4 Univ of Idaho Students Murdered, Bryan Kohberger Arrested, Moscow, Nov 2022 #107

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  • #981
I think you're missing the point I was making, which was, they could have done everything possible and it would not have changed the outcome.

As someone with an anxiety disorder severe enough to put me on disability, I don't see how conditioning someone to live with the perpetual fear of the highly unlikely is helpful. It's a miserable way to live.

MOO

I apologize for missing the point of your message, @iamshadow21, and am very sorry you suffer from such a debilitating condition.

But please don’t think I want any woman to live in perpetual fear. My point here is that college students (without severe anxiety disorders) might take some precautions to feel less fearful and out of control (or at least help their parents feel less anxious).

I am not a mental health worker, so I have no expertise in how to help a person with an anxiety disorder deal with the tragedy that took place at 1122 King Road.
 
  • #982
The concern I have is the defense wanting to wait until this leak investigation is over. They’ve used every means at their disposal to take the death penalty off the table, and this would offer new hope.
Have to say, regardless of their rights to air what they want using protected anonymous sources, I think it was quite irresponsible of Dateline to air their program so close to trial day.

If the motion for continuance relates to the trial and does cite the potential leak and the current independent investigation which is about to/ has just commenced, it will be interesting to see what arguments are used. INAL so do not understand how the defense might frame such an argument to make it valid so Hippler would allow a continuance. Moo
 
  • #983
I think he was probably there too. And being vegan, I agree I try every place that has vegan options.
Yes! I'm vegan also FTA. I know all the vegan spots also or w vegan options. Fortunate, I'm in Los Angeles.
 
  • #984
Well, IIRC, BK submitted the celebrated essay in May 2020, so I think he was a senior undergraduate. It still enabled him to pursue and later receive his master’s.

It’s pretty satisfying, isn’t it, that people here criticize his writing skills like he criticized the English language skills of his female WSU professor. Too bad he can’t read our commentary.

I wonder if Bryan will continue to write in prison. Has he already started his next paper, eager to submit it to a respected academic journal? Maybe a book? Surely he’ll write in first person, as he is wont to do. About the Idaho murders, no doubt.

IMO
I believe anything BK writes is subject to search and seizure in his cell before the trial begins. Surely he can't be stupid enough to write anything incriminating while awaiting trial????

But then again, BK is BK...so who knows?? The same guy that bought the murder weapon on Amazon and had it delivered to his home before he left for WU, drove his own car to the murder scene 23 times prior, circled the house 4 times on the night of the murders, took his own phone, left a sheath with DNA on it.

Not a criminal mastermind genius at all. I think he wanted to become one and this was his first attempt as a budding SK. Glad he made those several huge mistakes. So very sorry that Maddie, Kaylee, Xana and Ethan had to pay the price for his evilness. :(

JMO
 
  • #985
Let me ask for opinions here:

What are the chances BK pleads guilty right before the trial?

I give it 60% chance.

What say you????
I say BK's arrogance and his need to relive the experience will not allow him to accept a Plea, and I don't think the State would offer one either.

JMO
 
  • #986
So Kohberger may not have had to take the GRE to get into his master’s program if he started the program the semester after submitting his crime scene final. He likely had to take the GRE to enter the PhD program, though, and his grades would have to be stellar.
One would hope so, but he also had glowing, flattering recommendations from DeSales, his grades there were top notch there I'd bet. I am so anticipating testimony from his Prof.'s there (KR especially).

MOO
 
  • #987
Possibly the summary page is not updating properly because of my location, but has the Motion to Continue been removed from the case summary,? Haven't got screen shot down pat so below is a copy and paste of the relevant page followed by link to the summary page. Or has the 20th May updated page now been removed and replaced with an earlier update,? Date printed is 15th May.

Someone in the US could maybe check the case summary independently incase I am not getting the the most updated version?

P92.

"...05/14/2025 Notice
Notice of Complaince
05/15/2025 Pre-trial ConferenceUS (9:00 AM) (Judicial Officer: Hippler, Steven)..."

[Motion to Continue was previously here dated 05/20/2025]

"...06/02/2025 CANCELED Jury Trial (8:30 AM) (Judicial Officer: Judge, John ;Location: Courtroom 3)
Vacated
07/21/2025 CANCELED Hearing Scheduled (9:00 AM) (Judicial Officer: Hippler, Steven)
Vacated
07/30/2025 Hearing Scheduled (9:00 AM) (Judicial Officer: Hippler, Steven)
08/11/2025 Jury Trial (8:30 AM) (Judicial Officer: Hippler, Steven)
ADA COUNTY DISTRICT COURT
CASE SUMMARY
CASE NO. CR01-24-31665
PAGE 92 OF 92 Printed on 05/14/2025 at 2:06 PM"

 
  • #988
And didn't AT have to enter the plea for him?
BK 'stood silent' during the question of how he plead "Guilty or Not Guilty". He refused to answer so the Judge automatically entered a Not Guilty plea on his behalf.
 
