Found Deceased France - Émile S., 2, outside grandparent’s house, Le Vernet, Alpes-de-Haute-Provence, 8 July 2023

[Quim The Extraordinaire]

Latest news, see Skigh’s post #856, is that he was found approx 115 metres from the grandfather's house.

Two miles vs ~350 feet is a difference.

Hope we get some clarity on the location.

 

[Sjöberg]

Two miles vs ~350 feet is a difference.

Hope we get some clarity on the location.

The Chapel in question has to be Chapelle Saint-Pancrace. It was also mentioned in an article.
The Church is probably Église Saint-Martin du Haut-Vernet, as this is the one in the village. But there is also supposedly another one somewhere - still narrowing it all down.

Des ossements du jeune garçon ont été retrouvés au sud du hameau du Haut-Vernet, après la chapelle Saint-Pancrace.
C'est en endroit que les locaux appellent "les 4 chemins", un endroit menant à plusieurs quartiers dont Ville Vieille et les Auches ou encore au col du Labouret.

Translate: Bones of the young boy were found south of the hamlet of Haut-Vernet, after the Saint-Pancrace chapel.It is in a place that the locals call "the 4 paths", a place leading to several districts including Ville Vieille and Auches or even to the Col du Labouret.
Source: DIRECT. Émile: l'avocat des parents du garçon fait part de leur "douleur"
A map is shared by this source: C'est tristement près de la Chapelle Saint-Pancrace, martyr et un des Saints Patrons des enfants... que les ossements d'Emile ont été retrouvés

Maps says 120m from the street corner to the church, but I am still narrowing down the exact spot of the find (must be somewhat farther), as the chapel is disappearing on maps: 14 Rue du Four to Église Saint-Martin du Haut-Vernet

EDIT: I think the chapel is 300m further, but google maps refuses to link the chapel by name for me. It was fine 10-15 min ago, but won't work, not sure if my old laptop is to blame or if it has been taken off maps.

 

[indicolite22]

IMO it's likely that he got lost and couldn't find his way back. If the searchers came near him, he likely would have heard them and cry for help. I can't believe they missed him. They will now try to remember when and how the place where he was found was searched. If he traveled much further, how did he end up near the home again?

 

[Lexiintoronto]

It seems like some politicians are speaking up when normally it’s the police who make a statement and are cautious with the information, imo.

 

[LadyL]

fly high little guy
condolences to the family

 

[Sjöberg]

Also noteworthy: about half-way from the church to the chapel there is a stream or small river or something. Can anyone more local share images of that or any insight? Maybe we arrive back to the old "wandered off & fell in"?

 

[renarde]

Maybe...

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[JerseyWasHome2]

All it takes is one searcher to sneeze (with their eyes closed), or look to the right when they should be looking left,or not be able to look under some dense bushes… if they did not do a structured grid search where you literally stand arms extended, hands touching, and cover every square inch, people are missed, sadly. We’ve seen it here repeatedly where someone’s remains are found by a hiker or hunter. Possible they did look at that exact spot but bones were moved by animals. Even a few feet makes a difference and in that terrain sadly I don’t see how it would have been possible to look at every square foot.

 

[indicolite22]

Reportedly he was wearing a yellow t-shirt at the time of his disappearance. It should have been spotted during the initial search if he was out in the open (not covered). I wonder if any clothing was found with the bones. Perhaps on steep terrain the remains could have moved down slope with time, due to weather and decomposition. One article mentioned someone's opinion that Emile would not have walked alone to where he was found.

 

[Stunned]

Reportedly he was wearing a yellow t-shirt at the time of his disappearance. It should have been spotted during the initial search if he was out in the open (not covered). I wonder if any clothing was found with the bones. Perhaps on steep terrain the remains could have moved down slope with time, due to weather and decomposition. One article mentioned someone's opinion that Emile would not have walked alone to where he was found.

*"someone's opinion" being the biggest take away.

 

[indicolite22]

*"someone's opinion" being the biggest take away.

It's a quote from the title of the article below (link was also posted earlier on the thread):

« Émile ne serait jamais allé seul là où on l’a retrouvé » : au Vernet, la consternation et les doutes

La terrible nouvelle a saisi les habitants du hameau des Alpes-de-Haute-Provence dimanche. Tous s’étonnent de la découverte du crâne dans un

www.leparisien.fr

I can't access the full article so I don't know who the quote is attributed to.

 

[renarde]

It's a quote from the title of the article below (link was also posted earlier on the thread):

« Émile ne serait jamais allé seul là où on l’a retrouvé » : au Vernet, la consternation et les doutes

La terrible nouvelle a saisi les habitants du hameau des Alpes-de-Haute-Provence dimanche. Tous s’étonnent de la découverte du crâne dans un

www.leparisien.fr

I can't access the full article so I don't know who the quote is attributed to.

