Abby & Libby - The Delphi Murders - Richard Allen Arrested - #209

[fred&edna]

Do they actually have a witness on the stand to say that it's RA or do they just want to play them? Weird.

We need legal advice @AugustWest !!

That kinda/sorta joins-up with my last post (no one to cross-examine). jmo

 

[Vern]

That kinda/sorta joins-up with my last post (no one to cross-examine). jmo

I just saw that. Thanks!

 

[BUF]

I have a feeling that there are going to be many objections, sidebars, etc from here on out.

 

[acutename]

Do they actually have a witness on the stand to say that it's RA or do they just want to play them? Weird.

We need legal advice @AugustWest !!

usually (?) some one from the facility- IT, manager, some one would come in and say this is the recording equipment we have, this is how we use it, make, model #, days it was functional blah blah blah. IMO.

 

[scapa]

I think the google searches are a big nothingburger IMO. Dude likes horror movies, Netflix, googled Delphi generally, googled for info about the bridge renovation, and he looked for updates about the case (like probably every other citizen of Delphi). Shrug, my search history would look similar.

Interesting that he was looking for a movie about a teen holding a man hostage, but not earthshattering. IMO

BBM

Definitely an odd one there -- guessing that the prosecution's interest is to present that either as an originating fantasy gone wrong or a retributive one in which a killer's guilt is assuaged by being victimized by a fantasy version of his own victim(s).

Not sure how effective these are likely to be -- don't they have to be introduced and/or explained by an expert witness before admission? I know very little about American jurisprudence so forgive the awkward question.

 

[photographer4]

IMO, one way to identify if RA is BG is to have him walk across the bridge and record him while he is doing it. Everyone's walk is unique...

So unique his own family and none of his friends, not even a single CVS customer tipped him into Le before he was arrested…..
Moooo.

 

[girlhasnoname]

Meta data can show you a date a photo of RA was taken. It cannot prove that RA is the man from LG’s phone bc unfortunately, the image she captured lacks any actual identifying information. People have thought that photo was all sorts of different men. None were named as RA until after he was arrested imo or surely the state would have been able to present evidence to this effect before they rested their case imo. I’m afraid LG’s video though helpful in some ways, does not definitively id RA. Mooo.

The video Libby so bravely took confirms to me 100% that man BG=RA=Killer, she captured their killer which I find beyond helpful. It's RA's stubby, short body frame with no neck and his little legs in jeans that break and roll at the top of his shoes. I'd be willing to bet the farm his inseam is 29" because that is the shortest generic mens sizing (mass production) and they're still too long for him. I've noticed his prison jumpsuits do the same and other photos of RA pre arrest show it as well.

It also captured RA's voice, which after reading a lot of the reports by people who were actually in the courtroom and the witness for the State when asked "Do you recognize the voice on the video", Harshman replied "Yes, It's Richard Allen".

It doesn't get much better than that, well only if RA hadn't murdered Libby and Abby and they had been alive to testify to it themselves.

JMO

 

[MassGuy]

So unique his own family and none of his friends, not even a single CVS customer tipped him into Le before he was arrested…..
Moooo.

No one could make out his face from that video, and none of the sketches would make anyone come forward and say it was him. Customers wouldn't recognize his clothing in that video, as that's not what he wore to work. What is strange is his wife not coming forward, as she would have recognized that clothing and known that her husband was there that day. Presumably anyway.

 

[girlhasnoname]

I have a feeling that there are going to be many objections, sidebars, etc from here on out.

I agree and I believe it was done by complete design. This DT does not have even a halfway logical case without hoodwinking and shenanigans IMO.

They want to throw the jury off from all of the horrible things they've had to sit through the last couple of weeks.

JMO

 

[Momofthreeboys]

Thanks @tlcya. I do find this one a bit off, maybe he was comparing notes:

<snipped & BBM>

It appeared Allen had an interest in disturbing movies. On April 27, 2022, he searched for “insidious” and “horrifying” things to watch. In another search from June 2023, he looked for the “most *advertiser censored**** up thing to watch on Netflix,” according to the analysis.

MOO

Which is hilarious. My spouse also "loves" the grossest violent movies he can find. Non drinker, non drug taker, non hunter, non gun owner husband LOL has the worse choice (for me) in movies and what to watch on TV. I don't even want to know what kind of podcasts he listens to or internet searches he might have on his phone. I put zero weight on anyone's movie choices and I'm guessing there aren't many jurors who would find his movie choices a direct correlation.

 

[Bbgiraffe]

I agree and I believe it was done by complete design. This DT does not have even a halfway logical case without hoodwinking and shenanigans IMO.

They want to throw the jury off from all of the horrible things they've had to sit through the last couple of weeks.

JMO

In this article Defense calls first 2 witnesses after state rests its case in Delphi murders trial it says the defense told the judge they're having a hard time charting their course when she said she didn't have time to rule on the Odinism thing again.

So it kind of creates the perception to me that they were really banking on this Odinism theory and they really don't have much beyond that.

 

[acutename]

No one could make out his face from that video, and none of the sketches would make anyone come forward and say it was him. Customers wouldn't recognize his clothing in that video, as that's not what he wore to work. What is strange is his wife not coming forward, as she would have recognized that clothing and known that her husband was there that day. Presumably anyway.

cannot remember if his wife worked...? So maybe she did not see him early that day? Also he was wearing pretty generic clothing- jeans/Carhartt jacket, so I am not sure if she would have thought about that too much. Very curious if she ever had any inkling about his mental states or if he did a good job hiding things from his family.

