4 Univ of Idaho Students Murdered, Bryan Kohberger Arrested, Moscow, Nov 2022 #93

[arielilane]

State of Idaho v. Bryan C. Kohberger​

Latah County CR29-22-2805

Case Summary (Updated 04/22/24)

• 04/19/2024 Amended Order Setting Briefing Schedule Hearing Date for Change of Venue Motion
• 04/19/2024 Order Allowing Defense Surveys to Continue

Idaho Judicial Cases of Interest

 

[Sundog]

State of Idaho v. Bryan C. Kohberger​

Latah County CR29-22-2805

Case Summary (Updated 04/22/24)

• 04/19/2024 Amended Order Setting Briefing Schedule Hearing Date for Change of Venue Motion
• 04/19/2024 Order Allowing Defense Surveys to Continue

Idaho Judicial Cases of Interest

Is the June 27 date scheduled for the Change of Venue hearing the same as the date that it was orignally scheduled for?

I thought that the defense had argued that they lost time with regard to the abrupt stop of their survey by the Court and would be asking for more time to complete and analyse the survey results in advance of the hearing for Change of Venue.

 

[girlhasnoname]

So weird.

So there was this SWAT thing so... were going to get Thai food....

Alrighty then.

The LEO'S reaction is classis: that's interesting. (But you KNOW he's THINKING why are you telling me this?)

Nervous energy? See how easily I talk about crimes, I'm newsy and teachery, I'm on the good side. Good, good, good, appalled by those who hurt people. Not me, I study those people...

He knew he wasn't speeding. I wonder if he thought the moment had come, he was going to be arrested right there next to his dad.

I hope his heart about stopped but that's my projection. Probably gave him a little thrill, a little duper's delight...

LE won't admit it but I think there was a BOLO on that vehicle and an alert to stop it under any legal pretense to get a headcount, who was driving and a driver's license. And two departments responded, unaware the other already had.

He had to feel them circling in.

JMO

BK looked like he wanted to strangle his Dad when he mentioned WSU. If looks could kill...

MOO

 

[Justice101]

BK looked like he wanted to strangle his Dad when he mentioned WSU. If looks could kill...

MOO

I agree on the BOLO and LE probably overdid it with 2 pull overs in the same state.

They probably took BOLO off once they go the reports from the 2 stoppings.

Pulling someone over who has not committed a driving offense or is suspicious is probably not 100% legal but definitely understood in this case. That's probably why LE denied it was intentional.

 

[Cool Cats]

Judge in Kohberger murder case allows surveys of potential jurors to continue ‘without modification’

Mon, April 22, 2024 at 9:30 PM EDT

Judge in Kohberger murder case allows surveys of potential jurors to continue ‘without modification’

The judge in the case against Bryan Kohberger, accused of killing four University of Idaho students in the fall of 2021, is allowing surveys that were being conducted with potential jurors to continue “without modification,” according to an order issued last week.

www.yahoo.com

“Because the information is now in the public record, the Court does not see any benefit in preventing the defense from continuing its surveys or requiring that the two questions at issue be eliminated,” Judge said.

Judge conceded, however, that the questions may include “prejudicial information or misinformation” about Kohberger.

“If defense counsel believes asking these survey questions, which arguably contain prejudicial information or misinformation about Defendant, is more beneficial than harmful … this Court does not, at this juncture, have sufficient information to second guess that strategic decision by trial counsel,” Judge said.

 

[Justice101]

The Prosecution should go ahead and put their own one out just to make the point.

 

[schooling]

Judge in Kohberger murder case allows surveys of potential jurors to continue ‘without modification’

Mon, April 22, 2024 at 9:30 PM EDT

Judge in Kohberger murder case allows surveys of potential jurors to continue ‘without modification’

The judge in the case against Bryan Kohberger, accused of killing four University of Idaho students in the fall of 2021, is allowing surveys that were being conducted with potential jurors to continue “without modification,” according to an order issued last week.

www.yahoo.com

“Because the information is now in the public record, the Court does not see any benefit in preventing the defense from continuing its surveys or requiring that the two questions at issue be eliminated,” Judge said.