  • #989
I see what you are saying, though my argument is not "well, anything is possible". I'm hoping that people can see that someone's "what is probable" and someone else's "what is probable" don't have to be the same. My probable does not include Maddie being the target. Doesn't mean I'm right, I just haven't seen any facts that proves she was so I reserve judgment. ATM, I think it was just the house. That could change next week when something else is released, because I originally thought Xana (for reasons I won't go into).

The point I was making is that I have seen posters make statements like "We can ALL see this is the only possible *whatever*" and nope, I don't see that as being the only possible *whatever* at all. And I don't think I am alone, but that is again, JMO. People get to have opinions. But we ALL get to have opinions and quite honestly, I would not mind a well thought out "They got the wrong house" theory. I'd like to nurture that a bit more. IMHO.
You are correct in saying that we don't for a fact the order of the killings. I've had questions all along, one day I'm convinced of XYZ and the next it's completely opposite.

I have no issues with any poster who shares an opinion different from mine, I actually welcome hypothesizing an alternate scenario.

JMO
 
  • #990
Yes! I'm vegan also FTA. I know all the vegan spots also or w vegan options. Fortunate, I'm in Los Angeles.

Same here! I’m trying to slowly make my way through all the fully vegan restaurants in my large urban area.

I also like the idea that BK encountered both Maddie (and Xana, IMO) at the Mad Greek because it seems just too coincidental otherwise. (Two of the four murder victims worked at The Mad Greek, which served vegan options, the murderer is a vegan, YET he didn’t first encounter them there? Come on!)

But then my more rational, sober, boring side reminds me that coincidences do happen (for example, there’s a 50% chance that 2 people in any group of 23 people will share the same birthday!).

According to my Happy Cow app, The Sugar Babe Bakery is the only fully vegan café in Pullman (as of Feb 2022, according to the entry). Happy Cow lists no fully vegan restaurants for Moscow.

However, we know BK likes Thai food, and he could choose from at least three restaurants that serve such food (two in Pullman and one in Moscow, at least today).

All in all, Happy Cow lists 23 restaurants with vegan options in the Pullman-Moscow area! That might seem like a lot for such a small population (less than 60,000 in 2022), but they are college towns, after all, and Moscow, at least, has a funky, liberal vibe.

I still think BK met Maddie & Xana at The Mad Greek, though I’ll certainly change my mind if shown sworn evidence to the contrary.
 
  • #991
Defense has asked for a continuance, but I know if that’s in regards to a hearing (like the one tomorrow), or for the case itself.




View attachment 587407
This is odd. Is it my location? The screen shot showing the updates to the summary page beginning 05/16/2025 are not showing in the link you attached to the summary page. Is this just me when I click on the link? If not then the summary page has been backdated back to 15th May since you made the screen shot. Jmo
 
  • #992
I apologize for missing the point of your message, @iamshadow21, and am very sorry you suffer from such a debilitating condition.

But please don’t think I want any woman to live in perpetual fear. My point here is that college students (without severe anxiety disorders) might take some precautions to feel less fearful and out of control (or at least help their parents feel less anxious).

I am not a mental health worker, so I have no expertise in how to help a person with an anxiety disorder deal with the tragedy that took place at 1122 King Road.
Thank you.

I wasn't disclosing my own condition to make you feel bad, just offering an alternative viewpoint. The kind of things you're suggesting aren't bad things to do, of course, but if a person becomes fearful then such things can become a cage. A pattern of things you do because you're too frightened not to, but you know as you're doing them that they're kind of futile, a panacea against all the potential ills and misfortunes that could befall you.

I think it's one thing to be aware and take sensible precautions, but I don't think it's necessarily a kindness to try and make someone fearful who isn't. We often mourn the loss of innocence in victims of crime, who have it brought home to them how cruel the world can be. I think it's wonderful there are people out there for whom youth is a golden time where bad things don't happen to you, just to distant strangers. I never had that.

MOO
 
  • #993
Yes, an event such as the Idaho murders is indeed exceedingly rare, but IMO a young person can learn so much from it by treating it as a cautionary tale.

Caveat: I AM NOT BLAMING THE VICTIMS.
This is a really excellent list. It would be great if this could be posted somewhere on WS for everyone to read. I’m saving it to share with people who aren’t in the forum.
 
  • #994
I'm looking at past threads and saw a lot of discussion on this question:

Did BK plan a mass murder event? Or was BK targeting a single victim and he was surprised, leading to subsequent murders? OR/and was BK targeting the house itself?

