4 Univ of Idaho Students Murdered, Bryan Kohberger Arrested, Moscow, Nov 2022 #104

[Megnut]

It was a humdinger!!

Humdinger, dumbdinger

AT can't present actual testimony that BK has ASD but that he couldn't tie his shoelaces when he was young, had other characteristics often associated with ASD but was never diagnosed as such as a child, so with maybe only herself as an authority, AT says he was misdiagnosed as a child...

So she wants to be able to instruct the jury in her opening statement for the guilt phase that he has ASD and not to make judgments about his appearance/behavior/lack of affect in court (which, by the way, is a standard jury instruction -- how a defendant acts in court is not evidence) when actually that's their mitigating defense for the penalty phase.

Hasn't had time to go through all of discovery though she has sat down and tried to watch some video so..... if the judge or the State could tell her where to find an alibi or a SODDI that would help her, otherwise she needs more time. Or the State should be sanctioned, taking the DP off the table. Or AT will walk in at the start of trial and be forced to say they're not ready.

The nerve.

JMO

 

[Gigiky]

If AT continues to refer to it as the doll house, maybe the state should put a bloody Barbie inside, and snap her back to the reality that there is nothing cutesy about referring to a model of the house where 4 murders occurred as such. I would suggest that if she ever refers to it as the doll house in trial, that will not be well-received by anyone other than perhaps her client. JMO

The fact that AT refers to it as a doll house at all speaks volumes to her Ethical, Moral and Professionalism. Also to include anyone else that make the same reference JMO.

 

[Odeto BJ]

If AT continues to refer to it as the doll house, maybe the state should put a bloody Barbie inside, and snap her back to the reality that there is nothing cutesy about referring to a model of the house where 4 murders occurred as such. I would suggest that if she ever refers to it as the doll house in trial, that will not be well-received by anyone other than perhaps her client. JMO

Agreed. Under the circumstances that bit of puerile minimalizing is gonna come back to bite her....

Some speculation:
We know that DD was driving around and made delivery at 3:59. Mr Hughes has done a great video on the whereabouts of A white Elantra over a considerable period prior to that; and the key period shortly thereafter. During or immediately after the DD delivery: Do we know if the DD driver ever saw anyone inside the house or saw indication that there was someone moving or otherwise reacting to the receipt of the food order? Lights on and off or???

AT has repeated that the street videos were not cued up or otherwise arranged to facilitate her review of them; she has to view their full duration to comprehend their relevancy. Of course, she does not have to do that review, others could reduce each one to the times where the Elantra, or at least the movements of a car, appears in the video and make a directory much as Hughes has done. AT could then review those relevant clips and retain the catalog....Much of that has been done by Mr. Hughes. For a 25 minute video....
Considering that AT keeps bringing this up: is the Defense in fact expecting to find an alternate vehicle, at multiple alternate times, as though SODDI appears in those videos? And that task therefore cannot be assigned to someone else? That only works for a very brief period after the white Elantra is last seen...IIRC the interval of time between XN on Instagram and and the first exchange between DM and BF is not very great, if the Defense is looking for an alternate vehicle they must be able to discredit or otherwise discount the XN connection because there are (2) live people who can substantiate the other end of the timing.
Maybe AT is taking so long to look at vids because she's trying to find a time warp? EEE-You

Pure curiousity. Nothing known that would substantiate. JMO.

 

[Maat99]

I wonder why AT is so worried about his affect in court? Are there any reports of him behaving bizarrely or inappropriately during his various hearings?

 

[Megnut]

Okay, I’ve skimmed through the last ten pages or so.

Having missed the majority of the hearing, what I garner from the posts here is leaving me gobsmacked.

It seems from what I’ve skimmed that AT and Co. are attempting to infantilize Bryan? Apparently there were comments that he had trouble tying his shoes and forming the numeral 5 correctly?

Did they claim this was when he was a child, or a persistent problem as an adult???

In any event it seems that Judge Hippler is smacking down all this nonsense, seeing as how BK managed to live alone, drive, go to college and so on.

I’m astonished/not astonished that his defense is flailing around, as they really have nothing to support BK as innocent. But I am truly surprised as to how they are coming across as such amateurs.

JMO and thanks to all my fellow posters for keeping the rest of us so well-informed.


To all the great posts I missed.

Yep. All of that.

He was never even diagnosed with ASD. The shoelaces and the 5s, that was all in his childhood.

Even the judge quipped, "was that before his doctoral program?"

 

[NicoleInVa]

I didn’t get to watch the end today. Are they reconvening tomorrow or did they finish all of the motions?

 

[Megnut]

I wonder why AT is so worried about his affect in court? Are there any reports of him behaving bizarrely or inappropriately during his various hearings?

She has to contend with his thumbs up selfie.

Plus he may be fascinated with crime scene photos and glare at witnesses -- or jurors. He might creep everyone out.

Have we at least heard the last of Sy Ray? That was quite the dressing down.

