Australia - 3 dead after eating wild mushrooms, Leongatha, Victoria, Aug 2023 #8 *Arrest*

[Porky1]

Was it ever established how one might reduce dehydrated fungi to "powder", what kind of device or implement might have been used?

A herb&spice grinder or food processor. I’d say a grinder as they’re inexpensive.

 

[Corina]

A herb&spice grinder or food processor. I’d say a grinder as they’re inexpensive.

And I wonder what might have happened to that, and any residue it might have held...

 

[Detechtive]

Just want to apologise for this post above. In my mind I thought the daughter was talking about the morning after the poisoning but, of course, she was speaking of the morning before the poisoning. So Erin drinking coffee then would be quite normal.

Duh me.

I did see somewhere that the day after the lunch, the oldest child found Erin sitting at the dining table drinking coffee.

 

[katydid23]

and no trace of the mushroom packaging?
If the leftovers were still in the bin why wasn’t the packaging?
When was her bin collection day?

Another thing
Her daughter reported her feeling ill before the kids ate the leftovers.
Surely you wouldn’t feed your kids a meal that made you feel ill or even a meal you’d prepared before feeling ill?

YES, good point. She was supposedly feeling unwell already, but she goes ahead and serves the leftovers to her kids. And I'm still not convinced that she hadn't received any messages about her lunch guests falling ill already.

 

[katydid23]

I did see somewhere that the day after the lunch, the oldest child found Erin sitting at the dining table drinking coffee.

That's what I thought I read too--but after checking, I believe it said that she was drinking coffee the morning of the luncheon, not the next day. IIRC

 

[Porky1]

I don’t think she did serve leftovers to her kids.

She served steak, beans and mash.

I think she told her daughter those were leftovers, but the leftovers were in the bin.

Left over cooked beef

 

[Baby baby Jane]

To store the mushrooms for 3-4 months.

Curious:
Wonder why Erin did not dispose of the dehydrator months before the lunch … at time of mushroom collection & drying. The dumped dryer would be long gone by the lunch.

Initially thought she disposed of it because it might be toxic after the death cap drying (but we have learned that collecting was months before lunch).
But
she must have still been using the dehydrator and the trace residue didn’t contaminate other items she dried.

She panic-disposed of it because it might indicate she was foraging?
Or did she think there was trace residue?
Did she risk cross contamination ?

I want to know about this dehydrator forensic results.

 

[SouthAussie]

Curious:
Wonder why Erin did not dispose of the dehydrator months before the lunch … at time of mushroom collection & drying. The dumped dryer would be long gone by the lunch.

Initially thought she disposed of it because it might be toxic after the death cap drying (but we have learned that collecting was months before lunch).
But
she must have still been using the dehydrator and the trace residue didn’t contaminate other items she dried.

She panic-disposed of it because it might indicate she was foraging?
Or did she think there was trace residue?
Did she risk cross contamination ?

I want to know about this dehydrator forensic results.

I am curious about when she developed the plan to poison the in-laws. Was it developed in the months that she apparently foraged the mushrooms and dehydrated them? Or did she do that with other intentions (perhaps poisoning just Simon)? Or did she do that just in case she wanted poison for "something"?

One would think that, as traces of Death Cap mushrooms were found on the dehydrator, that she ONLY used it for the Death Cap mushrooms. Otherwise - as you say - cross contamination might be possible.

Though I think her FB friends said she posted pics of dehydrated mushrooms? Or did she only tell them about them? If she posted pics, I wonder if they were pics of dried Death Cap mushrooms - perhaps identifiable by a specialist.

imo

 

[iamshadow21]

A herb&spice grinder or food processor. I’d say a grinder as they’re inexpensive.

Very easy to bin, too, they're small.

When I worked in the electrical section of Target, that was the most stolen item. People would take them out of the box and pocket them. They apparently chop weed very nicely, I've been told.

I use mine to grind coffee and whole spices.

MOO

 

[Porky1]

And I wonder what might have happened to that, and any residue it might have held...

Perhaps that was thrown away soon after.

Iam still puzzled as to why she kept the dehydrator until after the ‘suspected’ poisening. Surely you would dispose of both well before the planned meal. Had she done that, her story re the Asian shop would have carried more weight. Wouldn’t you buy another safe replacement to use instead?

 

[Detechtive]

I am curious about when she developed the plan to poison the in-laws. Was it developed in the months that she apparently foraged the mushrooms and dehydrated them? Or did she do that with other intentions (perhaps poisoning just Simon)? Or did she do that just in case she wanted poison for "something"?

One would think that, as traces of Death Cap mushrooms were found on the dehydrator, that she ONLY used it for the Death Cap mushrooms. Otherwise - as you say - cross contamination might be possible.

Though I think her FB friends said she posted pics of dehydrated mushrooms? Or did she only tell them about them? If she posted pics, I wonder if they were pics of dried Death Cap mushrooms - perhaps identifiable by a specialist.

imo

I reckon it was around the time Simon stopped paying school fees after she learned he had put “separated” on the tax return. The same time she took the children out of the religious school and into the public school because his parents weren’t on her side to control him anymore.

Prior to that, I think she just wanted to get rid of Simon and keep his family.

 

[SouthAussie]

Iam still puzzled as to why she kept the dehydrator until after the ‘suspected’ poisening. Surely you would dispose of both well before the planned meal. Had she done that, her story re the Asian shop would have carried more weight. Wouldn’t you buy another safe replacement to use instead?

I wonder if she kind of "forgot" about the dehydrator. If she hadn't used it since drying the Death Cap mushrooms.

