Daniel Penny on Trial for manslaughter and negligent homicide of Jordan Neely

[Izzylizzy]

You answered my question before I asked it but I’ll ask others who don’t believe Mr Penny is guilty…”Do you wish he had testified or are you glad he didn’t?”

Personally, as someone who believes he is guilty, I would have liked to have heard him testify as I wanted to know what he was thinking when he was warned he could kill Mr Neely. But I think he was smart not to testify.

He couldn't get on the stand with the prosecution having that 30 min video.
The defense's all American patriotic "Danny" boy would be exposed as a blatant liar again and again to the jury.
Unless there's some earth shattering evidence that was presented today by the defense it just shows that having had 3+million in your coffers proves that there are things that money can't buy.

 

[Izzylizzy]

I think that there was enough reasonable doubt and they had his interrogation video so they didn’t think they needed him to take the stand… moo

The defense fought to keep his 30 min interrogation out of evidence and they lost.
He incriminates himself over and over in it and he would have been ripped to shreds had he taken the stand.
Hopefully the prosecution' uses it in closing pointing out all his lies in relation to the video(s).
They may have already done that during the trial but the media coverage is so bad who knows?

jmo

 

[Lilibet]

I see it as he believes he just took some excess garbage out and put it in front of his neighbors house and is being inconvenienced now because someone had the audacity to video him doing so.

Sadly, I’m inclined to agree with you. I hate to think that of my fellow Americans, but I see a cynical intolerance being expressed in the last decade or so. I’m sure some of it is due to being just plain tired of our towns and cities being overrun by those who need intervention and help. It’s scary. Also, intolerance and anger toward people of all kinds, but especially marginalized ones, has become more acceptable IMO.

JMO

 

[Izzylizzy]

I want to get this straight.
The defense called as witnesses just

1. DP's relatives, neighbor,and Marine friends who all testified to a sterling character.

2. The doctor that testified to JB's schizophrenia, K2 addiction and violence.

3. Dr. Chunfru who ran with the SCT/Psychosis and K2 as the cause of JN's death and not the chokehold.

4. Court clerk with the arrest warrant for JN.

Did I miss a martial arts expert or anyone else?

jmo

 

[Izzylizzy]

Hey Dan, then why did you fight to prevent the video being entered as evidence? lol
Shoddy reporting just about everywhere on this case.

"One of Penny’s lawyers, Daniel Kenniff, noted after court that jurors did hear from Penny, in the form of his recorded statements to police minutes and hours after he put Neely in a chokehold."

Daniel Penny doesn't testify as his defense rests in subway chokehold trial

Daniel Penny has chosen not to testify at his trial in the death of an agitated man he choked on a subway train

abcnews.go.com

 

[Izzylizzy]

I find it extremely telling that the defense did not call a martial arts instructor.

I guess money can't buy you everything.

jmo

 

[LinasK]

I find it extremely telling that the defense did not call a martial arts instructor.

I guess money can't buy you everything.

jmo

Nor the Marines, nor police justifying the use of a lethal choke-hold.

 

[Izzylizzy]

Nor the Marines, nor police justifying the use of a lethal choke-hold.

NY Police can't justify it because chokes are illegal for them to use.
The defense had an obscene amount of money at
their disposal and I assume that they paid for all air-fare lodging of the witness that flew in.
Which they should.
Curious if you can also pay a character witness for their testimony too? lol
The prosecution did have DP's Marine martial arts instructor testify and that didn't go well for the defense.
It speaks volumes when you can't even get paid career experts.
I was expecting the best of the best from the defense and all we got was a career forensic expert in private practice who makes 5 million a year doing cases like this and all that was offered up was the SCT which has been disproved in the world of hematology.
jmo

 

[Izzylizzy]

This is very positive for the prosecution.
jmo

"Much of the final day of witness testimony Friday was dedicated to Manhattan Assistant District Attorney Dafna Yoran’s cross-examination of Chundru. Yoran called attention to instances where, she said, Chundru’s testimony contrasted with the findings of other medical professionals, including the American Society of Hematologists, and of his opinions in other cases.

On Friday afternoon, prosecutors also called New York City Police Officer Stephon Joefield as a rebuttal witness, to refute earlier testimony from Chundru that two people at the scene reported Neely was breathing after Penny let him go.

