Abby & Libby - The Delphi Murders - Richard Allen Arrested - #209

[gremlin444]

Former fire chief says he saw no clothes in creek the night Abby and Libby went missing | Day 13 of Delphi murders trial for suspect Richard Allen

Seven years after Libby German and Abby Williams were killed, the trial continues for the man accused of murdering them.

www.wthr.com

9:17 a.m. - The third witness for the defense is Ofc. Christopher Gootee who has served with the Hammond Police Department since 2005.
Gootee interviewed Brad Weber as part of the Delphi investigation.
The state objected and the judge told the jury that was not substantive evidence.
According to Gootee, Weber said he went home after work the day the murders happened.
A report, written by an FBI Special Agent working with Gootee, was entered as evidence.

 

[photographer4]

I personally believe that RA straddled Abby, pinning her arms to her side with his thighs, before slitting her throat.

I also think it’s possible that he used soft restraints that didn’t leave marks and/or that the girls were so terrified that they were frozen.

Then when did she grab the tree to leave a bloody handprint per testimony of Cicero? Edited by me to say - I stand corrected. It was LG who Cicero said left the handprint. Thanks to those who pointed it out. Pass the coffee pls.

 

[gremlin444]

https://fox59.com/delphi-trial/delphi-murders-allens-mental-health-at-center-of-day-13/

During Allen’s key confession, he said a van spooked him, leading him to order the girls across Deer Creek and kill them. Defense attorney Jennifer Auger asked Gootee if Weber went straight home from work that day; Gootee said he didn’t know.

Auger showed him a report from Feb. 19, 2017, to refresh his memory. He’d spoken to Weber on that day. However, he couldn’t say if Weber told him he went straight home after work.

 

[Vaderman]

n when did she grab the tree to leave a bloody handprint per testimony of Cicero?

That was Libby.

 

[Momofthreeboys]

In this article Defense calls first 2 witnesses after state rests its case in Delphi murders trial it says the defense told the judge they're having a hard time charting their course when she said she didn't have time to rule on the Odinism thing again.

So it kind of creates the perception to me that they were really banking on this Odinism theory and they really don't have much beyond that.

My belief is they have 2 strategies so want to know which one they are executing.

 

[gremlin444]

Then when did she grab the tree to leave a bloody handprint per testimony of Cicero?

The OP was talking about Abby, you are thinking about Libby.

 

[EllaMinnowP]

I hope we find a better source than this because surely there is some mistake.​

"trained interviewer, canvassing neighborhoods" = doesn't know what Weber said, completely missed RA's house.​

Gang taskforce focusing on kidnapping. smh
**************

Gang Response Investigative Team (GRIT)​

The GRIT initiative is an FBI-led task force designed to identify, disrupt, and dismantle gangs and gang-related activities. The primary mission of the GRIT is to reduce the incidence of gang-related violence in Indiana.

About Indiana HIDTA – Indiana HIDTA

indiana-hidta.org

It is interesting, leaning toward weird, imo, that he was called to the stand, if that’s all he could offer. This one from WANE seems to confirm/ corroborate the way WISH reported it.

Auger showed him a report from Feb. 19, 2017, to refresh his memory. He’d spoken to Weber on that day. However, he couldn’t say if Weber told him he went straight home after work.

The timeline is especially important for the state’s theory on how and when the murders played out.

https://www.wane.com/top-stories/delphi-murders-allens-mental-health-at-center-of-day-13/

 

[Deleted member 296739]

So... what's said by RA in these videos is ruled to be hearsay?

I’m so confused- how is that hearsay?

Edit- answered above

 

[Bbgiraffe]

Then when did she grab the tree to leave a bloody handprint per testimony of Cicero?

Cicero also testified he believed Libby left a bloody handprint shaped like an upside down "L" on one of the trees. His testimony and photos from the crime scene led to several jurors looking away.

Blood pattern expert says Libby German's body was moved | Day 9 of Delphi murders trial

Seven years after Libby German and Abby Williams were killed, the trial continues for the man accused of murdering them.

www.wthr.com

Libby left the handprint per Cicero. Abby had no blood on her hands.

 

[Momofthreeboys]

It is interesting, leaning toward weird, imo, that he was called to the stand, if that’s all he could offer. This one from WANE seems to confirm/ corroborate the way WISH reported it.

Auger showed him a report from Feb. 19, 2017, to refresh his memory. He’d spoken to Weber on that day. However, he couldn’t say if Weber told him he went straight home after work.

