Australia - 3 dead after eating wild mushrooms, Leongatha, Victoria, Aug 2023 #12 *Arrest*

[MrJ]

Bit surprised Erin professes to be a Christian. Doesn't the Ten Commandments say not to lie, Erin?

 

[Sarahlou]

One of the worst performance in a witness box I can recall.

Surely every member of that jury must be wishing this could be wrapped up quickly so they can all agree on a guilty verdict and go home.

Yeah she's absolutely finished. Surely there can only be one obvious verdict now.

 

[Lord Peter Flimsy]

Someone who lies won’t just say an adamant ‘no’ to a question and EP sure doesn’t like to use that word when being asked awkward questions.

 

[Deleted member 363451]

Bit surprised Erin professes to be a Christian. Doesn't the Ten Commandments say not to lie, Erin?

Yes, and the sixth commandment is "Thou Shalt not kill."

 

[303gmf]

I’m having a hard time imagining EP throwing any *edible* food in the bin

Yes!
I’ve wondered all along why the bin outside, no one uses a garbage disposal in Australia?
Wildlife doesn’t get into food smelling trash cans?

 

[Deleted member 363451]

Even now when I see the news reports on TV about the days events at court, I still find it hard to believe what Erin Patterson did.

This really stood out to me today.

"You agree that you told police in your record of interview that you loved Don and Gail?" Dr Rogers asks.

"Correct," Erin says.

"Surely if you had loved them .. You would have immediately notified the medical authorities that there was a possibility that the foraged mushrooms had ended up in the meal", Dr Rogers says.

"Well I didn't," Erin says.


This is the real Erin. She let her mask slip today...

 

[Deleted member 363451]

Bit surprised Erin professes to be a Christian. Doesn't the Ten Commandments say not to lie, Erin?

I think she's still secretly an atheist, but it would go down better in court if she says that she's a Christian...

 

[Two SCents]

DBM

 

[MrJ]

Yes!
I’ve wondered all along why the bin outside, no one uses a garbage disposal in Australia?
Wildlife doesn’t get into food smelling trash cans?

If you mean the sink thing no that's not a thing here. Councils or local government has bin days one day a week where the type of bin you put out for rubbish collection changes depending on the collection calendar

 

[JBowie]

Even now when I see the news reports on TV about the days events at court, I still find it hard to believe what Erin Patterson did.

This really stood out to me today.

"You agree that you told police in your record of interview that you loved Don and Gail?" Dr Rogers asks.

"Correct," Erin says.

"Surely if you had loved them .. You would have immediately notified the medical authorities that there was a possibility that the foraged mushrooms had ended up in the meal", Dr Rogers says.

"Well I didn't," Erin says.


This is the real Erin. She let her mask slip today...

Yep, and another occasion when IMO a prosecutor should repeat the answer for the benefit of the jury: "So you could have, but you didn't."

 

[303gmf]

If you mean the sink thing no that's not a thing here. Councils or local government has bin days one day a week where the type of bin you put out for rubbish collection changes depending on the collection calendar

Thank you!
I’ve wondered throughout this whole case, confusing.
Everything goes in my disposal, usually only dry trash non food items to the outside can for pick up

 

[TootsieFootsie]

Garbage disposals never became popular in Australia.
I actually have never known anyone who has one.

One reason is that many people choose to compost organic products, and/or put them out with the green waste bin to be recycled.

 

[katydid23]

Erin denies preparing a 'poisoned beef wellington' to feed to Simon​

Dr Rogers then puts a series of questions to Erin about Simon’s invite.
“I suggest that you wanted him to come to the lunch so that you could feed him part of the poisoned beef wellington meal?” Dr Rogers asks.
“That’s not true,” she replies.
“I suggest that you prepared a poisoned beef wellington for him, just in case he turned up at midday or shortly after midday on Saturday, 29 July,” Dr Rogers says.
“No, that’s not true,” Erin replies.
“And when he didn’t show up for lunch at some stage you threw it in your rubbish bin,” Dr Rogers says.
“I did put the pastry and mushrooms in the rubbish bin,” Erin replies.
Dr Rogers says Simon gave evidence that it was “rare” for Erin to invite people to her home.
“I didn’t do it often, no, but I did it sometimes,” she says.