It's attributed to the mayor, François Balique, who once again shut down access to the hamlet of Haut-Vernet.

 

[JerseyWasHome2]

*"someone's opinion" being the biggest take away.

Yes! My recollection of early reports was that he could run, and would move quickly…

 

[musicaljoke]

Back at post #226 we heard that LE searched 96 hectares or about 237 acres before calling off the search.

Two square miles is 517 hectares or 1280 acres.

 

[Lonicera]

Now we should find Emile’s hiking shoes and his clothes: if the child came alone in this place, his shoes are certainly around . But the weather is very rainy at the moment and streams are in flood. This will complicate the work of the canine brigade of Gramat which is expected on the spot this
monday.

 

[RickshawFan]

Reportedly he was wearing a yellow t-shirt at the time of his disappearance. It should have been spotted during the initial search if he was out in the open (not covered). I wonder if any clothing was found with the bones. Perhaps on steep terrain the remains could have moved down slope with time, due to weather and decomposition. One article mentioned someone's opinion that Emile would not have walked alone to where he was found.

Toddlers don’t react the same way as adults when they get “lost”. They don’t have a concept of “lost”. They also tend to curl under things to feel safe. They may whimper instead of cry. They are very difficult for SAR to find.

These are aspects of the science of “lost person behavior”.

 

[Snoopster]

All it takes is one searcher to sneeze (with their eyes closed), or look to the right when they should be looking left,or not be able to look under some dense bushes… if they did not do a structured grid search where you literally stand arms extended, hands touching, and cover every square inch, people are missed, sadly. We’ve seen it here repeatedly where someone’s remains are found by a hiker or hunter. Possible they did look at that exact spot but bones were moved by animals. Even a few feet makes a difference and in that terrain sadly I don’t see how it would have been possible to look at every square foot.

I don't know what to believe about this case.
Was it a wandering toddler who went further than searchers believed he would go?
Was Emile a victim of crime against a child?

No matter the case, I want to provide hugs to Emile's family and loved ones. They must be so tormented.

I will wait until LE provides more details from their investigation.

 

[bearbear]

a little 2 year old girl is missing in serbia in apparantly very similar circumstances to emile, Danka Ilic

 

[Sjöberg]

a little 2 year old girl is missing in serbia in apparantly very similar circumstances to emile, Danka Ilic

If you have the time, it would be great to have a thread for her, especially as international movement is not ruled out (a unconfirmed sighting in Vienna, Austria is currently being investigated by the LE and she is added to Interpol, though as always, probabilities are that she is closer to home, one way or the other). Link1, Link2

As for Émile, I suspect we're in for a long silence, then maybe we get the CoD (is it usually published in France in such cases?), and if any further investigation is needed, there will probably be another long silence. If it is ruled undetermined and if no more bones are found, I am not even sure how things could proceed. So I guess finding the rest of his body and his clothes etc is a priority for now.

 

[kittythehare]

It would therefore be in this particularly steep area, rightly called the Auches ravine, that Émile's skull would have been discovered on Saturday by a hiker, herself a resident of Haut-Vernet, according to the mayor. You can get there by going down from the hamlet.
“It’s one of the worst things we can face”
Back in Le Vernet, we meet the mayor, François Balique, passing through the town hall to issue an order prohibiting access to Haut-Vernet for several days, so that the gendarmes and residents are not disturbed.

“This discovery of Émile is a new ordeal for everyone. People are really suffering from this story here. First, there was this disappearance, these incessant searches. This week's reconstruction has rekindled the wounds. And then death... A 2 and a half year old child who dies in his town, for a mayor, it is among the worst things we can face. My thoughts are with Émile’s family. I can't help but believe that an adult is involved in this matter. Émile would never have gone alone to where he was found. »

Concerning the area where the child's skull was discovered, the councilor struggles to understand: “There are people who regularly pass on the path nearby, I passed there last week. The volunteers have been there, I’m sure. I was there during the searches. And the gendarmes couldn't have missed him with the dogs... There was even some logging this fall. The loggers didn't see anything either. It's incomprehensible. »

« Émile ne serait jamais allé seul là où on l’a retrouvé » : au Vernet, la consternation et les doutes

La terrible nouvelle a saisi les habitants du hameau des Alpes-de-Haute-Provence dimanche. Tous s’étonnent de la découverte du crâne dans un

www.leparisien.fr

wow!
I presume he knows more than the general public know.
Is this a rational assessment based upon actual known facts or is he just speculating/
he has taken a very active role from the outset, I don't recall hearing him speak recklessly in the past/
Is my memory good on this or am I mistaken?

it's a bombshell for sure..to my ears , at least.