CA CA - Bob Harrod, 81, Orange County, 27 July 2009 - #17

[zwiebel]

Thanks, I forgot it was the narrator. I'm guessing that noon was the time the housekeeper gave to the program makers though - even if that wasn't filmed. It would have been a pretty catastrophic mistake on their part to get her arrival time wrong, and incomprehensible if they left such a mistake in.

If the housekeeper had arrived at 2.45pm then son in law's 3.04pm receipt from home depot makes more sense. But they make his wife's maybe one, noon? and missing 28 hours announcements even more nonsensical. And it makes PB's 11.45ish call irrelevant too.

Looking back through the articles, I can't find one direct comment from the housekeeper, or any 'couldn't be reached' or 'declined to comment' mentions either. Is it possible none of the media ever tried to speak to her before Disappeared?

I'd still like to know if anyone ever spoke to Bob's gardener too, just in case he/she had noticed anything. It did cross my mind that the gardner and housekeeper might both have been originally scheduled to come on the Tuesday - might even have worked for the same company - and that the gardner might have arrived on Tuesday as planned, and even crossed paths with JuM that day. I suppose it would have been mentioned if that had happened though.

 

[Cubby]

There is a very interesting trial taking place in New England at the moment, where a man is charged with murdering his wife in 1984 and hiding her body in a dry well, beneath the floor of his barn. She was discovered by the new owners in 2010. A tip in the form of a photo of bedding is being used as evidence:

"... a family photo that incidentally portrayed bedding that was similar to the bedding in which Mrs Heath's skeletal remains were wrapped...Det Insalaco had provided that photo...after receiving it from a Heath family friend."

http://www.newtownbee.com/news/news...iner-describes-attack-heath-murder-tri/166257

I'm still wondering if any of Bob's bedding was missing, and if Mrs Harrod was able to tell police what it looked like, if it was.

The cleaning lady would be able to identify bedding as well. She too could provide a description of bedding which might have been missing.

 

[Grainne Dhu]

Looking back through the articles, I can't find one direct comment from the housekeeper, or any 'couldn't be reached' or 'declined to comment' mentions either. Is it possible none of the media ever tried to speak to her before Disappeared?

I'd still like to know if anyone ever spoke to Bob's gardener too, just in case he/she had noticed anything. It did cross my mind that the gardner and housekeeper might both have been originally scheduled to come on the Tuesday - might even have worked for the same company - and that the gardner might have arrived on Tuesday as planned, and even crossed paths with JuM that day. I suppose it would have been mentioned if that had happened though.

SBM

As to the lack of mention of the CL in the media before the Disappeared episode, I wonder if it is a simple consequence of the fact that people who do menial jobs in the US are often treated as though they are invisible. If none of Bob's descendants were willing to give a reporter her full name, the reporter would have no way to even attempt to contact her.

If Bob had a yard service (I think he most likely did), it is an unusual company configuration to offer both housecleaning and yard work. It's not impossible but the two things just don't go together in the mindset of the US.

I do have a man who comes and does the yard work (both my husband and I are too disabled to do it ourselves). In our case, rather than being on a strict schedule, our yard work man comes whenever he thinks our yard may need some attention. Now part of this is peculiar to Iowa; in a rainy year, we may need to have the yard mowed and weedwhacked twice a week but in a drought year, it may only need to be done once a month or so. Our yard work man lives relatively nearby, so he plans to do our yard whenever he needs to do his own.

The only advance notice he gives us is when he pulls up and our two dogs start bouncing and making excitement sounds. He always has a cookie for each of them and says he really enjoys them.

I think our arrangement is not so unusual and it wouldn't surprise me if Bob's yard work person or service just came whenever they figured it would be necessary.

 

[Grainne Dhu]

The cleaning lady would be able to identify bedding as well. She too could provide a description of bedding which might have been missing.

To be fair, she may not remember. I know I could not come up with a comprehensive list of our bedding but I could identify whether a particular sheet was ours or not.

And pillowcases, fuhgeddaboudit. Since pillowcases last the longest, I have pillowcases from sheet sets where the sheets are long since gone. I like to put a different colour of pillowcase on every pillow, I think it makes the pillow mountain look colourful and inviting. But it means that I have so many I couldn't possibly begin to list them.

Not so helpful when trying to figure out if something is missing but potentially helpful if bedding is ever found.

 

[zwiebel]

It would be very easy to identify any sheets that went missing from my house - flipping dog's hairs. My dog doesn't sleep in my bed (or his own, for that matter), but somehow they always seem to get dog hairs stuck to them. It drives me mad when we have guests, but I can't think of any cure apart from making the dog live in the vacuum cleaner.

