CA CA - Bob Harrod, 81, Orange County, 27 July 2009 - #17

[Mahouston69]

wouldn't CL notice if carpets had been cleaned? They stay damp a while and usually you turn on some fans to get the air moving to facilitate drying, (and try to get smaller stuff of the floors so you don't have to work around it, in my experience)

hmm unless something else could have been rented

All I have read is that it took JeM a while upstairs (cleaning) before CL went upstairs. I am also not sure, since changing the bed sheets didn't spark anyone's attention in getting ready for Fontelle to arrive, carpet cleaning probably didn't either. But, it would be a good way for it never to be "tested" for anything. I don't think the police immediately thought crime scene, and they weren't there until evening right?

 

[Mahouston69]

My web searches turned up a lot of references in earlier posts to the carpet being cleaned, but I couldn't find a confirming statement regarding whether JuM cleaned them herself, when she was down the hill changing the sheets, or whether Bob had arranged in advance for professional cleaners. The posts were prior to my joining WS and included a reference to JuM posting on ROTW about finding homemade solutions for fluid stain removal. I'm hoping this might refresh the memory of someone who may have the old ROTW posts archived.

The only thread I found on an archived post was about using Nature's Miracle to get out cat pee by JuM

 

[sreshowtime]

Grainne...well yeah maybe.... certain cleaning for specific reason if warranted....but not a hey welcome back after your cold feet,now you can resume life with the Mrs., everything is all spiffy, everything is done up for ya, kind of way....maybe more like a half azz kind of way, while prowling around scoping stuff out kind of way, take advantage of the situation that has presented itself, why bother doing more than minimal at this point kind of way.
Way? Way.

 

[zwiebel]

The only thread I found on an archived post was about using Nature's Miracle to get out cat pee by JuM

There was one about Vodka and vomit as well, I think.

On the topic of vomit; anyone know if this would be one of the side effects of an overdose of nytroglycerine and/or Prozac? Anyone know what they taste like? RB's thought it worthwhile to mention them in relation to Bob, (in a way that tries to make him look suspicious, as usual) so maybe we should look at what the effect might have been if Bob should have somehow ended up imbibing a large amount that Monday?

 

[sreshowtime]

Hemodynamic Effects

The effects of nitroglycerin overdose are generally the results of nitroglycerin's capacity to induce vasodilatation, venous pooling, reduced cardiac output, and hypotension. These hemodynamic changes may have protean manifestations, including increased intracranial pressure, with any or all of persistent throbbing headache, confusion, and moderate fever; vertigo; palpitations; tachycardia; visual disturbances; nausea and vomiting (possibly with colic and even bloody diarrhea); syncope (especially in the upright posture); dyspnea, later followed by reduced ventilatory effort; diaphoresis, with the skin either flushed or cold and clammy; heart block and bradycardia; paralysis; coma; seizures; and death.

 

[sreshowtime]

Prozac Overdose: Symptoms
If a person overdoses on Prozac, the symptoms can vary. The most common Prozac overdose symptoms include:


Seizures
Drowsiness
Nausea
Fast heart rate (tachycardia)
Vomiting.


Other Prozac overdose symptoms may include, but are not limited to:


Coma
Irregular heart rhythm (arrhythmia)
High blood pressure (hypertension)
Low blood pressure (hypotension)
Fever
Fainting
Loss of life.

 

[sreshowtime]

it could be interesting to know what Mr.H's frame of mind was like during any phone calls he had that morning...if he sounded unusual in any way, or any thing different was thought by anyone that had previously spoken to him before, you know, someone familiar with his speech patterns, etc...or if he mentioned anything about how he was feeling
ya never know

 

[zwiebel]

It certainly would. If PB's account of the 'conversation' she had with Bob that Monday morning is to be believed, he was irritable and hardly capable of speaking - just gave 'favorable responses'.

Maybe she's a vital last witness (besides son in law) to Bob's condition, just before he disappeared?

 

[Grainne Dhu]

Grainne...well yeah maybe.... certain cleaning for specific reason if warranted....but not a hey welcome back after your cold feet,now you can resume life with the Mrs., everything is all spiffy, everything is done up for ya, kind of way....maybe more like a half azz kind of way, while prowling around scoping stuff out kind of way, take advantage of the situation that has presented itself, why bother doing more than minimal at this point kind of way.
Way? Way.

Yeah.

I think most of what went on Tuesday was prowling about with a digital camera or even just a cell phone camera taking pictures of various things that were wanted. And trying to find any inconvenient documents.

I really think most of the physical cleanup took place on Monday.

 

[sreshowtime]

umhuh

 

[travelbug]

It certainly would. If PB's account of the 'conversation' she had with Bob that Monday morning is to be believed, he was irritable and hardly capable of speaking - just gave 'favorable responses'.

Maybe she's a vital last witness (besides son in law) to Bob's condition, just before he disappeared?

If that conversation actually took place was it early after noon, just after noon, around 11:30, etc.) perhaps it was because the last people he felt like speaking to that morning were his daughters. IMHO they would be the reason he might run away from home, not Fontelle.

