Australia - 3 dead after eating wild mushrooms, Leongatha, Victoria, Aug 2023 #9 *Arrest*

[Walk A Mile]

Imagine how Simon, and any other of his relatives feel, hearing this.
Other relatives 'know' Simon's character, and would have witnessed his behaviour with EP.
Hope, this can be addressed later.
?? more lies from EP.

Actually, I'm not finding this allegation surprising. We already know that she has initiated multiple separations from him - common in women attempting to leave controlling/narcissistic partners, who are then "love bombed" into giving them another chance.

We know Erin felt he was financially abusive from the information about her missing out on child support / family tax benefit and then feeling blindsided that he filed his tax return as separated.

Her son mentioned the games his father played in relation to the school.

There's a lot of indicators that suggest, at minimum, financial abuse.

It is my belief that EP murdered her in-laws, and that she was probably a victim of coercive control/financial abuse. One doesn't excuse the other.

 

[Ellery84]

It is my belief that EP murdered her in-laws, and that she was probably a victim of coercive control/financial abuse. One doesn't excuse the other.

Thats a really interesting proposition as a motive for the alleged crime(s).

 

[drsleuth]

4m ago

What is the lethal dose of death cap?​

By Judd Boaz​

Dr Gerostamoulos is asked the lethal dose of toxins, which he says is 0.1 milligrams per kilogram.

"So for a 70kg adult, it's about three tablespoons," Dr Gerostamoulos says.

He tells the court this is based off animal studies rather than humans, for obvious reasons.

Juror dismissed in Erin Patterson murder trial — as it happened

Erin Patterson faces three charges of murder in the Latrobe Valley Law Courts. She's accused of killing three relatives by serving them beef Wellington containing poisonous mushrooms. Follow the events as they happened in our live blog.

www.abc.net.au

 

[drsleuth]

1m ago

What happens if you eat death cap toxins?​

By Judd Boaz​

The prosecutions asks about what happens when these death cap toxins are ingested.

Dr Gerostamoulos says at the outset, a poisoning victim will experience vomiting, diarrhoea and progressively get worse without treatment.

He tells the court that the body is unable to process the toxin as it would a normal drug.

The court hears that the toxins do not have a long half-life and leaves the blood after a day, but the concentration in tissues and urine is higher and easier to detect.

Dr Gerostamoulos says samples taken are matches against "pure" samples of the toxins.

Juror dismissed in Erin Patterson murder trial — as it happened

Erin Patterson faces three charges of murder in the Latrobe Valley Law Courts. She's accused of killing three relatives by serving them beef Wellington containing poisonous mushrooms. Follow the events as they happened in our live blog.

www.abc.net.au

 

[drsleuth]

1m ago14.47 AEST
Gerostamoulos tells the court toxins in death cap mushrooms are not usually tested for at the institute.

He says when testing for death cap mushrooms the institute looks for the presence of amatoxins.

He says the amatoxins produced by death cap mushrooms are alpha-amanitin, beta-amanitin and to a lesser extent gamma-amanitin.

These can lead to a range of symptoms including liver failure and cell death, the court hears.

Erin Patterson trial day 12 – as it happened

This blog is now closed

www.theguardian.com

 

[Detechtive]

Erin put leftovers aside while plating up: Witness​

The court also heard Ms Cripps recalled Erin telling her that she put “two plates aside” when plating up, adding that she mentioned they were for leftovers.

https://www.heraldsun.com.au/truecrimeaustralia/the-mushroom-cook/erin-patterson-trial-live-updates-from-morwell-court/live-coverage/6b4cf21616470f7bfc285cdb671b62b6#/entry/31624691

Turns out she wasn't too short on crockery afterall, given that there at least 4 large grey dinner plates, 1 small tan/orange plate, 2 "other" plates (for leftovers), and the 4 or so other smaller white desert plates.

 

[drsleuth]

Toxins in death caps are ‘stable’ when heated, forensic expert says​

Gerostamoulos, explained his department develops tools to measure toxins, looks for poisons in samples, then make reports on their findings.

He said the main toxins in death cap mushrooms - which his lab does not routinely look for - are alpha amanitin, beta amanitin, and to a lesser degree, gamma amanitin.

He said the toxin cells for death caps are “rather large molecules” and are “quite stable”, meaning they are resistant to termperature changes.

“(They are quite stable) when they are frozen or when they are subjected to heat.

“So when they are prepared in a meal, they are quite stable - their structure remains intact.

“They are quite water soluble compounds, but it depends on how they have been prepared.”

Lethal dose of death cap mushrooms revealed in court​

is 0.1 milligrams per kilogram.

“So for a 70kg adult, it’s about 50g, or three tablespoons,” Gerostamoulos said.

Gerostamoulos said those findings were based off animal studies, not humans, for obvious reasons.

Court hears Erin Patterson decided not to use dried mushrooms in pasta dish due to ‘smell’

Erin Patterson is accused of killing three people with poisonous death cap mushrooms.

