Phone Calls and Phone Records

[BigCityAccountant]

I had wondered about the area codes myself.... the only thing that I can think of is, where she was calling at the time, she was considered "local" and didn't have to dial the area code? If she was "out of the area" she had to dial area code?

The province I live in, in the past few years, has transitioned into dialing the area code (finally needed 2 area codes ... we are small haha), regardless if local or not. We went through a very long transition time too, where you could dial it or not and still get through.


ETA: btw ... Hi Mystic :wave:

Yes, that is exactly what I think too! Ditto on the Hi Mystic!

 

[BigCityAccountant]

Right she didn't dial outside of her area code that day at all. And the only ones on her network were also in her area showing the 920 area code that she was also in. The blank ones could be from anywhere as they were not on her network. This is how I understood it in the testimony from the cellphone person. I will look for it.


ETA
I am wrong the testimony says any blank ones are incoming and that they dont show any incoming. But what im confused about is why some show the area code and some don't if they are all outgoing?

Conceding again--Missy you were right!

 

[missy1974]

LOL poor BCA! I couldn't help but think this morning that you needed sleep and coffee and all will be good again LOL

 

[dexter75]

I have fallen asleep, mid post here before:blushing:

More than once..FWIW

LOL poor BCA! I couldn't help but think this morning that you needed sleep and coffee and all will be good again LOL

 

[Limaes]

Limaes ~ I disagree, it's not in the testimony.

JZ's testimony~
Q. So I guess mid-afternoon could have been 2, 2:30 possibly?
A. Could have been.
Q. Could have been 3:00?
A. Could have been.
Q. Could have been 3:30 or a little after that, something like that, but sometime in the middle of the afternoon?
A. Yes.

That small snippet of testimony is the result of the Defense leading the witness. This is what her testimony finished off on.

Dawn ~ no one said she was in on the coverup, but she can be wrong in how she is remembering things IMO Like her calling TH... not TH calling her. By the way, there is no verification with any phone records other than times of incoming calls. There is nothing admitted into evidence that shows who those incoming calls are from. Shoot, TH's phone records that were admitted even say on them that they may not be complete, and SA's records were made up on a spreadsheet (not even by the person that testified about them )IIRC

If they're incomplete, doesn't meant they're incorrect and I believe they do state Teresa called AT. The important thing is the timing means that she had finished at the Z's and at that stage was aware that she was to go to the "Avery Brothers" (she never said SA and probably was unaware it was he who booked her until she got there).

SA calling TH ~ those calls were not long, one didn't even get through to her phone (he hung up before it connected), and the other was 8 seconds on her phone, 7 on his. IMO not long enough for a conversation.

Teresa stated in her voicemail to the Janda/Dassey number that she could not come unless they called her with the address - which MaM gobsmackingly left out of the show. Who called her with the address then? It is no coincidence that Teresa phoned Dawn 3 mins after Avery's call telling her it was the Avery Bros.

This is the part of Teresa's message that MaM cut off

If KZ has more data related to these cell phones and cell pings, and she has indicated that she does, I have to think that Strang and Buting did "screw up", which I kind of already figured LOL Also.... I'm still not sure whether I believe she went to Zipperer's or Avery's first, at this point it's like the 'chicken and the egg' for me. I don't see any solid evidence of either, and I could make those calls fit both "stories". JMO

TBH I wouldn't be suprised if KZ walks without stepping inside the courtroom.


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[BigCityAccountant]

I think we started the discussion by discussing if SA called with the address or how TH got the address, correct? We also discussed who called at 1:54 pm--I know I've posted this before--but could it be possible that the 1:54 pm call would have been someone at Auto Trader texting the address to TH? I know I've asked the question before because the from message is different than the other messages. She would have been on the road at the time heading to GZ, it would also explain why she called Auto Trader possibly AFTER she saw the address. It would also explain Dawn's testimony.

For instance, if she received the text with the address, then finished at GZ, looked at the text and said Oh, that's the Avery's. Called Dawn and said Oh yeah, that's the Avery Brothers. That would all make sense. So, now the question is--Could it be possible the phone number listed belongs to Dawn or Angela or someone else that worked at Auto Trader?

