Daniel Penny on Trial for manslaughter and negligent homicide of Jordan Neely

[Deleted member 39678]

The strangulation death of JN by DP was videoed.
He was brain dead 2.5 minutes into the video that was entered as evidence.
As I just replied to you had JN dropped then and there while ranting and was never taken down and put in a chokehold and died then yes, maybe drugs would have been the cause.
But..that is not the way this tragic event unfolded.

I still don't get it. Why does the timing have to be exactly how you say?

And how can someone determine a person is brain dead from watching a video? I don't understand that either. JMO.

 

[jepop]

Bringing relevant post forward from earlier in thread. I see a conviction if jury does its duty. I hope they work with the evidence and will be fully cognisant of the charges and the law. Moo.

Post in thread 'Daniel Penny on Trial for manslaughter and negligent homicide of Jordan Neely'

Nov 5, 2024

The ONLY issue at play here from the very beginning is whether Penny should have kept Neely in a chokehold for as long as he did until Neely was dead.

Various arguments here are irrelevant. No one was terrified after Penny put Neely on the floor and restrained him, ultimately with help from two other men. Penny’s wild talk was no longer an issue. No one needed to move to another car. They were able to get off the train while Penny was holding Neely down. There was no need for Penny and others to be aware of Neely’s mental illness and arrest history. He appeared to be a threat and...

• Lilibet

• 
• 

 

[Lilibet]

If someone attacks me and I die of a heart attack (I have pre-existing heart trouble), is that person who attacked me innocent? Of course not. There is a miniscule chance that I would have had a heart attack and died at that moment had I not been attacked. So, regardless of the amount of K2 taken by Neely, the precipitating factor in his death at that moment was Mr Penny’s chokehold.

JMO

 

[acutename]

Trying to remember the details: did the first responders immediately start resuscitation once they felt the pulse? Was he immediately intubated and given positive pressure breaths?

Did not want to touch him... so if you think that DP was not sympathetic, consider...

Jordan Neely Was Alive When Police Arrived, Didn't Give ...​

The Daily Wire
https://www.dailywire.com › news › jordan-neely-was-a...





Nov 4, 2024 — ... Neely mouth-to-mouth because Neely looked dirty and disease-ridden. ... I wouldn't want one of my officers getting sick from this.” If ...

 

[LinasK]

Did not want to touch him... so if you think that DP was not sympathetic, consider...

Jordan Neely Was Alive When Police Arrived, Didn't Give ...​

View attachment 545590
The Daily Wire
https://www.dailywire.com › news › jordan-neely-was-a...





Nov 4, 2024 — ... Neely mouth-to-mouth because Neely looked dirty and disease-ridden. ... I wouldn't want one of my officers getting sick from this.” If ...

So as IceIce was saying, then you do Chest Compressions, rather than nothing.

 

[Lilibet]

I still don't get it. Why does the timing have to be exactly how you say?

And how can someone determine a person is brain dead from watching a video? I don't understand that either. JMO.

The medical examiner and her supervisor are doctors. They know what death under those circumstances looks like.

Medical examiner testifies about Jordan Neely's injuries in subway chokehold trial

Over the last two weeks, the prosecution showed jurors Penny in his own words in the moments following the incident and called nearly three dozen witnesses to testify.

abc7ny.com

Dr. Harris testified about significant moments on video where she could see signs of death. She says Neely's face turns purple, and there are involuntary movements that are consistent with the brain dying.

 

[Izzylizzy]

Bringing relevant post forward from earlier in thread. I see a conviction if jury does its duty. I hope they work with the evidence and will be fully cognisant of the charges and the law. Moo.

Post in thread 'Daniel Penny on Trial for manslaughter and negligent homicide of Jordan Neely'

Nov 5, 2024

The ONLY issue at play here from the very beginning is whether Penny should have kept Neely in a chokehold for as long as he did until Neely was dead.

Various arguments here are irrelevant. No one was terrified after Penny put Neely on the floor and restrained him, ultimately with help from two other men. Penny’s wild talk was no longer an issue. No one needed to move to another car. They were able to get off the train while Penny was holding Neely down. There was no need for Penny and others to be aware of Neely’s mental illness and arrest history. He appeared to be a threat and...

• Lilibet

• 
• 

Yes, and the prosecution has a clear cut power point closing showing all that.

In addition all the passengers exited the car, which was then stopped, 30 secs after DP took JN down and there were 2 other men helping DP hold him.

 

[Lilibet]

It’s interesting that Penny’s attorney discusses K2 in terms of how it would affect Neely’s actions, not anything related to the chokehold.

Jordan Neely Was Alive When Police Arrived, Didn’t Give Mouth-To-Mouth Because He Was ‘Filthy’: NYPD

Officers did not perform mouth-to-mouth on Jordan Neely, who still had a pulse, following the incident last year on the New York City subway car concerning former U.S. Marine Daniel Penny. Penny restrained Neely, a troubled man with a lengthy criminal record and a history of mental health...

www.dailywire.com

It’s very important that the jury be aware of that drug in Mr. Neely’s system, and the effects of that drug, because it affects behaviors, particularly when Mr. Neely was likely in a psychotic episode to begin with, which he has a history of,” the attorney added. “It’s going to affect how threatening Neely appeared.”