7news.com.au

 

[drsleuth]

1m ago

How easy is it to detect toxins?​

By Judd Boaz​

The prosecution asks Dr Gerostamoulos how difficult it is to detect amanitins, and he says it can be done reliably.

We move onto the case at hand, the court hears that Dr Gerostamoulos received several samples for death cap toxin testing.

Some of these samples were taken while the person was alive, while others were taken after the person had died.

Dr Gerostamoulos says the most recently taken samples were tested immediately, as they served as the most reliable samples for the detection of toxins.

Juror dismissed in Erin Patterson murder trial — as it happened

Erin Patterson faces three charges of murder in the Latrobe Valley Law Courts. She's accused of killing three relatives by serving them beef Wellington containing poisonous mushrooms. Follow the events as they happened in our live blog.

www.abc.net.au

 

[drsleuth]

1m ago05.52 BST
Gerostamoulos tells the court the lethal dose of amatoxins for a 70kg adult would be about three tablespoons.

But he says the exact lethal dose will “depend on how much of the toxins are there”.

Gerostamoulos says the studies have been conducted in animals including mice and dogs.

He says:

They’re very toxic compounds.

Gerostamoulos says a small amount of amatoxins are found in the death cap mushrooms. He says:

Less than 10% of the mushroom actually contains the alpha-amanitin and beta-amanitin.

Gerostamoulos tells the court a person who has ingested the amatoxins will experience diarrhoea, vomiting and progressively get worse if a person is not treated.

He says the liver cannot process these amatoxins like a “normal drug”. He says:

Once a foreign drug is ingested, the body will look to remove that.

He says alpha-amanitin and beta-amanitin can be detected in the body when someone has ingested death cap mushrooms.

He says:

They have a very short half-life which means they don’t persist in the body for a long time.

He says the toxins may remain in the urine for a few days.

Erin Patterson trial day 12 – as it happened

This blog is now closed

www.theguardian.com

 

[drsleuth]

More than 50 toxicology samples taken for Don Patterson​

The samples, taken both while he was alive (anti-mortem) then once he died (post-mortem), included blood, hair samples, stomach contents, liver, and fluid taken from his eye.

Court hears Erin Patterson decided not to use dried mushrooms in pasta dish due to ‘smell’

Erin Patterson is accused of killing three people with poisonous death cap mushrooms.

7news.com.au

 

[drsleuth]

Key Event
Just now

Donald Patterson's samples positive for death cap toxins​

By Judd Boaz​

Dr Gerostamoulos is asked about the tests conducted on samples of Donald Patterson's blood, hair, stomach contents, liver and eye fluid.

The samples were taken both before and after his death, and were tested for the death cap toxins — alpha-Amanitin and beta-Amanitin.

A table of toxicology results are then shown to the court. Dr Gerostamoulos runs down the different sections of the results.

Under a column for alpha-Amanitin and beta-Amanitin, the table shows that the toxins were found in Donald Patterson's urine.

It was not detected in blood samples, or in any of the post-mortem samples.

Dr Gerostamoulos reiterates the toxins are quickly eliminated from blood, and if a sample is not taken within 24-30 hours, "it is very unlikely" that the toxins will be detected.

However, it remains in the urine until the urine leaves the body.

Juror dismissed in Erin Patterson murder trial — as it happened

Erin Patterson faces three charges of murder in the Latrobe Valley Law Courts. She's accused of killing three relatives by serving them beef Wellington containing poisonous mushrooms. Follow the events as they happened in our live blog.

www.abc.net.au

 

[browneyes]

Thats a really interesting proposition as a motive for the alleged crime(s).

I agree. I’m surprised she can tarnish his reputation without taking the stand or having witnesses testify for her. To me, it’s just something to try to make her sympathetic. IMO

 

[drsleuth]

1m ago05.59 BST
Gerostamoulos says the institute’s laboratory has a “reportable threshold” when testing a specimen for the presence of a compound. This is a concentration that can be reliably and repeatedly reported in a specimen, he tells the court.

He says if it falls below the threshold it is reported as “not detected”.

The reportable threshold for alpha-amanitin and beta-amanitin in samples like blood is “0.5 nanograms per mL”, he says.

Gerostamoulos tells the court testing for these toxins requires specialised techniques. He says:

We developed a technique that we know works reliably.

Gerostamoulos confirms the institute received a range of specimens for testing in this case.

He says these included antemortem, taken while the person is alive, and postmortem samples, taken when the person has died.

Samples collected soon after the ingestion are the most reliable.

Erin Patterson trial day 12 – as it happened

This blog is now closed

www.theguardian.com

 

[drsleuth]

1m ago

Some samples taken much later than others, toxicologist says​

By Judd Boaz​

Dr Gerostamoulos explained the disparity in results between ante-mortem and post-mortem samples, meaning samples taken before Don's death and after his death.

"The post-mortem specimens were collected on the 8th of August, 2023, which is almost a week after the ante-mortem samples were collected," Dr Gerostamoulos says.

He says toxins were also not detected in hair for similar reasons.