 

[Limaes]

You have to factor SA's 2.24pm call to Teresa into the timeline. Imo, it is no coincidence that she called Auto Trader immediately after his call and told Dawn who it was.

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[missy1974]

BCA ~ I don't think those messages are text messages, they are all voicemail messages. So whoever left her that message, it was a VM. JMO


As for TH calling AutoTrader at 2:27pm.... there is an INCOMING call at that time, she can't have an incoming call and call AutoTrader at the same time, I do believe that would be physically impossible IMO Which would mean that Dawn was WRONG.

I personally have come to the conclusion that Dawn or maybe Angela (or is it possible that SA called her directly in one of the morning calls before TH checked her messages?) gave TH the phone number and TH called before she was faxed the sheet that had the address on it. Just by her message that she left, saying that she didn't have the address or anything.

 

[missy1974]

the 2:24pm call was 8 seconds long on TH's records, 7 seconds on SA's records (most likely went to VM and he hung up before the beep) IMO

Kratz spreadsheet:
http://www.stevenaverycase.org/wp-c...nd-362-Auto-Trader-Appt-and-Phone-Records.pdf

TH's records
http://www.stevenaverycase.org/wp-c...Trial-Exhibit-361-Halbach-Cingular-Report.pdf

SA's records
http://www.stevenaverycase.org/wp-c...rial-Exhibit-359-Avery-Call-Log-2005Oct31.pdf

 

[ZOOL]

Has there been any discussion that 9202278985 belongs to a telemarketer "Global Crossing Telemangement, Inc." in Madison, Wisconsin?

 

[Limaes]

BCA ~ I don't think those messages are text messages, they are all voicemail messages. So whoever left her that message, it was a VM. JMO


As for TH calling AutoTrader at 2:27pm.... there is an INCOMING call at that time, she can't have an incoming call and call AutoTrader at the same time, I do believe that would be physically impossible IMO Which would mean that Dawn was WRONG.

I personally have come to the conclusion that Dawn or maybe Angela (or is it possible that SA called her directly in one of the morning calls before TH checked her messages?) gave TH the phone number and TH called before she was faxed the sheet that had the address on it. Just by her message that she left, saying that she didn't have the address or anything.

Yes yes, it WAS an incoming call to Teresa at 2.27pm. However it was Teresa who told them, not the other way around. How would they know the address? There is no testimony that SA called AT again to leave an address.

He called her directly. His records only show three calls to her and only one of them was prior to 2.27pm.



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[Limaes]

the 2:24pm call was 8 seconds long on TH's records, 7 seconds on SA's records (most likely went to VM and he hung up before the beep) IMO

Kratz spreadsheet:
http://www.stevenaverycase.org/wp-c...nd-362-Auto-Trader-Appt-and-Phone-Records.pdf

TH's records
http://www.stevenaverycase.org/wp-c...Trial-Exhibit-361-Halbach-Cingular-Report.pdf

SA's records
http://www.stevenaverycase.org/wp-c...rial-Exhibit-359-Avery-Call-Log-2005Oct31.pdf

If SA is calling her at 2.24 and then again at 2.35, then she hadn't arrived yet which destroys the theory that she went to Avery's before the Z's. You can say more in 8 seconds than you think.

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[missy1974]

Yes yes, it WAS an incoming call to Teresa at 2.27pm. However it was Teresa who told them, not the other way around. How would they know the address? There is no testimony that SA called AT again to leave an address.

He called her directly. His records only show three calls to her and only one of them was prior to 2.27pm.



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Here is the document that Dawn testified to faxing to TH.

1st page
http://www.stevenaverycase.org/wp-c...nd-362-Auto-Trader-Appt-and-Phone-Records.pdf

Dawn also testified to getting the address from SA when he called at 8:12am (Day 2, page 76)

Q. Did he provide you an address where he wanted this photo to be taken?

A. Yes, he did.

Q. Did he provide you an address where he wanted this photo to be taken?

A. Yes, he did.

Angela (also from AutoTrader), states that TH called (which is not on the records we have) while Dawn was on her lunch and TH said sure she can do the job, get Dawn to fax me the information when she is back from lunch. Someone, whether it was Angela, or Dawn in her earlier message, must have left Barb's phone number, because TH had it and called it at 11:43 and at that time, according to her recorded message, she did not have the address yet, but according to page one of the link above, it does have the address, TH just didn't have it at 11:43 apparently.