I have a lots of bedding, so wouldn't notice immediately if something was missing, but would eventually. I bought them all. I'd recognise them too, apart from the plain white sheets.

That reminds me; I think JuM? said she changed Bob's linens for her posh ones because he had cheap, mismatched sheets? So, old ones, I guess? There seemed to be an underlying criticism of Bob there. Not exactly fair, seeing as he's missing and can't answer back. Also, Bob had only been widowed just over a year when he went missing. In my house, I'm in charge of bedding buying and choosing and I can't help thinking it would have been the first Mrs Harrod in charge of that in Bob's house too. So maybe those old sheets were actually her choice?

Whatever. I buy cheap ones too, because half the time I grab them to protect the furniture from all the renovation work and they get ruined. In an emergency, if a builder grabbed a sheet from my linen cupboard to protect something, I wouldn't mind too much. If a relative let themself into my house while I was away and swapped the sheets on my bed for slippy, slidy silk ones of their choosing, I'd hit the roof. Then use them as a dust sheet and send them back, covered with paint, with a thank you note. Just to make sure it didn't happen again.

 

[zwiebel]

I know there must be some married men out there who choose the household bedding, by the way. It's just that I have never met one in my entire life. I've met a lot of men who look at the assembled pillows and polsters and quilts in their home and roll their eyes though.

 

[zwiebel]

I have no idea where that word polster came from. I think I meant bolster, unless it's a German word popping out.

 

[cloudajo]

JuM previously posted on ROTW that JeM has been volunteering as a Citizen on Patrol (COP) for Twin Peaks.

JuM posted today that JeM is coming home from the command post where the search is going on for the missing hiker from Germany.


http://forums.rimoftheworld.net/showthread.php?60-claire&p=318342#post318342

Citizens on Patrol:

The Twin Peaks Citizens on Patrol are under the direction of the Twin Peaks Sheriff's Station. Volunteers perform various crime prevention duties such as vacation home checks, provide residential and business security checks, assist with Neighborhood Watch Programs and work in the office assisting our clerical staff. When requested they conduct fingerprinting for our kids and participate in special events such as parades, school carnivals, safety fairs, grand openings, and many other duties. While on patrol they write citations, such as handicapped parking and other similar violations.

http://cave.sbsar.org/Units/COP/COP418/COP418.htm

 

[mikkismom]

JuM previously posted on ROTW that JeM has been volunteering as a Citizen on Patrol (COP) for Twin Peaks.

JuM posted today that JeM is coming home from the command post where the search is going on for the missing hiker from Germany.


http://forums.rimoftheworld.net/showthread.php?60-claire&p=318342#post318342

Citizens on Patrol:

The Twin Peaks Citizens on Patrol are under the direction of the Twin Peaks Sheriff's Station. Volunteers perform various crime prevention duties such as vacation home checks, provide residential and business security checks, assist with Neighborhood Watch Programs and work in the office assisting our clerical staff. When requested they conduct fingerprinting for our kids and participate in special events such as parades, school carnivals, safety fairs, grand openings, and many other duties. While on patrol they write citations, such as handicapped parking and other similar violations.

http://cave.sbsar.org/Units/COP/COP418/COP418.htm

Glad to see he is using his 'search skills'. :sigh:

 

[Grainne Dhu]

That reminds me; I think JuM? said she changed Bob's linens for her posh ones because he had cheap, mismatched sheets? So, old ones, I guess? There seemed to be an underlying criticism of Bob there. Not exactly fair, seeing as he's missing and can't answer back. Also, Bob had only been widowed just over a year when he went missing. In my house, I'm in charge of bedding buying and choosing and I can't help thinking it would have been the first Mrs Harrod in charge of that in Bob's house too. So maybe those old sheets were actually her choice?

SBM

Am I the only person in the world who deliberately mismatches the sheets? I like the top and bottom sheet to be different colours and all the pillowcases to be different, as well. All the same colour is too matchy-matchy and hotel-like for me. I like the bed to be all colourful and it feels more inviting to me. Between us, we have 9 pillows (regular bed pillows, not decorative ones), so it's like going to sleep in a Monet painting. Big patches of different colours.

I imagine JuM would have plenty of denigrating to do about my household.

OMG, I just remembered. She's into dogs... I wonder if she ever attends dog training seminars? Nah, I don't think she's the type. If I could get a good look at her dogs, I'd remember (bad at human faces, never forget a dog face).

 

[zwiebel]

JuM previously posted on ROTW that JeM has been volunteering as a Citizen on Patrol (COP) for Twin Peaks.