Juror dismissed in Erin Patterson murder trial — as it happened

Erin Patterson faces three charges of murder in the Latrobe Valley Law Courts. She's accused of killing three relatives by serving them beef Wellington containing poisonous mushrooms. Follow the events as they happened in our live blog.

www.abc.net.au

 

[drsleuth]

1m ago

Gail Patterson's results show no death cap toxins​

By Judd Boaz​

Gail Patterson, Don's wife, has her toxicology results shown to the court next.

No alpha-Amanitinorbeta-Amanitin toxin was detected in any of the blood, serum or hair samples were found in any of the samples.

No urine was collected from Gail Patterson.

Juror dismissed in Erin Patterson murder trial — as it happened

Erin Patterson faces three charges of murder in the Latrobe Valley Law Courts. She's accused of killing three relatives by serving them beef Wellington containing poisonous mushrooms. Follow the events as they happened in our live blog.

www.abc.net.au

 

[drsleuth]

1m ago

Heather Wilkinson's results show no toxins​

By Judd Boaz​

Heather Wilkinson's test results are next.

Urine was collected from Heather Wilkinson, unlike from Gail Patterson.

No alpha-Amanitin or beta-Amanitin toxin was found in her samples.

Juror dismissed in Erin Patterson murder trial — as it happened

Erin Patterson faces three charges of murder in the Latrobe Valley Law Courts. She's accused of killing three relatives by serving them beef Wellington containing poisonous mushrooms. Follow the events as they happened in our live blog.

www.abc.net.au

​

 

[drsleuth]

1m ago

Ian Wilkinson samples test positive for death cap toxins​

By Judd Boaz​

Ian Wilkinson's toxicology report results are shown, with based off a range of samples taken from him during his hospital stay.

The court hears that the toxin beta-amanitin was found in Ian's serum.

The sample of urine taken from Ian Wilkinson showed the presence of alpha-amanitin.

Juror dismissed in Erin Patterson murder trial — as it happened

Erin Patterson faces three charges of murder in the Latrobe Valley Law Courts. She's accused of killing three relatives by serving them beef Wellington containing poisonous mushrooms. Follow the events as they happened in our live blog.

www.abc.net.au

​

 

[drsleuth]

1m ago06.13 BST
Jurors are shown the toxicology results for Patterson’s mother-in-law, Gail Patterson.

Gerostamoulos tells the court the institute received more than 50 antemortem samples from Dandenong Hospital and the Austin Hospital.

He says no urine was collected or suitable for analysis.

Gerostamoulos says the results show no detection of alpha-amanitin and beta-amanitin above the reportable threshold in any of blood specimens.

1m ago06.12 BST
Gerostamoulos confirms he was sent antemortem and postmortem samples for Patterson’s father-in-law, Don Patterson.

He tells the court samples included stomach contents, a small section of liver and fluid from the eye.

He confirms a number of the specimens were tested for alpha-amanitin and beta-amanitin.

The jury is shown a table of the toxicology results for Don Patterson.

Prosecutor Sarah Lenthall asks Gerostamoulos about the results.

An antemortem urine sample shows a “clear detection” of alpha-amanitin and beta-amanitin, the court hears.

Gerostamoulos says postmortem blood and serum samples, collected days after Don presented to hospital, did not detect alpha-amanitin and beta-amanitin.

He tells the court when blood samples are collected after 24 hours of ingestion, they are unlikely to show levels of alpha-amanitin and beta-amanitin.

He says:

We know they persist in urine for some time longer.

1m ago06.13 BST
Jurors are shown the toxicology results for Patterson’s mother-in-law, Gail Patterson.

Gerostamoulos tells the court the institute received more than 50 antemortem samples from Dandenong Hospital and the Austin Hospital.

He says no urine was collected or suitable for analysis.

Gerostamoulos says the results show no detection of alpha-amanitin and beta-amanitin above the reportable threshold in any of blood specimens.

Erin Patterson trial day 12 – as it happened

This blog is now closed

www.theguardian.com

 

[drsleuth]

Key Event
4m ago

No death cap toxins found in Erin Patterson's body​

By Judd Boaz​

A table showing results from Erin Patterson's tests is shown to the court.

No death cap mushroom toxins were found in her body.

3m ago

Erin Patterson's children also test negative for toxins​

By Judd Boaz​

Samples were taken from both of Erin Patterson's children.

Both children tested negative for the toxins found in death cap mushrooms.

3m ago

We head to a break​

By Judd Boaz​

At the conclusion of the toxicology results, Justice Beale signals for a break.

Back with more, soon.

Juror dismissed in Erin Patterson murder trial — as it happened

Erin Patterson faces three charges of murder in the Latrobe Valley Law Courts. She's accused of killing three relatives by serving them beef Wellington containing poisonous mushrooms. Follow the events as they happened in our live blog.

www.abc.net.au

 

[Eloise]

them (the toxins) not being found in Erin + kids is expected, but I thought they'd have been found in all dinner guests?