GA GA - Shirley, 87, & Russell Dermond, 88, Putnam County, 2 May 2014 - #11

[Deleted member 162919]

I just can't see this murder happening anywhere but the house, there's too much risk. maybe this was all done where RD was beheaded like they contained it all to 1 area. Another easy was to keep blood from going all over would be to bag the head before they hit them.

 

[kirkassoc]

That's what I kept trying to understand, if all bludgeonings or knocks in the head would produce blood all over, I had thought early on like you, she was more fragile

and of course if outside, if there was blood......no traces

I just cannot put together a scenario on how this all played out!

Maybe we're a bit to rational in our thinking. Remember Manson and his helter/skelter? Maybe this was a skelter (unbelievably horrific) without the helter (no evidence left behind, orderly and controlled)....

 

[kirkassoc]

I just can't see this murder happening anywhere but the house, there's too much risk. maybe this was all done where RD was beheaded like they contained it all to 1 area. Another easy was to keep blood from going all over would be to bag the head before they hit them.

Now, THAT's something I hadn't thought of before! BBM. Perhaps they both had their heads covered (blindfolded) before they were struck. Makes a lot of sense.

 

[dancinunderthemoon]

I just can't see this murder happening anywhere but the house, there's too much risk. maybe this was all done where RD was beheaded like they contained it all to 1 area. Another easy was to keep blood from going all over would be to bag the head before they hit them.

well even SS said he was or thought he had been leaning on the car so that would indicate he was hit or shot right there because he was moved a few feet according to drag marks, remember? Still cant understand why they moved him after he was beheaded.

Im not aware of how bullets exit at close range or not, or if a .22 is used or 38...….I kept thinking of the spatter too but yeah that makes sense about the bag on the head, dang, they sure did think it through if they did that, that was mentioned a long while back too but I had forgotten

at any rate, scent dogs apparently didn't find a trail for either, so , then they very well could have been hit there and she carried to the boat......I was always thinking cadaver...they wouldn't hit on a scent but would hit on cadaver or are they the same dog?

 

[dancinunderthemoon]

Now, THAT's something I hadn't thought of before! BBM. Perhaps they both had their heads covered (blindfolded) before they were struck. Makes a lot of sense.

RD it had to be an ambush, they grabbed her and him and as that happened RD was grabbing for SD, then the bags, hmm, now we are thinking 3 animals, 2 to hold, 1 to hit one or both, whoever held him, shot him?Or maybe they fired a warning shot or something...…..

 

[dancinunderthemoon]

Maybe we're a bit to rational in our thinking. Remember Manson and his helter/skelter? Maybe this was a skelter (unbelievably horrific) without the helter (no evidence left behind, orderly and controlled)....

I agree, we don't have a murderers mind so it's hard to fathom anything really

 

[dancinunderthemoon]

I just can't see this murder happening anywhere but the house, there's too much risk. maybe this was all done where RD was beheaded like they contained it all to 1 area. Another easy was to keep blood from going all over would be to bag the head before they hit them.

away from the house in another location is a lot of risk...……..but not anywhere on the grounds except lakeside would be risky

but who that did this, would want to be in the yard, even standing by the garage, in case anyone had walked by...…….

somebody KNEW no one was going to walk by there, who would, they had NO neighbors...except the ONLY neighbors were in Turkey at the time of the murders

but they certainly weren't afraid of any passersby, ...….somebody knew a lot, they also knew someone would come by.....EVENTUALLY but that there was no OTHER family in the area

HA, they left the door unlocked so someone would find them.. clearly they knew the people that would drop in would be friends from the party that they missed

the reason for the towels staunching the blood flow, because they didnt want them foudn right away but they did want them found

Problaby no one would just go inside if it had been Saturday or sunday but too many days had gone by so they HAD to go in

the door was left unlocked lakeside so either the were sloppy or they DID want them found

PEOPLE KEEP ASKING WHY DID THEY TAKE HIS HEAD ADN LEAVE HIM, WHY NOT LEAVE THEM BOTH OR TAKE THEM BOTH

well, they left him there and the door unlocked, staunched the flow of blood, isn't that contradictory? Leave the door unlocked yet....oh..... uuuuhhh, omg, if someone had to use a key it would have been one of their children...…...it's best to let a stranger or friend find the body, they wont be implicated

SD was hauled off to confuse the investigation, you know I guess they didn't care if she was found or not...…….there was no evidence left after 10 days in the water except the manner of death

inheritance paid out, life continues as usual

 

[Deleted member 162919]

I don't think the bodies one being left in the garage and 1 being dumped in the lake were done to confuse the investigation. SS from the beginning split up his team and 1 focused on RD and the other focused on the missing SD until she was found so they failed at confusing investigators if that was their intent. SS has missed something here or overlooked something and he needs to go back from the beginning and start over. To interview that many people and not have any suspects he either asked the wrong questions, or discarded an answer he should have looked into more. My guess is SS has had a suspect since day 1 or 2 but he just can't prove it was that person

 

[kirkassoc]

I wonder that since the murders had happened a few days earlier than when "his" body was discovered, was there no smell? I am so sensitive to smells. I would have thought the moment someone stepped into that house (or at least the garage), that the smell would be overwhelming. Perhaps it was, but I've never seen it mentioned. It was warmer weather also which causes quicker decomposition, I would think?

