Australia - 3 dead after eating wild mushrooms, Leongatha, Victoria, Aug 2023 #10 *Arrest*

[Spectrix]

I really want to see her police interviews and her behavior in them.

Me too, I would find that fascinating. If her interviews (or parts of them) are played in court then we might have a chance of them becoming publicly available.
They released 3.5 hours of interview footage after Greg Lynn's trial.

-

 

[drsleuth]

That's a good point. Now it's been suggested that she hadn't bought any dried mushrooms, she must have been dehydrating edible foraged or shop mushrooms for the kids. It's alleged that she visited one of the deathcap locations the day after it was posted on iNaturalist, and bought the dehydrator the same day. She must have dehydrated the deathcaps pretty soon after that because they'd barely last a week in the fridge. So why did she keep those aside instead of hiding them in the muffins for the kids?

It's also kind of gross that it appears she didn't clean the dehydrator very well. The toxicologist reported that some "vegetable matter" on the dehydrator had tested positive for amatoxin. That makes it sound like more than just trace elements.

Perhaps @Detechtive can chime in if she knows what stage Erin was posting about dehydrating mushrooms on the crime group.

WEEK 2

Day five: Three friends Patterson made in a true crime Facebook group took the stand. They said Patterson shared photos of her food dehydrator online and that she consulted the group for advice on beef wellington recipes around July 2023.

Erin Patterson mushroom trial: Toxicologist takes stand, lethal dose ‘variable’

Erin Patterson is accused of killing three people with poisonous death cap mushrooms.

7news.com.au

 

[drsleuth]

Perhaps @Detechtive can chime in if she knows what stage Erin was posting about dehydrating mushrooms on the crime group.

Also found this article

Dr Rogers said in March, April and May 2023, Erin began posting messages in the true crime Facebook page – earlier mentioned in the opening – about dehydrating mushrooms.
“She shared that she’d purchased a food dehydrator and posted a few messages and photos about it in the chat, including a photograph of the dehydrator sitting on her kitchen bench,” Dr Rogers said.
“The accused explained in the chat that she’d been dehydrating mushrooms, blitzing them into powder and hiding powdered mushrooms in everything. This included putting powdered mushrooms into chocolate brownies without her children knowing,” Dr Rogers said.

https://www.heraldsun.com.au/truecrimeaustralia/the-mushroom-cook/erin-pattersons-murder-trial-begins/live-coverage/619e3e9c679ec350e86955d2baf82748?amp

 

[drsleuth]

Just putting this link here as a reference, as it has links to every day of the live updates

Mushroom Trial I Herald Sun | Linktree

Keep up to date with the Herald Sun's coverage of the trial gripping the world.

linktr.ee

 

[MsMarple]

For me personally it’s really hard to wrap my head around the accused purposely concealing the true source of the mushrooms. Her own defense admitted she lied.

Imagine if your toddler ate a handful of your antidepressants and you were so “panicked” that you told the emergency professionals that it was aspirin and you don’t have any antidepressants. Would anyone be so afraid that they’d be willing to let their child die rather than tell the truth?

In this case there’s growing evidence of lies being told to pretty much everyone. Erin even told one interviewer that she brought in a sample of the lunch which wasn’t true! What was the point of that one? Mind boggling!

Erin told doctor she'd brought lunch leftovers to hospital, court hears​

By Judd Boaz​

Professor Stuart says she then asked about any remains from the lunch.

"Did you ask her specifically about any leftovers of the meal?" prosecutor Sarah Lenthall says.

"Yes I did ask her that ... she did say there were some leftovers she put in a bag in the rubbish bin," Professor Stuart says.

"She also mentioned that she'd brought some leftovers into the emergency department, but there was no evidence to me that there were leftovers in the emergency department."

She says after the interview, she checked with medical staff and learned Erin's blood work had come back looking fine and showing no ill health.

Mushroom expert quizzed on death cap identification in Erin Patterson trial — as it happened

An internationally recognised fungi expert has given evidence in the trial of Erin Patterson, who is accused of murdering three relatives with a poisoned beef Wellington meal. Look back at how the day unfolded in our live blog.

www.abc.net.au

 

[SouthAussie]

Dr Rogers said in March, April and May 2023, Erin began posting messages in the true crime Facebook page – earlier mentioned in the opening – about dehydrating mushrooms.
“She shared that she’d purchased a food dehydrator and posted a few messages and photos about it in the chat, including a photograph of the dehydrator sitting on her kitchen bench,” Dr Rogers said.

She apparently did not purchase the Sunbeam dehydrator until 28th April. So she either had a different one before that, or used a different method to dehydrate mushrooms before that (mushrooms can be dehydrated in an oven).