OK, Erin, if you do invite guests over sometimes, why do you only have 4 dinner plates?

 

[MaxDecimus13]

The conversation on this thread has made it clear that the prosecution did not do a good job clarifying how many mushrooms would be needed to poison the guests, how much would be deadly, how quickly it would be deadly, etc

When the trial started, this was the key evidence to me and I don't feel it was adequately addressed. I had some key questions about whether the cooked beef would be infused with the toxins, or whether it was possible to only get as ill as Erin did. For me, this was the absolute key factor in determining her guilt. If it was possible, then she was likely just lucky/unlucky, the reality being if she had been one of the 3 who had died we wouldn't know about the case nearly as well.

This is why I was surprised she took the stand. Instead of vague notions of guilt that they hadn't proved, we now have Erin's accounts to decide if we find them credible and often we don't. Take explanations like the bulimia, the not realising she'd used foraged mushrooms, the pooing by the side of the road, the admittance that she was making up the cancer to get them to help with childcare etc These have made me less likely to believe her, because she is clearly editing her version to make it look better which raises doubt about the whole thing.

The mad thing is, I still think there's a chance she's innocent but has handled it in such a way that there's a real chance she'll go down.

 

[dothetime]

Things we learned today​

Both the defence and the prosecution had an opportunity to question accused killer Erin Patterson today.

Much of the day's questioning featured crown prosecutor Nanette Rogers SC suggesting propositions to Erin, which were then emphatically denied.

Here's what we learned today from her testimony:


Erin confirmed she lied about her dehydrator and history of foraging to police. She described her lying to police as a "stupid, kneejerk reaction", saying she was scared but that she shouldn't have done it

Photos were shown to the court of what appeared to be Erin's kitchen, which Erin said she had no memory of taking. Erin denied that photos that appeared to be of mushrooms sitting on her kitchen bench were death cap mushrooms. This conflicts with mycologist Tom May's evidence that the appearance was consistent with death caps.

Erin confirmed she had foraged for wild mushrooms in the months before the July 29 lunch.

Erin conceded that it was "probably true" that she knew she would become a suspect if she told police the truth about her dehydrating of mushrooms.

Erin denied she had told her Facebook friends she was an atheist, denied she was very close to Christine Hunt, a previous witness, and denied she had used emojis to mock the Pattersons praying for her.

Erin denied she told her lunch guests that she had cancer, a contradiction to testimony given by Ian Wilkinson and Simon Patterson

We also learned that the trial may extend even longer than planned, with Justice Beale telling the jury there was a possibility that more evidence could be presented.


At that point, Justice Beale suggests the court hearing adjourn for the day.

Erin Patterson's cross-examination will continue tomorrow.

I h

A nice little visualisation

https://www.heraldsun.com.au/truecrimeaustralia/the-mushroom-cook/erin-patterson-trial-live-mushroom-cooks-crossexamination-continues/live-coverage/96f4b99c4b1e9690eb9cf37d8e56c071

Poor guy is probably trauma bonded

Also, his Baptist upbringing would have ingrained in him that marriage is for life.

 

[Walk A Mile]

Yes!
I’ve wondered all along why the bin outside, no one uses a garbage disposal in Australia?
Wildlife doesn’t get into food smelling trash cans?

Garbage disposals are very rare in Australian houses. I don't believe I've ever seen one. Household waste would go out in the council collection bin, the "wheelie bin". They are reasonably resistant to most wildlife if they are not overfilled.

 

[MaxDecimus13]

I’m having a hard time imagining EP throwing any *edible* food in the bin

This might be funny but it's true.

Who do you know who eats a 3rd of a nice meal and then doesn't at least keep it until later? The guests can't, but the host can absolutely keep her own meal.

In every instance where I've ever been at a meal and somebody wasn't hungry or was full as to leave that much of the meal, they always apologise and say they'll have it later.

This is a small but odd fact IMO.

 

[katydid23]

Do we know that an untouched serving of beef wellington landed in the bin?

If so, then this is really in stark contrast to how Erin usually acts:
- The fruit platter and gravy were still in the fridge from the lunch when police had a search warrant which I believe was days later! Why throw out the beef wellington but keep fruit and gravy - makes zero sense, unless..
- She had to use the unlabelled package of mushrooms from a mysterious 'Asian shop' that smelled funny, but threw out a serving of beef wellington that she had spent 'a fortune on'...
- Which leftovers did she then scrape the mushrooms off from and fed to her children...

