Australia - 3 dead after eating wild mushrooms, Leongatha, Victoria, Aug 2023 #11 *Arrest*

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  • #321
"I had been fighting a never-ending battle of low self-esteem most of my adult life.

Aha!

"Narcissistic individuals are actually really hamstrung by insecurity and shame, and their entire life is an attempt to regulate their image," says Ramani Durvasula, a licenced clinical psychologist and professor at California State University, Los Angeles. "Narcissism has never been about self-love – it is almost entirely about self-loathing." [bbm]

It's long been established that there are two types of narcissists: "vulnerable" ones, who have low self-esteem and crave affirmation, and "grandiose" ones, who have a genuinely overinflated sense of self.


 
  • #322
Key Event
1m ago
Erin and Simon's tensions

By Joseph Dunstan

Mr Mandy notes there were separations between 2009 and 2015 and asks how the children were managed during these times.

"I would say that even though obviously our relationship was struggling to cause a separation, it was really important to both of us to cooperate about [our son] and make it as easy on him as possible," she says.

She sighs afterwards, appearing distressed. Mr Mandy says there must have been "some tension" to cause the separations and asks what that was.

"Primarily what we struggled with over the entire course of our relationship ... it was, we just couldn't communicate well when we disagreed about something," she says.

"We could never communicate in a way that would make each of us feel heard and understood."
 
  • #323
Enough background already, cut to the chase!
 
  • #324
Key Event
1m ago
Court adjourns

By Joseph Dunstan

Mr Mandy asks if it's an appropriate time for the hearing to adjourn for the day.

Justice Beale agrees, and today's evidence comes to a close there.
 
  • #325
24 minutes ago

'Fighting a never-ending battle of low self-esteem': Erin details body image issues
Mr Mandy asks how Erin felt about herself.
“Physically, not good,” she said.
“I’d been fighting a never-ending battle of low self-esteem most of my adult life, and the further inroads I made into being middle aged, the less I felt good about myself.”
She said she put on more weight and was planning to have gastric bypass surgery.

Erin told the court she met Simon at Monash Council in the early 2000s, where she worked as an admin assistant for RSCPA which was contracted by the council, while her husband was a traffic engineer.
Asked how their relationship began, Erin said they had mutual friends and they spent time together with lunch or after work drinks.
She said they began dating in July 2005.

18 minutes ago

'I was trying to convert him to being an atheist': Erin on her early relationship with Simon
She said she met Simon’s parents in early 2005. Erin described herself as a “fundamentalist atheist” at that time, while Simon was Christian.
“We had a lot of conversations about life, religion, politics … and I was trying to convert him to being an atheist, but things happened in reverse, and I became a Christian,” she said.
She said she met his parents for the first time at Korumburra Baptist Church in early 2005.
“I remember being really excited about it, because I’d never been to a church service before I’d been to my sister’s wedding in a church that was it, and I was I was really looking forward to it,” she said.
She said she remembered Ian was preaching and there was a banner on the wall behind him.
“It could still be there now, but it said … faith, hope and love,” she said.
“Ian gave a sermon talking about that.”
She said a communion followed the service which she participated in.
Asked what impact the service had on her, Erin replied: “I had what, best can be described as, like a spiritual experience.”
She said she’d previously thought of religion as an “intellectual exercise” but the experience was different and she felt “quite overwhelmed” by it.

14 minutes ago

Erin and Simon enjoyed going camping together
Erin said she went on lots of weekend camping trips with Simon in 2005 which brought her closer to him.
“I remember (camping) was really important to Simon that year. He was concerned that he’d become too work focused … he wanted to make sure that he turned off, switched off, and relaxed over the weekend,” she said.
“I was always welcome and usually went.”
Simon was also a member of the Glen Eira Christian Community Church in Melbourne, which she attended a few times with him.
They also visited his parents several times that year, also going to Korumburra Baptist Church.
Erin said she also began attending bible study with Simon’s cousin and two of his school friends.
The pair became engaged in February 2007.