JMO

 

[NoeticSoul]

Humdinger, dumbdinger

AT can't present actual testimony that BK has ASD but that he couldn't tie his shoelaces when he was young, had other characteristics often associated with ASD but was never diagnosed as such as a child, so with maybe only herself as an authority, AT says he was misdiagnosed as a child...

So she wants to be able to instruct the jury in her opening statement for the guilt phase that he has ASD and not to make judgments about his appearance/behavior/lack of affect in court (which, by the way, is a standard jury instruction -- how a defendant acts in court is not evidence) when actually that's their mitigating defense for the penalty phase.

Hasn't had time to go through all of discovery though she has sat down and tried to watch some video so..... if the judge or the State could tell her where to find an alibi or a SODDI that would help her, otherwise she needs more time. Or the State should be sanctioned, taking the DP off the table. Or AT will walk in at the start of trial and be forced to say they're not ready.

The nerve.

JMO

Basically she's twiddling her thumbs to delay delay delay, feigning stupid and uninformed, diagnosing her own client's mental illnesses these days with clients (without professionals to assist), and campaigning about non existent (undisclosed) discovery from the state. Sweeeeeeeeeeeeeeet. DUMB.

 

[NoeticSoul]

I wonder why AT is so worried about his affect in court? Are there any reports of him behaving bizarrely or inappropriately during his various hearings?

NO he just sits there like a ventriloquists dummy in court.. small, low, and helpless seemingly... ALl a show imo

 

[NoeticSoul]

She has to contend with his thumbs up selfie.

Plus he may be fascinated with crime scene photos and glare at witnesses -- or jurors. He might creep everyone out.

Have we at least heard the last of Sy Ray? That was quite the dressing down.

JMO

They are NEVER going to prevail about that "victory" THUBS UP VIDEO/PHOTO. Still wish I could unsee that too forever. That face, awkward as it IS in the thumb's up photo..... speaks Volumes and will to the jury I am certain.

 

[Arkay]

If AT continues to refer to it as the doll house, maybe the state should put a bloody Barbie inside, and snap her back to the reality that there is nothing cutesy about referring to a model of the house where 4 murders occurred as such. I would suggest that if she ever refers to it as the doll house in trial, that will not be well-received by anyone other than perhaps her client. JMO

Yeah, and ita, what a stupid and needless JAB at the very house where 4 innocent young adult souls perished needlessly and brutally. AT seems to have no compassion or empathy even before trial. Makes me sick how nonchalant AT and crew are about this all. While its brightly evident that the poor 'mentally and physically disabled BK' purchased a knife, sheath, and sharpening tools (pre planned!). How is THAT deficient in any mental capacity?

The fact that AT refers to it as a doll house at all speaks volumes to her Ethical, Moral and Professionalism. Also to include anyone else that make the same reference JMO.

Agreed. Under the circumstances that bit of puerile minimalizing is gonna come back to bite her....

Oh boy——I saw these comments while skimming, but I think I didn’t focus——WTH was this about????

What is the context??? Was AT implying the girls were “Barbie dolls?”

I’m sure I did miss the context but how diminishing this is, a house where four young people were viciously murdered!

It’s grotesque if she was trying to trivialize what happened within that house, and instead attempt to paint it in a belittling and light-hearted manner.

“Puerile minimizing,” for sure. Well said.

JMO

 

[Odeto BJ]

AT can't present actual testimony that BK has ASD but that he couldn't tie his shoelaces when he was young, had other characteristics often associated with ASD but was never diagnosed as such as a child, so with maybe only herself as an authority, AT says he was misdiagnosed as a child...

So she wants to be able to instruct the jury in her opening statement for the guilt phase that he has ASD and not to make judgments about his appearance/behavior/lack of affect in court (which, by the way, is a standard jury instruction -- how a defendant acts in court is not evidence) when actually that's their mitigating defense for the penalty phase.

Edited by me...Love it all though.

To misquote Carl Sagan:
The absence of a diagnosis is not a diagnosis of absence.

So AT can't say it yet: But he was there, in November 2022; and should not be held accountable because he had ASD some 20 plus years ago....and AT wants to draw the jury's attention to his behavior during trial so the D can use his specific presence to support a contention that the DP should not be utilized in this case.

Minor oddities as mitigation for a heinouse crime.
Maybe all convicted and incarcerated criminals who can substantiate say, dyslexia, should be immediately paroled?
As to odd behaviors....I keep thinking of Charles Adelson.

JMO

 

[NoeticSoul]

Oh boy——I saw these comments while skimming, but I think I didn’t focus——WTH was this about????

What is the context??? Was AT implying the girls were “Barbie dolls?”

I’m sure I did miss the context but how diminishing this is, a house where four young people were viciously murdered!

It’s grotesque if she was trying to trivialize what happened within that house, and instead attempt to paint it in a belittling and light-hearted manner.

“Puerile minimizing,” for sure. Well said.

JMO

Related to the 'Doll House' comment that the D made... I refer you t to @katydid23 's post here

AT was simply referring to the house replica that was created. AND that's what I meant by her having no compassion, being so curt and smug about that home as to 'nick name it;'.

