Daniel Penny on Trial for manslaughter and negligent homicide of Jordan Neely

[mickey2942]

Yep.
Struggling to breathe.

When you can't breathe, you do go into an automatic "panic". And then, you start to having even more problems with breathing.

I have worked with kids, who have asthma, on just slowing down, not panicking, and managing their mind and body. Before it goes into a full asthma attack.

 

[Ontario Mom]

Yep.
Struggling to breathe.

Possibly. Struggling to get free is what I had in mind but it's certainly possible he was also struggling to breathe.

 

[Izzylizzy]

You can't state DP "obviously ignored this dangerous sign" when nowhere in the source of that information on wikipedia does it say DP saw this happen, and ignored it.

The original source is Hell Gate a subscriber only site, and according to the wiki entry it simply says "another witness said..."

The alleged witness isn't even named, and the original article isn't available.

We'll have to wait and see if it comes out at trial.
In the meantime the 2 men were right over Neely's mouth so it would basically be impossible for them to have not seen it had it occurred.

 

[Izzylizzy]

When you can't breathe, you do go into an automatic "panic". And then, you start to having even more problems with breathing.

I have worked with kids, who have asthma, on just slowing down, not panicking, and managing their mind and body. Before it goes into a full asthma attack.

Terrifying experience.

 

[Izzylizzy]

Possibly. Struggling to get free is what I had in mind but it's certainly possible he was also struggling to breathe.

I'll go with "struggling to breath" aka as being strangled, and in this case to death.

 

[shotgun09]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1856513844241223990

 

[Izzylizzy]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1856513844241223990

Curious who the other man is and if he was identified and interviewed ?
I have yet to see a witness list published or a trial schedule.
The NY Post had nothing today and a few other media sources who did post it was info from yesterday about Gonzalez.

 

[LinasK]

Seems like it'd be hard to miss coughing up blood. Ignoring that is willful.

 

[Izzylizzy]

Start of the trial was delayed today.

'Daniel Penny misused combat technique in deadly subway chokehold, trainer testifies'

"NEW YORK -- When Daniel Penny fatally choked a homeless man aboard a Manhattan subway last year, the 25-year-old veteran appeared to be using a combat technique that he learned in the U.S. Marines, according to the martial arts instructor who served alongside Penny and trained him in several chokeholds.

But contrary to the training he received, Penny maintained his grip around the man's neck after he seemed to lose consciousness, turning the non-lethal maneuver into a potentially deadly choke, the instructor, Joseph Caballer, testified Thursday.

"Once the person is rendered unconscious, that's when you're supposed to let go," Caballer said.'

cont:
https://abc7ny.com/post/daniel-penn...hold-jordan-neely-trainer-testifies/15545913/

 

[Izzylizzy]

Did DP even ask the detective what the condition of JN was?

'Doctor from medical examiner's office takes stand'​

"Jurors also saw Penny's voluntary police precinct interview, where he told detectives he wasn't trying to injure Neely, he was trying to keep him from injuring someone else. A detective testified Penny did not know that Neely had died when he gave that interview.

"The doctor from the medical examiner's office who performed Neely's autopsy also took the stand. She said Neely had blunt force trauma to his face, neck, torso and arms in the form of scrapes and bruises. She ruled his cause of death as compression of the neck.

Testimony resumes Friday.'

Daniel Penny's martial arts instructor testifies in NYC subway chokehold death trial

Daniel Penny's martial arts instructor from the Marine Corps took the stand Thursday for day six of witness testimony in Penny's trial in the chokehold death of Jordan Neely.

www.cbsnews.com

 

[Izzylizzy]

"Mr. Penny told the detectives that he had released his chokehold as soon as he received confirmation from others in the subway car that they were holding Mr. Neely.

But a witness who testified this week, Eric Gonzalez, said that he had told Mr. Penny to release his hold on Mr. Neely and that he would help grab the man’s hands. Mr. Penny ignored his suggestion and continued the chokehold, he said.

Prosecutors have said that Mr. Penny held Mr. Neely in a chokehold for about six minutes, releasing him only after he had become unconscious and gone limp.

A medical examiner who testified Thursday afternoon, Dr. Cynthia Harris, said that she had determined that Mr. Neely died from “compression of the neck.” On his death certificate, she told the jurors, she wrote in parentheses the word “chokehold.”