So this is jmo, but I think it's something of a combination of all three. The house was attractive to a potential murderer for many reasons related to surveillance and possible navigation with online floorplans. The house was filled with attractive co-eds, and was frequented by a single male. BK would have undoubtedly been blinded with jealousy by someone like Ethan, and would clearly have resented the young and vivacious female occupants because of his problems with rejection and beyond. BK undoubtedly (again, jmo) had found a way to gain heightened awareness of the individual occupants of the residence by the time he entered the home. He may have to some extent been more heavily focused on a single individual there. But I don't know that he was so fixated on any single victim that he'd have gone in to murder that single victim exclusively. Again, jmo, but I'd tend towards BK deciding to murder as many people as possible versus as many as necessary-- but at the same time, viewing a clean escape as paramount. And I do think BK was surprised, and that the surprise may have triggered an earlier departure than he'd originally planned. Basically, I think factors related to the home itself and the occupants of that house created a twisted, creepy kind of "perfect storm" for the disaster that became BK. (And here, I'd be thinking of "perfect storm" definition I've seen used with disasters arising from a rare combination of circumstances.)
 
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  • #995
Thank you.

I wasn't disclosing my own condition to make you feel bad, just offering an alternative viewpoint. The kind of things you're suggesting aren't bad things to do, of course, but if a person becomes fearful then such things can become a cage. A pattern of things you do because you're too frightened not to, but you know as you're doing them that they're kind of futile, a panacea against all the potential ills and misfortunes that could befall you.

I think it's one thing to be aware and take sensible precautions, but I don't think it's necessarily a kindness to try and make someone fearful who isn't. We often mourn the loss of innocence in victims of crime, who have it brought home to them how cruel the world can be. I think it's wonderful there are people out there for whom youth is a golden time where bad things don't happen to you, just to distant strangers. I never had that.

MOO
"I think it's one thing to be aware and take sensible precautions, but I don't think it's necessarily a kindness to try and make someone fearful who isn't. We often mourn the loss of innocence in victims of crime, who have it brought home to them how cruel the world can be. I think it's wonderful there are people out there for whom youth is a golden time where bad things don't happen to you, just to distant strangers. I never had that."

This share from above
Adding words would wreck it!
 
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  • #996
I regularly refer to this virtual tour of the house where the murders occurred, and was pleasantly surprised that new content was just added on Tuesday, May 20:


(Please give me a heads up via DM if this website is not allowed.)
Wow thanks for that, it really gives a 3 D perspective I didn't have before. The house was such a hodgepodge of doors and rooms from all the additions.

All of the bedrooms were small, especially Maddie's. It looks like a twin or full size mattress and you can see how it was situated with the left side up against the wall. (Where Kaylee reportedly was sleeping).

DM's room was directly beneath Maddie's so it makes sense she woke up to the noises. The stairs to the 3rd floor were right in front of you exiting the Kitchen/ Living Room. DM's room was off in a small alcove from the stairs. I can see more clearly now how BK could have missed DM while passing by on his way out through the kitchen to the slider.

Creepy even though it's just an empty model knowing now what happened there. :(

JMO
 
  • #997
I apologize for missing the point of your message, @iamshadow21, and am very sorry you suffer from such a debilitating condition.

But please don’t think I want any woman to live in perpetual fear. My point here is that college students (without severe anxiety disorders) might take some precautions to feel less fearful and out of control (or at least help their parents feel less anxious).

I am not a mental health worker, so I have no expertise in how to help a person with an anxiety disorder deal with the tragedy that took place at 1122 King Road.
The tragedy at 1122 Kings Road was going to take place regardless of normal safety precautions taken by any college kids IMO.

BK was on a mission to murder that night and he unfortunately succeeded. Thankfully he was idiotic enough to leave a trail leading right back to him. He destroyed what he could not have and what he could never be. :(

IMO
 
  • #998
I'm guessing the chance of BK taking a last minute plea is 0%. This is his show, and he's reveling in every second. I think he's anticipating reliving the whole thing during the trial, wallowing with glee at the misery he's caused. I think he will then go on to fancy himself a prison academic and write articles or books about his great knowledge and manage a huge level of correspondence.

He think's he's a criminal genius like the fictitious Dr Hannibal Lecter. Who even in fiction, also got caught.

MOO
 
  • #999
I'm looking at past threads and saw a lot of discussion on this question:

Did BK plan a mass murder event? Or was BK targeting a single victim and he was surprised, leading to subsequent murders? OR/and was BK targeting the house itself?

