GUILTY Australia - 3 dead after eating wild mushrooms, Leongatha, Victoria, Aug 2023 *Arrest* #18

[iamshadow21]

I believe that Erin planned to kill the others whether Simon turned up for the lunch or not. She'd already prepared the poisonous Beef Wellingtons...

Yeah, it's not a twenty minute job. The duxelles alone takes ages. You've got to chill everything properly before cooking, or the pastry will just collapse and melt off in the oven - see season three of the Great British Bake Off. Even with the shortcuts she took, she must have been prepping and cooking for at least a day.

And the proof that Simon not coming wasn't the trigger was in her bin - the remains of the poisoned Wellington she made for him were what the police found. The pastry cut in half with the traces of duxelles and meat. That can't have been hers, because by her own account she ate at least half hers, and hers wasn't poisoned because she's alive. So when she thought Simon was coming, she'd already prepared his serve.

MOO

 

[Deleted member 363451]

Sole survivor of Erin Patterson’s mushroom lunch speaks after her guilty verdict | 9 News Australia​

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[Deleted member 367982]

"My name is Ian... I used to lead services here a lot... And I'm pleased to be back with you again," he said.

Ian Wilkinson walks outside the Korumburra Baptist Church.

Later in the service, a church member reportedly delivered a special prayer.

"We pray especially for the Wilkinson and Patterson families," she said.

Wilkinson reportedly chose the theme of hope for the sermon, reading from Psalm 23:4.

"Even though I walk through the valley of the shadow of death, I will fear no evil," he said.

Pastor Ian Wilkinson returns to church after fatal mushroom trial

"My name is Ian... I used to lead services here a lot... And I'm pleased to be back with you again," he told the congregation.

www.1news.co.nz

imstilla.grandma,
You've seen a lot of killers come and go. What are your personal thoughts on Erin Patterson about what she's done and what she could do in the future.

 

[HoneyBunOne]

I don't know whether anyone has mentioned a potential trigger for this crime. Forensic psychologists I follow say there's usually some 'last straw' that triggers a mass murderers to take action, although they've been fantasizing about it long beforehand.

Something that made her so upset it, she deliberately over--rode her own common-sense and 48 years of law-abidingness, to risk getting caught and go for the elimination of Simon and all the people on his side.

I think we don't know what that trigger was. I suspect it might have been something one of the kids said, or Simon said, etc, that lead her to this reckless determination.

It's like a pot that's been simmering for decades, but something turns up the heat that causes it to boil over.

What do people think?

I think the perceived snub of the 70th birthday party invitation for either Heather or Gail, I can't recall which, may have been the straw that saw her down this murderous path.

Probably the fact that Simon cancelled last minute was the ultimate straw.

Spot on. You understand this case extremely well. And you’re right, she did move money and hide assets, and I’m going to add that she was probably fraudulently claiming welfare that she wasn’t entitled to.

That’s my opinion.

I don't believe it could have been Simon pulling out, that happened the night before. She'd already researched, foraged, dehydrated, blitzed, shopped & prepared the meal by that stage.

I also believe that Erin was fudging some numbers (didn't she have an accounting degree, or at least some accounting knowledge?) to ensure she could get money from the government. She was essentially a single parent at that point, although the government wasn't aware, and yet she had enough money to survive on, provide for the kids, and not have to work.

 

[Deleted member 363451]

I think the perceived snub of the 70th birthday party invitation for either Heather or Gail, I can't recall which, may have been the straw that saw her down this murderous path.


I don't believe it could have been Simon pulling out, that happened the night before. She'd already researched, foraged, dehydrated, blitzed, shopped & prepared the meal by that stage.

I also believe that Erin was fudging some numbers (didn't she have an accounting degree, or at least some accounting knowledge?) to ensure she could get money from the government. She was essentially a single parent at that point, although the government wasn't aware, and yet she had enough money to survive on, provide for the kids, and not have to work.

She probably loaned money to Simon's siblings for tax purposes/Centrelink purposes.

 

[imstilla.grandma]

imstilla.grandma,
You've seen a lot of killers come and go. What are your personal thoughts on Erin Patterson about what she's done and what she could do in the future.

We still may never know why Patterson did it. I'm not sure everyone can live with that. She has become a true crime obsession. True crime sells. So will she...

 

[Monstradamus]

She probably loaned money to Simon's siblings for tax purposes/Centrelink purposes.

It definitely wasn't out of the goodness of her (evil) heart.

 

[Kemug]

Yep, perfecting her craft, imo.