JuM posted today that JeM is coming home from the command post where the search is going on for the missing hiker from Germany.


http://forums.rimoftheworld.net/showthread.php?60-claire&p=318342#post318342

Citizens on Patrol:

The Twin Peaks Citizens on Patrol are under the direction of the Twin Peaks Sheriff's Station. Volunteers perform various crime prevention duties such as vacation home checks, provide residential and business security checks, assist with Neighborhood Watch Programs and work in the office assisting our clerical staff. When requested they conduct fingerprinting for our kids and participate in special events such as parades, school carnivals, safety fairs, grand openings, and many other duties. While on patrol they write citations, such as handicapped parking and other similar violations.

http://cave.sbsar.org/Units/COP/COP418/COP418.htm

I hope Herr Kroft is found safe. It's four days now, and he doesn't have any supplies. I hope he at least had some water in his backpack. Hopefully, other members of his party will be able to continue searching because it sounds like he may have fallen and could be laying injured somewhere. The first NBC article is spelling his name Alyof Kroft, but I'm sure it is really Alois Kroft.

My thoughts are with his friends and especially his family in Deutschland if they were not with him - it must be so hard being so far away when a family member goes missing.

http://www.nbclosangeles.com/news/local/German-Alyof-Krost-Hiking-Lake-Arrowhead-226281971.html

http://losangeles.cbslocal.com/2013...ing-hiker-from-germany-enters-its-fourth-day/

 

[zwiebel]

JuM previously posted on ROTW that JeM has been volunteering as a Citizen on Patrol (COP) for Twin Peaks.

JuM posted today that JeM is coming home from the command post where the search is going on for the missing hiker from Germany.


http://forums.rimoftheworld.net/showthread.php?60-claire&p=318342#post318342

Citizens on Patrol:

The Twin Peaks Citizens on Patrol are under the direction of the Twin Peaks Sheriff's Station. Volunteers perform various crime prevention duties such as vacation home checks, provide residential and business security checks, assist with Neighborhood Watch Programs and work in the office assisting our clerical staff. When requested they conduct fingerprinting for our kids and participate in special events such as parades, school carnivals, safety fairs, grand openings, and many other duties. While on patrol they write citations, such as handicapped parking and other similar violations.

http://cave.sbsar.org/Units/COP/COP418/COP418.htm

If JeM is partcipating in searches, I guess he will be assisting in any searches for Bob, too? So, besides being the last person to see him, he could eventually become the first person to locate him, as well?

As Bob's son in law and a member of a group under the sheriff's direction, I guess JeM is able to keep himself and the family informed about where any searches for Bob are taking place, and he will know all about the procedures for reporting a person missing, how crucial it is to respond in a timely fashion and how important things like a last seen time and description are. And also how important it is to keep the public aware a person is still missing, and for family and friends to co-operate fully with police and authorities.

I suppose it goes without saying that Citizen's Patrol wouldn't allow someone to be out searching if they were not physically fit and able to negotiate their way around rough terrain quickly.

 

[zwiebel]

Does anyone know if son in law had experience searching for missing people before he provided the following help for police searching for Bob?


"Police say Bob Harrod's son-in-law was doing work at the house July 27 in preparation for Fontelle Harrod's arrival.....he left the house to buy supplies from Home Depot around 2.30 pm.."
http://www.ocregister.com/articles/-214111--.html

"Bob...was last seen at about 1.30pm....Bob...with help from his daughter and son-in-law, had been rearranging things in his home."
http://www.nbclosangeles.com/news/l...r-Marrying-Childhood-Sweetheart-52086697.html

"Robert was last seen at 11am...When a family member returned to the house at approximately 1pm, Harrod was gone." (Placentia Police Dept)
http://placentia.org/DocumentCenter/Home/View/102

Robert...was last seen Monday afternoon at his home....by his son in law, who told authorities he went to Home Depot and that, when he returned, Harrod was gone....is described as...brown eyes.....last see wearing white pants, white hat and a shirt of an unknown color"
http://articles.latimes.com/2009/jul/31/local/me-missing-groom31

"I last spoke to him somewhere between 11 and 12.....heard son in law say he was going to the hardware store...."
https://www.findthemissing.org/cases/2706

Reporter: "A family member told media Bob was showing early signs of dementia. Detectives who interviewed his doctor say Bob was of sound mind, Loomis said."
http://articles.latimes.com/2010/feb/02/local/la-me-disappeared3-2010feb03/2

Reporter: "Bob Harrod's daughters called Fontelle Harrod in Missouri and she called in a report to police."
http://www.ocregister.com/articles/-214111--.html

Reporter: "Unable to reach Bob Harrod's children for comment on this story"
http://losangeles.cbslocal.com/vide...ssing-placentia-mans-wife-suspects-foul-play/