 

[zwiebel]

On Bob's Namus entry, daughter PB says the call was between 11.30 and 12.noon Monday morning, I recollect. Later, daughter RB posted they found out it was closer to 11.45am, and they knew it was PB's call because the number 'came up as private'.

I'm really not sure how that would prove it was PB's call, though.

And it was in that call PB overheard son in law say he was going to the hardware store. So you can see what that does to the timeline:

11.45 am Bob is in the home, alive and well. Son in law is leaving for the hardware store.

12noon. Housekeeper arrives and sits on stoop, and within minutes son in law returns from his store visit.

So Bob disappeared in a period of around 15 minutes, and son in law managed to go to the store, buy whatever and return, in that same, short period of time.

 

[sreshowtime]

just because a call shows, ( caller id I assume) doesn't necessarily mean any one was spoken to...kwim? Is the landline being referenced? and I don't know if the phone carrier can actually tell if the calls go thru or not, & provide to LE? and any duration? Do they have a way to determine?

I know cells , we can get a complete bill showing calls in and out and duration of minutes, if they are answered.

 

[zwiebel]

This would be on a landline. Daughter said Bob couldn't use a mobile and seemed to find it amusing, so I believe that's the truth.

In the UK, call duration and the number it comes from is always available on normal records (unless someone has a private number, then it's just the duration). There is no way to tell who was speaking, of course. I think you may have to request that service, otherwise all the calls get lumped together under long distance/local, etc.

It doesn't work like that in Germany though, and I've no idea about the US.

Daughters said Bob did not have long distance, so he would not have been able to call Fontelle or other long distance - she would have had to call him all the time. Hopefully, that info is accurate.

 

[Cubby]

On Bob's Namus entry, daughter PB says the call was between 11.30 and 12.noon Monday morning, I recollect. Later, daughter RB posted they found out it was closer to 11.45am, and they knew it was PB's call because the number 'came up as private'.

I'm really not sure how that would prove it was PB's call, though.

And it was in that call PB overheard son in law say he was going to the hardware store. So you can see what that dies to the timeline:

11.45 am Bob is in the home, alive and well. Son in law is leaving for the hardware store.

12noon. Housekeeper arrives and sits on stoop, and within minutes son in law returns from his store visit.

So Bob disappeared in a period of around 15 minutes, and son in law managed to go to the store, buy whatever and return, in that same, short period of time.

IMO, the story about the call from PB was probably from Agnes, if there was a call at all near noon. I think JuM and/or AH checked Bob's caller id, saw there was a call about noon (probably from the housekeeper?) and tried to claim that as their own call to Bob to gap the holes in the timeline.

 

[Cubby]

LE could and I think did obtain phone records. The phone records would indicate if the call was connected or not. So they could tell if someone picked up on Bob's end or not.

I wonder if Bob had a voice mail box from his phone provider.

 

[zwiebel]

RB said Bob switched the answering machine off, when Georgia went into hospital. Sadly, that sounds like the old-fashioned kind on a separate machine, where a person in the home can just delete any stored messages or call numbers.

Thinking back to that photo of Bob though, opening a present at Christmas.....it looks as though he was there alone. So it may have been taken after 2008, when Georgia died. And it did look as though it might have been a new, large-button Panasonic phone, with integral answering machine, maybe?

 

[Grainne Dhu]

This would be on a landline. Daughter said Bob couldn't use a mobile and seemed to find it amusing, so I believe that's the truth.

In the UK, call duration and the number it comes from is always available on normal records (unless someone has a private number, then it's just the duration). There is no way to tell who was speaking, of course. I think you may have to request that service, otherwise all the calls get lumped together under long distance/local, etc.

It doesn't work like that in Germany though, and I've no idea about the US.

Daughters said Bob did not have long distance, so he would not have been able to call Fontelle or other long distance - she would have had to call him all the time. Hopefully, that info is accurate.

Not quite accurate. Even if you only have local service, you can still make long distance phone calls by using calling cards. Or you can buy long distance minutes from a different carrier, where the company gives you a toll-free number to call and a PIN to identify yourself.

 

[travelbug]

IMO, the story about the call from PB was probably from Agnes, if there was a call at all near noon. I think JuM and/or AH checked Bob's caller id, saw there was a call about noon (probably from the housekeeper?) and tried to claim that as their own call to Bob to gap the holes in the timeline.

That was the implication I was making with my post. There was so much fluctuation in the stories, and times, put out there by the daughters that IMHO it casts doubt on everything they say.

 

[zwiebel]

I so agree travelbug. There is so much information that's been put out over the years that doesn't add up. And the avoidance of every subject that really matters in the search for Bob is telling too.

Apparently, one daughter has never even 'felt the need' to ask her brother in law about Her father's disappearance.

Poor, poor Bob. It seems all he has, is the kindness of strangers.

And Mrs Harrod.

And the Orange County Cold Case Unit now. Maybe it was the lack of support for Bob in some quarters that encouraged Placentia PD to ask for outside help. I hope so. That would be fitting.