4 minutes ago

Erin's parents missed her wedding for Russian holiday
In 2006, she moved to a small town called near Korumburra.
At their wedding, Erin said she walked down the aisle by David Wilkinson – the son of Ian Wilkinson – because her own parents were “in Russia, on a train” at the time.
She said they had their honeymoon in Olinda but they were keen to do a trip around Australia.
They sold their belongings and bought a Nissan Patrol, first heading to Sydney before they “slowly meandered” their way across Australia.
The couple eventually settled in Perth towards the end of 2007.
“Simon was pretty keen to keep traveling, and I was pretty keen to stop for a while and put down roots. I was keen to start having babies, I guess, for one better way to phrase it, so we did,” she said.
Simon got a council job about 40 minutes south of Perth while Erin applied for university.
She said she fell pregnant in about March or April 2008 before their son was born in January the following year.


4:14 PM

'I had no idea what to do with a baby': Accused grateful for in-laws' help
During the first few weeks of their son’s life, Erin said Simon’s parents came over to meet him.
She said they were living in a small flat at the time, so they decided to rent a place down south where they stayed with Don and Gail for about a week.
“I remember being really relieved that Gail was there, because I felt really out of my depth. I had no idea what to do with a baby, and I was not confident, and she was really supportive and gentle and patient with me,” she said.
She said Gail gave her good advice about the baby.
“You know you don’t have to stick to this timetable, this schedule. Just relax and enjoy your baby,” she said.

 
  • #326
also she's discharged herself against medical advice at least twice now! Really, she would not do well working in the hospital system. (yes I'm aware not all nurses work in the hospital system, but you have to work there as a student and you pretty much always have to do at least a year after graduating, typically...) The way she sees the world is very atypical, I think. The way she thinks she should still be a part of her exes family; the way she thinks she knows better than medical professionals (yet apparently wants to be one?) Such an odd person, IMO

Also they first separated for the first time after their son was born. It feels like they've been separate more than together over all! And overall, quite an unstable relationship. Why get so pissy about 'separated' on the tax return then?

They are 'humanising' her, on her own terms. Trying to have her judged less harshly.

imo

I agree. Its making me like her even less but I guess its not about me or what I think, its about if its working on the jury
 
  • #327
They are 'humanising' her, on her own terms. Trying to have her judged less harshly.

imo

Yep, and let's see what the prosecution does about that without appearing to be bullying this poor Christian soul.

Frankly, I'm surprised that she elected to take the stand. Maybe Mandy has told her that it would be good to shed a few tears along the way.
 
  • #328
3m ago07.15 BST
Court hears about the weeks after the birth of Patterson’s son

Patterson’s son was born in 2009, the court hears. She says the birth was “very traumatic” and an emergency cesarean was performed.

Patterson appears to become emotional as she recalls the birth.

She says her son was in the neonatal ICU ward during the hospital admission. Patterson says when medical staff said her son could be discharged, they wanted her to remain in hospital for her recovery.

I remember having a conversation with Simon about it and I was really upset.
She says Simon told her: “You can just do it. Let’s just leave.”

Patterson then discharged herself against medical advice, the court hears.

She says after Don and Gail visited the young family in Perth a few weeks after their son was born.

She says Gail was “gentle and patient” with her and gave her advice about how to interpret her son’s cries.

 
  • #329
4m ago15.56 AEST
Patterson says when she first met Simon she was a “fundamentalist atheist”.

Patterson says on the trip in early 2005 she attended a church service at the Korumburra Baptist Church. She says it was the first church service she had attended.



Patterson says Ian Wilkinson was delivering the sermon.



She says in the first half of 2005, Patterson and Simon spent a lot of time going on camping groups with others. She says they became “a lot closer” during that time before they began dating in July 2005. She says:


We continued to do a lot of camping.

2m ago06.58 BST
Patterson and Simon married in 2007, court hears

Patterson and Simon were part of a bible study group, she says.

