Abby & Libby - The Delphi Murders - Richard Allen Arrested - #204

[SouthEnd]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1850010521849741461

The analytical, admin part of my brain feels so satisfied in the way the P is structuring the case to reflect exactly the order of evidence they 'teased' during the opening statements. Nice.

All MOO

 

[MassGuy]

The analytical, admin part of my brain feels so satisfied in the way the P is structuring the case to reflect exactly the order of evidence they 'teased' during the opening statements. Nice.

All MOO

I do love that part, but I'm concerned if their presentation of those things is lacking. I'm thrilled the jury gets to ask questions to clear that stuff up though.

 

[ClearAhead]

Day 7 Murder Sheet

@34:35 Several times TMS has gave examples of Rozzi making condescending comments and throughout this entire trial and “it’s not clear why he thinks the jury wants to be condescended to or hear a man being condescending”. R said “there’s no minimal education requirement for people in professional groups related to fire arms examination is there, is there?”. She says “well no but there was for the police for the position I was in I needed to have a bachelors degree”. Rozzi snears “well I guess you could have a bachelors degree in physical education”. KG “ Basically that sounded very condescending to me to people who don’t have advanced degrees.” Likely some members of the jury don’t have any degrees at all, fact is there is very, very intelligent people in this world doing very important things who do not have advanced degrees.

@ about 41:00 TMS feels the “bulldog-style” persona R is putting on in court is really cringe-worthy, obstinate and obnoxious, very annoying to watch. He lost the jury early on during his cross. It was obvious by the expressions on the their faces. Reporters stopped taking notes. This witness was absolutely unflappable and that disturbed R. He thought he would be able to rattle her and failed, continuing to badgering/bullying the witness, it went on and on for a very, very long time, going nowhere. Silly comments to her ie “There’s no pictures in this report, so I guess we can’t trust anything in it”. The Judge had a huddle after afternoon break before jury came in and JG said in a tone of frustration “are we about done with this cross?” R said “sure we are, it’s only about 15 minutes more”. JG says “you know when lawyers tell me a time I usually just double it”. People in the gallery laughed.

 

[ClearAhead]

The Delphi Murders: Richard Allen on Trial: Day Seven: The Forensic Firearms Examiner

We discuss the seventh day of Richard Allen's trial. We had a whole day of testimony from former forensic firearms examiner, Melissa Oberg. Support The Murder...

murdersheetpodcast.com

50:50 timestamp above

Apparently the defense handed out some pictures to the jurors as specific exhibits but forgot to label them (Exhibit A, B, C, etc). Rozzi had to go up the jury and was holding up a copy of each picture he was trying to reference and telling the jury to take out the corresponding one in the bundle of pictures they had. Judge Gull suggested the defense redo the pictures for tomorrow with labels.

I stopped here just to listen but this ‘problem with paper’ account. It was very weird in an amusing way just to imagine it happening. Glad you transcribed it!

 

[WildHuncher]

<modsnip - quoted post was removed>

Question: What in heck is a nothing burger?!

Imagine nothing with special sauce, lettuce, cheese, pickles and onions on a sesame seed bun. Now remove the special sauce, lettuce, cheese, pickles, onions, and sesame seed bun.

 

[snooptroop88]

Day 7 Murder Sheet

@34:35 Several times TMS has gave examples of Rozzi making condescending comments and throughout this entire trial and “it’s not clear why he thinks the jury wants to be condescended to or hear a man being condescending”. R said “there’s no minimal education requirement for people in professional groups related to fire arms examination is there, is there?”. She says “well no but there was for the police for the position I was in I needed to have a bachelors degree”. Rozzi snears “well I guess you could have a bachelors degree in physical education”. KG “ Basically that sounded very condescending to me to people who don’t have advanced degrees.” Likely some members of the jury don’t have any degrees at all, fact is there is very, very intelligent people in this world doing very important things who do not have advanced degrees.

