Canada - USA Trade War commencing March 2025 #3

[Lilibet]

I have no words I can say on here about trump and this crud. Trump has got to love all the attention on him good or bad.i hope the EU and Canada continue to work together. Since when does another country tell us who we can work trades with . Trump has no say in anything Canada does
Jmoo

And tomorrow he’ll turn around and change his mind…again. These performances are designed to get us to look over there while he does something over here. *Look at the puppy!” “Oooh a shiny thing!!” “Squirrel!!!”

And most of the press falls for it except a rare few like the crew on MSNBC—Chris Hayes, Rachel Maddow, and Lawrence O’Donnell.

 

[Lyanna]

somehow i am starting the hear Nero fiddle...jat

Yew, Donald doesn't care about his responsibilities to the people of America. He's just thinking about what a wonderful (terrible) and amazing (disastrous) empire (prison) he's created.

Moo

 

[seasideForest]

It's a top priority. The EU/UK have made 3 requests of Canada/EU/UK alliance:

• build ...
• build ...
• open unoccupied land for EU military training exercises

Not only does Canada's vast terrain offer unique possibilities to train European forces, including low-level flight training that is all but impossible over Europe, it could also play an important part in Europe's rearmament.

https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/canada-allies-europe-trump-1.7486978

Italics by me.

This isn't against you Otto, just jumping off your post, as a Canadian long since overseas: What about the First Nations on that so-called 'unoccupied land'? There's a non-fiction book "Nitassinan" by Marie Wadden, which is about the area called Nitassinan, homeland of the Innu, (Labrador and parts of Quebec), which was used for low-level training flights to the detriment of the Innu.

It's easy, I think, in more southerly parts of Canada and of course in Europe to see the vast 'unoccupied' north of Canada, without taking First Nations and Inuit into consideration. I'm missing that a little on this thread.

MOO

 

[ekc]

Italics by me.

This isn't against you Otto, just jumping off your post, as a Canadian long since overseas: What about the First Nations on that so-called 'unoccupied land'? There's a non-fiction book "Nitassinan" by Marie Wadden, which is about the area called Nitassinan, homeland of the Innu, (Labrador and parts of Quebec), which was used for low-level training flights to the detriment of the Innu.

It's easy, I think, in more southerly parts of Canada and of course in Europe to see the vast 'unoccupied' north of Canada, without taking First Nations and Inuit into consideration. I'm missing that a little on this thread.

MOO

please dont give him more to chew on....as Michael Angelo talked to the pope "when does it end....when im finished"...jat

 

[Lilibet]

Some interesting quotes in this Guardian article, including how US admin actions against Canada are signs of growing fascism.

Yale professor who studies fascism fleeing US to work in Canada





bolded by me for emphasis.

Good for Stanley. Timothy Snyder, whose book “On Tyranny” I’ve posted recently will be joining him. He’s still listed at Yale but he’s taken a leave for this year and will start teaching at the Munk School in 2026-27 IIRC. Meanwhile, he appears often on MSNBC.

I follow his Substack…. Thinking about... | Timothy Snyder | Substack
I googled to see if Stanley has a Substack, but he’s busy apprearing on other people’s substacks.

 

[LovesPeace2]

And tomorrow he’ll turn around and changed his mind…again. These performances are designed to get us to look over there while he does something over here. *Look at the puppy!” “Oooh a shiny thing!!” “Squirrel!!!”

And most of the press falls for it except a rare few like the crew on MSNBC—Chris Hayes, Rachel Maddow, and Lawrence O’Donnell.

I wonder what that orange umpaloompa would do if one day the media and other countries ignored his rants and messy drama. I think that would get to him more then people's angry reaction.

 

[Herat]

Brings back COVID memories:

Trump put a 21% tariff on Canadian softwood lumber. He is also threatening to up to what would almost be 51%.

Softwood lumber is used for furniture making in the US. So there's a lot of hurt to the furniture industry in the Carolinas.

But guess what else imported softwood lumber is used for? Northern Bleached Softwood Kraft Pulp ( NBSKP)

This is what paper towels and toilet paper are made from. We could be looking at toilet paper shortages and hoarding, again. Would THAT finally get the attention of his faithful?

 

[Elliot_Alderson]

I wonder what that orange umpaloompa would do if one day the media and other countries ignored his rants and messy drama. I think that would get to him more then people's angry reaction.

He'd probably call it a "witch hunt" and blame it on Democrats.

 

[otto]

• U.S. President Donald Trump has threatened to impose “far larger” tariffs on the European Union and Canada if they work together to combat trade tariffs.
• “If the European Union works with Canada in order to do economic harm to the USA, large scale Tariffs, far larger than currently planned, will be placed on them both in order to protect the best friend that each of those two countries has ever had!,” Trump posted on social media platform Truth Social on Thursday.

https://www.cnbc.com/2025/03/27/trump-threatens-far-larger-tariffs-on-eu-and-canada-.html

Who is the "best friend" that Canada and the EU ever had? Each other?

