Australia Australia - William Tyrrell Disappeared While Playing in Yard - Kendall (NSW) #79

[SouthAussie]

All GJ is doing is creating an unnecessary diversion and distraction to the facts that have already been presented to the coroner.

The way I see it is that people don't have to read or listen to what Gary Jubelin, Mick Willing, Dan Box, or any other person has to say about this matter, if they don't want to.

imo

 

[FromGermany1]

wrote back saying I was concerned 'potential evidence ... has been lost'. Evidence we'd gathered when I led the investigation had not been put to witnesses, I wrote, because we had understood they would be questioned about it during the inquest hearings. After I was taken off the case, this had not happened. Over more than a dozen pages, I also tried to explain what we'd learned about some of these people."

bbm
What big negative surprise and disappointment. Just to quit your job immediately, if you are an involved detective (in my layman's thinking)!

 

[Awakening]

My late grandfather Andy, had a saying that he would say after lunch every Christmas Day “well Christmas is just as far away as it ever was”

I fear a resolution to what happened to William is just as far away as it ever was.

 

[Wexford]

Just wanted to let you know more about this @JLZ, because I thought I remembered communications between the Coroners Office and Jubes about the inquest.

This happened in June 2021.


"Despite still not wanting to call me as a witness, the State Government's Director of Inquests wrote asking me to set out on paper what I knew about the case.
I wrote back saying I was concerned 'potential evidence ... has been lost'. Evidence we'd gathered when I led the investigation had not been put to witnesses, I wrote, because we had understood they would be questioned about it during the inquest hearings. After I was taken off the case, this had not happened. Over more than a dozen pages, I also tried to explain what we'd learned about some of these people."

(I didn't add those dots between 'potential evidence' and 'has been lost'. Jubes did. Probably not wanting to reveal in his book what that evidence was.)

Ref: Badness by Gary Jubelin, Chapter: Stolen from Me, page 158

The fact there was never a proper handover from Jubelin to Laidlaw was always concerning. Everyone has their methods and I think GJ was playing the long game. Regardless of if he was correct or not, it appears to me that it was never allowed to be played out either way (if only just to rule out certain people).

 

[Chrissy74]

The fact there was never a proper handover from Jubelin to Laidlaw was always concerning. Everyone has their methods and I think GJ was playing the long game. Regardless of if he was correct or not, it appears to me that it was never allowed to be played out either way (if only just to rule out certain people).

When Hans Rupp retired and handed over the case to GJ, the handover between the 2 investigators was done at the home of and in the presence of the fp (a new direction where’s WT podcast). I’m not sure if this is general practice and what purpose this type of handover serves but what we do know is that when GJ took over Ws case his focus was geared towards a possible abduction and that remained his focus for the next 4yrs.
We also know that at the time GJ was removed from the case the coroner and her legal team were already in possession of the brief of evidence and at some point GJ was contacted by the State Government's Director of Inquests wrote to GJ asking him to provide information on what he knew about the case.
Seeing that the “The handover” seems to be a huge point of contention and the concerns surrounding it, I would love to know your opinion Wexford on What difference would it/could it have made to the investigation if there was an official handover between GJ and Detective Laidlaw?

 

[SouthAussie]

The fact there was never a proper handover from Jubelin to Laidlaw was always concerning. Everyone has their methods and I think GJ was playing the long game. Regardless of if he was correct or not, it appears to me that it was never allowed to be played out either way (if only just to rule out certain people).

As compared to the handover Jubes got from Hans Rupp .... in part, because obviously conversation happened, at the very least about the bio parents, the foster parents, and Bill Spedding.

• Weeks after William disappears, Rupp and Jubes chat briefly about the case.
• In January, Mick Willing requests that Jubes takes over the case from Rupp after Rupp retires in February.
• Rupp has ruled out both the bio parents and the foster parents by now.
• Jubes looks at the eagle.i computer system to look at the case - over 1000 reports, statements, investigators’ notes waiting for review - and sees how much was missed in the 1st hours and days when the locals treated it as a missing persons case, before Homicide was called in.
• Jubes can't find a written investigation plan.
• Rupp then takes Jubes to meet the foster parents. Jubes assesses that he will need to look at them first as they were both with William that morning.
• Jubes implores (unsuccessfully) with Rupp, then acting commander Jason, and then with Mick Willing, to not raid Bill Spedding's properties, to investigate him covertly instead.
• It is 2 weeks until Rupp retires. Jubes is now in Perth. The raid of Bill Spedding's properties happens.
• Jubes returns from Perth and spends 2 days writing up a proper investigation plan, and takes over the case.