 

[photographer4]

In this article Defense calls first 2 witnesses after state rests its case in Delphi murders trial it says the defense told the judge they're having a hard time charting their course when she said she didn't have time to rule on the Odinism thing again.

So it kind of creates the perception to me that they were really banking on this Odinism theory and they really don't have much beyond that.

I think they did a good job poking holes in the state’s case. Particularly with the Dr Wala shenanigans. I don’t especially need the Soddi defence to see many glaring issues with the investigation and the case against RA. Mooo. I don’t think their case is resting on Odins really but since they filed a motion to get that in, I’m unclear as to why she hasn’t ruled on this yet? When does she expect to issue a ruling? Do we know? Not moo regarding the lack of ruling to date is a question. Ty.

 

[Skigh]

No one could make out his face from that video, and none of the sketches would make anyone come forward and say it was him. Customers wouldn't recognize his clothing in that video, as that's not what he wore to work. What is strange is his wife not coming forward, as she would have recognized that clothing and known that her husband was there that day. Presumably anyway.

I personally find it very difficult to think that she did not recognise him .

 

[FrostedGlass]

10:35 A.M: COURT IS IN SESSION FOR FRIDAY.​

At 9:01 a.m. the jury entered the courtroom and court is back in session. Judge gull tells defense attorney Brad Rozzi that they will chat about his motions he’s filed on transports during the lunch break.

Gull says the jury has once again had supervised contact with their electronic devices.

The defense calls Christopher Gootee and the state immediately calls for a sidebar. The sidebar lasts 9 minutes.

Gootee tells the jury he is a Hammond, Ind. police officer and has background as an EMT. He says he has training in interviewing witnesses and suspects.

Defense attorney Jennifer Auger asks him about the importance of correctly documenting interviews. Gootee says he was with an FBI gang response task force or GRIT. They focused on kidnappings.

Gootee tells the jury that GRIT assisted with the Delphi investigation by canvassing neighborhoods and conducting interviews. He says he worked on the investigation for over a week.

Gootee says he spoke to Brad Weber during the investigation. Auger asks Gootee what Weber said about where he went after work on February 13, 2017.

Auger asks Gootee what an FBI 302 is, Gootee says it is a report from an interview. Auger shows him an exhibit, which is an FBI 302 report from his interview with Weber.

Gootee says he spoke to Weber on Feb. 19, 2017. He tells the jury that he doesn’t know what Weber said, despite looking at his own report. Auger finishes her questions, the state does not cross-examine.

Delphi Murders trial: Day 13 live blog

Delphi Murders trial of Richard Allen continues with testimony from witnesses. Allen is charged with murder of two girls in 2017. Follow for updates.

www.wishtv.com

I hope we find a better source than this because surely there is some mistake.​

"trained interviewer, canvassing neighborhoods" = doesn't know what Weber said, completely missed RA's house.​

Gang taskforce focusing on kidnapping. smh
**************

Gang Response Investigative Team (GRIT)​

The GRIT initiative is an FBI-led task force designed to identify, disrupt, and dismantle gangs and gang-related activities. The primary mission of the GRIT is to reduce the incidence of gang-related violence in Indiana.

About Indiana HIDTA – Indiana HIDTA

indiana-hidta.org

 

[acutename]

does anyone know how BG managed to leave no DNA on the victims? wore gloves that were discarded? their clothing if he touched it burned?

 

[Deleted member 296739]

Or, he could've been there in person to see/hear the van.

jmo

Yup absolutely- the other “option” has been suggested as to how he would have known about details other that first person experience- not saying it’s true - but only thing I’ve seen as an alternative- moo

 

[MassGuy]

I personally find it very difficult to think that she did not recognise him .

He literally tells her that he did it and she tells him that he didn’t, and his mind is not right. If him telling her that doesn’t do it, she doesn’t strike me as the type to reach that conclusion on her own based on the BG video. So if she did have an inkling, she found a way to dismiss it.

Massive blind spot.

 

[AugustWest]

@minor4th @AugustWest @PrairieWind

Do they actually have a witness on the stand to say that it's RA or do they just want to play them? Weird.

We need legal advice @AugustWest !!

My hourly rate is $237.00 per hour, which is $20 below the national average! I will forego the retainer, as this shouldn't take more than a few hours of work and a small lunch break.

Spoiler: Hearsay

Just kidding! I'm not clear on the facts of the issue right now. I have had to work some today, so I am a little behind. From my understanding, Gull sustained a hearsay objection on audio of a videotape. She overruled an objection yesterday by the defense when Harshman read off Wala's report. The audio on the videotape is hearsay, as are the words of Wala when Harshman is reading off the report. There are exceptions to hearsay, and I think this objection has to do with authentication. I'll see what more I can find out.

 

[Kittybunny]

Is this a crazy theory?

I was wondering if Libby and Abby had a toxicology report done (which I cannot find the answer to)
As Richard Allen worked in a pharmacy is it possible the girls were drugged or sedated, hence the lack of defensive wounds or signs of restraint? Could that also explain why BG may have spent an extended period of time over the creek before leaving? possibly waiting for something to take effect or had knowledge of how long the effects of something would last etc?

Just MOO

I personally believe that RA straddled Abby, pinning her arms to her side with his thighs, before slitting her throat.

I also think it’s possible that he used soft restraints that didn’t leave marks and/or that the girls were so terrified that they were frozen.