Jurors were shown a police body-camera video of Neely laying on the ground when Joefield responded to the subway. Joefield could be heard saying Neely was breathing. Joefield testified that Neely was unconscious and unresponsive when he arrived. He said he checked Neely’s pulse and that he had one, but that neither he nor his partner had checked whether Neely was breathing.

“I assumed that because he had a pulse that he was breathing,” Joefield testified.

Harris, the medical examiner, previously testified that a pulse can be maintained for about 10 minutes after the brain dies in cases of asphyxial death.'

Daniel Penny won't testify in his manslaughter trial as defense rests in chokehold death case

Daniel Penny is charged with manslaughter in the May 2023 killing of Jordan Neely. The jury is expected to hear closing arguments after Thanksgiving.

www.nbcnews.com

 

[LinasK]

This is very positive for the prosecution.
jmo

<snipped>

Jurors were shown a police body-camera video of Neely laying on the ground when Joefield responded to the subway. Joefield could be heard saying Neely was breathing. Joefield testified that Neely was unconscious and unresponsive when he arrived. He said he checked Neely’s pulse and that he had one, but that neither he nor his partner had checked whether Neely was breathing.

“I assumed that because he had a pulse that he was breathing,” Joefield testified.

Harris, the medical examiner, previously testified that a pulse can be maintained for about 10 minutes after the brain dies in cases of asphyxial death.'

Daniel Penny won't testify in his manslaughter trial as defense rests in chokehold death case

Daniel Penny is charged with manslaughter in the May 2023 killing of Jordan Neely. The jury is expected to hear closing arguments after Thanksgiving.

www.nbcnews.com

Thank you for finding that.

 

[Izzylizzy]

"In a heated, at times confrontational, hours long cross-examination, Dafna Yoran, an assistant district attorney, pushed back at Dr. Chundru’s comments, citing studies that concluded that “sickle cell trait was not associated with a higher risk of death than absence of the trait.”

Dr. Chundru said that people rarely die from the trait alone, but combined with the other factors Mr. Neely faced, it could become deadly.

A person with the sickle cell trait has one of the two genes that are required for sickle cell disease, a painful and sometimes life-threatening condition that can deform red blood cells into crescent shapes that stick together and block blood flow. It’s not the first time the trait has come up in a high-profile case: In the trial of Derek Chauvin, the former police officer who was convicted of murdering George Floyd by kneeling on his neck, defense lawyers unsuccessfully invoked sickle cell as a potential cause of death.'

Penny Trial Defense Shifts Focus From Choke to Sickle Cell and Drug Use

Lawyers for Daniel Penny, who is accused of choking Jordan Neely to death, called an expert who argued that a combination of factors led to Mr. Neely’s death.

www.nytimes.com

 

[Izzylizzy]

Chundru had testified that JN had no broken blood vessels in his eyes and that the bruises on JN's neck did not match up with DP's arm position.
He was proved to be wrong on both counts.
This is yesterday's testimony.
jmo

"Under cross-examination, Assistant Manhattan District Attorney Dafna Yoran was able to get Chundru to acknowledge that video of the chokehold showed Penny’s arm in a “blood choke” position, and that Neely did have matching bruises on his neck. Chundru argued, however, that “You can have a chokehold applied, leave with that kind of injury, and survive.”

“With the video, it gives us the evidence that a chokehold occurred but did not cause the death [of Neely],” Chundru testified after being asked to compare Neely’s death to one of his previous cases.'

Chokehold Did Not Kill Jordan Neely, Forensic Expert Testifies In Daniel Penny’s Defense

A forensic pathologist testified on Thursday that Jordan Neely’s death was caused by the “combined effects” of the synthetic marijuana he was using, his schizophrenia, and other factors. Dr. Satish Chundru reviewed Neely’s autopsy records and video evidence for Daniel Penny’s defense team, the...

www.dailywire.com

 

[fred&edna]

Closing arguments in the case should be interesting.

jmo

 

[shotgun09]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1860137892682826162

 

[Snoopster]

<modsnip>
The jury is now armed with a visual record of the scene. I think they are in a good position to decide on a verdict, whatever that might be.