Arrange the mushrooms on drying screens and place in the oven. Prop open the oven door with a wooden spoon to vent steam. Dehydrate until leathery, 2 to 3 hours
Dried Mushrooms Recipe

April 28
The prosecution says Erin's mobile phone data suggests she travels to Loch before returning to Korumburra.
Two and a half hours later, Erin allegedly purchases a Sunbeam food lab electronic dehydrator from a Leongatha store.
The key people, timeline and evidence in Erin Patterson's mushroom murder trial

 

[Bats]

The issue is that they didn't start treatment earlier because no one except Erin knew that the mushrooms were foraged

Is that your opinion or a fact? I haven't been able to find any information that says the antidote was delayed because the information was incorrect about where the mushrooms came from. Happy to be corrected though!

The is no risk of Amatoxin Poisonings with mushrooms from supermarket or Chinese grocers because Commercial mushrooms are grown in huge warehouses

Then why did the doctors administer an amanita antidote, if there was no risk?

If it wasn't intentional, I imagine she would have described to her guests how she'd put so much effort into foraging for local mushrooms for the dish

I'll remember to tell my dinner guests that the potatoes are home grown, the eggs were sourced from my sister's hen, the meat was sourced from the butcher down the road etc...

 

[SouthAussie]

I haven't been able to find any information that says the antidote was delayed because the information was incorrect about where the mushrooms came from.

Then why did the doctors administer an amanita antidote, if there was no risk?

It sounds as if they might have believed her lies about an Asian grocery store.
Doctors go a lot on what people tell them. They believe them, in the absence of other information.

I am not sure when the Asian grocery store was first mentioned. I know Erin told her brother-in-law about it on Monday 31st.

Doctor ordered death cap mushroom antidote two days after lunch, court hears​

By 6.30am the following day – 31st July – Morgan advised Dr Mark Douglas that Don’s condition had worsened and Gail was showing “similar progress”.

Douglas, who was on call, advised Morgan to immediately administer silibinin – the antidote to death cap mushroom poisoning.

Arriving at Dandenong hospital, Douglas says he reviewed Don in the intensive care unit.
Under questioning by Nanette Rogers SC, Douglas confirms Don was conscious at this point.

Douglas recalls a conversation with medical staff who said the mushrooms in the beef wellington meal consumed by Don were from an Asian grocer.

Don was then sedated to allow for incubation so he could be transferred to the Austin hospital which has a major toxicology unit, Douglas says.
Gail was later also transferred to the Austin hospital, the court hears.

Erin Patterson trial day seven – as it happened

This blog is now closed

www.theguardian.com

 

[Tutter]

Is that your opinion or a fact? I haven't been able to find any information that says the antidote was delayed because the information was incorrect about where the mushrooms came from. Happy to be corrected though!


Then why did the doctors administer an amanita antidote, if there was no risk?


I'll remember to tell my dinner guests that the potatoes are home grown, the eggs were sourced from my sister's hen, the meat was sourced from the butcher down the road etc...

 

[Tutter]

None of those things have poisonous varieties though. I would want to know if you home canned something, because if you didn’t do it correctly, botulism can harm you. I might choose not to eat something home canned or self picked in the wild. ( garden is different). Imo.

 

[Deleted member 363451]

The issue is that they didn't start treatment earlier because no one except Erin knew that the mushrooms were foraged.

The is no risk of Amatoxin Poisonings with mushrooms from supermarket or Chinese grocers because Commercial mushrooms are grown in huge warehouses. Deathcaps cannot be propagated because they rely on the roots of Oak trees.

Copying this over from the previous thread -
It's been reported that Erin was an experienced forager and that the family foraged together:

A family friend reported that Erin Patterson was known to be good at foraging wild mushrooms, and that the Patterson family would “pick mushrooms together each year when they were in season”

If it wasn't intentional, I imagine she would have described to her guests how she'd put so much effort into foraging for local mushrooms for the dish. There'd be no reason to hide it, her family would be excited about eating the locally hand picked delights.
Likewise, when the guests presented to hospital the morning after the lunch, they'd have reported to hospital staff that there were locally foraged mushrooms in the dish.

As Deathcaps are known to grow locally in the area (and cannot be cultivated), then amatoxin poisoning from foraged mushrooms would be seen as an immediate possibility - it wouldn't require waiting to hear Erin's lies about where the mushrooms came from and they'd be able to begin preventative treatment in case amatoxins had been ingested, instead of waiting for signs of metabolic acidosis and starting the treatment WAY too late.

Early treatment is critical, that's why - As soon as amatoxin was suggested by the toxicologist as a possibility - they wanted to immediately start the kids on preventative liver treatment - even though they didn't have symptoms.