 

[NoeticSoul]

I didn’t get to watch the end today. Are they reconvening tomorrow or did they finish all of the motions?

IIRC done but for some written decisions due by the judge soon related to this hearing.

 

[NoeticSoul]

Edited by me...Love it all though.

To misquote Carl Sagan:
The absence of a diagnosis is not a diagnosis of absence.

So AT can't say it yet: But he was there, in November 2022; and should not be held accountable because he had ASD some 20 plus years ago....and AT wants to draw the jury's attention to his behavior during trial so the D can use his specific presence to support a contention that the DP should not be utilized in this case.

Minor oddities as mitigation for a heinouse crime.
Maybe all convicted and incarcerated criminals who can substantiate say, dyslexia, should be immediately paroled?
As to odd behaviors....I keep thinking of Charles Adelson.

JMO

Perfectly said. I'm gonna quote @Warwick7 and say BAM! xox

 

[katydid23]

IMO AT and Sy Ray deserve every bit ofJudge H’s ire and tongue lashing r/t SR’s inflammatory and accusatory language in his Affidavit.
Judge at one point referred to SR’s “conspiracy theories” based on no evidence and leaving the AT&T seven day timeline for receiving Timing Advance records out of his Affadavit.
Called SR out/scolded him and AT about leaving that info out and mentioned their serious allegations/ implying the state is hiding evidence which could lead to serious consequences for state officers of the court, not least of which disbarment.

Judge said he sees no facts or evidence that the TA reports can be obtained another way per SR/AT’s claims, and said he’d only allow it if facts and evidence are presented to back up said claims and if I heard him correctly, he’d allow AT questioning on it without the jury present. Did I hear that right?

Just wondering why bother if the Jury can’t hear about alleged evidence SR supposedly has about other ways to obtain BK’s TA reports.
I’m having trouble understanding if SR provides facts/evidence to back up his claims and Attorney’s can only question SR and other witnesses about it without the Jury present, the Jury won’t hear about it and so won’t be considering it in their deliberations, so why bother with it at all?? Isn’t it considered inadmissible evidence if the Jury can’t hear about it??

Wondering if it’s because the D will be able to mention it in opening or closing statements which aren’t considered evidence? Idk. IANAL and my head’s been spinning on that one but perhaps I heard the Judge wrong r/t AT questioning SR/other witnesses without the Jury present.
I did have to turn my volume up several times throughout this hearing in order to hear the Judge. IMO he’s soft spoken and tends to not speak into microphone lol, I love this Judge though!

Way to smack ‘em down Judge H, huge virtual thumbs up!

IMHOO

Yes, the judge did say that AT can question Agent Ballance in court, w/out jury present.

I've seen that happen before as a way to test the alleged evidence. Thus if she questions the FBI agent, and asks him about the TA records, and IF there was a way for him to get BK's records from November, that many weeks later, the judge will decide how successful her questioning was.

The judge will decide if the agent had another way of procuring those TA reports or not. If the judge believes there were no TA reports for BK available to the prosecution , then the D will have to give up on that accusation.

If the agent waffles or seems inconsistent, then the judge can allow further questioning, perhaps of other people involved, etc. But I doubt it will go that way. IMO

 

[mickey2942]

I found the request to throw out the description of the perpetrator, having, "Bushy Eye Brows". Ludicrous.

That does describe BK!!!

 

[katydid23]

Have you ever heard so much moaning and groaning from a defense team?

It was really evident when they were complaining about the ATT data----and they kept say how complicated and confusing and complex it was and there were not specific explanations from the prosecution added to the data about what it all meant---

And the judge said something like 'from my experience when you purchase online you click on the product, it goes into your cart and they you enter your card info. Isn't that what the state was attempting to send you? '

And then the D attorney tried to muddy it all up, saying 'it's so much more complicated than that, with AI, and suggested purchases, and maybe things you just looked at and not bought, and the other family on the account too'...blah blah blah

And Judge H said ' I think you are overcomplicating things'.[ or some comment like that]

 

[NoeticSoul]

I found the request to throw out the description of the perpetrator, having, "Bushy Eye Brows". Ludicrous.

That does describe BK!!!

Most all of what was presented today by the D was Ludicrous and time wasting
imo

 

[fcavanaugh]

Yes, the judge did say that AT can question Agent Ballance in court, w/out jury present.

I've seen that happen before as a way to test the alleged evidence. Thus if she questions the FBI agent, and asks him about the TA records, and IF there was a way for him to get BK's records from November, that many weeks later, the judge will decide how successful her questioning was.

The judge will decide if the agent had another way of procuring those TA reports or not. If the judge believes there were no TA reports for BK available to the prosecution , then the D will have to give up on that accusation.

If the agent waffles or seems inconsistent, then the judge can allow further questioning, perhaps of other people involved, etc. But I doubt it will go that way. IMO

Thank you so much for your reply and confirmation I didn’t hear wrong, it doesn’t help that I was trying to multitask and watch/listen to the hearing while working lol.
Everything you said/explained makes perfect sense.
Thanks again @katydid23!


IMHOO