The timeline is especially important for the state’s theory on how and when the murders played out.

https://www.wane.com/top-stories/delphi-murders-allens-mental-health-at-center-of-day-13/

We may find out he perjured himself. It's what I suspect.

 

[photographer4]

That was Libby.

Thanks for this. I mixed up who’s who.

 

[detectivewannab]

My first thought is she froze and Libby choose to flight after seeing what he did to Abby.

 

[m00c0w]

We may find out he perjured himself. It's what I suspect.

Who perjured himself?

If it was in the report, the defense would have just read the relevant portion of the report back to the witness after it was admitted into evidence. It sounds more to me like the defense went on a fishing expedition based on a way they perceived something to be written in that report, but the witness couldn't recall specifics and didn't want to speculate on something not written in the report.

JMO

 

[tlcya]

Which is hilarious. My spouse also "loves" the grossest violent movies he can find. Non drinker, non drug taker, non hunter, non gun owner husband LOL has the worse choice (for me) in movies and what to watch on TV. I don't even want to know what kind of podcasts he listens to or internet searches he might have on his phone. I put zero weight on anyone's movie choices and I'm guessing there aren't many jurors who would find his movie choices a direct correlation.

I will agree with you on this. I enjoy gory horror flicks. I enjoy true crime flicks. MEH, I think the google searches are not really useful or probative in any way.

 

[EllaMinnowP]

https://www.wane.com/top-stories/delphi-murders-allens-mental-health-at-center-of-day-13/

Ultimately, it appeared Gull decided to allow videos to be played without audio. The debate wasn’t finished there, however. The defense said it couldn’t say for sure when the videos were from because of the way they were labeled in discovery. Gull said they can’t use the videos if they can’t verify the dates.

The defense will do some additional research and try to introduce them later. Allen’s team will call additional witnesses after lunch.

Much of Friday’s proceedings have been taken up by the prosecution’s objections and multiple sidebars involving counsel and the judge.

 

[MassGuy]

My first thought is she froze and Libby choose to flight after seeing what he did to Abby.

That’s my theory as well. He stabbed Abby and quickly turned on Libby, I think he actually stabbed Libby too before she was able to make a run for it. Then he caught up with her, inflicted the reminder of the wounds, and dragged her body back towards Abby’s.

 

[tlcya]

does anyone know how BG managed to leave no DNA on the victims? wore gloves that were discarded? their clothing if he touched it burned?

MOO just because touch DNA exists doesn't IMO mean it is reasonable to expect to find it at any given crime scene. People manage to commit violent crimes every day and leave not a speck of DNA. Not because they are criminal masterminds, but because they are either careful or lucky. IMO RA was the latter.

 

[detectivewannab]

It’s going to be Keegan coming in hot.

I believe the defense is going to drop a bombshell today

Can you explain this?

 

[Arkay]

MOO, defense witness Liebert saw a man on a private drive not far from the crime scene in the morning on February 13th. I have no reason to doubt her testimony. I also think it means exactly nothing since the crime occurred hours later. JMO

Yes, and so far I have no qualms about Mailbox Guy.

The man on Libby’s video is the man who told them to go DTH. If Mailbox Guy does not resemble BG, IMO that rules him out.

 

[MassGuy]

-First on the stand was Hammond Police Officer Christopher Gootee
-He interviewed Brad Weber about 6 days after the murders with an FBI agent
-When defense attorney Jennifer Auger asked him if Weber went straight home after work, Gootee said he didn't know

She then showed him a report done by FBI Special Agent Adam Pohl to see if it could refresh his memory
-Gootee looked at the report and still couldn't say if Weber went straight home after work
-Auger appeared stunned and confused
-Gootee stepped down soon after

The questioning was all done to show that Brad Weber was lying when he testified for the prosecution that he did go home straight after work
-Whether or not Weber's van was on the trail around 2:30 the afternoon of the murders has become the central point in this case

Next up was Dr. Deanna Dwenger who is the director of behavioral health at the Indiana Department of Corrections
-She said she had concerns about the 24/7 video surveillance of Mr. Allen and recommended the cameras be removed but it never happened.

She testified that solitary confinement is not good for mental health
-She also admitted that the IDOC has policies to make sure someone who is seriously mentally ill as Allen was doesn't continue to "decompensate"
-She said those policies weren't followed with Allen

During cross, Deputy Prosecutor Diener brought up that Dr. Wala thought Allen was feigning his symptoms
-She didn't say much outside of that
-After this, the video controversy happened. See my other thread for that info.
-Updates to come this afternoon

https://twitter.com/x/status/1852392447684305103