GUILTY Australia - 3 dead after eating wild mushrooms, Leongatha, Victoria, Aug 2023 *Arrest* #18

[katydid23]

We don't need to be, though. She is clearly self absorbed, cold, lacking empathy, and a calculated mass killer. This can only really lead to ASPD, IMO.

She lies about illness to gain sympathy - this means she fits the diagnostic criteria for Munchausen’s Syndrome (properly known today as factitious disorder imposed on self), not Munchausen's by proxy (where the perpetrator commits acts upon others to glean sympathy and attention).

All you need to do is look up the DSM IV to see the diagnostic criteria to see what her behaviours fit - as they are all behaviourally based, that's all psychologists do to tick the boxes of these diagnosis' IMO.

Factitious disorder imposed on self - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

EXACTLY.
I think she and Nurse Letby had a lot in common. Callous, coldblooded and selfish.

I think she is similar to many patients of Munchausens. They often move into the 'By Proxy' version of the illness.

When she was secretly poisoning Simon, that was Munchausen by Proxy, imo. Or Factitious Disorder by Proxy. She was poisoning him then pretending to care for him by nursing him back to health, gaining his trust, etc.

And I think her fateful luncheon was an offshoot of her attacks upon Simon. IMO

 

[Scuffy35]

The the Dame Phyllis Frost Centre is in the news at the moment for cruel treatment and conditions. I wonder if Erin was behind the complaints to the media.

The article didn't mention anything about the swimming pool and basketball/tennis court facilities.

www.news.com.au

 

[Ellery84]

Shocking new claims about lockdowns, suicide attempts and ‘green water’ at Melbourne prison

A prisoner’s diary from a maximum security women’s jail in Melbourne exposes shocking claims about what’s going on there.


https://www.news.com.au/national/vi...n/news-story/6e4b32742c92b49076a0ae8f98746f22

 

[Scooby-Doo]

Um, I'm confused, your two statements seem to contradict each other. Can you explain better?

Women are seven times as likely as men to choose poison as their murder weapon.

there are nine male killers for every one woman killer.

So, in raw numbers, more men kill with poison than women do.

But among men murderers, poison is used in just over one-third of one percent of killings.

But for women, it is used in more than 2.5 percent of killings.

 

[iamshadow21]

Women are seven times as likely as men to choose poison as their murder weapon.

there are nine male killers for every one woman killer.

So, in raw numbers, more men kill with poison than women do.

But among men murderers, poison is used in just over one-third of one percent of killings.

But for women, it is used in more than 2.5 percent of killings.

So, women are more likely to choose poison as a weapon, but men are far more likely to kill, so there are far more male poisoners than female. This is awesome information that I did not know.

I think most of the active threads I'm following (though not all!) featuring poisoning are actually men, right now. The Craig case, for example.

MOO

 

[Charlot123]

I'm not the poster your question is directed at but I think they were using statistics to disprove the notion that women are more likely to be a poisoner than a man. The first sentence being someone else's belief and the second sentence being the stats. Maybe I'm wrong.

Anyhow, now I'm curious re statistics and also reference and context of how they've been gathered and compiled, ie is that for convicted cases and if so, in what country / countries and what time frame.

JMO MOO

The first part was definitely not mine; I was just interested in the traits that would be common for poisoners and did not say anything about specifically women.

About women killers, though, I remember one article stating that women killers were more frequently than men motivated by “removing an obstacle”. I don’t know if it is applicable to this case specifically.

 

[Baby baby Jane]

My research & conclusion -
Many murderers choose methods based on what’s available (to them) …. And whether murderer thinks they can get away with it.

 

[Warshawski]

Shocking new claims about lockdowns, suicide attempts and ‘green water’ at Melbourne prison

A prisoner’s diary from a maximum security women’s jail in Melbourne exposes shocking claims about what’s going on there.


https://www.news.com.au/national/vi...n/news-story/6e4b32742c92b49076a0ae8f98746f22

This is not a good read, and I certainly wouldn’t want to be in that situation nor in those conditions.
I doubt I’d cope, and I pray that I’ll never traverse the path that leads me there.

However, and at the risk of being cried down, the reality is that these are not people on a visit to a holiday resort.

They are being ‘housed’ in this establishment as punishment for the Crimes they have committed
(simple definition of a Crime is an act that is in breach of the law, usually because it endangers or aggrieves individuals or society )

I’ll say no more . ..as it’s just my opinion.

 

[JBowie]

Shocking new claims about lockdowns, suicide attempts and ‘green water’ at Melbourne prison

A prisoner’s diary from a maximum security women’s jail in Melbourne exposes shocking claims about what’s going on there.


https://www.news.com.au/national/vi...n/news-story/6e4b32742c92b49076a0ae8f98746f22

The irony:

Dame Phyllis Irene Frost AC DBE JP (née Turner; 14 September 1917 – 30 October 2004) was an Australian welfare worker and philanthropist, known for her commitment to causes, such as helping prisoners. She chaired the Victorian Women's Prisons Council for many years --Wiki

 

[Observe_dont_Absorb]

My research & conclusion -
Many murderers choose methods based on what’s available (to them) …. And whether murderer thinks they can get away with it.

I wonder if EP thought she was playing god or challenging the god these people believed in?
Since she had taken against them and was previously a 'devout atheist' ? I wonder if a part of what she did was to challenge to their belief itself 'where is your god now?' or 'if god is looking after you, then you wouldn't die' etc.

