Australia - 3 dead after eating wild mushrooms, Leongatha, Victoria, Aug 2023 #10 *Arrest*

[MsMarple]

1m ago22.02 EDT
The jurors have entered the courtroom in Morwell.

Patterson’s lawyer, Colin Mandy SC, is continuing to cross-examine Detective Leading Senior Constable Stephen Eppingstall, the officer in charge of the investigation into the lethal lunch.

 

[HoneyBunOne]

That's what I was getting at. She's claiming to be poor yet willing to spend so much on delivery food.

I'm not sure she ever did claim to be poor did she?

She complained about phone prices, expensive beef wellington (which she chose to serve), school fees & minimal child support. The government takes into consideration custody amounts per parent and parental earnings to come up with this figure. Unless there was some hiding of money or assets on Simon's part ( which I am not alleging), then it was deemed that $40 per month was accurate. It shows she must have had extensive earnings, despite not appearing to have a job. It's not uncommon for those with lots of money to be stingy. Not sure why, but it happens.

 

[MrJ]

5m ago
12.08 AEST
Mandy asks if Eppingstall obtained a “large number of receipts” from Booktopia as part of the investigation.

Eppingstall agrees he did find a large number of books related to diets.

Mandy turns to the “significant media interest” in the case. He says from 1 August 2023, the police media unit were “briefed and holding lines were prepared”.

Eppingstall says holding lines are “short blurbs that go out to [the] media” to let the public know basic details of an incident. He says: "It’s a very generic statement."

 

[LinasK]

I'm not sure she ever did claim to be poor did she?

She complained about phone prices, expensive beef wellington (which she chose to serve), school fees & minimal child support. The government takes into consideration custody amounts per parent and parental earnings to come up with this figure. Unless there was some hiding of money or assets on Simon's part ( which I am not alleging), then it was deemed that $40 per month was accurate. It shows she must have had extensive earnings, despite not appearing to have a job. It's not uncommon for those with lots of money to be stingy. Not sure why, but it happens.

But if you're stingy, you aren't splurging on takeout meals. That's my point. I get delivery food, but I wouldn't ever spend $25/person on that kind of food. That's how much my Mother's Day Brunch cost in an expensive restaurant. Like you said- there are cheaper options for food.

 

[MrJ]

1m ago 12.15 AEST
Mandy asks Eppingstall about Patterson’s Bendigo Bank records he obtained during the investigation.

He shows one record for purchase in Glen Waverley.

Mandy says:

These are examples of the sorts of information available from the bank records.

Eppingstall says:

Yes, sir.

He confirms no bank records were obtained for the time period prior to 1 July 2023.

He says he does not recall seeing records from other banks.

 

[Two SCents]

I am trying to keep an open mind (which isn't easy with all the lies she's told) but possibly at this stage things didn't point to the lunch yet (as far as I know the 4 lunch guests also shared a dinner the night prior to the lunch). But yes, seeing that Erin said she was unwell overnight, the road trip on the next day and feeding her children the 'left overs' doesn't make sense at all.

I'm also trying to keep an open mind until we've heard it all, not easy is it?

The lunch wasn't suspected until the medical staff recognised through test results that they weren't dealing with a gastro type infection. This was late in the day on Sunday.
Simon's sister or cousin said he called her about her parents being taken to hospital and during the phone call he said to her Erin is soldiering on at home.
Erin and Simon's son said Erin didn't want to go to church, but thought it ok to go to flying lessons as there would be less people. That could be taken to mean less chance of infecting others with a gastro infection.
During Sunday it appears it was thought to be a gastro infection by everyone who attended the lunch even if we don't believe Erin.

Just editing to add....This doesn't fit with intent to poison I know, but feeding the children leftovers would be a perfectly reasonable thing to do if you thought you had gastro as opposed to food poisoning.

 

[Walk A Mile]

Having assets, getting an inheritance, or even having a decent income doesn’t always mean someone’s got their finances sorted—or has much spare cash to throw around.