Use of K2, sometimes referred to a “spice,” has been linked to psychosis.

 

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[Izzylizzy]

Did not want to touch him... so if you think that DP was not sympathetic, consider...

Jordan Neely Was Alive When Police Arrived, Didn't Give ...​

View attachment 545590
The Daily Wire
https://www.dailywire.com › news › jordan-neely-was-a...





Nov 4, 2024 — ... Neely mouth-to-mouth because Neely looked dirty and disease-ridden. ... I wouldn't want one of my officers getting sick from this.” If ...

DP was trained in lethal force and the possible fatal outcome and JN was brain dead when LE first arrived.

He left Neely laying there not breathing and lifeless so why didn't he do CPR then?
We know he had no concern for JN's condition as he held his lifeless body in the chokehold for just about a minute so I guess that's why.

 

[Izzylizzy]

It’s interesting that Penny’s attorney discusses K2 in terms of how it would affect Neely’s actions, not anything related to the chokehold.

Jordan Neely Was Alive When Police Arrived, Didn’t Give Mouth-To-Mouth Because He Was ‘Filthy’: NYPD

Officers did not perform mouth-to-mouth on Jordan Neely, who still had a pulse, following the incident last year on the New York City subway car concerning former U.S. Marine Daniel Penny. Penny restrained Neely, a troubled man with a lengthy criminal record and a history of mental health...

www.dailywire.com

It’s very important that the jury be aware of that drug in Mr. Neely’s system, and the effects of that drug, because it affects behaviors, particularly when Mr. Neely was likely in a psychotic episode to begin with, which he has a history of,” the attorney added. “It’s going to affect how threatening Neely appeared.”

Use of K2, sometimes referred to a “spice,” has been linked to psychosis.

DP's defense is the "look over there" not at the what actually happened one.

Neely also suffered from paranoid schizophrenia so which came first, the chicken or the egg?
He could have done K2 the week before for all we know because it stays in one's system.

 

[Deleted member 39678]

The medical examiner and her supervisor are doctors. They know what death under those circumstances looks like.

Medical examiner testifies about Jordan Neely's injuries in subway chokehold trial

Over the last two weeks, the prosecution showed jurors Penny in his own words in the moments following the incident and called nearly three dozen witnesses to testify.

abc7ny.com

Dr. Harris testified about significant moments on video where she could see signs of death. She says Neely's face turns purple, and there are involuntary movements that are consistent with the brain dying.

Sounds like the ME was guessing about the brain death diagnoses via video.

And I'm still not understanding why her supervisor had to verify her work and opinion. Seems strange to me. JMO.

 

[Ontario Mom]

DP's defense is the "look over there" not at the what actually happened one.

Neely also suffered from paranoid schizophrenia so which came first, the chicken or the egg?
He could have done K2 the week before for all we know because it stays in one's system.

Do you have a link to verify what you're saying about K2? I know nothing about it, so just hoping to keeping things factual.

 

[Deleted member 39678]

Do you have a link to verify what you're saying about K2? I know nothing about it, so just hoping to keeping things factual.

I have looked at several sources about K2 and Spice and haven't read anything about testing levels and longevity so I also would like to know more about those things.

 

[Ontario Mom]

I have looked at several sources about K2 and Spice and haven't read anything about testing levels and longevity so I also would like to know more about those things.

Considering it's a known factor in this case, I think it matters. At least until ruled out, if it can be.

jmo

 

[Deleted member 39678]

Considering it's a known factor in this case, I think it matters. At least until ruled out, if it can be.

jmo

I agree.

 

[LinasK]

Considering it's a known factor in this case, I think it matters. At least until ruled out, if it can be.

jmo

It hasn't yet come out to be a know factor in this case. No one has testified that it is.

 

[Izzylizzy]

Considering it's a known factor in this case, I think it matters. At least until ruled out, if it can be.

jmo

There is no toxicity levels test for K2

 

[Ontario Mom]

It hasn't yet come out to be a know factor in this case. No one has testified that it is.

It is indeed a known fact in this case:

"A toxicology report revealed Neely had a synthetic cannabinoid otherwise known as K2 in his system" Medical examiner testifies in trial of Daniel Penny for NYC subway chokehold death

 

[Deleted member 39678]

There is no toxicity test for K2

I'm interested in seeing a link for that fact too. We know that they found K2 in Neely's system so they can test for that.

The report ultimately showed that Neely, who jurors have heard had a history of abusing the synthetic marijuana drug K2, had the drug in his system when he died.

Daniel Penny chokehold caused Jordan Neely death, even if homeless man had enough drugs in system to ‘put down an elephant’: ME testimony

The medical examiner who ruled Jordan Neely’s death was a homicide caused by Daniel Penny’s chokehold insisted Friday she’d stand by the ruling.

nypost.com