Madeleine McCann: German prisoner identified as suspect - #15

[haden]

Where CB and his legal team may fall down though is that he has already been interviewed in relation to the matter in 2013 after the police sent him a summons. Depending on what he said at the time, evidence that has since been gathered may prove he lied.

"The man, who we have agreed not to name, added: “Christian said ‘just because I was in Portugal 12 years, they send me this.

“‘Just because I was living there at the time and also in that time frame I was close by. Just because I was living out of a van’.

“He kept going on about it and waving the paper around saying, ‘I have nothing to do with this, they are trying to get me’.

“It was like he had rehearsed what he was saying.”

The friend added: “He said that he went to answer the summons and he told police that he had nothing to do with it.

“I asked him ‘but why say that as you’re only a witness?’ He just said ‘let’s have a party!’.

“He told me, ‘they asked me a load of questions and I answered them’. Then he said, ‘they’ve got nothing on me. They can’t get me’.”

Madeleine McCann suspect 'joked he had hid her in cellar' claims sickened ex-pal

Yes! The questioning was 8 years ago. I hope it was filmed. And I hope the lawyer doesn't get this video.

 

[enjy15]

Not being caught for those type of crimes doesn't necessarily mean you haven't committed them. Besides, as you say the rape was indeed violent.

There's also numerous reports of unhinged behaviour and attacks. He beat some of his previous girlfriends. There was another report from a classmate who CB was bullying and who CB attacked. There was also a report of him getting into a barfight in Portugal. And of course the freezer at the kiosk debacle where he turned up with armed thugs to intimidate the owner. And he frequently owned a gun, getting convicted twice for illegally carrying one.

While there may be no firm evidence yet of any murderous intent, there is certainly evidence of violent and aggressive behaviour. Although regarding murderous intent as well, he did threaten to kill one of his ex-girfriends and/or their family members if I recall correctly. And on the skype chat he also claimed he wanted to kill his victim once he'd finished abusing them.

No absolutely - I mean as in I can’t believe he hasn’t been caught before as he obviously is violent but he’s only been caught of 1 violent crime. It’s just shocking if he is guilty of MM and any other of the murders he’s linked with that he has got away with it for so long!

 

[JugsAndTugs]

in all the photos we have seen he has never looked at all overweight

Is pot belly a term for overweight? Not being pedantic but I’d think it’s more of little gut and if he wore loose fitting clothing that could hide the fact..

I’m really just brainstorming in all fairness, this is torture waiting on more news.

 

[mrjitty]

Where CB and his legal team may fall down though is that he has already been interviewed in relation to the matter in 2013 after the police sent him a summons. Depending on what he said at the time, evidence that has since been gathered may prove he lied.

"The man, who we have agreed not to name, added: “Christian said ‘just because I was in Portugal 12 years, they send me this.

“‘Just because I was living there at the time and also in that time frame I was close by. Just because I was living out of a van’.

“He kept going on about it and waving the paper around saying, ‘I have nothing to do with this, they are trying to get me’.

“It was like he had rehearsed what he was saying.”

The friend added: “He said that he went to answer the summons and he told police that he had nothing to do with it.

“I asked him ‘but why say that as you’re only a witness?’ He just said ‘let’s have a party!’.

“He told me, ‘they asked me a load of questions and I answered them’. Then he said, ‘they’ve got nothing on me. They can’t get me’.”

Madeleine McCann suspect 'joked he had hid her in cellar' claims sickened ex-pal

Yes.

Although again all this would depend on him being charged, at which point he could be confronted with these contradictions.

Wonder if he had legal representation at that interview?

 

[mrjitty]

No absolutely - I mean as in I can’t believe he hasn’t been caught before as he obviously is violent but he’s only been caught of 1 violent crime. It’s just shocking if he is guilty of MM and any other of the murders he’s linked with that he has got away with it for so long!

It's really not that unusual.