"Jeff Michaels....would not comment for this story."
http://www.ocregister.com/articles/-214111--.html

"His (son-in-law) receipt shows that he paid for his items after 3pm. He thinks he was at Home Depot for 45 minutes to an hour, so given 15 minutes or so of driving time, you're looking at 1.30pm. When son-in-law arrived back at at Harrod's house a housekeeper was waiting outside.."
http://www.ocregister.com/news/harrod-147900-loomis-family.html

"Bob's housekeeper of more than ten years arrived around noon...after about 15 minutes, son-in-law drove up to the house,"
Amazon.com: Disappeared: Season 6, Episode 13 "Long Lost Love"

"...told police he left the home to buy supplies around 2.30pm, and time-stamped receipts bear him out,"
http://www.ocregister.com/news/harrod-214111-vanished-ordeal.html

"When he got back, my Dad was gone....we're thinking maybe one? Noon?" (son in law's wife, JuM), link to TV interview can be found in the media thread if anyone wants to watch it again.

 

[cloudajo]

Not sure if he had any experience before, but JuM posted back in October 2012 that JeM was taking night classes and CPR, so I assume that's when his training was in progress for this program.

Oh look the training includes "media relations."

Requirements
We ask that you put in at least 8 hours per month plus attend the monthly meeting. You will need to purchase your own uniform (we will give assistance if needed). You will also attend a 40-hour academy where you will learn the structure of the citizen volunteer program, the areas we cover, the rules and conduct. Also included is extensive training in conducting vacation home checks, residential and business checks, media relations, civil liabilities, traffic control, radio procedures, fingerprinting, and equipment training. Last but not least, CPR and First Aid training.

http://cave.sbsar.org/Units/COP/COP418/COP418.htm

 

[zwiebel]

I'm beginning to wonder now if JeM will try to volunteer to help out at the Orange County Cold Case Unit too.

But no. They are investigating Bob's missing person case, and Bob's son in law has kept his distance from that, starting from the day Bob disappeared.

I wonder if he has picked up any useful tips and hints about police investigative procedures, during his time helping /working with the Citizens Volunteers?

 

[zwiebel]

This article is calling the missing man Alyof Krost. That's three articles with three different versions of his name. I hope it wasn't Bob's son in law in charge of media info there.
http://www.sbsun.com/general-news/20131004/search-continues-in-lake-arrowhead-area-for-missing-hiker

Here in Germany he is named as Alois Krost.
http://www.bild.de/bildlive/2013/20-vermisstt-32688438.bild.html

Ich hoffe Alois bald gefunded wird.
(I hope Alois is found soon)

I wanted to send good wishes in German because this thread is coming high in google searches in German for articles about Alois now.

 

[zwiebel]

It is under sad circumstances, but those hikers in Lake Arrowhead, and the other SAR people there now looking for Alois Krost, are helping Bob too. I don't know if any searches for Bob in San Bernardino County have been carried out in the past four years he's been missing, but now there is a chance that if he is there, he might be discovered.

I hope Bob's son in law has reminded his fellow citizen volunteers that his father in law, Bob Harrod, is still missing and needs to be found too.

 

[cloudajo]

It is under sad circumstances, but those hikers in Lake Arrowhead, and the other SAR people there now looking for Alois Krost, are helping Bob too. I don't know if any searches for Bob in San Bernardino County have been carried out in the past four years he's been missing, but now there is a chance that if he is there, he might be discovered.

I hope Bob's son in law has reminded his fellow citizen volunteers that his father in law, Bob Harrod, is still missing and needs to be found too.

Something tells me he hasn't mentioned it.

 

[zwiebel]

I suppose with the 'last seen' times ranging from 10am to about 3pm for Bob, it may be difficult to discuss Bob's case with other professionals/search volunteers.

Luckily, ŵith Alois, someone has been diligent in reporting the time he went missing.

 

[Cubby]

To be fair, she may not remember. I know I could not come up with a comprehensive list of our bedding but I could identify whether a particular sheet was ours or not.

And pillowcases, fuhgeddaboudit. Since pillowcases last the longest, I have pillowcases from sheet sets where the sheets are long since gone. I like to put a different colour of pillowcase on every pillow, I think it makes the pillow mountain look colourful and inviting. But it means that I have so many I couldn't possibly begin to list them.

Not so helpful when trying to figure out if something is missing but potentially helpful if bedding is ever found.

True. I think it would depend on who laundered Bob's bedding. I don't recall it being said who did Bob's laundry before he married Fontelle. Did he do his own laundry after Georgia passed, or did the housekeeper do some of the laundry?

Also, after 4 years of being in the elements, I don't know how much of bedding might be recognizable after so much time......

Just thinking outloud.....