Interesting, the word "witchcraft" has just raised its head in my mind - never thought about it like that before!

 

[Monstradamus]

Interesting, the word "witchcraft" has just raised its head in my mind - never thought about it like that before!

Self reflection, perhaps?

 

[Kemug]

I don't believe Simon and the children need to move away, as there seem to be a lot of Pattersons in the Leongatta area, and outsiders needn't know who is who. The kids could slightly alter their first names sometime maybe, if they would feel more comfortable. Much better for them to stay in the area, IMO.

 

[RiSpy]

Yes, even if the medical authorities weren't onto it straight away, the deaths would still be traced back to the lunch, imo. Was she just going to throw her hands in the air, and say "I'm sorry, it was a terrible accident, let's just move on with our lives"?
It seems to me she was blinded by rage and revenge, and didn't think through the consequences / outcome very well.
Once people's usefulness to her was over, and she wasn't getting the supply and control any more she flipped her lid, big time.

MOO

agree. She does come across as the type who wants to be in control. You can get a sense of that from the messages exchanged in the family group chats and messages between her and Simon.

 

[RiSpy]

She was a good mom as long as she saw the kids as part of herself. But had she got away with this murder...what do people think would happen when her kids would start branching off, dating, move in with partners, get married, and she did not like their partners? More people would have been at risk, I am sure.

have thought the same. I got the impression that she dotes on her son. The age old saying "a son is a son till he takes a wife" IMO the wife will be fair game to Erin, if she maintains close comtact with her son.

​

 

[RiSpy]

Honestly, they can't win. The damage is done and now they're left to pick up the pieces. Best case scenario, Simon wraps them up in love, stability and normality. He keeps a circle of trusted friends and loved ones, the ones still alive that is, around him. He gets them thorough counselling and allows them to grieve, get angry, cry, whatever is deemed healthy. If it all becomes too much, relocating and starting fresh is not the worst of ideas. Unfortunately, they're not alone, far too many kids are paying for the sins of their parents. We can only hope they rise above their childhood and succeed in all areas of life.

hopefully Simon will meet someone who can offer them a loving family environment

 

[Deleted member 363451]

I don't believe Simon and the children need to move away, as there seem to be a lot of Pattersons in the Leongatta area, and outsiders needn't know who is who. The kids could slightly alter their first names sometime maybe, if they would feel more comfortable. Much better for them to stay in the area, IMO.

It's not for us to say of course, but I think that there's too many memories in Leongatha and dark ones at that. Moving to another state in Australia, would be a brand new start for Simon and the kids and also they are less likely to be recognised...

 

[RiSpy]

I think the perceived snub of the 70th birthday party invitation for either Heather or Gail, I can't recall which, may have been the straw that saw her down this murderous path.


I don't believe it could have been Simon pulling out, that happened the night before. She'd already researched, foraged, dehydrated, blitzed, shopped & prepared the meal by that stage.

I also believe that Erin was fudging some numbers (didn't she have an accounting degree, or at least some accounting knowledge?) to ensure she could get money from the government. She was essentially a single parent at that point, although the government wasn't aware, and yet she had enough money to survive on, provide for the kids, and not have to work.

Fudging some numbers does appear to be what she was doing. Simon rightfully wrote separated on his tax return as they were separated. Erin wasn't happy with this as it stopped her from getting the 15,000 annual family tax benefit. I am sure the tax department will be all over her. You would have to be living under a rock not to have taken notice of this from the court case if you worked for the tax dept.

 

[RiSpy]

Taking you children to ballet lessons or flying lessons doesn't make you a good mother. Murdering your children's grandparents makes you a terrible mother...

Ignoring hospital advice that your children need to be assessed also makes you a terrible and unfit mother.

 

[JBowie]

Ignoring hospital advice that your children need to be assessed also makes you a terrible and unfit mother.

Ordinarily, yes, but in this case she knew the kids had not consumed any DC mushrooms.

IMO, her claim that she didn't want to alarm the kids would have triggered any doctor in the circumstances.

 

[Eloise]

Wow, is it a ‘common’ occurrence? … maybe I need to be on the alert !

Sorry , I do think I understand your sentiments, and tho becoming more & more concerning, I so hope that behaviour doesn’t become accepted as ‘common’.

People have heard me lament that fact that I see the ‘loss of basic values’ as an epidemic that’s destroying our society, and no it’s almost from the time of birth for many.
It seems that Life is Cheap for so many people - yet I do question if they’d find their own life so easily dispensed with…. and I actually doubt it for the most. DV killers are very troubled individuals, way lost to any salvation at that point - many will kill themselves too, even if it’s later . IMO that’s a whole different discussion.