 

[HoneyBunOne]

This is not a good read, and I certainly wouldn’t want to be in that situation nor in those conditions.
I doubt I’d cope, and I pray that I’ll never traverse the path that leads me there.

However, and at the risk of being cried down, the reality is that these are not people on a visit to a holiday resort.

They are being ‘housed’ in this establishment as punishment for the Crimes they have committed
(simple definition of a Crime is an act that is in breach of the law, usually because it endangers or aggrieves individuals or society )

I’ll say no more . ..as it’s just my opinion.

I would mostly agree, and mention that it is a MAXIMUM security prison. However, clean water and, ironically, food that won't kill you, should be available.

 

[katydid23]

This is not a good read, and I certainly wouldn’t want to be in that situation nor in those conditions.
I doubt I’d cope, and I pray that I’ll never traverse the path that leads me there.

However, and at the risk of being cried down, the reality is that these are not people on a visit to a holiday resort.

They are being ‘housed’ in this establishment as punishment for the Crimes they have committed
(simple definition of a Crime is an act that is in breach of the law, usually because it endangers or aggrieves individuals or society )

I’ll say no more . ..as it’s just my opinion.

Lockdowns are inevitable because there are hundreds of aggressive, anti-social prisoners crammed together with a much smaller number of guards. Their only recourse is to shut things down for awhile. imo

Also, no surprise there would be some suicidal tendencies. Must be depressing to be incarcerated, and alienated, separated from loved ones. People with much fewer problems commit suicide. So I cannot blame the institution for the suicidal ideation situation.

The water situation is another matter entirely. That needs to get sorted immediately.

 

[Warshawski]

I wonder if EP thought she was playing god or challenging the god these people believed in?
Since she had taken against them and was previously a 'devout atheist' ? I wonder if a part of what she did was to challenge to their belief itself 'where is your god now?' or 'if god is looking after you, then you wouldn't die' etc.

I understand your suggestion - but I’ll also suggest that if that was her Play she was way off in her understanding

 

[Monstradamus]

Today is the 2 year anniversary of the fateful lunch.
Prior to sentencing, let's take a moment to remember the victims of this terrible crime.
4 unsuspecting lovely people enjoying a meal together, hosted by a calculating killer with murder on her mind.
Best wishes to Ian, Simon and families.

RIP Don, Gail and Heather.

 

[MrJ]

It has been a while since I've contributed to this thread. It's very easy to get swept up in the news and following this case from the initial months to the arrest, trial, and finally guilty conviction. But we should never forget Don Patterson, Gail Patterson and Heather Wilkinson, three lovely, innocent and generous people that had their lives cruelly and evilly taken from them. Honestly, it's no use mentioning the murderer's name again. Not on this anniversary. Rest in peace to these three amazing people, and I wish Simon, Ian and all of the children who are no doubt going to find today very difficult. I really have a hard time with coming to terms with how senseless these murders were, but whatever I think, I'm sure it would be a thousand times more difficult for the families involved. I just hope they all know that they are supported through their grief.

 

[LinasK]

So, women are more likely to choose poison as a weapon, but men are far more likely to kill, so there are far more male poisoners than female. This is awesome information that I did not know.

I think most of the active threads I'm following (though not all!) featuring poisoning are actually men, right now. The Craig case, for example.

MOO

That makes alot more sense.

 

[Eloise]

Mushroom murderer Erin Patterson barred from selling Leongatha home

Convicted triple-murderer Erin Patterson has been barred from selling the home in which she served her relatives a deadly beef Wellington meal so it may be used in future compensation claims by her victims or their families.

www.abc.net.au

 

[HoneyBunOne]

Mushroom murderer Erin Patterson barred from selling Leongatha home

Convicted triple-murderer Erin Patterson has been barred from selling the home in which she served her relatives a deadly beef Wellington meal so it may be used in future compensation claims by her victims or their families.

www.abc.net.au

I hope Ian tries to get every penny he deserves, and then some. However, I feel like he'd perhaps be the type of person to let it rest and not chase any money that might be rightfully his, especially if it may mean taking money away from the Patterson children. Any money left after legal fees would likely be left to the children when Erin dies. Or so you would expect. Can members of the family claim compensation for the loss of their loved ones? Would it have to be the next of kin applying for it?

 

[JBowie]

Mushroom murderer Erin Patterson barred from selling Leongatha home

Convicted triple-murderer Erin Patterson has been barred from selling the home in which she served her relatives a deadly beef Wellington meal so it may be used in future compensation claims by her victims or their families.

www.abc.net.au

Patterson's lawyers are listed as a mortgagee on the Leongatha address, making it unclear as to whether her victims or indeed her legal team would have the first priority when it comes to how the value of the home could be distributed.

I'm wondering if there are precedent court decisions covering that question.

 

[Deleted member 363451]

Nz p

I hope Ian tries to get every penny he deserves, and then some. However, I feel like he'd perhaps be the type of person to let it rest and not chase any money that might be rightfully his, especially if it may mean taking money away from the Patterson children. Any money left after legal fees would likely be left to the children when Erin dies. Or so you would expect. Can members of the family claim compensation for the loss of their loved ones? Would it have to be the next of kin applying for it?

I wonder if he'll have ongoing medical expenses?