In my apartment block there was a guy who lived below us who was a known drug dealer and we routinely called the police on him due to his domestic incidents. He loved threatening other residents.

Sadly these kind of abusive people get away with violence against women for years.

But in any event, i would like to see evidence of murder, before tabloids start "linking" him to multiple murders all over europe.

 

[redplanet]

Different apartment but same shutter design and sliding window design. At 1:10 in video is very good demonstration of opening the closed shutter and also the sliding window, all from outside with no tools.
Espacio Exterior: The "burglary that went wrong" theory of the abduction of Madeleine McCann

 

[worldwatcher]

Different apartment but same shutter design and sliding window design. At 1:10 in video is very good demonstration of opening the closed shutter and also the sliding window, all from outside with no tools.
Espacio Exterior: The "burglary that went wrong" theorie of the abduction of Madeleine McCann

I know.. I asked it before (in general) but do you think it was an easy slip / way out, with a 3/4 yr old child, size of Madeline?
I mean... the window looks kinda small imo so it would have been difficult if this was a 1 person act? If he had someone on the look out,he could have been warned/signaled that one of the T7 came to check (and heard that noise,without checking?) And handed her over to another person from outside the window...

 

[tedtink]

Where CB and his legal team may fall down though is that he has already been interviewed in relation to the matter in 2013 after the police sent him a summons. Depending on what he said at the time, evidence that has since been gathered may prove he lied.

"The man, who we have agreed not to name, added: “Christian said ‘just because I was in Portugal 12 years, they send me this.

“‘Just because I was living there at the time and also in that time frame I was close by. Just because I was living out of a van’.

“He kept going on about it and waving the paper around saying, ‘I have nothing to do with this, they are trying to get me’.

“It was like he had rehearsed what he was saying.”

The friend added: “He said that he went to answer the summons and he told police that he had nothing to do with it.

“I asked him ‘but why say that as you’re only a witness?’ He just said ‘let’s have a party!’.

“He told me, ‘they asked me a load of questions and I answered them’. Then he said, ‘they’ve got nothing on me. They can’t get me’.”

Madeleine McCann suspect 'joked he had hid her in cellar' claims sickened ex-pal

Agree.

I've been thinking about what Fulscher said yesterday too.

"I was very surprised because the police had known for over two years that the garden was used by my client. I think the prosecutors are trying to influence the decision of the European Court by making bad media."

I wonder whether CB discussed the allotment when he was interviewed by LE in 2013 re MM?
LE wouldn't have given this info to the Lawyer, so it must have been CB who told the Lawyer himself.

 

[Okapi]

Coming back to the question of whether it was an abandoned burglary/opportunistic abduction OR a planned abduction, I think it might have been both.

I wondered if it was possible CB initially scouted the apartment to rob, and had a look around (including the wardrobe in the main bedroom), leaving scents later detected by the cadaver dog. (See posts earlier in this thread about the possibility of scent trails from clothing or shoes). The cadaver alerts are indicated in a great diagram here:

Madeleine McCann: jaw-dropping footage of dogs alerting in McCann apartment and car

Also HB described how her attacker (possibly CB) had intruded her apartment before the night of her attack.

So, he may have been in the apartment to reccie, maybe to see if a burglary was more worthwhile, or an abduction. He may have already seen MBM in the resort, or may have realized children were staying here after this initial trespass.

He then switched to an abduction plan. After recccies on the McCanns' routines and movements (witness accounts of blonde man/men observing the apartment), he returned to abduct the child.

That may account for both scenarios but it is of course just MOO.

 

[MENDEL]

Different apartment but same shutter design and sliding window design. At 1:10 in video is very good demonstration of opening the closed shutter and also the sliding window, all from outside with no tools.
Espacio Exterior: The "burglary that went wrong" theory of the abduction of Madeleine McCann

I don't take the thesis of burglary gone wrong. Nothing can support that except fertile imagination. Sorry, but we can't see how much closed were shutters before lifting and he's counting on a open window, something unwarranted.

