Australia - 3 dead after eating wild mushrooms, Leongatha, Victoria, Aug 2023 #11 *Arrest*

[browneyes]

Thanks. Good grief.

I'm imagining the prosecutor starting with: "You've certainly told a lot of lies, haven't you?"

I hope they start with Erin,Erin,Erin with a shake of their head.

 

[SouthAussie]

a lot of 'i felt scared', 'I felt anxious', 'I felt overwhelmed' in EP's testimony as to why she didn't do certain things. Which I think is code for I was afraid someone was going to find out the truth and ask questions IMO

Repeat something often enough, people start believing it.

Trying to portray herself as a scared, anxious, overwhelmed person who could easily make a silly mistake, like putting death cap mushrooms in a duxelle.

imo

 

[Megnut]

Did Erin divide 5 filets 8 ways? Or did she already have filets from her freezer? Did she prepare two full meals and hadn't yet decided how to play it?

Jmo

 

[Lisa4]

@TootsieFootsie, I just wondered if you missed my question here to you? It is a genuine, respectful question. I would be very interested in your answer. Of course I do understand you may not wish to, and that's okay too.

With all due respect Tootsie, personally my jaw fell open when I read the first line.

I have only come across two people (one male, one female) in my whole life who were truly their own worst enemies. Both have ended up alienating their families and everyone around them, except their very long-suffering and loyal spouses.

(Editing to add) As casual acquaintances, I never suspected what living nightmares they each were to their respective famiies and anyone under/close to them. It was only when circumstances changed at different times, and I became involved in their lives that I had my eyes opened.

So far, everything I have heard from EP reminds me strongly of those two miserable persons - but she is both rolled into one, plus more.

I am truly seeking to understand your opinion here. Maybe you have never met anyone who seemed okay enough at first but turned out to be truly awful behind the scenes to those closest to them?

 

[MrJ]

I hope they start with Erin,Erin,Erin with a shake of their head.

Erin's replaying the football hitting the vase (if you know you know) in her dreams tonight but instead it's her thinking 'I don't even know how many lies I told today, I need to write them all down'

 

[Neet_Mc]

Did anyone notice when the crowd was filmed waiting outside the court to go in this morning, that there was a woman wearing pajama pants? Why was it that Erin's defence wanted this case to be held in Morwell so badly?

I think, like the Paterson’s, EP thinks somewhat lowly of the country folk. Jury members potentially have more similar backgrounds than potentially could result at a city-based court, so they’re likely to interpret/behave in a more predictable way to the evidence (and lies). i.e the Asian grocer / Chinese mushrooms may be received as more of a dog whistle.

No I don’t think there was any mention of them, or any dried mushrooms in the pantry. I suspect the Tupperware container disappeared along with the plates prior to the police search.

100%…maybe in the toilet cubicle at Caldermeade?!?

 

[Megnut]

So Erin testified that she was embarrassed that she couldn't control her weight, couldn't control what she ate.

So she controlled what everyone what ate.

JMO

 

[Detechtive]

I hope they start with Erin,Erin,Erin with a shake of their head.

I really want them to ask just one question, to start with. The question @SouthAussie asked previously.

"Where is Phone A, Erin?"

 

[Bats]

Surely the defence must be told to get it over with by now, after 3 days?

Wait, didn't the prosecution get 5 weeks?

 

[Porky1]

Remember she's got a butlers pantry. Most food would be prepared in there. Maybe she put their 4 plates on the bench and told them to grab one. Then emerged from the pantry with hers. IMO

Butlers pantry design is a bit random and personal, some are a dry pantry, others have a sink, dishwasher, etc but the stove is generally in the kitchen.

 

[Porky1]

No I don’t think there was any mention of them, or any dried mushrooms in the pantry. I suspect the Tupperware container disappeared along with the plates prior to the police search.

100% agree. Guilty or not

 

[Observe_dont_Absorb]

She can't help it if she is smarter than them. I think that's her general attitude towards life. She's the smartest person in the room.

This phrase is so often used with these type of baffling cases …
The person never imagined they’d be held to account as their arrogance blinded them

 

[tillytatler]

I have been wondering about motive too (I know they aren't going to lay one out in the case).