 

[Cryptic]

I find it extremely telling that the defense did not call a martial arts instructor.

I guess money can't buy you everything.

jmo

Money cant buy everything, but there are attorneys magazines loaded down with ads from many kinds of expert witnesses- all offering to testify with uhmmmm..... "friendly spins" for the defense or for plaintiffs.

Expert martial artists / retired police physical techniques instructors very likely sign on as expert witnesses for far less than the defensive docs did. Thinking that even a fraction of the 3 million dollars raised for the defense could fund a tournament's worth of submission hold implementing and spinning- both literally and figuratively karate guys and girls.

Yet.... as you observed, none were called.

This seems to be a gaping hole that you could drive a subway train through. Why would they allow the prosecution martial arts witness to be the sole, and therefore, most authoritative voice on a very important subject? They challenged the prosecution's doctors, why not challenge their martial artists as well?

 

[Izzylizzy]

Money cant buy everything, but there are attorneys magazines loaded down with ads from many kinds of expert witnesses- all offering to testify with uhmmmm..... "friendly spins" for the defense or for plaintiffs.

Expert martial artists / retired police physical techniques instructors very likely sign on as expert witnesses for far less than the defensive docs did. Thinking that even a fraction of the 3 million dollars raised for the defense could fund a tournament's worth of submission hold implementing and spinning- both literally and figuratively karate guys and girls.

Yet.... as you observed, none were called.

This seems to be a gaping hole that you could drive a subway train through. Why would they allow the prosecution martial arts witness to be the sole, and therefore, most authoritative voice on a very important subject? They challenged the prosecution's doctors, why not challenge their martial artists as well?

IMO:
Not calling a marital art's expert may be due to the conversation DP had with detective Medina during the interrogation video.
Medina was a Marine and did/does Brazillian jiu jitsa and he asked DP was it or it looked like you had him in a "rear naked choke",which is bringing the person down from behind, wrapping a leg around them and with your other hand push down on the person's head.
The Green Belt DP played stupid and said he didn't do or train in Brazilian jiu jitsu and Medina responded with (para) '" but don't the Marines teach that in their martial arts" and DP mumbled something without giving a decisive answer.
Now, if the defense called a MA expert and upon cross the prosecution showed him/her the video and asked what hold that is they would answer a "rear naked choke" and then be asked is a Green Belt taught about lethal chokes and the dire consequences, and the answer would be "yes"
There obviously would be more details in the questioning but that would be the drift.

Moral of the story?
That DP knew exactly what type of chokehold he held JN in for 6mins and that it was lethal which would prove to the jury that DP also lied to Medina about the choke when being interrogated.
The defense tried to get that 30 min video thrown out and it's no wonder.

 

[SugarQueen]

All I will say is given the choice I’d ride with 10 DP’s rather than 1 JN. I don’t believe DP expected JN to die. I DO believe he was justified in trying to stop JN from possibly hurting someone.
I don’t think anyone here believes Neely deserved to die. Some of us just believe it was accidental, and unintentional.

 

[Izzylizzy]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1860137892682826162

So if I have this right the defense is claiming that for the 51 secs that JN was lifeless and DP still held him in the chokehold that he wasn't applying any pressure to JN's neck?
And this somehow warrants DP a pass?

If this is claimed by the defense in closing then I hope the prosecution' rebukes that with it shows that DP knew the man he held in a lethal chokehold became lifeless and as the seconds went on did not show any movement, then why didn't this man who is a Marine Green Belt trained CPR in medical training for emergency situations not perform CPR on Jordan Neely?
jmo

 

[Izzylizzy]

All I will say is given the choice I’d ride with 10 DP’s rather than 1 JN. I don’t believe DP expected JN to die. I DO believe he was justified in trying to stop JN from possibly hurting someone.
I don’t think anyone here believes Neely deserved to die. Some of us just believe it was accidental, and unintentional.

imo:
I believe that DP didn't set out to kill JN.

Yet I also believe that being a Marine Green Belt trained in lethal chokes and the possible dire consequences he was fully equipped along the way to realize that the man he had in the choke was in dire condition and for whatever reason he was totally indifferent about it and continued the chokehold.