Judge conceded, however, that the questions may include “prejudicial information or misinformation” about Kohberger.

“If defense counsel believes asking these survey questions, which arguably contain prejudicial information or misinformation about Defendant, is more beneficial than harmful … this Court does not, at this juncture, have sufficient information to second guess that strategic decision by trial counsel,” Judge said.

I see the judge adjusted his definition of 'public record'. I only say that because at the hearing it seemed like he wanted to frame it as anything officially on record with the court and anything LE might have said during the course of the investigation (MOO).

So while I disagree that this doesn't taint the jury pool. And since this trial is going to happen...somewhere. The chickens do eventually come home to roost IMO. So as the judge pointed out, it seems like they are not doing themselves any favors.

And maybe a lawyer can chime in here but I interpret the statement to protect the ultimate decision of the court from any appeals by labeling it a "strategic decision" that he wans't going to "second guess".

MOO

 

[schooling]

She is doing a great job for her client and so the People of the State of Idaho will not have to worry that BK's future appeal filings will result in anything other than being DENIED....2 Cents

I love the the judge's statement because he's essentially saying what you said here but in nicer words.

It was a masterful case of implying that he's second guessing by refusing to legally second guess. Also, MOO, he essentially called it a strategic blunder without using those words.

Edit: I see I replied to you 2x in a row and did so out of order of your original posts. My bad!

 

[SpiderFalcon]

I love the the judge's statement because he's essentially saying what you said here but in nicer words.

It was a masterful case of implying that he's second guessing by refusing to legally second guess. Also, MOO, he essentially called it a strategic blunder without using those words.

Edit: I see I replied to you 2x in a row and did so out of order of your original posts. My bad!

I also like the way he pointed out to BOTH PARTIES:




indicating that NOW, the survey questions ARE a part of his definition of PUBLIC RECORD.

 

[Betty P]

Judge in Kohberger murder case allows surveys of potential jurors to continue ‘without modification’

Mon, April 22, 2024 at 9:30 PM EDT

Judge in Kohberger murder case allows surveys of potential jurors to continue ‘without modification’

The judge in the case against Bryan Kohberger, accused of killing four University of Idaho students in the fall of 2021, is allowing surveys that were being conducted with potential jurors to continue “without modification,” according to an order issued last week.

www.yahoo.com

“Because the information is now in the public record, the Court does not see any benefit in preventing the defense from continuing its surveys or requiring that the two questions at issue be eliminated,” Judge said.

Judge conceded, however, that the questions may include “prejudicial information or misinformation” about Kohberger.

“If defense counsel believes asking these survey questions, which arguably contain prejudicial information or misinformation about Defendant, is more beneficial than harmful … this Court does not, at this juncture, have sufficient information to second guess that strategic decision by trial counsel,” Judge said.

Just read that article and it looks like a new dirty trick for defense teams. Spam call potential jurors and do some "push polling". Some political campaigns do the same thing.

 

[NCWatcher]

Just read that article and it looks like a new dirty trick for defense teams. Spam call potential jurors and do some "push polling". Some political campaigns do the same thing.

Yes, but as the judge said, the false survey info itself is not beneficial to BK. IF there was an intention to do "push polling" for BK's benefit, the defense is doing an especially rotten job. He's going to be tried somewhere.
MOO

 

[Betty P]

Yes, but as the judge said, the false survey info itself is not beneficial to BK. IF there was an intention to do "push polling" for BK's benefit, the defense is doing an especially rotten job. He's going to be tried somewhere.
MOO

It may not have worked this time, but future defense teams will learn to work it in their favor. I just dislike the possibility that it could be used to taint juries or lead to nullification.

 

[NCWatcher]

It may not have worked this time, but it future defense teams will learn to work it in their favor. I just dislike the possibility that it could be used to taint juries or lead to nullification.