Most of the focus here for motive has been around revenge, money etc given some of the conflicts within the family.

But what I wonder is if she was feeling very distressed by the thought of Simon's family (who she thought of as her own) drifting away and, in her mind, abandoning her. She admits that she continued the lies about her health because it felt nice having them express care.

I wonder whether her (alleged) action was an attempt to sort of "keep them for herself" - after all you can't be "abandoned" by people who are dead, and they would have gone out on a "high note" so to speak when their relationship felt strong and a lot of care was being shown to her. Kind of an "if i can't have them, nobody can".

 

[Porky1]

I call bs on her factory resetting her phone while it's in police custody because she wanted to see what happened. There must've been something, or some things, that were incriminating. And not just photos of foraged mushrooms.

I agree but what if it were banking details, passwords saved on phone, etc.

 

[MrJ]

I wonder whether her (alleged) action was an attempt to sort of "keep them for herself" - after all you can't be "abandoned" by people who are dead, and they would have gone out on a "high note" so to speak when their relationship felt strong and a lot of care was being shown to her. Kind of an "if i can't have them, nobody can".

I can see a potential motive for the alleged actions as jealousy. She kept being at family events while separated, which ok, I can kind of see why that would happen. But her seemingly pathological need for external validation couldn't handle SP's family moving on from her. IMO

 

[dalsglen]

@PingTheRouter has there been any actual real tears from Erin? Or just her well versed *sniff sniff*

 

[LenaOdenthal]

Just one thing that I haven't seen mentioned - as well as the hand scrapes, long term bulimia sufferers often have significant dental problems. Stomach acid from frequent purging (vomiting) damages tooth enamel. Would dental records show this? If, however, a patient never admits to having bulimia to their dentist, would it just be put down as unfortunately weak teeth/enamel?

Of course, even if she had managed to take good care of her teeth over the years, it wouldn't disprove that she vomited after binging on cake that particular day.

Regarding plates, and carrying them to the table, I agree it would be easy enough to keep her own back no matter whether they were matching or not. She was trying to create a "one big family" vibe, not a restaurant equivalent where they felt waited upon.

 

[Scuffy35]

Regarding plates, and carrying them to the table, I agree it would be easy enough to keep her own back no matter whether they were matching or not. She was trying to create a "one big family" vibe, not a restaurant equivalent where they felt waited upon.

That is a good point.

 

[Poirot's niece]

Reputable sources confirm that the toxins in death cap mushrooms (Amanita phalloides) enter the bloodstream shortly after ingestion. These toxins, particularly amatoxins like α-amanitin, are absorbed through the gastrointestinal tract and rapidly distributed via the bloodstream to vital organs, notably the liver. Once in the liver, they inhibit RNA polymerase II, disrupting protein synthesis and leading to cell death

You also must remember, that hours after the lunch, Erin "vomited" (allegedly). 2 or so hours later. At least. After consuming a lot of cake after cleaning up with her son. We are possibly looking at approximately 3 hours post-meal. They were in her digestive tract for at least 2-3 hours going by her own testimony.

There is absolutely no way that she would not be deathly ill if she even ingested 1/3 of one of those poisoned pasties/pies and then vomited.

Symptoms occur within 6-24 hours, but that is because the liver is already experiencing necrosis/cell death at that point.

Amanita phalloides - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

<modsnip - not an approved source>

Thanks. I should of been more specific. I meant a peer reviewed medical/clinical or biomedical journal piece. <modsnip>

I have found some objective texts.

Amatoxin Mushroom Toxicity - StatPearls - NCBI Bookshelf

https://www.austin.org.au/Assets/Files/Amanita%20Guideline_July%202024.pdf

https://www.mdpi.com/1422-0067/25/23/13028#:~:text=phalloides%20poisoning%20%5B26%2C27%5D,principal%20organ%20affected%20%5B1%5D.

 

[303gmf]

i find it telling that when confronted with the reality of the situation and asked about how she felt at the time, she responds with:
i felt anxious
i felt confused
i.felt overwhelmed
I felt worried about my children
what she did not ever say was
I felt very concerned about my guests
(you know, those people she professed to have loved)
moo

Days of court time for hundreds of “I’’

How can Mandy attract more clients with this disaster?