Shutters had two thumb prints in the middle on the outside. So either shutters had been repaired some time before or those were intruder's as those prints are unlikely under normal usage. If so, to make those marks consistent then he had shutters fully closed and had to use some tool to lift them enough to keep lifting the rest by him. Now we have windows issue. If he couldn't be sure they were open, and quite likely he couldn't, then he had to have a away to open them swiftly from outside.

Nothing here is covered by video where a possibly partly lifted shutter is half lifted and a window is already open.

 

[redplanet]

I know.. I asked it before (in general) but do you think it was an easy slip / way out, with a 3/4 yr old child, size of Madeline?
I mean... the window looks kinda small imo so it would have been difficult if this was a 1 person act? If he had someone on the look out,he could have been warned/signaled that one of the T7 came to check (and heard that noise,without checking?) And handed her over to another person from outside the window...

After opening shutter and window as demonstrated in video I thank it is very easy for the intruder to climb in the opening is plenty big enough. I agree that climbing out the same opening carrying a child is difficult but there is no need for the intruder to do that because once inside he can easily exit through the door which faces the car park, IMO.

 

[MENDEL]

After opening shutter and window as demonstrated in video I thank it is very easy for the intruder to climb in the opening is plenty big enough. I agree that climbing out the same opening carrying a child is difficult but there is no need for the intruder to do that because once inside he can easily exit through the door which faces the car park, IMO.

Just a question. No one knows for sure if doors were closed or open. But let me know if you use to leave doors open (including on latch) when you take holidays? I spent some time in a hotel recently and I always made sure balcony and room's doors were locked before leaving room. If he entered though windows, and he probably did, then he left though them. If not for any other reason at least for the sake of time sparing. Also, windows are 91cm from floor, something quite easy for a 180cm guy to pass though both ways even with a small child.

 

[Dlk79]

Just a question. No one knows for sure if doors were closed or open. But let me know if you use to leave doors open (including on latch) when you take holidays? I spent time in a hotel recently and I always made sure balcony and room's doors were locked before leaving room. If he entered though windows, and he probably did, then he left though it. If not for any other reason at least for the sake of time sparing. Also, windows are 91cm from floor something quite easy for a 180cm guy to pass though both ways even with a small child.

Patio doors were definitely unlocked. They can only be locked from the inside and GM, MO and KM all acknowledged this is how they entered and left the apartment.

GM stated in his second interview, the front door was probably left unlocked too. But that door can only be opened from outside with a key since it has a latch. Can be opened from the inside using the knob.

KM said she cannot recall whether the sliding window was locked or not but believes it was closed. The shutters themselves have no locking mechanism.

 

[redplanet]

I don't take the thesis of burglary gone wrong. Nothing can support that except fertile imagination. Sorry, but we can't see how much closed were shutters before lifting and he's counting on a open window, something unwarranted.

Shutters had two thumb prints in the middle on the outside. So either shutters had been repaired some time before or those were intruder's as those prints are unlikely under normal usage. If so, to make those marks consistent then he had shutters fully closed and had to use some tool to lift them enough to keep lifting the rest by him. Now we have windows issue. If he couldn't be sure they were open, and quite likely he couldn't, then he had to have a away to open them swiftly from outside.

Nothing here is covered by video where a possibly partly lifted shutter is half lifted and a window is already open.

Good point: how does he initiate raising shutter from fully closed status?

 

[MENDEL]

Patio doors were definitely unlocked. They can only be locked from the inside and GM, MO and KM all acknowledged this is how they entered and left the apartment.

GM stated in his second interview, the front door was probably left unlocked too. But that door can only be opened from outside with a key since it has a latch. Can be opened from the inside using the knob.

KM said she cannot recall whether the sliding window was locked or not but believes it was closed. The shutters themselves have no locking mechanism.

DLK, it would be quite unusual to have doors unlocked on holidays. Anyway a window was used almost for sure and so doors weren't used whatever their status IMO.

 

[Newthoughts]

Agree.