Yeah but surveys have been used for decades to assess attitudes of potential jurors when planning to file a change of venue motion. That's nothing new. In fact, it's the courts that have required data like survey data. And in any case, once the venue is chosen, it's up to the defense AND the prosecution AND the judge to ensure a fair jury is seated. I'm just not seeing why this survey or this kind of survey would change that. Might potential jurors lie under oath during voir dire? Sure, that can happen. But in this case, it still would seem if the survey were to elicit more lying, the lying would help the prosecution.
MOO

 

[katydid23]

I think it was his Dad driving home?

Both times they were pulled over it was BK behind the steering wheel.

 

[Balthazar]

In your opinion, how do you think they will attempt to show that he wasn't in Moscow if his phone was turned off between 2:50am and 4:50am and it can't place him elsewhere? How will they introduce that if he chooses not to testify?

If he had anything solid, like video evidence, electronic evidence, an eyewitness, etc., wouldn't they have put that in the alibi defense?

IMO, and I'm just looking at this strategically and based on the expert they have hired, I think that the defense will say that BK never turned his phone off and I expect they will prove that using his meta data.

I believe the defense will say BK left his apartment BEFORE midnight and headed southwest to the Wawawai Park. Wawawai park has no cell service. However, if BK was in that park and taking photos, his phone would be sending and receiving meta data. Meta data is much more accurate than CAST Report data. That, IMO, is the subtext of what was written in BK's Alibi response. If I were the prosecution, I would be very concerned about this information that the defense has given.

But, IMO, there is much, much more to the alibi than what I stated above.

There were 2 situations going on in Moscow and Pullman that night which had drawn a lot of additional people into both areas and may well have impacted the cell towers.
1. In Moscow, there was the UofI Moscow vs. UC Davis football game during the afternoon with lots of partying afterwards. UC Davis football is famous for having a huge and loyal fan base who go to all of their games, including their away games with average UC Davis attendance of more than 10,000 people. In addition the UofI Vandals ALSO have a loyal fanbase that attend their games. The Kibbie Dome can hold 16,000. Beyond those who traveled to Moscow to watch the game would be many others who came in from companies which offer support services and amenities to college football fans.
2. And in Pullman at WSU, it was Fall Family Weekend which is known to be an incredibly busy weekend in Pullman. This influx of thousands of people would have put significant strain on local resources, including local cellular resources.

WSU family weekends have their pros and cons

If your family wants to get rowdy and go join in singing “Back Home” by Andy Grammer, go with the fall. If they are looking for a relaxing weekend to see the campus and have a nice dinner, I would opt for the Spring. Fall and spring might have a lot of differences but neither...

dailyevergreen.com

WSU Pullman had 17,827 students in Fall 2022. If each student had 1 parent come for Fall Family Weekend, that's another 17,827 people in the area.

The population of Moscow is around 26,000 and the population of Pullman is 32,000 for a total of 58,000 people. Hotels and AirBnB's and the like would have been completely full. I have seen gossip online that accommodations fill up not only in Moscow and Pullman but up to 4 hours away for these types of events. Just for the sake of estimating this situation, let's say there were 27,000 additional people in the area from out of town (this is probably a very low estimate.) This is a temporary population increase for Moscow and Pullman of 46.55%. My expectation is that the temporary increase in population would strain local services including cell towers. This situation may be used by the defense witness to explain some of BK's alleged phone pings such as the one in Blaine. There are 4 cell towers in Pullman, Wa, and 3 cell towers in Moscow, ID. There really are a lot of areas nearby Moscow and Pullman which have no cell coverage.

The alibi indicates that BK went to different locations that night which have not been identified yet. There are no pings to identify where he was during the time of the murders in Moscow. Did his phone ping elsewhere or is there meta data proving exactly where he was? This is the burning question that the prosecution needs to figure out.

All JMOO.

 

[Balthazar]

BBM from the above
"I believe that the police later said what they initially believed was the morning pass by the house by BK was incorrect and he was in Pullman at the time."