Which leftovers did she scrape off for the kids? I'm guessing the SAFE one she made for herself.

Key Event
1m ago
Prosecution accuses Erin of having 'two faces'

By Joseph Dunstan and Judd Boaz

Dr Rogers then takes Erin to her interview with police held a week after the beef Wellington lunch.

In it, Erin spoke about how she had "no other family" and she wanted Gail and Don Patterson to stay in her kids' lives.

"They're good, decent people that have never done anything wrong by me, ever," Erin told police at Wonthaggi Police Station.

Erin becomes emotional in the witness box for the first time today after her police interview is read out.

Next, Dr Rogers launches into a series of suggestions put to Ms Patterson in rapid succession.

"I suggest that you didn't love them. Correct or incorrect?" Dr Rogers asks.

"That's not true," Erin responds.

Dr Rogers puts to Erin that she was angry about Gail and Don taking Simon's side in the dispute over finances.

"That's not true," Erin says.

Dr Rogers puts to Erin that this feeling of anger continued.

"Incorrect," Erin says.

"You had two faces. A public face of appearing to have a good relationship with Don and Gail, as shown to [various people]," Dr Rogers says.

"Are you asking me to agree if I had two faces?" Erin asks.

Dr Rogers repeats her initial question.

"I had a good relationship with Don and Gail," Erin says.

"I suggest that your private face was the one you showed in your Facebook messenger group," Dr Rogers says.

"Incorrect," Erin replies.

"And how you truly felt about Don and Gail was as you expressed it in your Facebook messages," Dr Rogers says.

"Incorrect," Erin responds.

Dr Rogers puts to her that how she truly felt about Simon Patterson was how she expressed it to Facebook friends.

"Incorrect," Erin says.

"You did not regard him as being a decent human being at his core," Dr Rogers says.

"Actually I still believe that," Erin says.

"And how you truly felt about Don and Gail was as you expressed it in your Facebook messages," Dr Rogers says.

"Incorrect," Erin responds.

Dr Rogers puts to her that how she truly felt about Simon Patterson was how she expressed it to Facebook friends.

"Incorrect," Erin says.

"You did not regard him as being a decent human being at his core," Dr Rogers says.

"Actually I still believe that," Erin says.




I don't get this part^^^^

"I still believe that'' she says. [she still believes what? that Simon is not a decent person?]

 

[CuriousDetective]

Which leftovers did she scrape off for the kids? I'm guessing the SAFE one she made for herself.

"And how you truly felt about Don and Gail was as you expressed it in your Facebook messages," Dr Rogers says.

"Incorrect," Erin responds.

Dr Rogers puts to her that how she truly felt about Simon Patterson was how she expressed it to Facebook friends.

"Incorrect," Erin says.

"You did not regard him as being a decent human being at his core," Dr Rogers says.

"Actually I still believe that," Erin says.




I don't get this part^^^^

"I still believe that'' she says. [she still believes what? that Simon is not a decent person?]

This confused me too. I’m not sure if she is saying “I still believe he is not a decent person” or “still believes that he is a decent person”

 

[MaxDecimus13]

Which leftovers did she scrape off for the kids? I'm guessing the SAFE one she made for herself.

"And how you truly felt about Don and Gail was as you expressed it in your Facebook messages," Dr Rogers says.

"Incorrect," Erin responds.

Dr Rogers puts to her that how she truly felt about Simon Patterson was how she expressed it to Facebook friends.

"Incorrect," Erin says.

"You did not regard him as being a decent human being at his core," Dr Rogers says.

"Actually I still believe that," Erin says.




I don't get this part^^^^

"I still believe that'' she says. [she still believes what? that Simon is not a decent person?]

Simon absolutely could be a bit of a right one, he could be coercive and abusive for all we know.

However, all we have is Erin's word on this and the knowledge that his relationship with his son wasn't great.

His character has basically been assassinated with no right to reply. There are two sides to every story, and I've known plenty of examples where somebody has had a warped view of who was the problem in a relationship.

I wonder how he must be feeling in all this.