 

[Detechtive]

Curious:
Wonder why Erin did not dispose of the dehydrator months before the lunch … at time of mushroom collection & drying. The dumped dryer would be long gone by the lunch.

Initially thought she disposed of it because it might be toxic after the death cap drying (but we have learned that collecting was months before lunch).
But
she must have still been using the dehydrator and the trace residue didn’t contaminate other items she dried.

She panic-disposed of it because it might indicate she was foraging?
Or did she think there was trace residue?
Did she risk cross contamination ?

I want to know about this dehydrator forensic results.

From what I’m learning throughout the trial, it seems to me that she really didn’t think anybody would suspect her or question her and that there would be a spotlight on her at all. I think she was shocked by the medical intervention, the police going to her house, the media attention etc.

 

[Baby baby Jane]

From what I’m learning throughout the trial, it seems to me that she really didn’t think anybody would suspect her or question her and that there would be a spotlight on her at all. I think she was shocked by the medical intervention, the police going to her house, the media attention etc.

Agree … she thought they would just die … 3 old people, no questions asked.

She had months to plan & research but made basic mistakes.

Does make you wonder if this is what she had done to Simon previously and he was never diagnosed, never died but very ill. Maybe Erin thought old folks might suffer the same get unwell in hospital but worse due to age.
Maybe she had done the same with Simon previously- same with the plates, etc

Maybe this time these mushrooms were more potent, or she just used more due to recipe, not expecting it to be so much more lethal.

Maybe not her first mushroom poison rodeo …

 

[MsMarple]

‘No, no, I scraped off all the mushrooms’: Patterson insistent the children didn’t need treatment, court hears​

Nurse Cindy Munro has told the court she told Patterson her two children would need to attend hospital for treatment as they had consumed leftovers of the lunch.

However, Munro said Patterson was reluctant to bring her children to the hospital.

Munro: “She said: ‘No no, I scraped off all the mushrooms’ and ‘the children were not unwell’.

“She did not want to cause a hassle or to take them out of school

“She became quite teary. She said I don’t want to stress them out.”

“I did say to her, even if she scraped off the mushrooms, some of it could have seeped through the meat and they could of been exposed to the toxins and that needed the immediate hospitalisation of the children.”

Munro said Dr Foote came in and again reassured Patterson about why she was being treated and why it was necessary for the children to also attend hospital.

Munro said Patterson repeated her insistent that she did not want to worry the children, before eventually agreeing to arrange for her children to present for care.

‘She wanted to talk to them about adult stuff’: Patterson’s daughter recalls talks about deadly lunch

Erin Patterson is accused of killing three people with poisonous death cap mushrooms.

7news.com.au

Erin’s reluctance to have the children seen and assessed makes no sense whatsoever unless she knew for certain that they hadn’t been exposed to the death caps. IMO.

If I was a juror that statement alone would push me towards “beyond a reasonable doubt.” I can’t imagine any reason why a mother would hesitate to learn that her kids were safe, no matter how much she disliked hospitals or didn’t want to upset them. Especially since witnesses described Erin as a doting mother. JMO

 

[Detechtive]

Erin’s reluctance to have the children seen and assessed makes no sense whatsoever unless she knew for certain that they hadn’t been exposed to the death caps. IMO.

If I was a juror that statement alone would push me towards “beyond a reasonable doubt.” I can’t imagine any reason why a mother would hesitate to learn that her kids were safe, no matter how much she disliked hospitals or didn’t want to upset them. Especially since witnesses described Erin as a doting mother. JMO

It’s interesting that people don’t plan on what can be deduced by their lack of action, as opposed to planning what their actions will be.

The lack of medical treatment for her and her kids shows absolutely she was confident they weren’t poisoned despite being in hospital pretending to be sick.

 

[Megnut]

Erin’s reluctance to have the children seen and assessed makes no sense whatsoever unless she knew for certain that they hadn’t been exposed to the death caps. IMO.

If I was a juror that statement alone would push me towards “beyond a reasonable doubt.” I can’t imagine any reason why a mother would hesitate to learn that her kids were safe, no matter how much she disliked hospitals or didn’t want to upset them. Especially since witnesses described Erin as a doting mother. JMO

Reminiscent of a husband, questioned in the death of his wife, who tells LE to leave his girlfriend out of it. IMO she didn't want the children involved, for reasons I question.

Saving up for the big surprise, your grandparents are dead?

Perhaps she hoped they'd be sicker faster her "sickness" would be more convincing and no one would ever know what exactly killed them.

JMO

 

[Shortfusepsb]

Reminiscent of a husband, questioned in the death of his wife, who tells LE to leave his girlfriend out of it. IMO she didn't want the children involved, for reasons I question.

Saving up for the big surprise, your grandparents are dead?

Perhaps she hoped they'd be sicker faster her "sickness" would be more convincing and no one would ever know what exactly killed them.

JMO

Until the autopsy...

 

[Megnut]

Until the autopsy...

But I wonder. Because it was beef wellington, mushrooms were on the radar. But if they had eaten brownies laced with Death Cap powder, would that have been discovered? Not the most common of food borne toxins.

 

[Detechtive]

But I wonder. Because it was beef wellington, mushrooms were on the radar. But if they had eaten brownies laced with Death Cap powder, would that have been discovered? Not the most common of food borne toxins.

You wouldn’t be able to hide the level of death caps (30gms) you would need to be sure they died in a brownie, in my opinion.

Also if she served brownies or muffins people could decline them, as not everyone eats sweet food like that. But you can’t decline the main meal, that would be rude.

What’s the other case you’re referencing about the girlfriend?