Someone might have a house, or even a few, or maybe they’re on a decent wage, but if they’re drowning in debt, living above their means, or just not great with money, it doesn’t mean they’re actually wealthy in a day-to-day sense.

She might be asset rich and cash poor.

 

[MsMarple]

Defence cross-examines police witness in Erin Patterson trial — as it happened

Erin Patterson is accused of murdering three of her relatives by serving them a beef Wellington lunch which contained death cap mushrooms. Follow the trial live.

www.abc.net.au

Key Event
2m ago

Bank records and phone records​

By Mikaela Ortolan​

Mr Mandy asks a few questions about Erin's bank records which were collected between July 1 and August 4, 2023.

The detective says he can't explain why police didn't collect records prior to July 1.

Mr Mandy highlights a few transactions which suggest some flaws in both of Erin's children's recollection of events during their interview with police.

We're now looking at Simon Patterson's phone which was handed into police during the investigation and later handed back to him.

LSC Eppingstall says Mr Patterson mentioned he had changed his handset at some stage.

Key Event
7m ago

The jury is in​

By Mikaela Ortolan​

LSC Eppingstall is back on the stand.

He's being questioned by defence lawyer Colin Mandy SC.

Mr Mandy is moving through his line of questioning quite quickly, touching on a number of topics.

He asks about a number of Booktopia book receipts that the detective says he's seen that relate to diet books purchased by Erin.

He then touches on the media's interest in the case. LSC Eppingstall confirms on August 6, the media and the wider public were informed that the Homicide Squad was involved in the investigation.

 

[MrJ]

Key Event
3m ago
Bank records and phone records
Mikaela Ortolan profile image
By Mikaela Ortolan

Mr Mandy asks a few questions about Erin's bank records which were collected between July 1 and August 4, 2023.

The detective says he can't explain why police didn't collect records prior to July 1.

Mr Mandy highlights a few transactions which suggest some flaws in both of Erin's children's recollection of events during their interview with police.

We're now looking at Simon Patterson's phone which was handed into police during the investigation and later handed back to him.

LSC Eppingstall says Mr Patterson mentioned he had changed his handset at some stage.

Defence cross-examines police witness in Erin Patterson trial — as it happened

Erin Patterson is accused of murdering three of her relatives by serving them a beef Wellington lunch which contained death cap mushrooms. Follow the trial live.

www.abc.net.au

 

[LinasK]

I'm also trying to keep an open mind until we've heard it all, not easy is it?

The lunch wasn't suspected until the medical staff recognised through test results that they weren't dealing with a gastro type infection. This was late in the day on Sunday.
Simon's sister or cousin said he called her about her parents being taken to hospital and during the phone call he said to her Erin is soldiering on at home.
Erin and Simon's son said Erin didn't want to go to church, but thought it ok to go to flying lessons as there would be less people. That could be taken to mean less chance of infecting others with a gastro infection.
During Sunday it appears it was thought to be a gastro infection by everyone who attended the lunch even if we don't believe Erin.

Yes, but if you have diarrhea, no matter the cause, you aren't taking a 3 hour car ride, wearing light colored pants and consuming things like hotdogs, chili, or coffee.

 

[HoneyBunOne]

But if you're stingy, you aren't splurging on takeout meals. That's my point. I get delivery food, but I wouldn't ever spend $25/person on that kind of food. That's how much my Mother's Day Brunch cost in an expensive restaurant. Like you said- there are cheaper options for food.

I'm not debating you, just offering a different perspective.

Sometimes people can be stingy about certain things, at certain times. Things they don't want to be paying lots of money for (a replacement phone, beef wellington - even though by choice). It's complex. For example:

In Australia, we'd love to pay $25 for an expensive restaurant meal on a special occasion day (Christmas, Mother's day etc). I paid $99 for a high tea on Mother's Day, yet I consider myself somewhat stingy. That amount usually covers a meal for my family out at a budget/average restaurant. The reason? It was a splurge for a special occasion, I can afford it, it was the going rate (we shopped around), and we wanted to take my elderly mother out for a fancy one-off type event. Yet the very next day I can be shopping around, comparing 2 pairs of pants and choosing the cheaper one just because it's cheaper. Or putting an item back because it's expensive - to me - for what it is. Or comparing flights and accommodation so I can save a small amount, just because it's a better deal. I generally like value for money and my pricing seems to be stuck in the 90's.

