the temperature of the milk increased based on the environmental temp in the vehicle
-how long it then had been in the vehicle before she even fell asleep on it

I'd like to see the screenshot of the milk jugs to see if in fact it's discernible that there's no condensation droplets on the milk jugs.

It's been awhile since I've seen it and I don't recall the resolution of it.