It looks like the USA government is rather insecure and jealous when he sees that his "friends" are also friends. The elected government seems unable to cope with not being the most important friend.

How is Canada and the EU looking after each other, when facing the same tyrant, a problem for the USA? Is the USA unable to stand on its own without leaning on Canada and the EU ... too weak to manage alone?

Is the USA government threatened by the thought that other countries do not need the USA? Why?

 

[otto]

I have no words I can say on here about trump and this crud. Trump has got to love all the attention on him good or bad.i hope the EU and Canada continue to work together. Since when does another country tell us who we can work trades with . Trump has no say in anything Canada does
Jmoo

Canada, the EU, and the UK have no choice but to work together. The alternative is exactly what has happened to Canada. The USA will one day decide that they don't want to pay for good and services from Canada, the EU, and the UK, and demand that the countries give up sovereignty.

Work together, or give up Constitution, human rights, health care, justice system, social protections, privacy, values and way of life? There is no choice.

 

[detective.moon]

EU foreign trade

China is the most important trading partner of the European Union.

www.destatis.de

when you combine import and export, in 2024 the “best friend” of the EU was the US, followed by China.

but when you look at what the EU imports, their favourite friend is China, followed by the US. trump definitely doesn’t like that the US buys more from the EU then the other way around.

when you look at individual EU countries their best trading friend is often another EU country.

 

[otto]

IMO, he's trying to increase sales of Tesla. EV cars aren't a typical MAGA car, what with all the environmental benefits and Donald's previous badmouthing of all EV vehicles (which suddenly changed?). So not sure who's going to be buying them.

Trump wants to halt the buildout of EV charging stations. Experts say it's not so simple

Trump’s 180 on Electric Vehicles—Provided They’re Teslas - The American Prospect

He won autoworkers’ support by opposing EVs, which need fewer workers to produce. Last week, he pitched Teslas to American motorists.

prospect.org

Looks like Trump has been reading about Hitler's "peoples car". He wants the "people's car" for 2030 USA to be the Tesla.

"In 1942, propaganda minister Joseph Goebbels described the future of Germany as that of "a happy people in a country full of blossoming beauty, traversed by the silver ribbons of wide roads, which are open to the modest car for the small man." Mirroring this aim, the Nazi “Strength through Joy” (Kraft durch Freude, or KdF) organization, which sought to highlight the advantages of National Socialism through leisure and travel, chose as one of its major efforts to promote a “People’s Car” (Volkswagen) for the German public.
...

Adolf Hitler’s admiration for technology in general and for automobiles in particular fueled this effort. Cars were, he said, “mankind's most marvelous means of transport." In 1934, Hitler suggested a basic, fuel-efficient vehicle that could transport two adults and three children and whose engine would be powerful enough to traverse Germany’s new Autobahnen. The design for a “People’s Car” was undertaken by the famed engineer Ferdinand Porsche, who based it on a model he pioneered in 1931."

https://encyclopedia.ushmm.org/content/en/article/volkswagen-1

 

[otto]

Italics by me.

This isn't against you Otto, just jumping off your post, as a Canadian long since overseas: What about the First Nations on that so-called 'unoccupied land'? There's a non-fiction book "Nitassinan" by Marie Wadden, which is about the area called Nitassinan, homeland of the Innu, (Labrador and parts of Quebec), which was used for low-level training flights to the detriment of the Innu.

It's easy, I think, in more southerly parts of Canada and of course in Europe to see the vast 'unoccupied' north of Canada, without taking First Nations and Inuit into consideration. I'm missing that a little on this thread.

MOO

Canada's Indigenous People must be consulted for projects on their land. Some provincial governments (Alberta) enter into talks for projects without including the Indigenous People at the first step. That's a problem, because adding them at the last step means barriers that require returning to the first step.

This has not always been the case, but Trudeau is responsible for ensuring that Indigenous People are consulted regarding their land use. The problem that comes up again and again is money, and changing boundaries. An agreement is made, Indigenous People vote, they change what they need or want, then more discussion for a new agreement. It never seems like the elected Indigenous Person (chief) has the freedom to make decisions without a vote on the decision that they agree to. It's always messy.

That's entirely my opinion based on seeing this play out of the years - there may be more to it than I know.

 

[Herat]

A new vehicle with hybrid technology or upgraded electronics and safety features would easily normally cost $40,000 USD.

If is is an import, after April 2 it will cost $50,000. As auto insurance and automobile licensing for most US states are based on purchase price, you can expect an increase in the fees you would normally have to pay, also.

So who has an extra $10 - 12K to pay for a new car at this time? And if you are fiancing it, who is gonna take the risk on interest rate increases?

A MAGA-lite relative of mine thinks this tariff is a huge mistake and will sink the economy, forcing Trump to remove it. And no, there is not way in holy hell anyone I know or am related to is buying a Tesla product.

 

[Herat]

Looks like Trump has been reading about Hitler's "peoples car". He wants the "people's car" for 2030 USA to be the Tesla.

