Australia - 3 dead after eating wild mushrooms, Leongatha, Victoria, Aug 2023 #11 *Arrest*

[LinasK]

For me: It’s the fact that when in hospital Erin was doing wees in the toilet pan and told the nurse they were poos, when they were wees, which makes me suspicious that she didn’t have gastro.

And then all of the food purchased on the way to her son’s flying lesson was another tell.

I think the medical tests will demonstrate that Erin was clinically well, apart from her blood pressure that slowly came back into a normal range.

She did get herself some fentanyl by giving a subjective self-identified headache rating of 8 or 7 out of 10: I imagine the unnecessary consumption of such a strong drug would have been a welcome break and reprise from her own disordered thoughts!! IMO

One certainly seems to know how to use the medical system to one’s advantage when one puts their mind to it. IMO

But Erin’s already admitted there were Death Caps in the meal when she gave evidence today, right?

Fentanyl for a headache??? You don't hear of that being prescribed in the US for that reason. I get bad migraines and yes there are prescription drugs stronger than Excedrin that are available- but not Fentanyl. Fentanyl is an extremely strong narcotic. I was given it once in a hospital for a procedure. I was euphoric and vomited for hours after.

 

[whiskia]

What's been implied by her testimony today, I think what they are trying to suggest is:

- she did a lot of foraging as a matter of course.

- she did a lot of dehydrating mushrooms as a matter of course.

- at some point she did pick mushrooms from near an oak tree and these were dehydrated and stored.

- she was in the habit of storing her wild dehydrated mushrooms in a tupperware box and then sprinkling them into things; that box (multiple boxes) would contain a mix of different dehydrated wild mushrooms gathered previously at a range of times.

- for the meal her intention was to use fresh mushrooms from woollies and dried mushrooms from an Asian store. And that this is also what she believed she had done.

- when she purchased the dried asian mushrooms they were smelly so she stored them in a tupperware.

- implication is that she used the fresh mushrooms from woollies as planned, went to grab the dried shop bought ones from the tupperware, confused it with one of her many other tupperwares full of dried mushrooms (or perhaps had stored them all together), inadvertently introduced death caps accidentally foraged at a previous date into the meal unbeknownst to her.

- she then vomits up her meal AND/OR as she is adding dried mushrooms randomly from multiple tuppers, she just happens not to get dosed.

Does it do enough of a job at introducing reasonable doubt? It actually does a pretty good job, imo. After that you are left with explaining her behaviour in the wake of the dinner, which is largely circumstantial actions or could be attributed to guilt.

Do i personally buy it? On balance, I don't. But it's good enough to give me pause, and that's all the defense needs.

100% agree. It is flimsy++ but it may sound plausible to one of the jurors and that is all she needs.
Very interested to hear her spin on the post poisoning story.
I find it gob smacking that someone could lie so much and so comprehensively!!

 

[Jess D]

What's scary to me is that Erin comes across as a truly fixated individual. Fixated on perceived slights. Fixated on specific incidents that Simon and his family forgot long ago. Fixated on people like Simon and his family when they don't react the way she wants them to. Fixated on the relationship, even when they're separated. It's terrifying.

If she wanted to keep going to all of Simon's family's events, then she should have stayed with him! Under the circumstances, his parents were nothing but kind and supportive to her and look how she repaid them.

 

[whiskia]

I agree. I don't see any tears in the pre-arrest footage - just a lot of eye rubbing.

MOO

Maybe she'd googled bulimia and was making sure the finger evidence wasn't going to be missed...

 

[Jess D]

I knew <well I was pretty sure> she had bulimia because she had those marks on her fingers “Russell’s Sign,” a pattern of calluses on the knuckles or back of the hand due to frequent purging (via self-induced vomiting) over a long period of time.

At the time when I noticed this, I spoke to some women who had gone through bulimia and they recognised the marks on Erin’s hands and knew what they were, and I had discussed those stills of the media videos that showed Erin’s hands and fingers with them, and the women who had the personal knowledge of bulimia and other sleuths and I went back and forth analysing them and discussing what they meant.

Photos can be found in this article, with the marks circled and written about:

Eerie detail in photo of mushroom cook that no one noticed until now

A strange detail on mushroom chef Erin Patterson's hands shows two injuries to the middle finger of her right hand, a cut below the knuckle and an abrasion on the finger's nail bed.

www.dailymail.co.uk

Article Credit: Candace Sutton / DMA

The article states
“The more serious-looking injury is situated below the knuckle of her middle right finger.”

“The second injury is around the region of the nail bed of the same finger.”


I know Erin would think no one else knew she had bulimia, and divided this to the court as some type of hidden secret, but once she became infamous, people online started to pay attention to everything she said or did, and in particular the way she looked.

How does the bulimia tie in with the case?