 

[Deleted member 162919]

I remember hearing the garage was climate controlled so I would think the temp was about 60 degrees. This is where I have experience. I walked into work on a Friday and discovered a coworker sitting at his desk he died of a heart attack sometime Thursday night. There was a nasty odor in the office and a faint smell in the hallway. Coroner said he was dead about 6 hours

 

[dancinunderthemoon]

I don't think the bodies one being left in the garage and 1 being dumped in the lake were done to confuse the investigation. SS from the beginning split up his team and 1 focused on RD and the other focused on the missing SD until she was found so they failed at confusing investigators if that was their intent. SS has missed something here or overlooked something and he needs to go back from the beginning and start over. To interview that many people and not have any suspects he either asked the wrong questions, or discarded an answer he should have looked into more. My guess is SS has had a suspect since day 1 or 2 but he just can't prove it was that person

Probalby right about SS, he questioned the killer I imagine...….but fell thru the cracks...…...and as far as confusing the investigation, it did initially, thinking she was kidnapped but no ransom note, remember the billboards allegedly put up in search of her? Well it gave them that window of opportunity in case they found RD first

I don't know what other reason unless it was to try to get something out of RD but what and who and why?

Unless just a serial killer?

 

[dancinunderthemoon]

I wonder that since the murders had happened a few days earlier than when "his" body was discovered, was there no smell? I am so sensitive to smells. I would have thought the moment someone stepped into that house (or at least the garage), that the smell would be overwhelming. Perhaps it was, but I've never seen it mentioned. It was warmer weather also which causes quicker decomposition, I would think?

Hey Kirk, the garage was air conditioned. I doubt they smelled anything because they rambled thru the house a bit before going INTO the garage, they looked first into the garage to see if the cars were there so then they both went all thru the house then something made HIM go back to garage and step down and walk in between the cars.

 

[dancinunderthemoon]

I remember hearing the garage was climate controlled so I would think the temp was about 60 degrees. This is where I have experience. I walked into work on a Friday and discovered a coworker sitting at his desk he died of a heart attack sometime Thursday night. There was a nasty odor in the office and a faint smell in the hallway. Coroner said he was dead about 6 hours

OMG, terrible Hockeyguy!! Sorry about your co worker!

 

[dancinunderthemoon]

I was just thinking...……..whatever the reasons the murderers handled this the way they did, or whatever they had in mind..……..this whole case is still confusing, the reason it's not solved besides the fact of lack of evidence left behind...…...so I think they DID intend to confuse the investigation as it's STILL under investigation maybe a little anyway.....even tho cold I hope it's not staunched completely! but, had it been a serial murder, there would have been evidence all over I think, like Kirk said this one had not skelter…….. just linking that evidence linking to someone is the problem, they aren't in the data base like so many others in this world who were evenctualy caught... but in this case SS says he has NO evidence...…..not that he doesn't have his suspicions, jeesh, I hope he has SOMEONE in mind that he needs to just find a piece of the puzzle to tie them to it!

 

[Deleted member 162919]

Who knows what data bases he has checked there are many and some are not linked to others

 

[Tripod]

Just checking in. I've been AWOL on this thread recently, but hopefully can spend a little more time here when summer ends. Keep up the good work, guys and gals!

 

[dancinunderthemoon]

Who knows what data bases he has checked there are many and some are not linked to others

so either they aren't in the database or SS hasn't checked them all...…...I have no clue how many he would have to go through or whats tied and what's not, think I"ll check into that for more info

 

[dancinunderthemoon]

Just checking in. I've been AWOL on this thread recently, but hopefully can spend a little more time here when summer ends. Keep up the good work, guys and gals!

Hey Tripod! Welcome back! WE are definitely brainstorming, something must GIVE! LOL

 

[watcher9]

Was the killer banking on RD being found first? What if SD had been found first? If she was unrecognizable, it could have been awhile before they could determine who she was before they could trace her back to her home.

My neighbor told me where to find his key. Did the Dermonds have a key hidden outside? Thieves seem to be able to find hidden keys. Could they have let a neighbor or two know where they hid a key?

 

[dancinunderthemoon]

Hmm, hadn't thought of that angle, well maybe I have, I guess in my mind I was thinking that the killers knew about the derby party and that someone would find him soon enough, but CLEARLY didnt want him found for a few days or more due to the towels used to stop blood going under garage doors into driveway....then they'd find her if she surfaced, I don't really think they meant for her to be hidden forever, ok if she was, ok if she wasn't, they got away, no evidence and any on her was washed away

She was in the tree stump part of the lake along the main river around many popular fishing spots......ha, the very reason she was found, probably hadn't surfaced until that day, boom, found by a fisherman, even SS said they would have found her that day too because he had patrols on the lake every day and she hadn't been spotted yet, so to find her the day she surfaced...…..interesting, not like no one would see her passing by, the fisherman thought it was a buoy, how obvious...…….didn't hide her very well to not want her to be found

If their children were being honest the D's were VERY particular about setting alarms, so I would imagine they did not have a key outside, but they could have, though that would contradict their safety habits IMO

Just tuned into ID channel and the investigator JUST said, the majority of times the killer is the one who finds the body

SO whoever did this, knew they couldnt be the ones to call in the find...…. hmmm ORR even call in for a welfare check if you want to distance yourself! WOW

Brad talked to his dad on Thurday before the murder, his sister, 10 days earlier or less, had visted

sorry to ramble

Was the killer banking on RD being found first? What if SD had been found first? If she was unrecognizable, it could have been awhile before they could determine who she was before they could trace her back to her home.

My neighbor told me where to find his key. Did the Dermonds have a key hidden outside? Thieves seem to be able to find hidden keys. Could they have let a neighbor or two know where they hid a key?