But this is about EP - and I don’t think it was a case of her thinking ‘nobody will care about them dying so won’t fully investigated

IMO Erin is all about ensuring situations were to her liking - and if not, she will go about making the changes required to bring that to be.

In this case she was absolutely sure of the plan she’d put in place & was quite comfortable with how she’d carried it all out.

And although her plan got a bit hijacked because the guests presented to hospital, she was confident in the story she’d worked out & that was how it would be (she needed them to die so she wasn’t about to give information now that might save them !)

She was also quite confident and blaze in Police interviews & property searches, even to the point of what I call ‘brazen’ behaviour; she was also confident in taking the stand at her trial and in taking on the Prosecutor with what IMO was an attitude of total disrespect & arrogance.

Her actions speak to me of someone who considers themselves way above the rest , someone who is entitled to have all their whims catered to, and if the imbeciles below her don’t deliver she sees them as a waste & it’s ‘off with their heads’ so to speak.

I’m not sure that sees criminality in her actions, I think she sees life to be at her bidding .

Not sure any of what I’ve said makes sense but it’s just my confluted opinion of a behaviour from someone who believes IMO that they are way above anything & anyone - she makes the rules .

I didn't say DV murders and family annihilation was common. I said it was common with those perpetrators to seem to have not planned for LE and the community actually caring about the person/s they did away with

that said, sadly at least in Australia, domestic violence murders are all too common. They're running at what, 1 a week to 1 a fortnight on average? Pretty disgustingly common actually

 

[Moll]

Yeah, I guess I'm trying to be more precise in understanding the very unusual phenomenon of committing homicide, much less mass murder, in middle age. Drunk driving is incredibly common and fortunately such people don't automatically progess to mass murder - we'd pretty much all be dead if they did!

I agree, drunk driving is not usually a precursor to mass murder, but EP's case was far from typical and was quite revealing of her character, I think. This was when she was 29, not a teenager.

She didn't just get tested because she was speeding and found to be over the limit, she crashed the car, damaging property.
The car was not registered.
She gave a false name and address to police (lying even when she was bound to be found out).

Mushroom chef crashed car and fled the scene

Erin Patterson, 48, lost her licence for 30 months in 2004 and was fined $1,000 for crashing her vehicle in the eastern Melbourne suburb of Glen Waverley.

www.dailymail.co.uk

If you want to be precise in understanding why someone commits murder in middle age I think you have to look not just at triggers but at the person's previous character. I was just modifying the picture presented of someone previously totally law-abiding suddenly committing a hideous crime.

 

[Charlot123]

She probably loaned money to Simon's siblings for tax purposes/Centrelink purposes.

I can’t get into the loans as I don’t know the details - it is still more a “he said, she said” situation and invites more questions than provides answers. However, I remember a totally different episode. Does anyone have any recollection of the time when Erin used to edit a local news leaflet? She complained about the locals to her online female friends. Poorly educated, and why was she even doing it for them… This is where I thought, you either do it or you don’t, but why do it and then, get irritated with the people who are reading it?

JMO, Erin is smart but she also has to feel that she is the smartest one in the room. Remembering what Simon said about Erin having poor self-esteem, being the “smartie” could have been her way to compensate. Allegedly between her and Simon, she was the organizing power, but Simon was a civil engineer, so, quite a match for her, IMHO. Yet she really self-asserted by putting him down (remember how she lamented, she invited people to clean the house and he didn’t notice, such stuff.)

So coming back to money. I don’t know what was the purpose of her loans to his family, tax is the first thing that comes to mind, but maybe, she was not minding the loans at first because it was in 2007, and at that time she viewed the Pattersons as her family. Financial relationships are so hard to understand, we probably shouldn’t even try, but I strongly suspect that at a certain point, she felt taken advantage of. And this where her cluster B-type anger must have become overpowering. She had an accounting degree, she was doing the taxes, she was independent and the money was hers. This is when she probably saw red.

Did she expect to improve her financial situation by killing them all, or was it a mere splitting where she and her kids were on one side, and the rest of the world, on the other one, hard to say. Perhaps just being angry with the Pattersons for all, perceived or real, financial transgressions, could have been enough to decide to kill them.

So ultimately, I think that these were her poisonous Cluster B traits that were the reason behind her crimes.

Who do you see as her parallel? Maybe Kaitlin Armstrong?