Well, I want to say that Erin was obsessed with mushrooms and also that obsessed with food in general, and her many diet book purchases speak to this obsession, as does the fact that the allegedly texted her friend that she “puts mushrooms in everything.” <Paraphrased.>

I’ve read that many people with eating disorders are actually obsessed with food and that forms a part of their illness.

I think the food dehydrator was just another arm
or tool of her unhealthy obsession with food, of her alleged eating disorder.

But what if the alleged eating disorder grew legs and she started wanting to control or poison what other people ate?

Now it’s no longer bulimia: It’s an eating disorder on steroids. IMO.

I was wondering what that mark on the back of her hand was.

 

[LinasK]

I think the dumping of the dehydrator and the lies to Police will be blamed on panic. They're the few things that were admitted by Erin's defence team. Lying doesn't mean you're a murderer, is what they're underlining there.

The defence may have other reasons why the phones were reset. Though, they don't need to have any reason really. Frankly, I think they're using the prosecution's evidence to bamboozle the jury with possibilities. I reckon when the jury are deliberating there'll be at least a half day in working out the phones and sims and at some point they'll ask themselves "and what was the point in us doing this again?" If there's a couple of "tech challenged" people in the jury they'll be lost after "Phone A" is mentioned.

The bamboozling tactic worked with me!

Panic behavior is usually a sign of guilt- like fleeing a scene, not crying at a funeral...At minimum she feared being charged with manslaughter. But I think the alleged poisonings were intentional and she still held rage at Simon and his family.

 

[SouthAussie]

"The Victorian mother accused of murdering three of her in-laws with a poisoned beef Wellington dish is poised to continue giving evidence when her trial resumes on Wednesday, after new details on the fatal lunch were revealed.

For the last two days, Erin Patterson, 50, has been giving her own version of events as to what happened on July 29, 2023 telling the court on Tuesday she accepted there had to have been poisonous mushrooms in the beef wellington she served, and that dried mushrooms used in its creation had sat in her pantry for months due to their “pungent” aroma.

The final question Ms Patterson was asked of the day was if she had a memory of putting wild mushrooms in May or June 2023 into a container that already contained mushrooms

“Yes, I did do that,” she said.

The trial continues."

https://www.goldcoastbulletin.com.au/news/breaking-news/erin-patterson-trial-mushroom-cook-set-to-return-to-witness-box-for-third-day-of-giving-evidence/news-story/3a869e4f6e5e7449cd22c99c9c021b4a

 

[LinasK]

What's been implied by her testimony today, I think what they are trying to suggest is:

- she did a lot of foraging as a matter of course.

- she did a lot of dehydrating mushrooms as a matter of course.

- at some point she did pick mushrooms from near an oak tree and these were dehydrated and stored.

- she was in the habit of storing her wild dehydrated mushrooms in a tupperware box and then sprinkling them into things; that box (multiple boxes) would contain a mix of different dehydrated wild mushrooms gathered previously at a range of times.

- for the meal her intention was to use fresh mushrooms from woollies and dried mushrooms from an Asian store. And that this is also what she believed she had done.

- when she purchased the dried asian mushrooms they were smelly so she stored them in a tupperware.

- implication is that she used the fresh mushrooms from woollies as planned, went to grab the dried shop bought ones from the tupperware, confused it with one of her many other tupperwares full of dried mushrooms (or perhaps had stored them all together), inadvertently introduced death caps accidentally foraged at a previous date into the meal unbeknownst to her.

- she then vomits up her meal AND/OR as she is adding dried mushrooms randomly from multiple tuppers, she just happens not to get dosed.

Does it do enough of a job at introducing reasonable doubt? It actually does a pretty good job, imo. After that you are left with explaining her behaviour in the wake of the dinner, which is largely circumstantial actions or could be attributed to guilt.

Do i personally buy it? On balance, I don't. But it's good enough to give me pause, and that's all the defense needs.

It's not reasonable to me.

 

[southgoldengirl]

Neither Erin nor her defence have blamed an Asian grocer.

From the outset they have said it was a tragic accident.

So what is her defense of how the Death Caps made there way into the BW that she cooked and served?

 

[LinasK]

So what is her defense of how the Death Caps made there way into the BW that she cooked and served?

Sounds like she's blaming the mystery Asian grocer and that she mixed up the ones she foraged with the ones she supposedly bought there.

 

[tmar]

Just catching up with this thread. I'm glad she took to the stand, it confirmed what an awful person she is. Not that we didn't know that already.

She has been telling lies to people around her for some time, getting away with it. Now trying this at the hospital, with Police, and now in court.
Hope this comes back to bite her.

 

[SouthAussie]

Neither Erin nor her defence have blamed an Asian grocer.

From the outset they have said it was a tragic accident.

