Australia - 3 dead after eating wild mushrooms, Leongatha, Victoria, Aug 2023 #10 *Arrest*

[Scuffy35]

On a jury, you focus on exactly what the judge tells you and nothing else. Most jurors take their job extremely seriously. I've been a panel member on several cases - murder, major fraud, drugs possession/dealing, illegal use of a car,

With a complicated time line such as this case, and the disjointed sequence of events as they are presented by the various witnesses, do the jury create or draw up a detailed timeline of events and pieces from the witness testimonies? I have never been on a jury, but it would be something I think would be necessary as an agreed basis for the jury deliberations by first going through all he testimony and opening/closing address transcripts to build this timeline up.

I know that the prosecution (and maybe the defence) would probably go through a sequencing of events and also joining some of the dots (eg the death cap mushroom photo that an expert was asked to identify was the same phot that the digital expert later shoed was from Erin's tablet), during their closing address, but I don't imagine it would be complete or detailed enough.

 

[Cliff Hardy]

It think it’s a stretch to suggest she might poison her kids.

It was a stretch believing she might poison her in-laws too but is looking more and more likely she did.

 

[Spectrix]

(eg the death cap mushroom photo that an expert was asked to identify was the same phot that the digital expert later shoed was from Erin's tablet),

@Scuffy35, can you please elaborate on this? I obviously missed this link in the haphazard reporting.

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[Deleted member 363451]

As far as I’m aware her online friends were her social world.


This is why I find it baffling that it could be deemed accidental. This level of alleged planning is problematic for Erins defence IMO.

It will be Interesting to see what the jurors conclusions on this will be and whether they find this along with the other post event behaviours as compelling enough in totality for a guilty verdict, or whether it’s not quite enough to get them over the line, and she’s acquitted.

I still think that she'll either get off or receive a minimum sentence.

 

[HoneyBunOne]

@Scuffy35, can you please elaborate on this? I obviously missed this link in the haphazard reporting.

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The mushroom expert earlier in the trial was shown a series of mushrooms and correctly identified them all I believe, showing his expertise. It turns out one he named as a death cap was later shown to be Erin's photo. That's the short version anyway.

 

[Jake18]

@Scuffy35, can you please elaborate on this? I obviously missed this link in the haphazard reporting.

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When Dr Tom May was testifying he was shown a photo by the prosecution of mushrooms in a dehydrator. No additional context was given. He identified the mushrooms with “reasonable certainty” as being Death Cap mushrooms.

Last week it transpired that the photo was one that had been found on one of EP’s devices.

 

[BreakingNews]

With a complicated time line such as this case, and the disjointed sequence of events as they are presented by the various witnesses, do the jury create or draw up a detailed timeline of events and pieces from the witness testimonies? I have never been on a jury, but it would be something I think would be necessary as an agreed basis for the jury deliberations by first going through all he testimony and opening/closing address transcripts to build this timeline up.

I know that the prosecution (and maybe the defence) would probably go through a sequencing of events and also joining some of the dots (eg the death cap mushroom photo that an expert was asked to identify was the same phot that the digital expert later shoed was from Erin's tablet), during their closing address, but I don't imagine it would be complete or detailed enough.

The murder trial I was on was quite straight forward re timelines. The judge, like in this trial, tells the jury what they need to focus on. The final summing up of prosecution and defence is very important for jurors, as is the final summing up of the judge. This can take days.

 

[Scuffy35]

@Scuffy35, can you please elaborate on this? I obviously missed this link in the haphazard reporting.

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It was in one of the ABC Mushroom Daily Podcasts.

 

[katydid23]

The murder trial I was on was quite straight forward re timelines. The judge, like in this trial, tells the jury what they need to focus on. The final summing up of prosecution and defence is very important for jurors, as is the final summing up of the judge. This can take days.

I think if we were watching the full trial, the timeline and the evidence would be pretty organised and clear. But we are watching a trial by tweets. It's really hard to understand the cohesive case when we are getting assorted tidbits here and there, Let alone, the occasional conflicting reports.

 

[Warshawski]

As far as I’m aware her online friends were her social world.


This is why I find it baffling that it could be deemed accidental. This level of alleged planning is problematic for Erins defence IMO.

It will be Interesting to see what the jurors conclusions on this will be and whether they find this along with the other post event behaviours as compelling enough in totality for a guilty verdict, or whether it’s not quite enough to get them over the line, and she’s acquitted.

I think the Defence knows they are pushing it up hill, but reality is that they only have to confuse One member of the jury enough so they’re not comfortable with a Guilty verdict. … for her to be determined Guilty, the jury must be unanimous in that decision.

 

[Spectrix]

Of course, putting them in brownies is odd but there are recipes for beetroot in various cakes, for eg, why not mushrooms. They are full of protein, great for growing bodies. She might have been experimenting to check detection but imho, it’s not relevant as she cooked a dish with mushroom paste.