Marine Who Trained Penny in Chokeholds Testifies at Manslaughter Trial

The military trainer said that Marines are taught to render a person unconscious in seconds. Mr. Penny held Jordan Neely, a homeless man, for six minutes.

www.nytimes.com

 

[Izzylizzy]

Snip from video of detective and DP.

Daniel Penny interrogation video reveals him telling detectives ‘I’m not trying to kill the guy’ hours after Jordan Neely’s chokehold death

It was the first time jurors heard the voice of the man whose fate they’re weighing.

nypost.com

 

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[Izzylizzy]

Medical examiner testifies about Jordan Neely's injuries in subway chokehold trial

Over the last two weeks, the prosecution showed jurors Penny in his own words in the moments following the incident and called nearly three dozen witnesses to testify.

abc7ny.com

 

[shotgun09]

I am following the case via "x", after finding two separate NYC reporters who were live x-ing. Questions and responses from witnesses. Very helpful, as MSM has not offered the same. Coverage sure has been lacking, IMO.
This last witness of the state, Dr Harris the ME has given some excellent testimony. Waiting for cross...

 

[Izzylizzy]

I am following the case via "x", after finding two separate NYC reporters who were live x-ing. Questions and responses from witnesses. Very helpful, as MSM has not offered the same. Coverage sure has been lacking, IMO.
This last witness of the state, Dr Harris the ME has given some excellent testimony. Waiting for cross...

Can you give just their names, not links?
The poor coverage is frustrating.

 

[Rolypolyoly]

Possibly. Struggling to get free is what I had in mind but it's certainly possible he was also struggling to breathe.

I'd suggest both, one as a direct reaction to the other. I'd certainly struggle to get free if someone had a hold of me and was obstructing my ability to breathe. JMO

 

[Ontario Mom]

I am following the case via "x", after finding two separate NYC reporters who were live x-ing. Questions and responses from witnesses. Very helpful, as MSM has not offered the same. Coverage sure has been lacking, IMO.
This last witness of the state, Dr Harris the ME has given some excellent testimony. Waiting for cross...

I've been following there as well since the coverage is basically garbage in MSM.

 

[Rolypolyoly]

"Mr. Penny told the detectives that he had released his chokehold as soon as he received confirmation from others in the subway car that they were holding Mr. Neely.

But a witness who testified this week, Eric Gonzalez, said that he had told Mr. Penny to release his hold on Mr. Neely and that he would help grab the man’s hands. Mr. Penny ignored his suggestion and continued the chokehold, he said.

Prosecutors have said that Mr. Penny held Mr. Neely in a chokehold for about six minutes, releasing him only after he had become unconscious and gone limp.

A medical examiner who testified Thursday afternoon, Dr. Cynthia Harris, said that she had determined that Mr. Neely died from “compression of the neck.” On his death certificate, she told the jurors, she wrote in parentheses the word “chokehold.”

Marine Who Trained Penny in Chokeholds Testifies at Manslaughter Trial

The military trainer said that Marines are taught to render a person unconscious in seconds. Mr. Penny held Jordan Neely, a homeless man, for six minutes.

www.nytimes.com

This witness testified that a properly applied chokehold, a blood choke which he had trained Penny to use, should take about 13 seconds to render the subject unconscious.

13 seconds, and when they are out you let go. 13 seconds, not 6 minutes. Let go as soon as subject is out. Not hold on for 51 more seconds.

JMO.

 

[Izzylizzy]

One's pulse can continue after death for a few minutes.
Neeley had a "faint pulse" when cops first arrived then no pulse.
Had he lived he was looking at being brain damaged from Penny's chokehold and Penny would be facing criminal charges for causing serious bodily harm.

'Cynthia Harris, M.D. arrives for Daniel Penny’s trial at the Manhattan Criminal Court building in New York City on Friday, Nov. 15, 2024. Penny, a Marine veteran, is charged with second-degree manslaughter and criminally negligent homicide in the 2023 death of Jordan Neely on a New York City subway train. (Adam Gray for Fox News Digital)'


"She also said that she believes that Neely died around two minutes, nine seconds into the video, after his face turned purple and he began “twitching” in death throes.

“I believe that at this point he has lost consciousness, and what we will see in the form of these twitchings represents brain injury,” she said."

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