Gene Hackman dead at 95: Iconic actor and wife, 63, are found dead with their dog at Santa Fe home. #2

[Cherwell]

It's the second house on the property. I put up the Zillow links elsewhere, but if you google 1425 Old Sunset Trail, you'll see two listings for the address, the big main one and this smaller one.

Well, I'm confused now as Old Sunset Trail and Santa Fe Summit seem to be two different locations on opposite sides of the main road.

 

[Izzylizzy]

 

[formerreddingrunner]

Well, there's a non-disclosure agreement (NDA) . But we don't know who is paying the caretaker in Hawaii. And it's also unclear how enforceable NDAs sometimes are.
MOO

Yeah, I feel like the caregiver (BA's mother's caregiver) is innocuous. If she just said, "I haven't heard from BA in a while, and I found that odd."

 

[NCWatcher]

That's the term I was looking for NDA. I remain surprised that the caretaker of a dead woman's elderly dememtia suffering 91 year old mother feels free to chime in with her derogatory statement.
Nursing homes and hospice definitely do not allow patient informatiom to be spread as gossip by employees.

Imo

I'm not sure most people would find what the mother's caretaker said after BA's death a derogatory statement. And BA wasn't the caretaker's patient. I saw it as more of a statement about puzzling behavior. Friends and employees who have spoken of not seeing the couple recently or the dog acupuncturist saying BA hadn't brought the dog Bear in since Oct weren't viewed as saying derogatory things. At least I don't think they were.
MOO

 

[formerreddingrunner]

Nursing homes and hospice definitely do not allow patient information to be spread as gossip by employees.

To be fair, the caregiver wasn't talking about her patient though. so, it's not a HIPAA violation in that regard.

To make a statement like, "My employer hasn't contacted me in a while, and I found that odd" if Betsy was paying (or was the executor of her mom's estate) her mom's caregiver isn't a violation of anything. And I doubt she signed a NDA for a job as a caregiver.

 

[avalonisland]

Still think way too much over thinking in this thread re intruders

I think Gene had a medical episode in that mud room, his wife rushed to get his tablets, disturbed the space heater, space heater knocked her out cold and killed her, I have seen space heaters and especially metal ones landing on the head of a woman in her 60’s would be enough to cause a fatal brain bleed

At his age and medical condition, a primary caregiver would expect at some point there may be a medical episode. Why did she not call 911? He was dressed with probably baseball cap with glasses on baseball cap (if similar to photos on Internet year and 2 prior). Wife caregiver taking 2 phones with her to get a daily thyroid med and hpb daily med makes no sense to me if there was a medical episode. If wife and husband in pjs, I could understand maybe dog in crate before morning let out. I also find it strange one can look from exterior into interior of house and see person on the ground in bathroom, so my guess is it was husband worker say if through a window.

 

[avalonisland]

We have no way of knowing that. Two years ago, driving through the fast food line, he looked old but relatively healthy. He was far more frail and emaciated a year ago in the photos we've seen, and a year later, at 95, with several people stating his health was failing recently, I'm guessing he was fragile as a feather. Older people often don't realize how weak they are, especially when they have had tons of support from a caregiver. Example: My husband's grandparents had been supporting each other symbiotically and when he had a heart attack and spent some time in the hospital, it all went wrong. Next thing you know, they were driving around town and couldn't remember where to go despite living there for decades. He had been covering for her dementia and when he also began to lose his memory, their system failed.

The primary caregiver, which I think was wife, was found on bathroom floor with prescription pills (seems daily routine script) and 2 PHONES. Why have 2 phones. I would think husband and wife would each have a phone with them at all times if cellphone

 

[NuttMegg]

I'm not sure most people would find what the mother's caretaker said after BA's death a derogatory statement. And BA wasn't the caretaker's patient. I saw it as more of a statement about puzzling behavior. Friends and employees who have spoken of not seeing the couple recently or the dog acupuncturist saying BA hadn't brought the dog Bear in since Oct weren't viewed as saying derogatory things. At least I don't think they were.
MOO

How does the caretaker know that BA did not check in with other relatives or friends about her mother's condition?
My brother suffers from dementia. I would never call a caretaker to learn of his condition. He doesn't remember who I am. It's cruel, imo, to try to remind a dementia patient about family members they have forgotten. It"s beyond heartless to purposely cause a dementia patient to try to remember something that we already know they have forgotten. The pain and confusion is heart breaking.

We don't know what the extent of BA's mother's dementia is. BA most certainly did, imo

 

[priyaya]

The primary caregiver, which I think was wife, was found on bathroom floor with prescription pills (seems daily routine script) and 2 PHONES. Why have 2 phones. I would think husband and wife would each have a phone with them at all times if cellphone

in my friend who is married to a much older man in his 80s, he doesn't really use the phone except to talk to her. if she's around he loses it all the time because if she's there, there is no reason he needs it.
that said did the warrant say BA was holding both phones? i though it just said 2 phones recovered

 

[Cherwell]

At his age and medical condition, a primary caregiver would expect at some point there may be a medical episode. Why did she not call 911?

Because she was dead or incapacitated herself?

The primary caregiver, which I think was wife, was found on bathroom floor with prescription pills (seems daily routine script) and 2 PHONES. Why have 2 phones. I would think husband and wife would each have a phone with them at all times if cellphone

We don't know where the two phones were. It has not been disclosed.

 

[avalonisland]

Video of Gene spotted enjoying a stroll, clad in a baseball cap, vest and flannel shirt in Santa Fe, New Mexico, on April 5, 2024 less than a year ago.