@ about 41:00 TMS feels the “bulldog-style” persona R is putting on in court is really cringe-worthy, obstinate and obnoxious, very annoying to watch. He lost the jury early on during his cross. It was obvious by the expressions on the their faces. Reporters stopped taking notes. This witness was absolutely unflappable and that disturbed R. He thought he would be able to rattle her and failed, continuing to badgering/bullying the witness, it went on and on for a very, very long time, going nowhere. Silly comments to her ie “There’s no pictures in this report, so I guess we can’t trust anything in it”. The Judge had a huddle after afternoon break before jury came in and JG said in a tone of frustration “are we about done with this cross?” R said “sure we are, it’s only about 15 minutes more”. JG says “you know when lawyers tell me a time I usually just double it”. People in the gallery laughed.

I knew they D would charm them like this. They just can't help themselves.

Seriously.

 

[sunshineray]

His (RA) wife was out of town, taking care of her mother. IIRC

He was the only one home.

But now says he went to visited his Mom that morning until noon. Is that why RA's Mom is on the witness list?

 

[sunshineray]

Meh... they saw a guy on the bridge. Doesn't make him a killer imo. In this day and age, I want the state to prove to me that the man on trial is the man who killed the kids. Do this with DNA and electronics. Show me why it cannot have been someone else. Given our forensic capabilities from 2017 to now - I'm afraid knowing only what we know so far, I'd be the juror that would NOT convict him. So far nothing electronic has linked RA to the crime yet?? Patiently waiting on the proverbial fence to be moved one way or the other.... MOOO

It actually does make him responsible for the armed kidnapping of Libby and Abby, therefore their murders that followed shortly thereafter because of the kidnapping. MO

 

[shonyakay]

I do love that part, but I'm concerned if their presentation of those things is lacking. I'm thrilled the jury gets to ask questions to clear that stuff up though.

We just don't seem to be getting the reporting of the state's follow up i.e. re-direct. At least I haven't seen much of it. I can't wait to read the actual transcripts if I get the chance. I have a feeling some testimony may be being left out since the trial goers are only allowed to take notes.

 

[ClearAhead]

about 50:22 Rozzi was admonished by JG “Will you stop misstating the evidence!”. The back of his neck looked like it turned red. Why this was, R was repeatedly listing off studies regarding unreliability of ballistics but he was vastly overstating/misstating the results of the study. So Luttrell would object and have to correct him each time, why JG was getting very annoyed.

Ultimately at the end of the day the jury looked glum. A very long, highly technical day of testimony, the long cross that went nowhere, the judges admonition.

 

[twall]

Day 7 Murder Sheet

@34:35 Several times TMS has gave examples of Rozzi making condescending comments and throughout this entire trial and “it’s not clear why he thinks the jury wants to be condescended to or hear a man being condescending”. R said “there’s no minimal education requirement for people in professional groups related to fire arms examination is there, is there?”. She says “well no but there was for the police for the position I was in I needed to have a bachelors degree”. Rozzi snears “well I guess you could have a bachelors degree in physical education”. KG “ Basically that sounded very condescending to me to people who don’t have advanced degrees.” Likely some members of the jury don’t have any degrees at all, fact is there is very, very intelligent people in this world doing very important things who do not have advanced degrees.

@ about 41:00 TMS feels the “bulldog-style” persona R is putting on in court is really cringe-worthy, obstinate and obnoxious, very annoying to watch. He lost the jury early on during his cross. It was obvious by the expressions on the their faces. Reporters stopped taking notes. This witness was absolutely unflappable and that disturbed R. He thought he would be able to rattle her and failed, continuing to badgering/bullying the witness, it went on and on for a very, very long time, going nowhere. Silly comments to her ie “There’s no pictures in this report, so I guess we can’t trust anything in it”. The Judge had a huddle after afternoon break before jury came in and JG said in a tone of frustration “are we about done with this cross?” R said “sure we are, it’s only about 15 minutes more”. JG says “you know when lawyers tell me a time I usually just double it”. People in the gallery laughed.

I felt the same way when Barry Scheck crossed Dennis Fung. No one can read a jury. JMO

 

[Boxer]

But now says he went to visited his Mom that morning until noon. Is that why RA's Mom is on the witness list?

All that does is put him east of Freedom Bridge. Is his mother going to alibi him?

 

[iamshadow21]

I do love that part, but I'm concerned if their presentation of those things is lacking. I'm thrilled the jury gets to ask questions to clear that stuff up though.

