4 Univ of Idaho Students Murdered, Bryan Kohberger Arrested, Moscow, Nov 2022 #107

[gremlin444]

Sooo.....on a scale from 1-10, how angry do you think Hippler is right now?

 

[Boxer]

JMO as the trail approaches. The "standing silent" is to me a preview of how unhelpful and defiant BK will be. It is especially striking, again JMO, because his previous rather recent history was one of siding with the law, with police, with straight-arrow behavior and even majoring in Criminal Justice. I think we will see, during the trial, glimpses of his real self, not the facade he put on for awhile. I think his disdain for law and for goodness will be on display. We will see. MOO

Catholic too. MOO he is completely divorced from what is right.

 

[MassGuy]

Judge Hippler can't decide anything until he knows from whence the leads came, can he?

Granting a continuance only provides more time for more publicity. Seems like a surefire way to be gifted continuance into perpetuity.

JMO

They argue the opposite:

In sum, the two-hour Dateline episode is uniquely prejudicial in both tone and content: it

constructs a speculative narrative around motive and guilt, features emotionally manipulative

production elements, and amplifies unsupported theories through self-styled “expert” commentary

— all timed to air just weeks before trial, when juror impressions are most vulnerable and voir dire

least equipped to neutralize such deep-seated bias. The forthcoming book by James Patterson,

which will arrive in the hands of potential jurors just two weeks before voir dire begins, promises

to set off a new round of inflammatory, negative coverage and to deepen the pervasive bias against

Mr. Kohberger on the eve of trial. The Court has already acknowledged that the Dateline special

exposes a likely violation of the non-dissemination order, and Mr. Patterson’s purported

“unmatched access” to sources including “local law enforcement” suggests that multiple

unauthorized disclosures have occurred. Depending on the results of the investigation into the

leaks, a continuance may be inadequate. Once the source(s) of the leaks are identified and the full

extent of misconduct revealed, the violations could warrant remedies more serious than delay. At

the very least, however, a continuance is essential to allow the extremely prejudicial impact to

partially subside, and to give the Court and the defense time to fully investigate and address the

scope of the violations. Only then can the conditions necessary for selecting an impartial jury and

ensuring a fair trial under the Sixth and Fourteenth Amendments be meaningfully restored.

 

[Boxer]

Thank you, @SpiderFalcon.

I see that in the Motion to Continue, pp.15-17, the defense is claiming that:

Bryan’s mother, as a young teenager, drank alcohol. Therefore BK may have FETAL ALCOHOL SYNDROME and they need to pursue family history going back three generations to find out if alcoholism is the root cause of his problems. Also they note they have to interview everyone more than once because people may remember a different detail at another time.

IMO this is utterly outrageous.

What the heck. How far can blaming someone/something else go?

 

[Megnut]

I hope, if anything, Judge Hippler only severs the guilt and penalty phases.

But that's problematic for a million new reasons.

I don't see how Judge Hippler could hamstring the State unless it can be shown that State agents are behind the leaks.

I don't see why the State would have jeopardized their case thusly.

I think Dateline arrived at their "facts" prior to and outside of the gag order.

And I side-eye the Defense. It would be a risky move but paid handsomely if they overshared, in order to towncry 'too much pretrial bias'....

The media is here to stay. Pushing trials ahead endlessly can't be the solution.

JMO

 

[MassGuy]

Thank you, @SpiderFalcon.

I see that in the Motion to Continue, pp.15-17, the defense is claiming that:

Bryan’s mother, as a young teenager, drank alcohol. Therefore BK may have FETAL ALCOHOL SYNDROME and they need to pursue family history going back three generations to find out if alcoholism is the root cause of his problems. Also they note they have to interview everyone more than once because people may remember a different detail at another time.

IMO this is utterly outrageous.

I think that was just an example cited by the defense. It's not that they're saying that's the case here.

 

[fcavanaugh]

Oh man. Waiting with bated breath to see what Judge Hippler decides.
The poor families, my heart goes out to them.