Looks to me like he was getting around pretty good then. More recent photos show him with a cane. Not sure how much his mobility would have degraded from last April.

JMO

He looks so alert and mobile for a 94 year old man with pacemaker. It's just a little strange to me that all of his rare photos are of him with like a soda/coffee and snack. Is this the only time he was allowed to leave house? I saw and loved the photos of him getting fast food. I cannot imagine driving at 93. I think much of what is on his/wife cellphones will be important, plus contents of trash bags. So sad overall, but mostly my heart is crushed for poor dog who died in crate or bathroom.

 

[Cherwell]

I'm not sure most people would find what the mother's caretaker said after BA's death a derogatory statement. And BA wasn't the caretaker's patient. I saw it as more of a statement about puzzling behavior. Friends and employees who have spoken of not seeing the couple recently or the dog acupuncturist saying BA hadn't brought the dog Bear in since Oct weren't viewed as saying derogatory things. At least I don't think they were.
MOO

I agree. She may have been doorstepped by reporters, and saying something like "I don't know, I haven't spoken to her since October" might have been her way of shutting them down.

 

[priyaya]

Because she was dead or incapacitated herself?

This is what i have to keep coming back to. Becky seemed so in charge of everything in that house and probably was used to doing most of it on her own since they withdrew from covid.

I can only wish the two both went quickly and never knew the other was suffering.

 

[priyaya]

He looks so alert and mobile for a 94 year old man with pacemaker. It's just a little strange to me that all of his rare photos are of him with like a soda/coffee and snack. Is this the only time he was allowed to leave house? I saw and loved the photos of him getting fast food. I cannot imagine driving at 93. I think much of what is on his/wife cellphones will be important, plus contents of trash bags. So sad overall, but mostly my heart is crushed for poor dog who died in crate or bathroom.

it seems they only went out to eat and at that point no way for the paps to catch you.
that said i do think Gene's apple strudel and coffee were his cheat day/moments of joy.

 

[Cherwell]

He looks so alert and mobile for a 94 year old man with pacemaker. It's just a little strange to me that all of his rare photos are of him with like a soda/coffee and snack. Is this the only time he was allowed to leave house? I saw and loved the photos of him getting fast food.

These are paparazzi photos. They take note of celebs' habits so they know where to hang out to get shots of them.

 

[NCWatcher]

How does the caretaker know that BA did not check in with other relatives or friends about her mother's condition?
My brother suffers from dementia. I would never call a caretaker to learn of his condition. He doesn't remember who I am. It's cruel, imo, to try to remind a dementia patient about family members they have forgotten. It"s beyond heartless to purposely cause a dementia patient to try to remember something that we already know they have forgotten. The pain and confusion is heart breaking.

We don't know what the extent of BA's mother's dementia is. BA most certainly did, imo

Maybe BA did check with other family. (But it's been reported BA had no other family besides her mother.) I think all the caretaker was saying was she/they had not heard from BA since Oct and that was unusual. Maybe I'm missing your point but I'm not sure how that relates to reminding the mother of anything. Are you suggesting the mother might have seen the caretaker's statement in a newspaper or online?
MOO

 

[NuttMegg]

Maybe BA did check with other family. (But it's been reported BA had no other family besides her mother.) I think all the caretaker was saying was she/they had not heard from BA since Oct and that was unusual. Maybe I'm missing your point but I'm not sure how that relates to reminding the mother of anything. Are you suggesting the mother might have seen the caretaker's statement in a newspaper or online?
MOO

Not at all. IIRC the original report was that the caretaker said that Betsy hadn't called her 91 year old dementia suffering mother in X number of months.

I will never be able to call my brother again, without purposely causing him pain and confusion. As I have seen it in person.

Maybe Betsy was in the same situation and shared my concern, not to cause her mother pain.

Anyway, i can't change my opinion that the caretaker was WAY out of line. So I'll just leave it at that.

 

[crazychris]

JMO - it has been stated a lot that Gene and Betsy were very much dog and animal lovers so they would surely know that mushrooms are toxic to dogs.

Ordinary mushrooms that you buy in the supermarket are not toxic to dog. We give our Beagle one sometimes.

 

[avalonisland]

Still think way too much over thinking in this thread re intruders

I think Gene had a medical episode in that mud room, his wife rushed to get his tablets, disturbed the space heater, space heater knocked her out cold and killed her, I have seen space heaters and especially metal ones landing on the head of a woman in her 60’s would be enough to cause a fatal brain bleed

But the medications found near wife are not for medical emergencies...just like daily prescription and maybe aspirin/ibuprofen for pain. Why would wife run to bathroom with 2025 calendar, 2 mobile cellphones, medical chart, not call 911 next to husband side, then she collapses to death in another room, near space heater with script bottles while leaving dog locked in crate and husband on mudroom floor having medical episode? This makes no sense. One could make sense is wife died in bathroom and was primary caregiver of husband and dog and crate which is why dog and husband ultimately could not care for themselves without primary caregiver being able to do so. Lesson learned: Dogs should never ever be locked in crate no matter what EVER.

 

[JDG]

He looks so alert and mobile for a 94 year old man with pacemaker. It's just a little strange to me that all of his rare photos are of him with like a soda/coffee and snack. Is this the only time he was allowed to leave house? I saw and loved the photos of him getting fast food. I cannot imagine driving at 93. I think much of what is on his/wife cellphones will be important, plus contents of trash bags. So sad overall, but mostly my heart is crushed for poor dog who died in crate or bathroom.

Having a pacemaker does not affect one’s alertness nor mobility.

It regulates your heartbeat, that’s it.

Some people have pacemakers from infancy yet lead long and healthy lives.