"After that fact was brought forward, I believe MPD disregarded the possibly 9am-ish visit and started saying they believe he was actually home at that time. "

I'm at a loss to understand the grounds for the statements above? The approx 9am to 9.32 am journey between Pullman and Moscow on Sunday 13th Nov 2022 was made part of the public record in first week of January 2023 when the PCA was released. It has only ever been mentioned in the PCA as far as I am aware, and I am assuming that the non dissemination order has since ensured that MPD have never, to my knowledge, made any extra judicial statements as is being claimed here. That is, MPD have never publicly claimed since the PCA was released that this jouney is:

"incorrect" and "...he was in Pullman at the time"

or

"...started saying they believe he was actually home at that time. "

I also haven't seen any court documents since the PCA making such claims on behalf of MPD.

Could you please provide an approved source for where you read this infomation. Imo these two sentences in you post read as if you have heard of or read the info somewhere.

I didn't read it. I saw it broadcast live on TV. This was stated by MPD on one of the televised daily updates on this case prior to the gag order but, obviously after BK's arrest. Gag order started 1/3/2023. Kohberger arrested 12/30/22. It should be fairly easy for you to find the actual video based on these parameters if you want to watch it yourself. Where I live this video was carried by Fox News, but if you are in Idaho or Washington, you may have a better source for the video.

 

[jepop]

I didn't read it. I saw it broadcast live on TV. This was stated by MPD on one of the televised daily updates on this case prior to the gag order but, obviously after BK's arrest. Gag order started 1/3/2023. Kohberger arrested 12/30/22. It should be fairly easy for you to find the actual video based on these parameters if you want to watch it yourself. Where I live this video was carried by Fox News, but if you are in Idaho or Washington, you may have a better source for the video.

Please link the source you mention or any other approved MSM source. The assertions are in your post unsourced. Thank you.

ETA please specify a time stamp if source is an official LE press conference.

 

[wendy44]

IMO, and I'm just looking at this strategically and based on the expert they have hired, I think that the defense will say that BK never turned his phone off and I expect they will prove that using his meta data.

I believe the defense will say BK left his apartment BEFORE midnight and headed southwest to the Wawawai Park. Wawawai park has no cell service. However, if BK was in that park and taking photos, his phone would be sending and receiving meta data. Meta data is much more accurate than CAST Report data. That, IMO, is the subtext of what was written in BK's Alibi response. If I were the prosecution, I would be very concerned about this information that the defense has given.

So in your opinion, the defense expert is going to testify that BK never turned his phone off that night? And this expert will testify that he left his apartment before midnight?

This might be a hard sell for the defense, though, as you say, we don't know what meta data they have. According to the PCA, his phone was using cellular resources that provide coverage to his apartment at 2:42am. And at 2:47am the phone was using resources that provide coverage southeast of the apartment consistent with traveling south through Pullman, WA. This is also consistent with the movement of the white Elantra they believe is his on video. And at 2:47am the phone stopped reporting to the network (could it have traveled to somewhere too remote for signal so soon and it was not actually turned off at that point?).
JMO

 

[Swansee]

@wendy44
Yes, since the original alibi statement, the defense has claimed BK was out driving prior to midnight. The PCA never states where the phone was pinging prior to 2:42, so we don't know if prior pings were also in the same location or elsewhere.
The thing about the "cellular resources providing coverage to his residence" phrase is that we don't actually know how wide that cone is. How vast of an area did those cellular resources provide coverage to? This is still unknown by us the public.

 

[whinewiththegravy]

Yes, but as the judge said, the false survey info itself is not beneficial to BK.

I could see it working for just the right opening and closing. Raise a jury’s expectations with inflammatory, incriminating information—“just look at all the lies and innuendo and fantasies that made Bryan an easy target! Hark at how the state tried in advance of this trial to ply the public with misinformation with the help of Fake News and Reddit!”—and then crow that the prosecution didn’t present any of it because it could be refuted.

Contrast sexy, easily digestible stuff like social media stalking—which neither side claims had happened—with dry, technical cell phone soothsaying that supports the actual on-the-ground surveilling. Really speaks to the contrarian mindset that glories in a good conspiracy. Just look at how manufactured doubts about poor DM’s credibility have been seeded into the public discourse.