#JusticeforKaylee,Maddie,Xana,and Ethan

IMHOO

 

[Megnut]

They argue the opposite:

In sum, the two-hour Dateline episode is uniquely prejudicial in both tone and content: it

constructs a speculative narrative around motive and guilt, features emotionally manipulative

production elements, and amplifies unsupported theories through self-styled “expert” commentary

— all timed to air just weeks before trial, when juror impressions are most vulnerable and voir dire

least equipped to neutralize such deep-seated bias. The forthcoming book by James Patterson,

which will arrive in the hands of potential jurors just two weeks before voir dire begins, promises

to set off a new round of inflammatory, negative coverage and to deepen the pervasive bias against

Mr. Kohberger on the eve of trial. The Court has already acknowledged that the Dateline special

exposes a likely violation of the non-dissemination order, and Mr. Patterson’s purported

“unmatched access” to sources including “local law enforcement” suggests that multiple

unauthorized disclosures have occurred. Depending on the results of the investigation into the

leaks, a continuance may be inadequate. Once the source(s) of the leaks are identified and the full

extent of misconduct revealed, the violations could warrant remedies more serious than delay. At

the very least, however, a continuance is essential to allow the extremely prejudicial impact to

partially subside, and to give the Court and the defense time to fully investigate and address the

scope of the violations. Only then can the conditions necessary for selecting an impartial jury and

ensuring a fair trial under the Sixth and Fourteenth Amendments be meaningfully restored.

We knew she would jump on it.

But after Dateline, after Patterson there will be others....

It's not like Hippler can grant an extension and then sequestered all would be jurors until the next trial date.

A new date helps AT because she's not ready, has no legitimate SODDI nor actual alibi, but six months from now, or twelve, who is rolling that die, that movies won't be made?

Fingers crossed he stands behind the jury, that these are issues for voir dire.

JMO

 

[Arkay]

I think that was just an example cited by the defense. It's not that they're saying that's the case here.

Oh, I hope I’m wrong then. I skimmed through and maybe I misread? I wanted to copy and paste but I always louse that up when I try.

In any event, even if this is meant to be an example, IMO it is indicative of how the defense is conjuring up absolutely ridiculous means of delaying the trial.

IMO

 

[gremlin444]

Thank you, @SpiderFalcon.

I see that in the Motion to Continue, pp.15-17, the defense is claiming that:

Bryan’s mother, as a young teenager, drank alcohol. Therefore BK may have FETAL ALCOHOL SYNDROME and they need to pursue family history going back three generations to find out if alcoholism is the root cause of his problems. Also they note they have to interview everyone more than once because people may remember a different detail at another time.

IMO this is utterly outrageous.

Quick correction:

The part about FAS is from an example, not talking about BK himself

Thus, mitigation investigations develop in stages, as explained in this example:

[R]ecords indicating that the client’s mother drank alcohol during her early teenage years would lead the mitigation specialist to .....

from Richard Dudley, Jr. and Pamela Leonard, Getting It Right: Life History Investigation as the Foundation for a Reliable Mental Health Assessment, 36 HOFSTRA L. REV. 963, 973 (2008)

 

[Ghostwheel]

Considering how quickly AT wrote and submitted her lengthy, detailed continuance, a conspiracy-minded person might think the defense had something to do with the leaks.

Of course, writing this new motion would have made it impossible to seek actual evidence for the alternate perpetrators, so she’ll need more time for that, too.

I know there will be a detailed investigation of the leaks, but hopefully Hippler will facilitate a special prosecutor to take care of it while trial prep continues.

IMO

ETA:

Actually, this motion to continue looks to have been written well ahead of the leaks, with one added statement about the leaks in the intro, and a final section addressing the leaks added to the body of the motion.

How many times can AT beat a dead horse?

Do you suppose she just has things like that sitting around and "fill in the blank"? I worked for a Divorce attorney and we had a lot of those. I don' t know how criminal law rules work, though.