"In 1942, propaganda minister Joseph Goebbels described the future of Germany as that of "a happy people in a country full of blossoming beauty, traversed by the silver ribbons of wide roads, which are open to the modest car for the small man." Mirroring this aim, the Nazi “Strength through Joy” (Kraft durch Freude, or KdF) organization, which sought to highlight the advantages of National Socialism through leisure and travel, chose as one of its major efforts to promote a “People’s Car” (Volkswagen) for the German public.
...

Adolf Hitler’s admiration for technology in general and for automobiles in particular fueled this effort. Cars were, he said, “mankind's most marvelous means of transport." In 1934, Hitler suggested a basic, fuel-efficient vehicle that could transport two adults and three children and whose engine would be powerful enough to traverse Germany’s new Autobahnen. The design for a “People’s Car” was undertaken by the famed engineer Ferdinand Porsche, who based it on a model he pioneered in 1931."

https://encyclopedia.ushmm.org/content/en/article/volkswagen-1

No way, no how a Nazi Tesla is gonna fly.

 

[Herat]

This morning NPR had a very interesting article about Vietnam stepping up at a rapid pace into manufacturing and trade. Rather rapidly, Vietnman had turned into a favorable country for manufacturing.

I have started to notice that some clothing I bought had "Made in Vietnam" on the label.

Vietnam has also just poised itself to give concessions to the Trump regime to preserve their dramatic success in manufacturing. Something that China has been unable to do. It will be interesting to see if Vietnam can escape the April 2 Trade Distruction Day disaster.

https://www.npr.org/2025/03/27/nx-s1-5336144/trumps-tariffs-on-china-left-some-winners-vietnam-is-one-of-them

 

[otto]

Where is the $100 billion of new revenue coming from?

The USA imposed 25% tariffs on foreign vehicles. A vehicle costs, for example, $40k. Add 25% tariff, now it costs $50k. That $10k has to come from someone. Car manufacturers are not going to cut salaries or use cheap materials, but they have to find $10k to give to the USA government.

That $10k is going to come out of the pockets of each USA car buyer. $100 billion is going to go from the pockets of people in the USA directly to their federal government. How is that okay with anyone?

"Crucially, the tariffs will also apply to car parts including engines, transmission and electrical components — many of which are shipped to the U.S. from abroad and used in American car production, although these are set to come into effect in May. Scharf estimated that the measures will result in “over $100 billion of new annual revenue” to the U.S."

https://www.cnbc.com/2025/03/27/trump-threatens-far-larger-tariffs-on-eu-and-canada-.html

 

[Herat]

This auto tariff is an absolute nightmare for American consumers, for car manufacturers of all kinds, and for auto dealerships.

Say I want to buy a new compact SUV with 4WD. Several lines and models are available

OOPS, many of the Japanese or Korean lines have models made in Canada that are imported into the US. 79% of Honda vehicles made in Canada are imported into the US.

So there's a confusing matrix of trying to find the model, features, color in a vehicle that is available, but made in the USA. Some Toyota SUVS are made in the US, but not all.

I wonder if dealers get any choice in stocking Canada-made or US-made models? Does anyone really thing you are not going to be charged a dealer premium for a US-made model? How far do you have to go to find the manufacter or assembly "site" by searching VIN's?

It even worse news if you want some fine European engineering. Some, but not all Volvo models are made/assembled in the US. Mercedes does make several SUV models in Alabama. However, if you want an Audi or Porsche SUV, you are out of luck. None of those are made/assembled in the US.

What a mess.

 

[sds71]

Orioles manager Brandon Hyde said they prepared the team to expect an unfavorable reaction to the National Anthem today

https://twitter.com/x/status/1905304406280528177

 

[otto]

A new vehicle with hybrid technology or upgraded electronics and safety features would easily normally cost $40,000 USD.

If is is an import, after April 2 it will cost $50,000. As auto insurance and automobile licensing for most US states are based on purchase price, you can expect an increase in the fees you would normally have to pay, also.

So who has an extra $10 - 12K to pay for a new car at this time? And if you are fiancing it, who is gonna take the risk on interest rate increases?

A MAGA-lite relative of mine thinks this tariff is a huge mistake and will sink the economy, forcing Trump to remove it. And no, there is not way in holy hell anyone I know or am related to is buying a Tesla product.

The natural consequence of 25% tariffs on the car industry (most NA and foreign vehicles are assembled in Canada, Mexico and the USA), means that car sales will drop. Many people will postpone buying a new vehicle until tariffs are removed, or reduced to somewhere in the region of 5%. That means that automotive employees have no work, so they are laid off and rely on (un)employment insurance.

None of this means that the automotive industry will move manufacturing to the USA. Over 10 years, perhaps, but with no car buyers, who will invest in USA automotive manufacturing?

If the USA gov't wants vehicles built exclusively in the USA, training engineers and building manufacturing plants is the first step. When that is in place, then tariffs can be placed on foreign built cars. Trump starts with the end goal and expects the foundational steps to magically appear.