The pair were engaged in February 2007 and married in June 2007, the court hears.

Patterson says from 2006 to early 2007, she lived in a town near Korumburra. Simon lived in Melbourne at the time, the court hears.

Mandy asks if she had a lot to do with Don and Gail at the time.

She says:


I did. They would often invite me over for a meal. Probably almost monthly.

The spiritual experience must have worn off... 👿
 
  • #330
I'm so glad she elected to take the stand; now we will have pages upon pages of this thread analysing her statements, and I'm here for it.
Pretty sickened by her talking about Don and Gail helping her out with her newborn son, and she returns the favour by (allegedly) murdering them. IMO
 
  • #331
also she's discharged herself against medical advice at least twice now! Really, she would not do well working in the hospital system. (yes I'm aware not all nurses work in the hospital system, but you have to work there as a student and you pretty much always have to do at least a year after graduating, typically...) The way she sees the world is very atypical, I think. The way she thinks she should still be a part of her exes family; the way she thinks she knows better than medical professionals (yet apparently wants to be one?) Such an odd person, IMO

Also they first separated for the first time after their son was born. It feels like they've been separate more than together over all! And overall, quite an unstable relationship. Why get so pissy about 'separated' on the tax return then?



I agree. Its making me like her even less but I guess its not about me or what I think, its about if its working on the jury
I think you’re right on. I worked in hospitals and see them as safe places where people get help. If I hated them there’s no way I could have chosen to work in a hospital. It makes no sense.

I think the accused is spinning another self serving fairy tale. JMO
 
  • #332
Key Event
1m ago
Erin, Simon and son back travelling

By Joseph Dunstan and Melissa Brown

Erin says after a while, they embarked on an outback journey they'd wanted to do, heading north up the Western Australian coast in April 2009.

She says they met a few other people at Broome before embarking on the Gibb River Road in the outback.

They then travelled through the Northern Territory, before heading across to northern Queensland, ending up in Townsville around November 2009.

"It had been a really good holiday but I’d had enough. I wanted to sleep in a real bed and it was getting hard to camp with [their son]," she says.

She and her son flew back to Perth while Simon drove their car back to Perth.
Someone is not telling the truth, did the baby son fly back with Erin or did Simon drive him back?

Here is what Simon told the court:

"We again packed up everything, went in a four-wheel drive with a tent and with a young baby and we drove through the northern half of Australia for a few months, up to the top of Cape York Peninsula and then got back down to Townsville where Erin chose to fly just herself back to Perth. So, I packed everything up and [name] and I drove across Australia through the middle, straight back to Perth."

 
  • #333
Someone is not telling the truth, did the baby son fly back with Erin or did Simon drive him back?

Need to re-call SP and ask him.

Given the two versions, I know which one I'm prepared to believe.
 
  • #334
Someone is not telling the truth, did the baby son fly back with Erin or did Simon drive him back?

Here is what Simon told the court:

"We again packed up everything, went in a four-wheel drive with a tent and with a young baby and we drove through the northern half of Australia for a few months, up to the top of Cape York Peninsula and then got back down to Townsville where Erin chose to fly just herself back to Perth. So, I packed everything up and [name] and I drove across Australia through the middle, straight back to Perth."

Thank you for finding that! It’s what I remember from testimony too.
 
  • #335
They are 'humanising' her, on her own terms. Trying to have her judged less harshly.

imo
Definitely. It's in the interest of her defence to put her on the stand...
 
  • #336
Definitely. It's in the interest of her defence to put her on the stand...
The million dollar question is whether she’ll lie on the stand.
 
  • #337
It's in the interest of her defence to put her on the stand...

Let's see about that when the prosecution has its turn at her.

She's a practised liar and any good prosecutor ought to be able to go to town on that.
 
  • #338
  • #339
I thought she might feel as though she had to testify, to stand a chance. She told so many lies that she needed to give a competing narrative, IMO.
 
  • #340
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