 

[girlhasnoname]

https://coi.isc.idaho.gov/docs/CR01-24-31665/2025/052125+Order+Granting+Leave+to+Exceed+Page+Limit.pdf

https://coi.isc.idaho.gov/docs/CR01-24-31665/2025/052025+Defendants+Motion+to+Continue.pdf

https://coi.isc.idaho.gov/docs/CR01-24-31665/2025/052025+Defendants+Motion+for+Leave+to+Exceed+Page+Limit.pdf

For the Defenses Motion to Continue & Continue Supplement (Ex Parte) to Exceed Page Limit...I wondered what 8.2 was about, hmmmm:

Idaho's Rule 8.2: Judicial and Legal Officials Professional Conduct:

a) A Lawyer shall not make a statement that the lawyer knows to be false or with reckless disregard as to its truth or falsity concerning the qualifications or integrity of a judge, a judicatorial Officer, or of a candidate for election or appointment to judicial or legal office.
b) A Lawyer who is a candidate for judicial office shall comply with the applicable conditions of the Code of Judicial Conduct.


https://isb.idaho.gov/wp-content/uploads/IRPC-ADAAcc.pdf

 

[Ghostwheel]

I am hoping someone who saw Dateline can help me here.
"a continuance is essential to allow the extremely prejudicial impact to partially subside"

How can what is in the Dateline episode be any more prejudicial than anything that is already out there? How can that "subside"? Either you followed the case or you didn't. If you are a potential juror who didn't follow the case or watch that Dateline episode (like I didn't even though I follow the case), the Dateline episode didn't affect anything. Serious question. How does this actually change anything as far as the case goes? If it would just be the sentencing because then it would make people more mad at the killer, wouldn't all this have come out in trial anyway and be part of sentencing knowledge?

 

[MassGuy]

I am hoping someone who saw Dateline can help me here.
"a continuance is essential to allow the extremely prejudicial impact to partially subside"

How what the Dateline episode any more prejudicial than anything that is already out there? How can that "subside"? Either you followed the case or you didn't. If you are a potential juror who didn't follow the case or watch that Dateline episode (like I didn't even though I follow the case), the Dateline episode didn't affect anything. Serious question. How does this actually change anything as far as the case goes? If it would it just be the sentencing because then it would make people more mad at the killer, wouldn't all this have come out in trial anyway and be part of sentencing knowledge?

I watched the show and focused on the footage, the revelations about his click history, and the information about him basically keeping a murder scrapbook on his phone.

The casual Dateline viewer will watch that episode and they'll talk about his "creepy selfies," his obsession with Ted Bundy, his internet searches, the strange interactions he had with people, the bizarre events with his female colleague, and the photos he had of college students on his phone.

The concern is that potential jurors watched that episode and it caused them to make up their minds.

I don't think it holds a lot of water, because lots of people don't watch shows like that (despite it being very popular). And just because you've seen it, doesn't mean you can't necessarily be objective.

If they can seat two Karen read juries in Massachusetts, they sure as hell can seat one for Kohberger.

 

[Megnut]

The first 20-30 pages read like a law student's essay on Capital Case Lawyering.

That's the job, AT. It's not like she just realized she has to exhaust every avenue, and no defense can ever be complete. Three generational family study? Why not four? Maybe a Neanderthal was dropped on his head and that's why BK made backwards 5s.
It's a ridiculous argument IMO. It's just a new printing of "we're not ready' where 'we're not ready' means 'we can't find an actual defense anywhere so we want to keep looking, as if we'll stumble upon one'.

JMO

 

[Ghostwheel]

I watched the show and focused on the footage, the revelations about his click history, and the information about him basically keeping a murder scrapbook on his phone.

The casual Dateline viewer will watch that episode and they'll talk about his "creepy selfies," his obsession with Ted Bundy, his internet searches, the strange interactions he had with people, the bizarre events with his female colleague, and the photos he had of college students on his phone.

The concern is that potential jurors watched that episode and it caused them to make up their minds.

I don't think it holds a lot of water, because lots of people don't watch shows like that (despite it being very popular). And just because you've seen it, doesn't mean you can't necessarily be objective.

If they can seat two Karen read juries in Massachusetts, they sure as hell can seat one for Kohberger.