 

[Limaes]

I've seen the transcript. If Teresa stated she didn't have the address then she couldn't have had it.

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[Hippiemomof5]

Do we not know the time the fax was sent? I'm assuming after 11:35 but before the 2:27 call from AT.

 

[missy1974]

Do we not know the time the fax was sent? I'm assuming after 11:35 but before the 2:27 call from AT.

There is no time in the trial transcripts or on the paper in the exhibit. It was after Dawn's lunch break. I'm not sure if that form is Dawn's or AutoTrader's copy, or if they found it at TH's, but I'm guessing not at her place, because that would add a whole new can of worms if this sheet was sitting on her desk, wouldn't it?

 

[BigCityAccountant]

You have to factor SA's 2.24pm call to Teresa into the timeline. Imo, it is no coincidence that she called Auto Trader immediately after his call and told Dawn who it was.

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But, she wouldn't have known it was SA--the call was blocked. She would have only seen "Restricted Number"

 

[BigCityAccountant]

Here is the document that Dawn testified to faxing to TH.

1st page
http://www.stevenaverycase.org/wp-c...nd-362-Auto-Trader-Appt-and-Phone-Records.pdf

Dawn also testified to getting the address from SA when he called at 8:12am (Day 2, page 76)

Q. Did he provide you an address where he wanted this photo to be taken?

A. Yes, he did.

Q. Did he provide you an address where he wanted this photo to be taken?

A. Yes, he did.

Angela (also from AutoTrader), states that TH called (which is not on the records we have) while Dawn was on her lunch and TH said sure she can do the job, get Dawn to fax me the information when she is back from lunch. Someone, whether it was Angela, or Dawn in her earlier message, must have left Barb's phone number, because TH had it and called it at 11:43 and at that time, according to her recorded message, she did not have the address yet, but according to page one of the link above, it does have the address, TH just didn't have it at 11:43 apparently.

There were 2 incoming calls prior to the 11:43 am outgoing call to BJ. We have no idea how long Dawn takes lunch, we do know so starts very early in the morning, so for her to talk lunch at 11:00 am would not be out of the question. It is possible that Dawn takes about 1/2 hour lunch, which could put her back around the 11:25 am call. Could the 11:10 am call be Angela from Auto Trader, possibly. Could the 11:25 am call be, possibly. We have no way of knowing without the full detail of all of the calls.

 

[missy1974]

There were 2 incoming calls prior to the 11:43 am outgoing call to BJ. We have no idea how long Dawn takes lunch, we do know so starts very early in the morning, so for her to talk lunch at 11:00 am would not be out of the question. It is possible that Dawn takes about 1/2 hour lunch, which could put her back around the 11:25 am call. Could the 11:10 am call be Angela from Auto Trader, possibly. Could the 11:25 am call be, possibly. We have no way of knowing without the full detail of all of the calls.

It's a little frustrating, isn't it? I don't know if I have ever followed a case that didn't look into phone/cell records in more depth. They may have had the more detailed cell information, but I don't know if they had more in terms of incoming calls.

TH actually had 4 incoming calls before she checked her VM at 11:04am, at 8:17, 9:46, 10:44 and 10:52am.

She checked voicemail at 11:04am.

And then she had 2 after she checked her messages, 11:10 and 11:25am, before she started making calls to what looks like customers she was going to see.

I think it was RH who said she usually slept late (not sure if just on Monday's or not... not sure how he knows this since he doesn't spend much time over there *sarcasm*)

 

[Limaes]

But, she wouldn't have known it was SA--the call was blocked. She would have only seen "Restricted Number"

That is what he wanted BCA.

As far as he knew, she did not know where the address was because that is what she said in the voicemail. If that is not the reason he was calling her, then just why was he calling her?



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