Beetroot is sometimes used as a natural colouring agent in cakes. Mushrooms are not.
As much as I love mushrooms, I feel like their nutritional content has been overly exaggerated in this thread.
She's not mixing mushrooms into the children's brownies because they're some kind of magical superfood.
They're just not.

• Protein: 2.2%
• Carbohydrates: 5.3%
• Dietary Fibre: 2.1%
• Fat: 0.5%
• Water 90%

Erin recounted to the child protection worker that she'd planned to use the dried mushrooms in a Carbonara but decided not to because they had "a very unpleasant smell."
So, did she throw them away? No. She disguised them in individually wrapped beef wellingtons and fed them to her in-laws.

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[Auntie Cipation]

We don’t know if EP had hobbies other than on-line sleuthing

W-w-w-what's wrong with having online sleuthing be one's primary hobby?

 

[Spectrix]

W-w-w-what's wrong with having online sleuthing be one's primary hobby?

That probably describes most of the members on this forum

 

[MsMarple]

Beetroot is sometimes used as a natural colouring agent in cakes. Mushrooms are not.
As much as I love mushrooms, I feel like their nutritional content has been overly exaggerated in this thread.
She's not mixing mushrooms into the children's brownies because they're some kind of magical superfood.
They're just not.

• Protein: 2.2%
• Carbohydrates: 5.3%
• Dietary Fibre: 2.1%
• Fat: 0.5%
• Water 90%

Erin recounted to the child protection worker that she'd planned to use the dried mushrooms in a Carbonara but decided not to because they had "a very unpleasant smell."
So, did she throw them away? No. She disguised them in individually wrapped beef wellingtons and fed them to her in-laws.

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Plus, thus far there haven’t been any social media posts or browser searches indicating Erin had an interest in the nutritional value of mushrooms, powdered or not.

Perhaps her defense will enter something into evidence but right now we’ve only read about Erin conducting taste tests on her children. That sounds (to me) more like an experiment in detecting the mushroom flavor rather than an attempt to supplement their diets. JMO

 

[Parker Knoll]

Yep - I agree.
There is absolutely no way you need to put powdered mushrooms in brownies fgs.
Those poor children.

 

[SouthAussie]

Erin recounted to the child protection worker that she'd planned to use the dried mushrooms in a Carbonara but decided not to because they had "a very unpleasant smell."
So, did she throw them away? No. She disguised them in individually wrapped beef wellingtons and fed them to her in-laws.

I just had a look at the Recipe Tin recipe (which Erin referred to) for making beef wellington. There is a step-by-step video.

There are a few things (besides the pastry coating) that might help conceal 'a very unpleasant smell'.

Basically:
First, a dijon mustard coating on the entire beef.
Second, a duxelle made with many eschalots (and the chopped mushrooms)
Third, a crepe that has been lined with prosciutto or ham.
Fourth, the puff pastry coating
Lastly, dijon mustard to seal the pastry closed.

The duxelle effectively has 3 layers on top of it - prosciutto, crepe, pastry. Then is "glued" together with mustard keeping it airtight.

Beef Wellington

It took loads of attempts but I’m proud to say I’ve finally cracked one of the trickiest of haute cuisine classics, the grand Beef Wellington. The result is incredibly juicy, edge-to-edge rose pink beef encased

www.recipetineats.com

 

[SouthAussie]

I know, there's probably hundreds of recipes for them out there. The problem I have is that she chose not to use a recipe for one. She chose quite a detailed recipe for one large one from a Recipe Tin Eats cookbook, one that even had a youtube video where you could see the process involved. Yet she still chose to turn them into individual pasties/pies/parcels.

Another reason for individual portions - besides the obvious one - is that Erin would not have had to put on latex gloves in front of her guests to slice portions of a whole beef wellington.

Or potentially contaminate a knife, which she may have needed to scrub right away, in front of them.

imo

 

[Deleted member 363451]

W-w-w-what's wrong with having online sleuthing be one's primary hobby?

 

[Deleted member 363451]

It think it’s a stretch to suggest she might poison her kids.

Re sneaking powdered mushrooms in the kids food, I don’t find that alarming, as discussed in previous threads. They are highly nutritious and exposure usually leads to tolerance and then enjoyment. Kids can be fussy with mushrooms but grow to like them with perseverance.

Of course, putting them in brownies is odd but there are recipes for beetroot in various cakes, for eg, why not mushrooms. They are full of protein, great for growing bodies. She might have been experimenting to check detection but imho, it’s not relevant as she cooked a dish with mushroom paste.

Nah, not buying it...

 

[Kemug]

W-w-w-what's wrong with having online sleuthing be one's primary hobby?

Nothing at all! And it's wonderful exercise - not only does it exercise the brain, it also exercises the fingers, the the . . the ... the ..... All that.