Thank you. BBM I don't think like that. Yeah, sure he had creepy stuff on his phone. Oddly, so do a lot of people (many I wouldn't not have expected and some for really random reasons) and if having Ted Bundy searches makes you a killer, I am in deep doo-doo.

ETA: I need to go get rid of those crime scene photos on my phone now....

 

[Megnut]

I watched the show and focused on the footage, the revelations about his click history, and the information about him basically keeping a murder scrapbook on his phone.

The casual Dateline viewer will watch that episode and they'll talk about his "creepy selfies," his obsession with Ted Bundy, his internet searches, the strange interactions he had with people, the bizarre events with his female colleague, and the photos he had of college students on his phone.

The concern is that potential jurors watched that episode and it caused them to make up their minds.

I don't think it holds a lot of water, because lots of people don't watch shows like that (despite it being very popular). And just because you've seen it, doesn't mean you can't necessarily be objective.

If they can seat two Karen read juries in Massachusetts, they sure as hell can seat one for Kohberger.

Exactly.

AT is loud but it's a fallacy. Not everyone watched Dateline. Not everyone reads Patterson. AT is purposefully conflating this, as if the media hand delivered this to the jurors during deliberation or somesuch.

Voir dire is voir dire for a reason. To weed out true crime afficionados, prime time TV watchers, mystery readers.

I hope Judge Hippler leans on his heels here.

Launching the investigation is proper but there's nothing to show it prevents BK from getting a fair trial. It only indicates the importance of jury selection.

JMO

 

[Arkay]

The first 20-30 pages read like a law student's essay on Capital Case Lawyering.

That's the job, AT. It's not like she just realized she has to exhaust every avenue, and no defense can ever be complete. Three generational family study? Why not four? Maybe a Neanderthal was dropped on his head and that's why BK made backwards 5s.
It's a ridiculous argument IMO. It's just a new printing of "we're not ready' where 'we're not ready' means 'we can't find an actual defense anywhere so we want to keep looking, as if we'll stumble upon one'.

JMO

Perfectly encapsulated.

This, to the nth degree.

IMO

 

[girlhasnoname]

Considering how quickly AT wrote and submitted her lengthy, detailed continuance, a conspiracy-minded person might think the defense had something to do with the leaks.

Of course, writing this new motion would have made it impossible to seek actual evidence for the alternate perpetrators, so she’ll need more time for that, too.

I know there will be a detailed investigation of the leaks, but hopefully Hippler will facilitate a special prosecutor to take care of it while trial prep continues.

IMO

ETA:

Actually, this motion to continue looks to have been written well ahead of the leaks, with one added statement about the leaks in the intro, and a final section addressing the leaks added to the body of the motion.

How many times can AT beat a dead horse?

If AT put as much time and thought into the actual case against her client BK, as she does with these word salad Motions, they would probably be further along in the process. See also...not accepting another DP Trial at the same time.

I knew she'd have words about the Dateline Special, glad she informed us of the James Patterson new book out on July 16th, didn't know about that lol.

The Defense cannot control the media and freedom of speech. They represented what might/could have happened according to 'sources' close to the investigation. Judge Hippler has jumped all over that immediately, like I thought he would and should.

These True Crime Story Specials have aired before trial for many, many high profile cases. It is the way of things now. Trial by TIKTOK, Insta, Fakebook and Youtube.

We shall see.

JMO

 

[PunishThenForgive]

In that 40 page motion, Kohberger’s defense team makes their case for a trial continuance.

“…due to the substantial amount of trial
investigation and preparation still outstanding, as well as recent and forthcoming publicity that is
highly prejudicial to the defense.”

Among other things they say they need more time to prepare for the penalty phase, and argue that the passage of time will mitigate some of the damage inflicted by the Dateline broadcast and James Patterson’s forthcoming book, which is scheduled to be released two weeks before the trial was set to begin.

I don’t know how the judge doesn’t grant this (penalty phase issues are their best argument), so it looks like there will not be a trial this summer.

Then the next book will be published, the next set of leaks leaked, and AT will ask for a fresh continuance.

If she has her way, the trial will finally take place when BK and all witnesses are elderly or dead.

Anyone else reminded of the Court of Chancery in Bleak House?