(paraphrased from)

https://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/truecrimeaustralia/gary-jubelin-i-catch-killers-book-extract-william-tyrrell-mistakes-and-why-the-case-hasnt-been-cracked/news-story/611acb35c2dc72864351559c7be6175d?amp

 

[marv hucker]

The fact there was never a proper handover from Jubelin to Laidlaw was always concerning. Everyone has their methods and I think GJ was playing the long game. Regardless of if he was correct or not, it appears to me that it was never allowed to be played out either way (if only just to rule out certain people).

There’s a couple of things which, IMHO, suggest this was directed from higher up the food chain. Sounds like the police commissioner was doing a fair bit of backgrounding of journalists too - and the infamous 2GB interview.

 

[Wexford]

As compared to the handover Jubes got from Hans Rupp .... in part, because obviously conversation happened, at the very least about the bio parents, the foster parents, and Bill Spedding.

• Weeks after William disappears, Rupp and Jubes chat briefly about the case.
• In January, Mick Willing requests that Jubes takes over the case from Rupp after Rupp retires in February.
• Rupp has ruled out both the bio parents and the foster parents by now.
• Jubes looks at the eagle.i computer system to look at the case - over 1000 reports, statements, investigators’ notes waiting for review - and sees how much was missed in the 1st hours and days when the locals treated it as a missing persons case, before Homicide was called in.
• Jubes can't find a written investigation plan.
• Rupp then takes Jubes to meet the foster parents. Jubes assesses that he will need to look at them first as they were both with William that morning.
• Jubes implores (unsuccessfully) with Rupp, then acting commander Jason, and then with Mick Willing, to not raid Bill Spedding's properties, to investigate him covertly instead.
• It is 2 weeks until Rupp retires. Jubes is now in Perth. The raid of Bill Spedding's properties happens.
• Jubes returns from Perth and spends 2 days writing up a proper investigation plan, and takes over the case.

(paraphrased from)

https://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/truecrimeaustralia/gary-jubelin-i-catch-killers-book-extract-william-tyrrell-mistakes-and-why-the-case-hasnt-been-cracked/news-story/611acb35c2dc72864351559c7be6175d?amp

Yes quite simply this. In a nutshell:
Handover from Rupp to Jubelin occurs. Jubelin identifies a proper investigation plan is not in place. Sets up investigation plan, continues on with investigating Spedding and then excludes him as a POI.
Savage then becomes main POI.
Jubelin removed from the case.
No handover from Jubelin to Laidlaw. It appears no further investigation of Savage so never ruled out (or in). Laidlaw concentrates on foster parents and foster grandmother and then more specifically to foster mother.
This is exactly the concern with no proper handover. The job was never finished.
Why though, is the big question to me.
And of course, where is William?

 

[Chrissy74]

Yes quite simply this. In a nutshell:
Handover from Rupp to Jubelin occurs. Jubelin identifies a proper investigation plan is not in place. Sets up investigation plan, continues on with investigating Spedding and then excludes him as a POI.
Savage then becomes main POI.
Jubelin removed from the case.
No handover from Jubelin to Laidlaw. It appears no further investigation of Savage so never ruled out (or in). Laidlaw concentrates on foster parents and foster grandmother and then more specifically to foster mother.
This is exactly the concern with no proper handover. The job was never finished.
Why though, is the big question to me.
And of course, where is William?

“The job was never finished”
Laidlaw took over the case only a month or two before the inquest began in early 2019. He came in with an open mind and conducted the investigation with objectivity annd impartiality. He had the huge task of starting his work and investigative processes, not from where someone else had left off, but from the very beginning.

 

[marv hucker]

“The job was never finished”
Laidlaw took over the case only a month or two before the inquest began in early 2019. He came in with an open mind and conducted the investigation with objectivity annd impartiality. He had the huge task of starting his work and investigative processes, not from where someone else had left off, but from the very beginning.

So in nearly six years he had a year’s wire tap on the mother, “not bluffed” (which was of course a bluff), dug up half the town, dropped seemingly all other lines of inquiry and has not turned up any evidence whatsoever.
And delayed the inquest for significant lengths - fairly important given a few persons of interest are well into their 70s.
Might have been impartial or objective, but also _totally_ ineffective.

 

[SouthAussie]

So in nearly six years he had a year’s wire tap on the mother, “not bluffed” (which was of course a bluff), dug up half the town, dropped seemingly all other lines of inquiry and has not turned up any evidence whatsoever.
And delayed the inquest for significant lengths - fairly important given a few persons of interest are well into their 70s.
Might have been impartial or objective, but also _totally_ ineffective.