And they are asking great questions. They're not phoning it in, they are listening, they are engaged, and when the prosecution AND defense questions leave them with answers they still want, they aren't being tentative about trying to get them.

MOO

 

[rez125]

And they are asking great questions. They're not phoning it in, they are listening, they are engaged, and when the prosecution AND defense questions leave them with answers they still want, they aren't being tentative about trying to get them.

MOO

Yep they sound engaged which is good for both sides.

 

[steeltowngirl]

The Delphi Murders: Richard Allen on Trial: Day Seven: The Forensic Firearms Examiner

We discuss the seventh day of Richard Allen's trial. We had a whole day of testimony from former forensic firearms examiner, Melissa Oberg. Support The Murder...

murdersheetpodcast.com

50:50 timestamp above

Apparently the defense handed out some pictures to the jurors as specific exhibits but forgot to label them (Exhibit A, B, C, etc). Rozzi had to go up to the jury and was holding up a copy of each picture he was trying to reference and telling the jury to take out the corresponding one in the bundle of pictures they had. Judge Gull suggested the defense redo the pictures for tomorrow with labels.

Oh dear. The same defense who complained that the prosecution had merely labeled by numbers 26 terabyte of data couldn’t manage to label their own pictures for the courtroom.

 

[technicallymissing]

Oh dear. The same defense who complained that the prosecution had merely labeled by numbers 26 terabyte of data couldn’t manage to label their own pictures for the courtroom.

The Delphi Murders: Richard Allen on Trial: Day Seven: The Forensic Firearms Examiner

We discuss the seventh day of Richard Allen's trial. We had a whole day of testimony from former forensic firearms examiner, Melissa Oberg. Support The Murder...

murdersheetpodcast.com

Brad Rozzi apparently also had a problem with the fact that one of Oberg's reports on the bullet was 14 pages of text but had NO pictures (of the bullet)... Said to her "Why on Earth wouldn't you put in a picture?" @ 44:50 in episode above
Perhaps his own picture plight just a few minutes later was his comeuppance

 

[MassGuy]

The Delphi Murders: Richard Allen on Trial: Day Seven: The Forensic Firearms Examiner

We discuss the seventh day of Richard Allen's trial. We had a whole day of testimony from former forensic firearms examiner, Melissa Oberg. Support The Murder...

murdersheetpodcast.com

Forgot to mention Brad Rozzi apparently also had a problem with the fact that one of Oberg's reports on the bullet was 14 pages of text but had NO pictures (of the bullet)... Said to her "Why on Earth wouldn't you put in a picture?" @ 44:50 in episode above
Perhaps his own picture plight just a few minutes later was his comeuppance

He’s a bit old for picture books.

 

[ClearAhead]

18/10/24: Instructions Of Court Pursuant To Criminal Rule 8 & Jury Rule 20 Of The Supreme Court Of Indiana

_Instructions of Court Pursuant to Criminal Rule and Jury Rule 20 of the Indiana Supreme Court of the State of Indiana.pdf

drive.google.com

Instructions to the Jurors
This is worth reading as it’s very important to the outcome of this case.

What is standing out to me is the elements within each of the four counts RA is charged with, each must be proven. Pertaining to the ‘felony’ murder charges it must be proven “The defendant R.M.A. killed (name of each victim) while committing or attempting to commit kidnapping”.

This is contrary to a conviction for felony murder with proof only of RA kidnapping them but not killing them.

I wonder if the elements of felony murder differ from state to state?

 

[twall]

about 50:22 Rozzi was admonished by JG “Will you stop misstating the evidence!”. The back of his neck looked like it turned red. Why this was, R was repeatedly listing off studies regarding unreliability of ballistics but he was vastly overstating/misstating the results of the study. So Luttrell would object and have to correct him each time, why JG was getting very annoyed.

Ultimately at the end of the day the jury looked glum. A very long, highly technical day of testimony, the long cross that went nowhere, the judges admonition.

She's not used to seeing Rozzi's style of cross since most of the murder trials she presides over are gang bangers. JMO

 

[ClearAhead]

She's not used to seeing Rozzi's style of cross since most of the murder trials she presides over are gang bangers. JMO

It doesn’t seem to be impressing anyone nor accomplishing anything.