So this is jmo, but I think it's something of a combination of all three. The house was attractive to a potential murderer for many reasons related to surveillance and possible navigation with online floorplans. The house was filled with attractive co-eds, and was frequented by a single male. BK would have undoubtedly been blinded with jealousy by someone like Ethan, and would clearly have resented the young and vivacious female occupants because of his problems with rejection and beyond. BK undoubtedly (again, jmo) had found a way to gain heightened awareness of the individual occupants of the residence by the time he entered the home. He may have to some extent been more heavily focused on a single individual there. But I don't know that he was so fixated on any single victim that he'd have gone in to murder that single victim exclusively. Again, jmo, but I'd tend towards BK deciding to murder as many people as possible versus as many as necessary-- but at the same time, viewing a clean escape as paramount. And I do think BK was surprised, and that the surprise may have triggered an earlier departure than he'd originally planned. Basically, I think factors related to the home itself and the occupants of that house created a twisted, creepy kind of "perfect storm" for the disaster that became BK. (And here, I'd be thinking of "perfect storm" definition I've seen used with disasters arising from a rare combination of circumstances.)
You pretty much summarised where I'm at present. Maybe this isn't fence sitting afterall. I don't feel the need to lock myself into any theory right now ( other than BK is the sole perp) and I'm not sure the circumstances or the public's level of knowledge allow too much narrowing down. Anyways Idk, but your post gells with me. I'm inclined to think his plans could have been more amorphous than clear cut. I think the house, its fishbowl aspect, the easy viewing, I imagine that played some part in his plans. Jmo

I'm looking forward to trial and hoping that there are not going to be any delays. Nooooo continuance pleeease...
 
  • #1,000
Yes, an event such as the Idaho murders is indeed exceedingly rare, but IMO a young person can learn so much from it by treating it as a cautionary tale.

Caveat: I AM NOT BLAMING THE VICTIMS.

Source for the following: me

WHAT A YOUNG PERSON CAN LEARN FROM THE IDAHO MURDERS:

1) If you have a sliding door, improve its security. (See my previous post.)

2) Keep windows locked, even the ones upstairs.

3) Keep doors locked, especially the external ones.

4) Install and use security cameras at each entry way, at least. A pair of light bulb cameras are easy to install and can be purchased on Amazon for about $40 (before tax) in the U.S.

5) Install an alarm system, if you or your parents can afford it.

6) Draw your curtains and blinds at night and while everyone is away from home so people can’t see inside your house. Add a curtain to your slider, as well.

7) If pets are allowed, get a large, protective dog for your house and make sure the dog can bark loudly.

8) Develop a cordial relationship with police so you aren’t afraid to call them when you are scared.

9) Manage your social media privacy settings so that only people you trust can view your content.

10) Learn first aid, including CPR (which includes checking and maintaining an airway). Learn how to recognize and respond to someone who is dangerously intoxicated. If someone has passed out, roll them into recovery position and call 911.

11) Create a well-stocked first aid kit and learn how to use it. Include doses of Narcan, and learn how and when to administer it.

12) Practice the 20-minute rule for alcohol consumption, and never drive or walk home while drunk.

13) Don’t walk or exercise at night by yourself, and always be aware of your surroundings. Even when with friends, carry a Mace or pepper spray canister with an alarm. If you must walk that large protective dog at night, do the same, and wear a head lamp if it’s very dark.

14) Vary your routine so a predator can’t predict your patterns.

15) Don’t prank your friends by pretending a truly dangerous thing is happening.

16) Keep a fire extinguisher in your kitchen and know how to use it. Also keep a smoke detector in each room. (OK, these have no relevance to this case, but they are important).

17) Use CO monitors in each room.

18) Read Gavin de Becker’s classic, The Gift of Fear.

19) Take a self defense class and maintain your skills.

20) (I know, in my dreams): If you are in a party house, make a pact that at least one person will be sober each night. That person should confirm that all windows and doors are locked, the alarm is set, security cameras are working, and that no one is literally passed out drunk. If anyone is unconscious, check their airway, breathing, and circulation, and start rescue breathing and chest compressions, if necessary, while another friend calls 911. If your unconscious friend is breathing, roll them into recovery position, and call 911. Administer Narcan if your friend overdosed on a narcotic.

If anyone can think of anything else or can suggest a correction, please chime in!
Great list of suggestions, a lot of kids going off to College generally see themselves as young and invincible, eager to be free from 'home rules' and spread their wings. Something like this murder wouldn't even be a remote thought in their heads.

In an off campus sorority affiliated house, it's even worse (speaking from experience). Much more relaxed rules and regs, often a fun 'party' house. I think back on some of the things I did back then and cringe. I was lucky, unfortunately not everyone is. Adding alcohol to the mix makes smart decision capabilities almost nonexistent. :(

JMO
 
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