Well, what it probably has done - along with the Rupp and Jubes investigations - is adequately cleared the FM. And possibly opened up a lawsuit against the NSW police.

imo

 

[Reneemaree88]

So in nearly six years he had a year’s wire tap on the mother, “not bluffed” (which was of course a bluff), dug up half the town, dropped seemingly all other lines of inquiry and has not turned up any evidence whatsoever.
And delayed the inquest for significant lengths - fairly important given a few persons of interest are well into their 70s.
Might have been impartial or objective, but also _totally_ ineffective.

It’s outrageous that so much time and resources have been wasted. Poor William has had to remain missing for another six years!! It’s been ten years now and no one has been able to find where that little three year old boy, alive or deceased is. ;(

 

[Raina_the_observer]

And delayed the inquest for significant lengths - fairly important given a few persons of interest are well into their 70s.
Might have been impartial or objective, but also _totally_ ineffective.

Elderly or dead. I am of the opinion that the FM is not guilty and that seems to be the consensus here now. But what a change from the pile-on and hate towards her a couple of years ago. And it appears they looked closely at FGM as of all the people present she was the only one whose account involved provably false statements. But then lost interest, was this because she died, they decided the FM must have been covering up for her?

 

[Marg944]

​

William Tyrrell detective flags unchecked bins after toddler disappeared​

“In a heavily redacted review of the investigation into missing William Tyrrell, the officer overseeing the search has highlighted a missed opportunity in the search.”

https://www.news.com.au/national/nsw-act/courts-law/william-tyrrell-detective-flags-unchecked-bins-after-toddler-disappeared/news-story/9ed07344ea11b2279364a6a361d6cd1d

 

[scruffydog]

Elderly or dead. I am of the opinion that the FM is not guilty and that seems to be the consensus here now. But what a change from the pile-on and hate towards her a couple of years ago. And it appears they looked closely at FGM as of all the people present she was the only one whose account involved provably false statements. But then lost interest, was this because she died, they decided the FM must have been covering up for her?

That's certainly not my thought. I firmly believe the FM is 100% responsible, and the FF and FGM helped cover it up. Listen, when someone beats a defenseless child with a spoon, and talks hatefully to and about children, she most certainly is capable of killing William.

 

[SouthAussie]

​

William Tyrrell detective flags unchecked bins after toddler disappeared​

“In a heavily redacted review of the investigation into missing William Tyrrell, the officer overseeing the search has highlighted a missed opportunity in the search.”

https://www.news.com.au/national/nsw-act/courts-law/william-tyrrell-detective-flags-unchecked-bins-after-toddler-disappeared/news-story/9ed07344ea11b2279364a6a361d6cd1d

Maybe Dan is getting ready to drop his next episode of the podcast. Because Dan (and Heath Parkes-Hupton) already published this information in the same publication a month ago. Maybe news.com.au is trying to get people buzzing again, or it's a really slow news day and they want the clicks.

Dec 9, 2024

https://www.news.com.au/national/crime/150-pages-of-censored-evidence-we-cant-show-you/news-story/82434840d2d57df3b8241ec0e940faae

 

[FromGermany1]

That's certainly not my thought. I firmly believe the FM is 100% responsible, and the FF and FGM helped cover it up. Listen, when someone beats a defenseless child with a spoon, and talks hatefully to and about children, she most certainly is capable of killing William.

My opinion: responsible - yes; death - rather no.

 

[marv hucker]

My opinion: responsible - yes; death - rather no.

Yep corporal punishment used to be very, very, very much standard practise up to the 80s/90s.
Not sure every parent over the age of ~60 is capable of murder.

 

[drsleuth]

A human skull found in a popular national park in Queensland may belong to a child and appears to have been deliberately placed.

Disturbing theory about human remains found at popular tourist destination

The remains have been sent for forensic testing.

7news.com.au

 

[Detective Willy]

​

William Tyrrell detective flags unchecked bins after toddler disappeared​

“In a heavily redacted review of the investigation into missing William Tyrrell, the officer overseeing the search has highlighted a missed opportunity in the search.”

https://www.news.com.au/national/nsw-act/courts-law/william-tyrrell-detective-flags-unchecked-bins-after-toddler-disappeared/news-story/9ed07344ea11b2279364a6a361d6cd1d

So suspicious that she never told Police about the drive for 6 days.

Never mentioned it in the 000 call either and also told husband William “was here 5 minutes ago”.

On the 000 call she said there were no cars around and also changed this story to there being 2 suspicious cars,

I see too many red flags and too many holes in her changing stories. In the absence of any other person looking guilty, she is still clearly at the very top of my list.

Police obviously can’t prove this though and she seems to be very lucky that Police were so sloppy in the early parts of this investigation.