I've been thinking about what Fulscher said yesterday too.

"I was very surprised because the police had known for over two years that the garden was used by my client. I think the prosecutors are trying to influence the decision of the European Court by making bad media."

I wonder whether CB discussed the allotment when he was interviewed by LE in 2013 re MM?
LE wouldn't have given this info to the Lawyer, so it must have been CB who told the Lawyer himself.

I think it's telling that while the search was ongoing CB's lawyer seemingly dropped his appeal only to say it was going ahead after the search.

I'm trying to come up with a reason in my head and all I can come up with is that there was definitely something significant there to find which spooked them into assuming the appeal would be pointless and that they are now assuming it wasn't found. My opinions only.

As LE aren't giving anything away and haven't yet charged or even arrested CB for anything to do with MM I wonder if what they could only have seen on MSM has reassured them. Either that the search didn't pinpoint an exact location or no statement or arrest was made

 

[MENDEL]

Good point: how does he initiate raising shutter from fully closed status?

I guess that if you put a metal tool from outside like a small screwdriver you can lift it enough to grab it and lift the rest you. That would explain those thumb prints in the middle on the outside as he likely had thumbs in that position when using tool.

 

[enjy15]

Coming back to the question of whether it was an abandoned burglary/opportunistic abduction OR a planned abduction, I think it might have been both.

I wondered if it was possible CB initially scouted the apartment to rob, and had a look around (including the wardrobe in the main bedroom), leaving scents later detected by the cadaver dog. (See posts earlier in this thread about the possibility of scent trails from clothing or shoes). The cadaver alerts are indicated in a great diagram here:

Madeleine McCann: jaw-dropping footage of dogs alerting in McCann apartment and car

Also HB described how her attacker (possibly CB) had intruded her apartment before the night of her attack.

So, he may have been in the apartment to reccie, maybe to see if a burglary was more worthwhile, or an abduction. He may have already seen MBM in the resort, or may have realized children were staying here after this initial trespass.

He then switched to an abduction plan. After recccies on the McCanns' routines and movements (witness accounts of blonde man/men observing the apartment), he returned to abduct the child.

That may account for both scenarios but it is of course just MOO.

I think when MM said “why didn’t you come when me and Sean were crying” to her parents is when CB may have tried to burgle the house, he might have woken MM panicked and ran (like he did when the young girls caught him doing a sex act in the room they were sleeping) MM may have been crying for her mum or dad so CB expected her parents to be there. Or he went in and then one of the T7 came back. I think he realised they were alone for certain periods of time and tried his luck the next night and changed his plans for from burglary to abduction.

If the door was unlocked from the inside though she could have been lured out hence why there was no evidence of abduction.

 

[MENDEL]

I think when MM said “why didn’t you come when me and Sean were crying” to her parents is when CB may have tried to burgle the house, he might have woken MM panicked and ran (like he did when the young girls caught him doing a sex act in the room they were sleeping) MM may have been crying for her mum or dad so CB expected her parents to be there. I think he realised they were alone and tried his luck the next night and changed his plans for from burglary to abduction.

If the door was unlocked from the inside though she could have been lured out hence why there was no evidence of abduction.

That makes sense indeed. That way he planned abduction as he had to under whatever scenario. Going there for burglary and leaving with a child is absolute nonsense to be nice.

 

[tedtink]

I think it's telling that while the search was ongoing CB's lawyer seemingly dropped his appeal only to say it was going ahead after the search.

I'm trying to come up with a reason in my head and all I can come up with is that there was definitely something significant there to find which spooked them into assuming the appeal would be pointless and that they are now assuming it wasn't found. My opinions only.

As LE aren't giving anything away and haven't yet charged or even arrested CB for anything to do with MM I wonder if what they could only have seen on MSM has reassured them. Either that the search didn't pinpoint an exact location or no statement or arrest was made

Perhaps CB is volunteering little information to his Lawyer too regarding the 2013 questioning?