 

[TootsieFootsie]

Defence cross-examines police witness in Erin Patterson trial — as it happened

Erin Patterson is accused of murdering three of her relatives by serving them a beef Wellington lunch which contained death cap mushrooms. Follow the trial live.

www.abc.net.au

We're now looking at Simon Patterson's phone which was handed into police during the investigation and later handed back to him.

LSC Eppingstall says Mr Patterson mentioned he had changed his handset at some stage.


Wow so Simon changed his phone!

 

[Two SCents]

Yes, but if you have diarrhea, no matter the cause, you aren't taking a 3 hour car ride, wearing light colored pants and consuming things like hotdogs, chili, or coffee.

If I had been to the toilet 10 times in the early morning as stated by her daughter and the trip for the flying lesson wasn't until 2.30pm - I might. I can't assume anything about the light coloured pants, she seemed to wear them frequently. We know she drank coffee and claims she had cereal at dinner time, we don't know who ate the other food items.

 

[Yh5r]

But if you're stingy, you aren't splurging on takeout meals. That's my point. I get delivery food, but I wouldn't ever spend $25/person on that kind of food. That's how much my Mother's Day Brunch cost in an expensive restaurant. Like you said- there are cheaper options for food.

$82 is not that expensive at all for the amount of food ordered given the prices in Australia. Even from the supermarket, it would still cost half of that most likely.
I don't think it has anything to do with the case anyway how much she did or did not spend on take away.

 

[MrJ]

1m ago
Simon Patterson's text messages downloaded

By Mikaela Ortolan

We're looking closely at the extraction of Simon Patterson's phone.

LSC Eppingstall says he only requested a limited extraction, seeking just the messages on Simon's phone.

While he doesn't have the exact number, he accepts that there were about 280 messages between Erin and Simon that were downloaded during that extraction.

 

[Kemug]

If at

A person lies to cover the truth, there appears to be a lot of lies told by the Defendant. Panic, or self preservation?

If at first you don't succeed, lie, lie, lie again.

 

[Yh5r]

Y

If I had been to the toilet 10 times in the early morning as stated by her daughter and the trip for the flying lesson wasn't until 2.30pm - I might. I can't assume anything about the light coloured pants, she seemed to wear them frequently.

I agree. Often food poisoning type symptoms like diarrohea and vomiting come on strong and feel totally awful but disappear quickly. The light coloured pants were just her personal preference. Neither of these things necessarily point to guilt IMO.

What is certainly very odd is that she didn't get anywhere near as sick as her guests and this leaves a huge question mark.

 

[Kemug]

And

She was more concerned about driving her son to flying lessons that day.

And not pooing her cream pants.

 

[LinasK]

If I had been to the toilet 10 times in the early morning as stated by her daughter and the trip for the flying lesson wasn't until 2.30pm - I might. I can't assume anything about the light coloured pants, she seemed to wear them frequently. We know she drank coffee and claims she had cereal at dinner time, we don't know who ate the other food items.

Coffee tends to be acidic. That's the very last thing you'd want to consume if you have diarhhea. I'd agree if it was Ginger Ale we were talking. And if you think you might be prone to have an accident. why not wear blue jeans instead?

 

[LinasK]

Y

I agree. Often food poisoning type symptoms like diarrohea and vomiting come on strong and feel totally awful but disappear quickly. The light coloured pants were just her personal preference. Neither of these things necessarily point to guilt IMO.

What is certainly very odd is that she didn't get anywhere near as sick as her guests and this leaves a huge question mark.

It's all of these pieces put together that tell me she didn't really have diarhhea.