Evil is unspectacular and always human,
And shares our bed and eats at our own table.
W. H. Auden

 

[Kemug]

Are there going to be any character references, people to attest to her nice nature, and how she couldn't possibly have done what she is accused of?

 

[MrJ]

I wonder when the trial starts today, or is it starting back up today? Usually it starts around 10 am IIRC (edit: ABC live blog is now up)

 

[MsMarple]

Erin Patterson's phone recorded in areas near death caps, court hears — as it happened

More witnesses will give testimony at Erin Patterson's murder trial at the Latrobe Valley Law Courts in Morwell. She accused of murdering three relatives by serving them a beef Wellington meal that contained poisonous mushrooms. Follow the trial in our live blog.

www.abc.net.au

Erin Patterson murder trial day 14 – as it happened

This blog is now closed

www.theguardian.com

 

[MsMarple]

Erin Patterson murder trial day 14 – as it happened

This blog is now closed

www.theguardian.com

3m ago11.15 AEST
The jurors have entered the court room in Morwell.

The prosecution calls their next witness, Christine McKenzie.

3m ago11.15 AEST
McKenzie is a retired pharmacist, the court hears.

For the past 17 years of her career she worked as a senior poisons information specialist at the Victorian Poisons Information Centre.

McKenzie worked at the centre from 2006, the court hears.

 

[MsMarple]

Erin Patterson's phone recorded in areas near death caps, court hears — as it happened

More witnesses will give testimony at Erin Patterson's murder trial at the Latrobe Valley Law Courts in Morwell. She accused of murdering three relatives by serving them a beef Wellington meal that contained poisonous mushrooms. Follow the trial in our live blog.

www.abc.net.au

1m ago

Technical difficulties to start the morning in Morwell​

By Judd Boaz​

A livestream set up for members of the media is currently down as the first witness takes the stand.

ABC reporter Sacha Payne is at the courts in Morwell however, and brings us the latest.

The week's first witness is Christine McKenzie, a former Senior Poisons information specialist at the Victorian Poisons Information Centre.

 

[MsMarple]

Poisons hotline explained to court​

By Judd Boaz​

Ms McKenzie explains the process of taking a call at the Victorian Poisons Information Centre.

She uses the example of a toddler who may have accidentally ingested a mushroom.

Ms McKenzie says she developed an algorithm with mycologist Tom May (who we heard from last week) which helps them assess calls regarding fungi and what advice to give.

 

[MsMarple]

Erin Patterson murder trial day 14 – as it happened

This blog is now closed

www.theguardian.com

2m ago02.24 BST
McKenzie says in her role she answered calls from members of the public and professionals regarding ingestion of a range of poisonous substances including fungi.

She tells the court what her role involved when someone calls the help line:

We need to ascertain the circumstances, for instance it might be a toddler who has a nibble of a little brown mushroom and nothing more.

She says if someone has symptoms, it becomes more urgent to identify the fungi.

McKenzie says she was “fascinated by the world of fungi” and did extra reading on the topic.

She says in her work, it was important to be able to quickly identify the most poisonous fungi.

 

[MsMarple]

Erin Patterson's phone recorded in areas near death caps, court hears — as it happened

More witnesses will give testimony at Erin Patterson's murder trial at the Latrobe Valley Law Courts in Morwell. She accused of murdering three relatives by serving them a beef Wellington meal that contained poisonous mushrooms. Follow the trial in our live blog.

www.abc.net.au

Fungi expert discusses death cap mushrooms​

By Judd Boaz​

Ms McKenzie says the most important thing from a VPIC point-of-view is being able to identify quickly the most toxic fungi and says the death cap mushroom is the fungi which has caused the most deaths in Australia.

The court hears the mushroom is usually present between March and May each year in Victoria, if the temperature and moisture is right.

 

[MsMarple]

1m ago

Witness finds and reports death cap to website​

By Judd Boaz​

The prosecution raises the website iNaturalist, which as we've heard several times in this trial is a citizen science site dedicated to logging observations of flora and fungi.

Ms McKenzie confirms she has an account on the site, and confirms she made two observations of death cap mushrooms.

The second of her observations was in Loch, dated to April 18, 2023.

She says while out for a walk with her husband, she had seen and photographed death caps under an oak tree.

Key Event
1m ago

Fungi expert tried to remove death caps in Loch​

By Judd Boaz​

Ms McKenzie tells the court she took photos of the death caps and then attempted to pick and remove all the mushrooms she could see.

She says due to her training, she was aware of their toxicity and was keen to remove them for safety.

Prosecutor Jane Warren asks Ms McKenzie if there was a risk that more could grow in the same area, and Ms Mckenzie says there was