It is possible that Ms Cripps is going to be among the growing number of witnesses whose recollections don't match Erin's current story.

imo


Ms Cripps was questioned about what Ms Patterson told her about the mushrooms used in the beef wellington lunch.

She told the jury that Ms Patterson said she used fresh mushrooms from Woolworths and dried mushrooms purchased from an Asian grocer.

“She said she read the ones she got from the Asian grocer would add a nice flavour,” Ms Cripps said.

Ms Cripps said Ms Patterson described rehydrating the dried mushrooms, chopping them up and mixing them with the fresh mushrooms.

Ms Patterson described the mushrooms as coming in a bag that was not resealable and had a white label, Ms Cripps said.

https://www.news.com.au/national/victoria/courts-law/erin-patterson-trial-alleged-mushroom-poisoner-was-ill-intensive-care-specialist-tells-court/news-story/2a1417ea5465148399f0c13da4735ad2

 

[LinasK]

It is possible that Ms Cripps is going to be among the growing number of witnesses whose recollections don't match Erin's current story.

imo


Ms Cripps was questioned about what Ms Patterson told her about the mushrooms used in the beef wellington lunch.

She told the jury that Ms Patterson said she used fresh mushrooms from Woolworths and dried mushrooms purchased from an Asian grocer.

“She said she read the ones she got from the Asian grocer would add a nice flavour,” Ms Cripps said.

Ms Cripps said Ms Patterson described rehydrating the dried mushrooms, chopping them up and mixing them with the fresh mushrooms.

Ms Patterson described the mushrooms as coming in a bag that was not resealable and had a white label, Ms Cripps said.

https://www.news.com.au/national/victoria/courts-law/erin-patterson-trial-alleged-mushroom-poisoner-was-ill-intensive-care-specialist-tells-court/news-story/2a1417ea5465148399f0c13da4735ad2

This just sounds sketchy. I hope that the authority who inspected the Asian markets or the grocers themselves testify that not only are Death Caps not sold, but that you wouldn't use hand-written little white labels on them.

 

[Cedars]

Sounds like she's blaming the mystery Asian grocer and that she mixed up the ones she foraged with the ones she supposedly bought there.

That might be credible if she herself got sick from the meal. IMO, the most damning evidence was how only her guests - people we know she didn't like - got desperately ill and she and her children did not.

JMO

 

[LinasK]

That might be credible if she herself got sick from the meal. IMO, the most damning evidence was how only her guests - people we know she didn't like - got desperately ill and she and her children did not.

She's counting on convincing the jury that she had explosive diarrhea from the meal that she controlled by just sitting in a car to "cork" it. Or that she had bulemia and threw up the toxins- which KatyDid looked up and it can't be done. If anything gave her diarrhea- it'd be consuming chili, coffee, and hotdogs.

 

[Jess D]

Sounds like she's blaming the mystery Asian grocer and that she mixed up the ones she foraged with the ones she supposedly bought there.

 

[browneyes]

Erin is gliding right now. The prosecution will remind the jury of the testimony of Ian Wilkinson, the medical staff who described the absolutely tortuous illness and death of her guests, her lies to the medical staff, her lie to persuade her guests to come for lunch, the video of her disposing of the dehydrator, and her infamous gas station stop. This pity party will end soon with the reemergence of the devastating truth. The cross examination and closings will seal her fate, IMO.

 

[MrJ]

Good morning. I will have the ABC live blog updates posted here as soon as they come in. Just over twenty minutes away from more EP witness testimony. I have to admit I'm quite excited to read more of I'm sure what will be a growing number of lies.

Erin Patterson says estranged husband asked her about poisoning his parents — as it happened

Erin Patterson is giving evidence for a third day in her triple-murder trial in Morwell. She's accused of murdering three relatives by serving them a meal that contained poisonous mushrooms. Look back at how Wednesday's hearing unfolded in our live blog.

www.abc.net.au

 

[MrJ]

Key Event
17m ago

What we learnt so far from Erin Patterson's testimony​

By Tim Callanan​

Wednesday will be Erin Patterson's third day on the witness stand as she continues to answer questions from her defence lawyer Colin Mandy SC.

Here are some key things we've learned from her testimony so far:

Key things we learnt from Erin Patterson's testimony in her murder trial​

 

[Jess D]

Erin is gliding right now. The prosecution will remind the jury of the testimony of Ian Wilkinson, the medical staff who described the absolutely tortuous illness and death of her guests, her lies to the medical staff, her lie to persuade her guests to come for lunch, the video of her disposing of the dehydrator, and her infamous gas station stop. This pity party will end soon with the reemergence of the devastating truth. The cross examination and closings will seal her fate, IMO.

I saw a video on Tik Tok last night of Colin Manday S.C. He looks very confident...